Picking Lock with Bic Pen

[email hidden] (Greg) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

OK, so I wanted to try this myself, on my computer lock made my
Kensington. It is a circular-key lock, shown here

http://www.computerlocks.com/html/2222.html

Took my under a minute to open it. It appears this is a security flaw
with not just bike locks.....

Don't some soda vending machines use the same type of lock?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Took my under a minute to open it. It appears this is a security flaw
with not just bike locks.....

Don't some soda vending machines use the same type of lock?

Yup.

The New York Daily News reported Friday that an Internet video has surfaced
showing how to pick one of the most secure locks known to cyclists: stick
the non-writing end of a Bic pen into the cylinder-shaped key hole and
twist.

Although the trick apparently works on many locks with tubular cylinder
technology including vending machines and some ignitions, it's the bike
industry's best known locksmith, Kryptonite, that's feeling most of the
heat.

"Pat" <[email hidden]> wrote in news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Took my under a minute to open it. It appears this is a security
flaw with not just bike locks.....

Don't some soda vending machines use the same type of lock?

Yup.

The New York Daily News reported Friday that an Internet video has
surfaced showing how to pick one of the most secure locks known to
cyclists: stick the non-writing end of a Bic pen into the
cylinder-shaped key hole and twist.

Although the trick apparently works on many locks with tubular
cylinder technology including vending machines and some ignitions,
it's the bike industry's best known locksmith, Kryptonite, that's
feeling most of the heat.

The interesting thing about this exploit (to me, anyway) is that you can
hold a bit of plastic tube concealed in your hand, walk up to a stranger's
bike, and look like you're the owner... maybe just struggling a bit with a
cranky key. It's not like using a carjack, or a freon spray and hammer, or
lifting a bike over a street sign pole. I know that any lock can be picked
or bypassed by a determined thief. This is different. It looks just like a
legitimate owner unlocking his or her bike. No wonder people are upset.

I'm not in a high crime area, and when I do lock my bike it's pretty low
tech. If I did live in a risky area, I'd use a case hardened chain
(preferably 4-sided or hex) wrapped in an innertube, with a high security
shrouded padlock like a Medeco or Abloy.

--
Mike Barrs

foldedpath said:

'm not in a high crime area, and when I do lock my bike it's pretty low
tech. If I did live in a risky area, I'd use a case hardened chain
(preferably 4-sided or hex) wrapped in an innertube, with a high security
shrouded padlock like a Medeco or Abloy.

--
Mike Barrs

Have you seen the reports about thieves breaking into a person's garage and
stealing the bike? Apparently the thieves go to the low crime areas with a
van and load up on expensive bikes. So it'd be hard to tell what's a
'risky' area, wouldn't it?

-B

Quoted message said:

Took my under a minute to open it. It appears this is a security flaw
with not just bike locks.....

I have a couple friends who say they have been successful in using the
technique to open their Kryptonite locks. I have a "Bike Guard" lock
(manufacturer is Norco I think) and I have NOT been able to open it using
the pen. The key hole in my lock is at the end of the cross bar.

Certainly not all U locks are vulnerable, unfortunately it's clear that
many locks are. Maybe it won't hurt to additionally lock your bike with a
cable lock for the time being?

--
Jem Berkes
http://www.sysdesign.ca/

Quoted message said:

Certainly not all U locks are vulnerable, unfortunately it's clear
that many locks are. Maybe it won't hurt to additionally lock your
bike with a cable lock for the time being?

Just had a thought, maybe someone with a vulnerable lock could experiment
with this.

Perhaps a simple counter-measure to this new type of lock picking is
heavily greasing your key hole? Maybe bearing grease or something. As I
understand it, the plastic pen has to get enough of a grip to produce the
required torque when opening the lock. Just an idea.

--
Jem Berkes
http://www.sysdesign.ca/

Quoted message said:

Have you seen the reports about thieves breaking into a person's garage

and

Quoted message said:

stealing the bike? Apparently the thieves go to the low crime areas with a
van and load up on expensive bikes. So it'd be hard to tell what's a
'risky' area, wouldn't it?

-B

What are you talking about? Everyone knows that bikes are supposed to be
kept in the dining room!

Pat in TX

Quoted message said:

Sat, 18 Sep 2004 01:59:58 GMT,
<[email hidden]>,

Jem Berkes said:

I have a "Bike Guard" lock
(manufacturer is Norco I think) and I have NOT been able to open it using
the pen. The key hole in my lock is at the end of the cross bar.

I also have a Norco branded BikeGuard 5 that has resisted all attempts
to open with any pen.
--
zk

Badger_South <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

foldedpath said:

'm not in a high crime area, and when I do lock my bike it's pretty
low tech. If I did live in a risky area, I'd use a case hardened chain
(preferably 4-sided or hex) wrapped in an innertube, with a high
security shrouded padlock like a Medeco or Abloy.

--
Mike Barrs

Have you seen the reports about thieves breaking into a person's
garage and stealing the bike?

I'm sure a lot of bikes are stolen from garages, but I suspect that most
garage break-ins are not specifically targeted at bikes. Also, I've
never owned a garage (at least in the last 15 years or so) that wasn't
tied into the house alarm system. That isn't a foolproof deterrent, but
it makes a lot of noise and triggers a police visit. That's more than a
U-lock on a lamp post will do. 🙂

Quoted message said:

Apparently the thieves go to the low
crime areas with a van and load up on expensive bikes. So it'd be hard
to tell what's a 'risky' area, wouldn't it?

Well, I think you can tell a lot about the local risk level by seeing
what other people are doing to secure their bikes. Also the LBS should
be a good source of info on the local bike theft scene. They'll be
hearing about it from people replacing stolen bikes.

I live in a Norman Rockwell-ish small town where many people still don't
lock their front doors or their cars. There is a minor uptick in crimes
(usually car break-ins) during the summer months when the tourists are
here. Otherwise it's pretty quiet. People around here are fairly casual
about bike security... leaving bikes unlocked outside a store when they
go in for a few minues, or just trusting that the bike is too beat up
and undesirable to be a target. There aren't a lot of expensive bikes
around here. The expensive ones do get locked up, or else they're just
not used for commuting or shopping, and the rider is never off the bike.
I don't see the massive 5 lb. chains and locks, or the 2 and 3 lock
setups around here, that you see in urban areas like NYC or San
Francisco.

--
Mike Barrs

Jem Berkes <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Just had a thought, maybe someone with a vulnerable lock could
experiment with this.

Perhaps a simple counter-measure to this new type of lock picking is
heavily greasing your key hole? Maybe bearing grease or something. As
I understand it, the plastic pen has to get enough of a grip to
produce the required torque when opening the lock. Just an idea.

Someone mentioned this idea over on bikeforums.net. Apparently that just
makes it easier to pick. The pen tube will grab anyway, because you're
forcing it on hard enough to spread it slightly and form an "impression."
Most locks are not regularly lube'd by their owners, so you're just making
it easier to get the pins moving and the lock opened.

That's hearsay, BTW. I haven't tried slicking up a barrel lock to see how
this works. Just thought I'd pass it on.

Even if greasing the barrel does work... this type of lock mechanism on
your bike is now a big "steal me" sign that encourages people to mess with
your bike, even if your particular lock is resistant to the Bic pen
exploit. For me, that's reason enough to avoid this type of lock. If I'm
going to use a lock at all, I want someone to take one look and figure it's
not worth messing with.

--
Mike Barrs

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Have you seen the reports about thieves breaking into a person's garage
and stealing the bike? Apparently the thieves go to the low crime areas
with a van and load up on expensive bikes. So it'd be hard to tell
what's a 'risky' area, wouldn't it?

What are you talking about? Everyone knows that bikes are supposed to be
kept in the dining room!

Bedroom and living room are also perfectly acceptable (I should know, I
store bikes in both places).

--
Benjamin Lewis

I regret to say that we of the FBI are powerless to act in cases of
oral-genital intimacy, unless it has in some way obstructed interstate
commerce. -- J. Edgar Hoover

"Benjamin Lewis" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] wrote:

[...]

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

What are you talking about? Everyone knows that bikes are supposed to be
kept in the dining room!

Bedroom and living room are also perfectly acceptable (I should know, I
store bikes in both places).

Any real cyclist will have constructed a dedicated, climate controlled
bicycle room with concierge service.

🙂

--
'The three little sentences that get you through life:
1]Cover for me.
2]Oh, good idea, boss!
3] It was like that when I got here.' -homer simpson

Quoted message said:

Any real cyclist will have constructed a dedicated, climate controlled
bicycle room with concierge service.

Like I said--dining room! Besides, this room has 3 windows for the bikes to
look out of and watch the neighborhood. It has carpet, air conditioning, and
sometimes I dust it.

pat in TX

See it in action
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=66128&page=1&pp=25

Kryptonite scrambles to find solution
Recall of flawed U-shaped locks could cost firms tens of millions of
dollars, experts say.
http://money.cnn.com/2004/09/17/news/midcaps/kryptonite/index.htm?cnn=yes

KRYPTONITE OFFERING FREE UPGRADE WORLDWIDE FOR CONSUMERS' HIGH END TUBULAR
CYLINDER LOCKS
http://www.kryptonitelock.com/inetisscripts/abtinetis.exe/templateform@public?tn=home_home

"Greg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

OK, so I wanted to try this myself, on my computer lock made my
Kensington. It is a circular-key lock, shown here

http://www.computerlocks.com/html/2222.html

Took my under a minute to open it. It appears this is a security flaw
with not just bike locks.....

On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 00:04:31 -0700, Benjamin Lewis <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Have you seen the reports about thieves breaking into a person's garage
and stealing the bike? Apparently the thieves go to the low crime areas
with a van and load up on expensive bikes. So it'd be hard to tell
what's a 'risky' area, wouldn't it?

What are you talking about? Everyone knows that bikes are supposed to be
kept in the dining room!

Bedroom and living room are also perfectly acceptable (I should know, I
store bikes in both places).

Ours are in the living room - all 3 of them.

Michael J. Klein [email hidden]
Dasi Jen, Taoyuan Hsien, Taiwan, ROC
Please replace mousepotato with asiancastings
---------------------------------------------

ted said:

See it in action
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=66128&page=1&pp=25

Kryptonite scrambles to find solution
Recall of flawed U-shaped locks could cost firms tens of millions of
dollars, experts say.
http://money.cnn.com/2004/09/17/news/midcaps/kryptonite/index.htm?cnn=yes

KRYPTONITE OFFERING FREE UPGRADE WORLDWIDE FOR CONSUMERS' HIGH END TUBULAR
CYLINDER LOCKS
http://www.kryptonitelock.com/inetisscripts/abtinetis.exe/templateform@public?tn=home_home

"Greg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

OK, so I wanted to try this myself, on my computer lock made my
Kensington. It is a circular-key lock, shown here

http://www.computerlocks.com/html/2222.html

Took my under a minute to open it. It appears this is a security flaw
with not just bike locks.....

This is bad! My u-lock has a x-key, not a round one.

Michael J. Klein [email hidden]
Dasi Jen, Taoyuan Hsien, Taiwan, ROC
Please replace mousepotato with asiancastings
---------------------------------------------