Philly sucks

"Sierraman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Frank Drackman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Sierraman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Howard Kveck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> In article <[email hidden]>,
> "Sierraman" <[email hidden]> wrote:
> >
> > Most girls go through Metamorphosis when racing. During and after an
event
> > at least for a time the juices are really flowing, so you get the
masculine
> > effect. But after a shower, some makeup, nice clothes and a Pina
> > Colada,
> > you wouldn't be able to even tell that was the same girl you saw
previously
> > racing.
>
> And after all that and a shave, they wouldn't be able to tell it
> was
> you. (Drum roll/cymbal smash) Heh heh, sorry, I just couldn't resist.
>
Howard

I'm not going to ask you to explain that one. It's seems like typical

rbr

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

sexist slant joke. I know there are a record number of sexist types in
here
that can't just enjoy both sides of men's and women's racing, but they
have
make personal attacks if you don't worship the men, like Lance and
crew.

I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

guess it's quite ok to be so fanatical about following the Top Pro men
racing careers in detail all the way down to what kind of underwear
they
are
wearing, but if you like to enjoy the women's side of the sport, there
must
be something wrong with you, like you are gay or something. No, no, no,
you
see being from the older generation, a bit old fashion, I still like
women,
and there are still quite a few of us who do. Most of you guys have it
backwards see, you just need a little counseling. You need to be
re-trained
to be interested in women, not the men. It's takes time but you can get
your
priorities in order in due course. Walter, William and Phil and a few
others
who have a keen interest in women's cycling and takes some really hot
photos
have their priorities in order, as they have little interest watching a
pack
of men go through the motions. OK, fine men are faster, stronger, but I
think a lot of you guys need to stop worshipping Lance and take a look

at

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

some of the (finer) aspects of the sport. Truth is, none of you guys
would
last more then a few stages with Somaribba, Brandli, or Luperini. Quite

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

humbling experience, but the good news is, the best view is from the

back

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

of
the pack. :-)

I have always enjoyed your knowledge of womens racing

Thanks, sheez, the ones who say something nice are the ones I have never
spoken to, how ironic, I guess because I am usually do battle with
mudslingers. I have gotton a few emails supporting my posts over the years
as a result of this thread. Thanks guys and gals. Maybe someone new can
fill
my shoes now. It's sad that one of the Top Pro women who is really good
and
would like to post here but she agrees and likely won't return. She
certainly knows only too well not to throw her pearls before swine. I
don't
blame her.

venting, getting some air now.

We have discussed things in the past, I just keep changing my alias. I have
enjoyed your knowledge of women's racing as well as the reports of the rides
and environmental stuff in your area. Don't let the immature members get
you down. They try to tear people down so that they can hope to feel better
about their miserable lives.

"Frank Drackman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Sierraman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Frank Drackman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Sierraman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
>
> "Howard Kveck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
> news:[email hidden]...
>> In article <[email hidden]>,
>> "Sierraman" <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> >
>> > Most girls go through Metamorphosis when racing. During and after

an

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> event
>> > at least for a time the juices are really flowing, so you get the
> masculine
>> > effect. But after a shower, some makeup, nice clothes and a Pina
>> > Colada,
>> > you wouldn't be able to even tell that was the same girl you saw
> previously
>> > racing.
>>
>> And after all that and a shave, they wouldn't be able to tell it
>> was
>> you. (Drum roll/cymbal smash) Heh heh, sorry, I just couldn't

resist.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>>
> Howard
>
> I'm not going to ask you to explain that one. It's seems like typical

rbr

Quoted message said:

> sexist slant joke. I know there are a record number of sexist types

in

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> here
> that can't just enjoy both sides of men's and women's racing, but

they

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> have
> make personal attacks if you don't worship the men, like Lance and
> crew.

I

Quoted message said:

> guess it's quite ok to be so fanatical about following the Top Pro

men

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> racing careers in detail all the way down to what kind of underwear
> they
> are
> wearing, but if you like to enjoy the women's side of the sport,

there

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> must
> be something wrong with you, like you are gay or something. No, no,

no,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> you
> see being from the older generation, a bit old fashion, I still like
> women,
> and there are still quite a few of us who do. Most of you guys have

it

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> backwards see, you just need a little counseling. You need to be
> re-trained
> to be interested in women, not the men. It's takes time but you can

get

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> your
> priorities in order in due course. Walter, William and Phil and a few
> others
> who have a keen interest in women's cycling and takes some really hot
> photos
> have their priorities in order, as they have little interest watching

a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> pack
> of men go through the motions. OK, fine men are faster, stronger, but

I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> think a lot of you guys need to stop worshipping Lance and take a

look

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

at

Quoted message said:

> some of the (finer) aspects of the sport. Truth is, none of you guys
> would
> last more then a few stages with Somaribba, Brandli, or Luperini.

Quite

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

a

Quoted message said:

> humbling experience, but the good news is, the best view is from the

back

Quoted message said:

> of
> the pack. :-)
>

I have always enjoyed your knowledge of womens racing

Thanks, sheez, the ones who say something nice are the ones I have never
spoken to, how ironic, I guess because I am usually do battle with
mudslingers. I have gotton a few emails supporting my posts over the

years

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

as a result of this thread. Thanks guys and gals. Maybe someone new can
fill
my shoes now. It's sad that one of the Top Pro women who is really good
and
would like to post here but she agrees and likely won't return. She
certainly knows only too well not to throw her pearls before swine. I
don't
blame her.

venting, getting some air now.

We have discussed things in the past, I just keep changing my alias. I

have

Quoted message said:

enjoyed your knowledge of women's racing as well as the reports of the

rides

Quoted message said:

and environmental stuff in your area. Don't let the immature members get
you down. They try to tear people down so that they can hope to feel

better

Quoted message said:

about their miserable lives.

I don't, just venting, but it's a shame that rbr can't be as mature and
robust as it's European counterparts. It's been a real eye opener talking to
that crowd and understanding how they do it over there in their groups. I
have posted links and photos of racing women here in the past as a way to
break the ice, like a proxy so that might open the door to talk about
something interesting about the women. That seems to work well in Europe but
here it usually only invites two types. One, the type who can only google
eye the women and speak to their faults, or two, attack the person who
posted it, usually me, that either you are sexist, pervert or gay for
posting the link. God forbid that anyone would actually want to discuss
anything about women's cycling so they like to rib you with the sexist
approach. Really pathetic, they don't do that over there in the Euro groups.
They don't post as much women's stuff over there either but they always
refrain from attacking your character.

B-

Sierraman said:

You are the only Indian guy I have even met that was foul mouthed, rude
and seem to have a enormous chip on his shoulders. I have met tons of
them over the years as they run all the quick stop stores down in the
valley, especially the liquor stores, gas stations. I have (never) met
one from India who was not polite and very friendly. In fact I knew
several from University, and we used to make Samosa and Tandori
chicken, Lassies, and all kinds of wonderful spiced curries after
school. They were always good company, and I never ran into one that
wasn't very humble, well mannered until I ran into you Amit in RBR.

Amit:

Sounds like Bruce wants you to be more like Apu on The Simpsons.

http://www.fortunecity.com/lavendar/poitier/135/thnkhell.wav

Sierraman said:

"amit" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

dumbass,

you're the biggest hypocrite. i thought it's was cool that you were
interested in a particular niche (women's racing), but you're the one
always going on about racer's looks and posting links to pics all the
time.

When I first came to the group a few years ago, I figured this would be cool
place to talk about cycling. I quickly realized it was run by a gang of
thugs which if you wanted in, you have to endure round after round of
humiliations which run the full gamut of all kinds of trips and traps,
carefully plotting at every turn to get their jollies.

That's not true. You only get humiliated if you're a tool.

Sierraman said:

I don't, just venting, but it's a shame that rbr can't be as mature and
robust as it's European counterparts. It's been a real eye opener talking to
that crowd and understanding how they do it over there in their groups. I
have posted links and photos of racing women here in the past as a way to
break the ice, like a proxy so that might open the door to talk about
something interesting about the women.

This is interesting (from Cyclingnews):

Rossner and Arndt become Gay Games ambassadors

Equipe Nurnberger's team manager and rider, Petra Rossner and Judith
Arndt, have recently joined the list of athletes to be named Gay Games
Ambassadors, reports 365gay.com.

Cycling has been part of every Gay Games since its inception in 1982,
when cyclo-cross and road races were held. In July 2006, at the Gay
Games VII to be held in Chicago, mountain biking, criteriums and time
trials have been added, although cyclo-cross no longer features as part
of the programme.

"Cycling is our first love, of course, but there is a sport for almost
everyone at the Gay Games," said Rossner. "We can't think of a better
goal to set than to get fit and take part in an event that does so much
on behalf of the gay and lesbian community around the world."

"We are both really pleased to get the opportunity to support the Gay
Games as Ambassadors," said Arndt.

Federation of Gay Games co-president Kathleen Webster said: "We're
honored that Petra and Judith are becoming Ambassadors in the middle of
their ongoing professional careers. Their openness and enthusiasm about
the goals of the Gay Games are an inspiration and I'm sure will earn
them many new fans."

Discuss.

Kyle Legate said:

Sierraman said:

I don't, just venting, but it's a shame that rbr can't be as mature and
robust as it's European counterparts. It's been a real eye opener talking to
that crowd and understanding how they do it over there in their groups. I
have posted links and photos of racing women here in the past as a way to
break the ice, like a proxy so that might open the door to talk about
something interesting about the women.

This is interesting (from Cyclingnews):

Why?
It was a surprise??

Quoted message said:

Rossner and Arndt become Gay Games ambassadors

Equipe Nurnberger's team manager and rider, Petra Rossner and Judith
Arndt, have recently joined the list of athletes to be named Gay Games
Ambassadors, reports 365gay.com.

Cycling has been part of every Gay Games since its inception in 1982,
when cyclo-cross and road races were held. In July 2006, at the Gay
Games VII to be held in Chicago, mountain biking, criteriums and time
trials have been added, although cyclo-cross no longer features as part
of the programme.

"Cycling is our first love, of course, but there is a sport for almost
everyone at the Gay Games," said Rossner. "We can't think of a better
goal to set than to get fit and take part in an event that does so much
on behalf of the gay and lesbian community around the world."

"We are both really pleased to get the opportunity to support the Gay
Games as Ambassadors," said Arndt.

Federation of Gay Games co-president Kathleen Webster said: "We're
honored that Petra and Judith are becoming Ambassadors in the middle of
their ongoing professional careers. Their openness and enthusiasm about
the goals of the Gay Games are an inspiration and I'm sure will earn
them many new fans."

Discuss.

Kyle Legate said:

Sierraman said:

I don't, just venting, but it's a shame that rbr can't be as mature and
robust as it's European counterparts. It's been a real eye opener talking to
that crowd and understanding how they do it over there in their groups. I
have posted links and photos of racing women here in the past as a way to
break the ice, like a proxy so that might open the door to talk about
something interesting about the women.

This is interesting (from Cyclingnews):

Rossner and Arndt become Gay Games ambassadors

Equipe Nurnberger's team manager and rider, Petra Rossner and Judith
Arndt, have recently joined the list of athletes to be named Gay Games
Ambassadors, reports 365gay.com.

After finding the story on that page THIS was a more interesting read:

At the Athens Summer Olympic Games two months earlier, Arndt won a silver
medal in the women's road race and made headlines around the world for
giving a one-finger salute as she crossed the finish line to the German
cycling federation for leaving Rossner off the 2004 Olympic team.  It was a
gesture of solidarity for a teammate who Arndt believed could have helped
propel one of the German cyclists to gold.

That Arndt and Rossner were in a committed relationship at the time was
also reported, but Rossner's achievements made Arndt's protest compelling. 
Much of the international press printed the fact of their being live-in
girlfriends almost as a sidelight to the incident itself, perhaps a sign
that merely being gay or lesbian isn't enough in certain sport circles to
generate headlines these days.

Quoted message said:

Cycling has been part of every Gay Games since its inception in 1982,
when cyclo-cross and road races were held. In July 2006, at the Gay
Games VII to be held in Chicago, mountain biking, criteriums and time
trials have been added, although cyclo-cross no longer features as part
of the programme.

"Cycling is our first love, of course, but there is a sport for almost
everyone at the Gay Games," said Rossner. "We can't think of a better
goal to set than to get fit and take part in an event that does so much
on behalf of the gay and lesbian community around the world."

"We are both really pleased to get the opportunity to support the Gay
Games as Ambassadors," said Arndt.

Federation of Gay Games co-president Kathleen Webster said: "We're
honored that Petra and Judith are becoming Ambassadors in the middle of
their ongoing professional careers. Their openness and enthusiasm about
the goals of the Gay Games are an inspiration and I'm sure will earn
them many new fans."

Discuss.

"Me" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 6/11/05 6:46 AM, in article [email hidden], "Kyle

Legate"

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote:

After finding the story on that page THIS was a more interesting read:

At the Athens Summer Olympic Games two months earlier, Arndt won a silver
medal in the women's road race and made headlines around the world for
giving a one-finger salute as she crossed the finish line to the German
cycling federation for leaving Rossner off the 2004 Olympic team. It was a
gesture of solidarity for a teammate who Arndt believed could have helped
propel one of the German cyclists to gold.

That was interesting to me at the time since not only Rossner got shafted,
but Luperini and others got shafted as well by their federations. That's
really cold to shaft your countries best riders like that, and especially
when it comes at the end of their careers. I believe there were others,
can't recall.

Quoted message said:

That Arndt and Rossner were in a committed relationship at the time was
also reported, but Rossner's achievements made Arndt's protest compelling.
Much of the international press printed the fact of their being live-in
girlfriends almost as a sidelight to the incident itself, perhaps a sign
that merely being gay or lesbian isn't enough in certain sport circles to
generate headlines these days.

This problem transcended that issue as they are the best in the world, and I
always enjoyed Arndt. She goes back to racing Luperini way, way back in the
tours TDF's, of the mid 90's and later. Even then she was a stellar climber.

snip-

B-

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Sad that someone as smart as you has been one of most pathetic tricksters in
this group. As mentioned earlier, you must be a miserable soul. I hope you
enjoy many years of tomfoolery in rbr. Your will be probably be 80 many
years from now and still be in this miserable group. Some people are
diehards here and probably the only friends they have are the losers here.

B-

Sierraman said:

Sad that someone as smart as you has been one of most pathetic
tricksters in this group. As mentioned earlier, you must be a miserable
soul. I hope you enjoy many years of tomfoolery in rbr. Your will be
probably be 80 many years from now and still be in this miserable
group. Some people are diehards here and probably the only friends they
have are the losers here.

Bruce:

You're whining.

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Sierraman said:

Sad that someone as smart as you has been one of most pathetic
tricksters in this group. As mentioned earlier, you must be a miserable
soul. I hope you enjoy many years of tomfoolery in rbr. Your will be
probably be 80 many years from now and still be in this miserable
group. Some people are diehards here and probably the only friends they
have are the losers here.

Bruce:

You're whining.

Some of you guys need to move on and allow new blood to run the group. You
guys can't stay in here forever. As far as I know only Kunich can do that. A
lot of you guys are getting older and it's just not very respectable to talk
the talk when you are way beyond your racing years. I don't know how old
Davy was but he is gone as are many, many others. It's time move on. I don't
climb that well anymore and I am not going to talk the talk if I can do the
work on the bike. Some of you guys are 60+ and still hanging here trying to
run things and challenge guys half your age in arguments posted from your
grandfathers rocking chair. Some of you guys need to know when to move on.
It's fun for a few years, but move on, unless you want to join the Kunich
club, you will be here until you are 90's calling each other names and
hurling insults from Grandpa's rocker.

B-

Sierraman said:

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Sad that someone as smart as you

he's smart probably because he's asian.

Sierraman wrote:
----------

if you don't like these people, why are you reading and replying to
their posts when it's so easy to skip over them? i think you just like
trolling and yelling (and that's what lots of people enjoy doing on
usenet, so don't think i'm coming down on you or singling you out)

heather
ps, this is a rhetorical question

"h squared" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Sierraman wrote:
----------

if you don't like these people, why are you reading and replying to
their posts when it's so easy to skip over them? i think you just like
trolling and yelling (and that's what lots of people enjoy doing on
usenet, so don't think i'm coming down on you or singling you out)

heather
ps, this is a rhetorical question

Are you still here too. Sheeze, I thought you moved on as well.

I'll check back in a few years and see how many of these guys are still
feeding their habit. Yes that's right, I've been venting some, so what,
since I don't hang here much anymore, I will have my say in this thread.

Let's move on.

Bye, bye.

B-

"Sierraman" wrote:
<snip>

Quoted message said:

you will be here until you are 90's calling each other names and
hurling insults from Grandpa's rocker.

I hope so!

Bruce, FWIW, I find many of the people in rbr to be very witty and
entertaining. Admittedly I've not (yet) been on the receiving end of any
particularly caustic barbs, but I'd like to think my skin is thick enough
that I wouldn't care. Plus, thanks to rbr, I've learned many new big words;
I've learned about interesting foods--I can't wait to try the Andouillette
in France this summer!; I've found cool race videos courtesy of Mr. Racket;
and many other things I'm too tired to think of right now. Oh yeah, one
more, just yesterday I got email out of the blue from a guy I raced with 25
years ago because he googled himself and found something I had written on
rbr mentioning him. How cool is that!?!

Anyway, IMHO, I think you have two misconceptions: (1) there are no "rulers"
of a newsgroup and if anyone feels that there are, then they need to
reevaluate their own perceptions; and (2) normal social-interaction
etiquette doesn't apply and there really is no reason it should. FWIW.

Mark

I apologize for insinuating that Jeff Jones might be on crack. Clearly
Bruce is the resident crack smoker in rbr.

-RJ

Sierraman said:

"Me" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 6/11/05 6:46 AM, in article [email hidden], "Kyle

Legate"

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote:

After finding the story on that page THIS was a more interesting read:

At the Athens Summer Olympic Games two months earlier, Arndt won a silver
medal in the women's road race and made headlines around the world for
giving a one-finger salute as she crossed the finish line to the German
cycling federation for leaving Rossner off the 2004 Olympic team. It was a
gesture of solidarity for a teammate who Arndt believed could have helped
propel one of the German cyclists to gold.

That was interesting to me at the time since not only Rossner got shafted,
but Luperini and others got shafted as well by their federations. That's
really cold to shaft your countries best riders

Why? We do it here all the time........

Quoted message said:

like that, and especially
when it comes at the end of their careers. I believe there were others,
can't recall.

Quoted message said:

That Arndt and Rossner were in a committed relationship at the time was
also reported, but Rossner's achievements made Arndt's protest compelling.
Much of the international press printed the fact of their being live-in
girlfriends almost as a sidelight to the incident itself, perhaps a sign
that merely being gay or lesbian isn't enough in certain sport circles to
generate headlines these days.

This problem transcended that issue as they are the best in the world, and I
always enjoyed Arndt. She goes back to racing Luperini way, way back in the
tours TDF's, of the mid 90's and later. Even then she was a stellar climber.

snip-

B-

"Me" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Sierraman said:

"Me" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 6/11/05 6:46 AM, in article [email hidden], "Kyle

Legate"

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote:

After finding the story on that page THIS was a more interesting read:

At the Athens Summer Olympic Games two months earlier, Arndt won a

silver

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

medal in the women's road race and made headlines around the world for
giving a one-finger salute as she crossed the finish line to the German
cycling federation for leaving Rossner off the 2004 Olympic team. It

was a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

gesture of solidarity for a teammate who Arndt believed could have

helped

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

propel one of the German cyclists to gold.

That was interesting to me at the time since not only Rossner got

shafted,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

but Luperini and others got shafted as well by their federations. That's
really cold to shaft your countries best riders

Why? We do it here all the time........

Those are smaller countries and two of the best women ever. That's would be
almost like shafting someone of Lance's statis, telling him he can't ride
the TDF, which happened to Luperini one year. She is basically the symbol of
the women's Giro, but even 2nd last year wasn't good enough for the
federation but hey, that's what happened.

"ronaldo_jeremiah" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I apologize for insinuating that Jeff Jones might be on crack. Clearly
Bruce is the resident crack smoker in rbr.

-RJ

You are another one of those resident [censored] in RBR. You can stay in the
Kunich club too. Glad I am leaving so I won't have to read any more [censored]
from dirtbags.

"Mark Fennell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:9%Gqe.6972$7s.1386@fed1read01...

Quoted message said:

"Sierraman" wrote:
<snip>

Quoted message said:

you will be here until you are 90's calling each other names and
hurling insults from Grandpa's rocker.

I hope so!

Bruce, FWIW, I find many of the people in rbr to be very witty and
entertaining. Admittedly I've not (yet) been on the receiving end of any
particularly caustic barbs, but I'd like to think my skin is thick enough
that I wouldn't care.

It's not about skin not being thick enough. My old best friend trains Navy
Seals and I spent 12 years in Karate. My skin is plenty thick. I just feel
like speaking out against all the abuse and [censored] before I leave
completely. I can have my say, fair enough. Why not, I have had to listen to
a record number of [censored] here for the last couple of years who are the
real RBR destroyers.

Plus, thanks to rbr, I've learned many new big words;

Quoted message said:

I've learned about interesting foods--I can't wait to try the Andouillette
in France this summer!; I've found cool race videos courtesy of Mr.

Racket;

Quoted message said:

and many other things I'm too tired to think of right now. Oh yeah, one
more, just yesterday I got email out of the blue from a guy I raced with

25

Quoted message said:

years ago because he googled himself and found something I had written on
rbr mentioning him. How cool is that!?!

The internet in general is that way, but I don't think I would give rbr
enough credit, certainly not for being a robust forum to discuss bike
racing. If anyone thinks it is, they are on crack. The really robust forums
are in Europe, not here. This forum doesn't have enough substance and what
is used for filler, is what is commonly called the static to noise ratio.
Too much noise for me. I prefer to move on. Too many [censored] here that are
always making personal attacks hiding behind their computers. They would
never say such [censored] to your face in public. Henry has a lot of balls using
his dumbass signature, I could never do that.

Quoted message said:

Anyway, IMHO, I think you have two misconceptions: (1) there are no

"rulers"

Quoted message said:

of a newsgroup and if anyone feels that there are, then they need to
reevaluate their own perceptions; and (2) normal social-interaction
etiquette doesn't apply and there really is no reason it should. FWIW.

Mark

Consider how just how much this forum lacks basic civility, and the records
number of garage posts over the last six months, I think this forum needs a
moderator. Someone who could lock out all the [censored], but's it's Usenet, and
that is the way it is. Some of your points are well taken, but I am just
having my say before exiting. Enjoy Santa Barbara, one of my favorite
places.

B-