Overdosing on GABA???

In article <[email hidden]>,
Bugsy <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

You can overdose on Apples is you to many for to long of a period.

Sure you can. I suppose you can OD on *anything*.

Quoted message said:

If
you are seriously worried, consult a physician not here from the Peanut
Gallery !!

True, "I read it on the Internet/Web" is the last thing any doctor
wants to hear. And I can't say as I blame them. On the other hand:
I imagine OmManiPadmeOmelet was only asking out of curiosity. His
friend is already hospitalized.

Besides: Depending on what is regarded a "traditional medical care"
in the U.S. these days as your sole source of information isn't
guaranteed to get one healthy, and may even kill you. (Did you know
"medical industry" snafus in the U.S. are responsible for more deaths
than all manner of firearms "related" mortality--accidental or
otherwise?) Ever taken antibiotics or any other medication that
kills-off the friendly bacteria in your gut and had a doctor suggest
you replenish after the antibiotic is done doing its work? Speaking
of antibiotics: How often do you see a U.S. doctor literally *refuse*
to write a prescription for antibiotics for a viral infection? Ever
had a doctor suggest something like St. John's Wort, instead of one
of the many expensive, aggressive drugs that have a spotty history,
at best, and produce physical and psychological dependencies? Ever
seen a doctor recommend a simple saline nasal wash or a steaming
regimen, for nasal/sinus issues, as opposed to expensive medication?
The list goes on, and on, and on, and on, ad nauseum.

USAian-style "traditional medicine" has its role, there's no doubt.
But doctors are not gods, the "traditional" medical system does not
have all the answers, and the "traditional" medical system tends not
to be forthcoming with the answers that do not yield it a profit.
That last wouldn't be so bad were it not for the fact that sometimes
the expensive answers injure or kill the patient.

--
Jim Seymour | "It is wrong always, everywhere and
WARNING: The "From:" address is a | for everyone to believe anything upon
spam trap. DON'T USE IT! Use: | insufficient evidence."
[email hidden] | - W. K. Clifford, ca. 1876

"Runs With Knives" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
Bugsy <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

You can overdose on Apples is you to many for to long of a period.

Sure you can. I suppose you can OD on *anything*.

exactly. there is a famous saying, that loosely translated (from the greek
iirc) is that "anything is a poison in the right doses"

it's ALL about dosing

you can die from drinking too much water, for example

whit

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

If
you are seriously worried, consult a physician not here from the Peanut
Gallery !!

True, "I read it on the Internet/Web" is the last thing any doctor
wants to hear. And I can't say as I blame them. On the other hand:
I imagine OmManiPadmeOmelet was only asking out of curiosity. His
friend is already hospitalized.

Besides: Depending on what is regarded a "traditional medical care"
in the U.S. these days as your sole source of information isn't
guaranteed to get one healthy, and may even kill you. (Did you know
"medical industry" snafus in the U.S. are responsible for more deaths
than all manner of firearms "related" mortality--accidental or
otherwise?) Ever taken antibiotics or any other medication that
kills-off the friendly bacteria in your gut and had a doctor suggest
you replenish after the antibiotic is done doing its work? Speaking
of antibiotics: How often do you see a U.S. doctor literally *refuse*
to write a prescription for antibiotics for a viral infection? Ever
had a doctor suggest something like St. John's Wort, instead of one
of the many expensive, aggressive drugs that have a spotty history,
at best, and produce physical and psychological dependencies? Ever
seen a doctor recommend a simple saline nasal wash or a steaming
regimen, for nasal/sinus issues, as opposed to expensive medication?
The list goes on, and on, and on, and on, ad nauseum.

USAian-style "traditional medicine" has its role, there's no doubt.
But doctors are not gods, the "traditional" medical system does not
have all the answers, and the "traditional" medical system tends not
to be forthcoming with the answers that do not yield it a profit.
That last wouldn't be so bad were it not for the fact that sometimes
the expensive answers injure or kill the patient.

--
Jim Seymour | "It is wrong always, everywhere and
WARNING: The "From:" address is a | for everyone to believe anything

upon

Quoted message said:

spam trap. DON'T USE IT! Use: | insufficient evidence."
[email hidden] | - W. K. Clifford, ca.

1876

On 2005-04-18, Runs With Knives penned:

Quoted message said:

USAian-style "traditional medicine" has its role, there's no doubt.
But doctors are not gods, the "traditional" medical system does not
have all the answers, and the "traditional" medical system tends not
to be forthcoming with the answers that do not yield it a profit.
That last wouldn't be so bad were it not for the fact that sometimes
the expensive answers injure or kill the patient.

It's not just that. No one doctor can possibly know everything about
everything. It never hurts to look around and ask about what you've
seen. A good doctor will either say, "I've heard about that too, but
I don't think it's a good idea for you, and here's why," or "Sure,
let's try it," or, "I hadn't heard about that, but I'll read up on it
and find out." A bad doctor will say, "Oh, you read that on the
intarweb? Bad patient! I know all! Raaarrr!"

--
monique

"Hugh Beyer" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

In a related, unrelated, dog fact, most dog foods have traces of
pentobarbital in them, thanks to the use of euthanized animals. Which is
why I only use one of the handful of super-premium dog foods available
in the US. 'Cause they don't. Among other reasons.

I'll bite. Brands?

www.canidae.com
www.merrickpetcare.com
www.oldmotherhubbard.com
www.f-r-r.com
www.naturapet.com
www.naturalbalanceinc.com
www.bluebuff.com
www.solidgoldhealth.com

I use the first two, as well as treats and biscuits from the third. I do not
recomment the last, Solid Gold, as their misleading advertising would make a
used car salesman blush.

The pet food industry has convinced the public and most vets that quality of
ingredients is unimportant, that all that matters is a certain % of
nutrients...%protein, %fat, % calcium, %phosphorus, etc. That way, they can
use [censored] in their foods. You could LITERALLY make a "proper" dog food from
the slop shoveled off the slaughterhouse floor mixed with the right amount
of elephant [censored].

The pet food industry, herein referrred to Hill's, as they are the worst
offender, whines about the use of the term "human grade ingredient",
claiming there is no legal definition. There isn't. But the super-premium
dog food companies listed above all us the term in the same way you or I
would: ingredients that you'd feed your kids for dinner. And their %
nutrients are all just fine.

So, if feeding your dog pentobarbital-laced road kill is OK with you, Hill's
Science Diet, Purina, Eukanuba, Iams, Nutro, etc, are just dandy. If,
however, free range chicken meat, or New Zealand lamb meat, etc., sound
better, the above brands will do your pet well. For only a small increase in
cost.

Go to websites, read the ingredient lists, decide for yourself.

David

On 2005-04-18, David Cohen penned:

Quoted message said:

The pet food industry has convinced the public and most vets that
quality of ingredients is unimportant, that all that matters is a
certain % of nutrients...%protein, %fat, % calcium, %phosphorus,
etc. That way, they can use [censored] in their foods. You could LITERALLY
make a "proper" dog food from the slop shoveled off the
slaughterhouse floor mixed with the right amount of elephant [censored].

The pet food industry, herein referrred to Hill's, as they are the
worst offender, whines about the use of the term "human grade
ingredient", claiming there is no legal definition. There isn't. But
the super-premium dog food companies listed above all us the term in
the same way you or I would: ingredients that you'd feed your kids
for dinner. And their % nutrients are all just fine.

Amen. I feed my cat canned Wellness (Old Mother Hubbard). It doesn't
smell like regular catfood at all; in fact, it smells like you could
happily slather it on a cracker and chow down. Haven't tried that,
though ...

--
monique

"Monique Y. Mudama" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

On 2005-04-18, David Cohen penned:

Quoted message said:

The pet food industry has convinced the public and most vets that
quality of ingredients is unimportant, that all that matters is a
certain % of nutrients...%protein, %fat, % calcium, %phosphorus,
etc. That way, they can use [censored] in their foods. You could LITERALLY
make a "proper" dog food from the slop shoveled off the
slaughterhouse floor mixed with the right amount of elephant [censored].

The pet food industry, herein referrred to Hill's, as they are the
worst offender, whines about the use of the term "human grade
ingredient", claiming there is no legal definition. There isn't. But
the super-premium dog food companies listed above all us the term in
the same way you or I would: ingredients that you'd feed your kids
for dinner. And their % nutrients are all just fine.

Amen.

Hallelujah!

Quoted message said:

I feed my cat canned Wellness (Old Mother Hubbard).

Excellent stuff.

Quoted message said:

It doesn't
smell like regular catfood at all; in fact, it smells like you could
happily slather it on a cracker and chow down.

Indeed. While Canidae homogenizes their canned dog food, so it looks like
dog food, Merrick cans their ingredients as is, so that it looks like, and
essentially is, people food. The ingredient list from one of their many
varieties of canned dog food: venison, water, fresh red jacket new potatoes,
fresh carrots, fresh zucchini, fresh sugar peas, fresh red delicious apples,
potato starch, egg, dried blueberry, menhaden fish meal, olive oil, then a
list of the vitamins and minerals added. It looks and smells like the
venison stew that it is.

Quoted message said:

Haven't tried that, though ...

Me, either. But in case of World War III, the dog will have to fight me for
the dog food 🙂

David

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

So, if feeding your dog pentobarbital-laced road kill is OK with you,
Hill's Science Diet, Purina, Eukanuba, Iams, Nutro, etc, are just dandy.
If, however, free range chicken meat, or New Zealand lamb meat, etc.,
sound better, the above brands will do your pet well. For only a small
increase in cost.

Woo-hoo. But maybe my kids should eat this good, too.

Hugh

--
Experience keeps a dear school, but fools will attend no other.

In article <[email hidden]>,

David Cohen said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

David Cohen said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote
> "David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> "OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote
>> > I've always thought that an overdose of K+ would work best,
>> > providing
>> > you could get it,
>>
>> That's the professional method, but extremely painful in a conscious
>> person.
>> It would be very difficult to do it to yourself.
>
> Painful? Really?
> Why? I thought that too high of a K+ level just made your heart
> stop???

Injecting concentrated potassium chloride into a vein causes extreme pain
if
you're conscious. Very caustic.

Oh. Ok, I was thinking Oral potassium, but I guess that it is not
possible to OD even with prescription potassium?

You could, but, the effects wouldn't be immediate. Or reliably fatal. But
access isn't a problem. KCL is available as a salt substitute in
supermarkets and as a water softener, instead of NaCl. So, you just dissolve
as much as you can in some water, and inject it. Sterility isn't really a
problem, since you're committing suicide.

Ouch.
I think the vodka/barbecue method would be less trouble. ;-)

But, for now at least, I think life is a better option. <lol>

I don't think god would appreciate having his/her gift thrown away like
that.

Oh, nevermind. You are an athiest. <G> I'm just agnostic.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> Then again, the vet uses Phenobarbital.

No. Pentobarbital. Same class, different drug.

I could swear the bottle he took the drug out of said Phenobarb, but my
memory could be faulty. It was a few years ago.

The names are nearly identical, and doctors and nurses have been known to
mix them up. Not me, of course, those other people.

Pentobarb, phenobarb, pentathol...three commonly used drugs in intensive
care medicine, easily mixed up.

Now you are scaring me!
Remind me to never land in ICU...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

In a related, unrelated, dog fact, most dog foods have traces of
pentobarbital in them, thanks to the use of euthanized animals. Which is
why
I only use one of the handful of super-premium dog foods available in the
US. 'Cause they don't. Among other reasons.

Damn. Is that really true?
I use Purina by my vet's recommendations.

Most vets, like most people doctors, know what little about nutrition that
they learned in school. And, in vet's case, that nutrition education is
bought and paid for by the Hill's pet food company.

I saw your brand recommendations and will look into them.

Thank you.

Is it possible to home make your own dog food and do a good job?
I've got a bunch of old venison in the freezer that is probably going to
be too freezer burned for human consumption, and I'd hate to waste it. I
have a meat grinder and a pressure cooker...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I 'spose I could switch if it'd make a difference in my dog's health,
especially the two elderly ones.

Do what you think is best. I wouldn't feed Purina to my worst enemy's dog.

Point taken!

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

And the paramedics. You know you're in trouble when the INSIDE of the
windows are covered with flies.

Been there, done that.

Quoted message said:

Ew. I thought you were a nurse, not a paramedic???

Am, was.

David

And I can see why......

Quoted message said:

--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>, "sangfroid" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

"Runs With Knives" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
Bugsy <[email hidden]> writes:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

You can overdose on Apples is you to many for to long of a period.

Sure you can. I suppose you can OD on *anything*.

exactly. there is a famous saying, that loosely translated (from the greek
iirc) is that "anything is a poison in the right doses"

it's ALL about dosing

you can die from drinking too much water, for example

whit

Word... ;-)
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

DZ 'S13N3 !1! said:

OmManiPadmeOmelet said:

Will Brink said:

> A friend of mine tried to commit suicide a couple of days ago by
> taking an overdose of GABA. According to her, she felt she would
> have a heart attack and die.

Talk about a cry for help. Your friend aint the brightest bulb is she?
My favorite is when a chick tries to commit suicide by an overdose of
birth controll pills.

No, she's not too bright.
And she needs some serious help.

You shouldn't be sharing your GABA with that friend in the first
place. If anything, it's probably expired by now 🙂

DZ

Not mine actually.
I don't use it.

Her boyfriend bought it for her......
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

In article <[email hidden]>,

David Cohen said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Is it possible to home make your own dog food and do a good job?
I've got a bunch of old venison in the freezer that is probably going to
be too freezer burned for human consumption, and I'd hate to waste it. I
have a meat grinder and a pressure cooker...

It's absolutely possible, but, for me, too much work. There are a bunch of
books and websites devoted to the topic.

I figure if I'm not willing to make mayself or my daughter a home-cooked,
fresh-ingredient , diet, I'm not going to do so for the dog.

David

Cool... I'll do some Googling then.
I imagine that Vionate for the added vitamins would work well.
I've used it for raising young poultry before, but it's a universal
supplement for all animals and it has dosage recommendations for
a variety of critters (including Ostriches, Llamas and other exotics)
listed on the side of the can.

I'm game to give it a try.... ;-)
I hate to waste stuff and I REALLY need to clean out that deep freeze!

Thank you!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-[censored]." -Jack Nicholson

On 2005-04-19, David Cohen penned:

Quoted message said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Is it possible to home make your own dog food and do a good job?
I've got a bunch of old venison in the freezer that is probably
going to be too freezer burned for human consumption, and I'd hate
to waste it. I have a meat grinder and a pressure cooker...

It's absolutely possible, but, for me, too much work. There are a
bunch of books and websites devoted to the topic.

I figure if I'm not willing to make mayself or my daughter a
home-cooked, fresh-ingredient , diet, I'm not going to do so for the
dog.

My aunt feeds her dog home-cooked stuff. For cats, you need to be
careful because without enough of certain supplements, they'll go
blind. Taurine is a biggy; not sure if there are others.

--
monique

David Cohen schreef:

Quoted message said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

David Cohen said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote

>I've always thought that an overdose of K+ would work best, providing
>you could get it,

That's the professional method, but extremely painful in a conscious
person.
It would be very difficult to do it to yourself.

Painful? Really?
Why? I thought that too high of a K+ level just made your heart stop???

Injecting concentrated potassium chloride into a vein causes extreme pain if
you're conscious. Very caustic.

Taking it orally wouldn't work?

Berna

--
( )_( ) Berna M. Bleeker-Slikker
/ . . \ [email hidden]
\ \@/ / http://www.volksliedjes.nl

"Berna Bleeker" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

David Cohen schreef:

Quoted message said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote:
>"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote
>
>>I've always thought that an overdose of K+ would work best, providing
>>you could get it,
>
>That's the professional method, but extremely painful in a conscious
>person.
>It would be very difficult to do it to yourself.

Painful? Really?
Why? I thought that too high of a K+ level just made your heart stop???

Injecting concentrated potassium chloride into a vein causes extreme pain
if you're conscious. Very caustic.

Taking it orally wouldn't work?

Much slower, not reliably fatal.

David

David Cohen said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

David Cohen said:

If you ever want to kill yourself, I'm the guy to ask.

Heh. I'll keep that in mind...

I've always thought that an overdose of K+ would work best, providing
you could get it,

That's the professional method, but extremely painful in a conscious person.
It would be very difficult to do it to yourself.

Quoted message said:

or maybe a big dose of heparin and a very large needle
and tubing leading into a 5 gallon bucket....... <smirk>

That's the "hot bath and longitutinal wrist cuts" method...no heparin
needed.

I can never remember whether it's "down the road" or "across the
street". Why don't they do a better job of teaching this in school?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Then there is the "barbecue method"...... CO production anyone?

Simple but effective.

The upstairs tenants over the garage REALLY don't like it, though.

David

-----------
Proton Soup

"And all this peace has been deceiving,
I need some wind to get me sailing"

"Proton Soup" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

David Cohen said:

"OmManiPadmeOmelet" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

"David Cohen" <[email hidden]> wrote:
> If you ever want to kill yourself, I'm the guy to ask.

Heh. I'll keep that in mind...

I've always thought that an overdose of K+ would work best, providing
you could get it,

That's the professional method, but extremely painful in a conscious
person.
It would be very difficult to do it to yourself.

Quoted message said:

or maybe a big dose of heparin and a very large needle
and tubing leading into a 5 gallon bucket....... <smirk>

That's the "hot bath and longitutinal wrist cuts" method...no heparin
needed.

I can never remember whether it's "down the road" or "across the
street". Why don't they do a better job of teaching this in school?

Really. With so much emphasis in US public schools on how to have safe sex,
why criminals have more rights than victims, why Islamic fundamentalist
terrorists are just misunderstood, and why Ronald Reagan had nothing to do
with the fall of the Soviet Union, you would think they would do a better
job of teaching suicide mnemonics.

David