OT: iPOD Owners Rejoice!

Ride-A-Lot said:

Yeh, it's OT but I'm sharing...

Can someone explain the hysteria over this ipod? I just don't get it.

JohnH said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Yeh, it's OT but I'm sharing...

Can someone explain the hysteria over this ipod? I just don't get it.

60GB iPod = $449

1500 Vinyl LP's and CD's = $20,000

Being able to put my entire collection on one device that I can take
anywhere and listen to = priceless.

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws

JohnH said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Yeh, it's OT but I'm sharing...

Can someone explain the hysteria over this ipod? I just don't get it.

Assuming you know what it is (if not, it's a walkman-style music device
that can hold thousands of songs so you never need to swap discs to
listen to all your stuff) I think the hysteria is mostly around clever
marketing of a sleek device.
I've had a hard drive based MP3 player for several years (made by
Creative Labs) and got it before the iPod hit the scene. The Apple
marketing team brought the formerly geeky device into the mainstream and
made it cool. They also created a music store that doesn't make them any
money on it's own, but it helps sell millions of iPods. Very clever and
very effective. The iPod has brought Apple back to being a tech
superpower again.

In regard to the OP: I guess that's cool, but this (mp3 conversion) has
been possible for some time, and why someone would buy a copy protected
file of lower quality than a CD at a higher price and not get the
artwork and the power to do what ever you want with your own music is
beyond me. The conversion of one lossy format to another is going to
further reduce the sound quality. I'll generally just buy the CD (for
less than the same songs would cost on iTunes), rip it to a higher
bitrate MP3 than what iTunes (or any of the other music stores that have
popped up) uses and have the freedom to move the file from computer to
computer, player to player, whatever I want.

Oh, and for anyone considering an iPod, do your homework and make sure
there isn't a much less expensive option out there that will do what you
want (or more). Unless you just want it to make you cool, that is.

Matt

JohnH said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Yeh, it's OT but I'm sharing...

Can someone explain the hysteria over this ipod? I just don't get it.

Who's hysterical. They're a nifty device. For $300 bucks I can listen
to my whole music collection (about 12 GB) from a box of nearly
insignificant size. I find it well worth the price.
Cell phones with lousy digital cameras-that I don't get.

Shawn

Shawn said:

JohnH said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Yeh, it's OT but I'm sharing...

Can someone explain the hysteria over this ipod? I just don't get
it.

Who's hysterical. They're a nifty device. For $300 bucks I can
listen to my whole music collection (about 12 GB) from a box of nearly
insignificant size. I find it well worth the price.
Cell phones with lousy digital cameras-that I don't get.

Shawn

the trick is getting that whole music collection onto the computer. What do
I do with 4 cases of vinyl I haven't touched in 15 years that still has some
good stuff?

penny

Ride-A-Lot said:

JohnH said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Yeh, it's OT but I'm sharing...

Can someone explain the hysteria over this ipod? I just don't get
it.

60GB iPod = $449

60 GB Creative Nomad Zen Xtra = $278

This is what I don't get. Ipods are way more expensive than other things,
and yet they sell like hotcakes.

Quoted message said:

1500 Vinyl LP's and CD's = $20,000

AFAIK, an ipod comes with $0 worth of music.

Quoted message said:

Being able to put my entire collection on one device that I can take
anywhere and listen to = priceless.

Oh definitely. I use my laptop for that kind of thing in the car or on a
plane; it does the job quite well, plus I can watch videos, listen to
streaming internet stations via cellular modem etc. It's much more
versatile.

I don't listen to music while riding or running so I guess I'm once again
in the minority.

Quoted message said:

and made it cool. They also created a music store that doesn't make
them any money on it's own, but it helps sell millions of iPods. Very
clever and very effective. The iPod has brought Apple back to being a
tech superpower again.

Repackaging something that's already been done and creating a money losing
store makes them a "tech superpower"? Seems to me they're more of a
"marketing superpower".

JohnH said:

Can someone explain the hysteria over this ipod? I just don't get it.

The iPod has become "more than a music player", its become a fashion
accessory necessary for hipness. Any trend-conscious high-schooler would
want one (for the 20 or so songs they listen to). Just look at the
commercials...they don't say a word about what it does; its all about
dancing around with white earbuds (funny thing is, their buds are [censored]
just like any other player).

That aside, its also a decent little music player. Its functionality is
pretty poor compared to the competition, but its fairly reliable and fits
in the pocket better than most equivalent players. I take mine with me
anytime I suspect I'll be waiting for any length of time. The ability to
just listen to whatever I feel like, whenever I feel like it, is more
enjoyable that I imagined it would be.

To the OP: thanks for the (very dated) links. I've been using jhymn for
some time now...but really I just prefer to avoid iTunes music. Their
quality is too poor for the price, and converting it to a non-proprietary
format only makes it worse. DRM penalizes customers for doing the right
thing, and buying DRM-restricted music sends the wrong message. I will get
the free songs if they're good, though. :-)

--
-BB-
To e-mail me, unmunge my address

small change said:

Shawn said:

JohnH said:

Ride-A-Lot wrote:

>Yeh, it's OT but I'm sharing...

Can someone explain the hysteria over this ipod? I just don't get
it.

Who's hysterical. They're a nifty device. For $300 bucks I can
listen to my whole music collection (about 12 GB) from a box of nearly
insignificant size. I find it well worth the price.
Cell phones with lousy digital cameras-that I don't get.

Shawn

the trick is getting that whole music collection onto the computer. What do
I do with 4 cases of vinyl I haven't touched in 15 years that still has some
good stuff?

penny

Use Sony Soundforge.

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws

MattB said:

JohnH said:

Ride-A-Lot said:

Yeh, it's OT but I'm sharing...

Can someone explain the hysteria over this ipod? I just don't get it.

Assuming you know what it is (if not, it's a walkman-style music device
that can hold thousands of songs so you never need to swap discs to
listen to all your stuff) I think the hysteria is mostly around clever
marketing of a sleek device.
I've had a hard drive based MP3 player for several years (made by
Creative Labs) and got it before the iPod hit the scene. The Apple
marketing team brought the formerly geeky device into the mainstream and
made it cool. They also created a music store that doesn't make them any
money on it's own, but it helps sell millions of iPods. Very clever and
very effective. The iPod has brought Apple back to being a tech
superpower again.

In regard to the OP: I guess that's cool, but this (mp3 conversion) has
been possible for some time, and why someone would buy a copy protected
file of lower quality than a CD at a higher price and not get the
artwork and the power to do what ever you want with your own music is
beyond me. The conversion of one lossy format to another is going to
further reduce the sound quality. I'll generally just buy the CD (for
less than the same songs would cost on iTunes), rip it to a higher
bitrate MP3 than what iTunes (or any of the other music stores that have
popped up) uses and have the freedom to move the file from computer to
computer, player to player, whatever I want.

Oh, and for anyone considering an iPod, do your homework and make sure
there isn't a much less expensive option out there that will do what you
want (or more). Unless you just want it to make you cool, that is.

Matt

One thing I like about the Apple Music Store is that I can get the few
songs I like from a CD for a few bucks rather than spending > $10 for
the same few songs.
As for fidelity. I can't hear the difference between AAC at 128 kb/s
and uncompressed CD, MP3 is a different story. Maybe it's my system,
maybe it's my ears (more likely, lots of years commuting with my car
system cranked).
Maybe doing this all on a Mac makes it easier than on a PC as well.

Shawn

JohnH said:

Quoted message said:

and made it cool. They also created a music store that doesn't make
them any money on it's own, but it helps sell millions of iPods. Very
clever and very effective. The iPod has brought Apple back to being a
tech superpower again.

Repackaging something that's already been done and creating a money losing
store makes them a "tech superpower"? Seems to me they're more of a
"marketing superpower".

Well, I call them a tech superpower because all the money from those
iPods is giving this tech company a huge capitol infusion. They're
actually doing some pretty cool things (IMO) with their operating system
and hardware on the computer side of things and I bet without all this
iPod money the R&D wouldn't be so well-funded.
But you are correct, they definitely are a marketing superpower first.

Matt

Shawn said:

One thing I like about the Apple Music Store is that I can get the few
songs I like from a CD for a few bucks rather than spending > $10 for
the same few songs.

But pretty much EVERY online music store sells songs of better quality for
that much or less. Of course, the other stores are competing with each
other, and competition is good for consumers.

Since the iPod doesn't work with any music stores except iTunes, there is
no competition and Apple can get away with lower-quality music that uses
less of their bandwidth. The thing that makes iTunes so popular is that
its part of a proprietary environment that works well with the iPod (~90%
of the market) and nothing else. It gets people even more heavily invested
in iPods, by making it easy to spend a lot of money on music that won't
work on anything not made by Apple. Even if Apple loses a lot of market
share, many people will still have to buy iPods because that's the only
thing their music works with. After all the complaining they've done about
Microsoft, its amazing how quickly Apple started exhibiting the same
monopolistic behavior (complete with lawsuits) when they took over a
product market.

Quoted message said:

As for fidelity. I can't hear the difference between AAC at 128 kb/s
and uncompressed CD, MP3 is a different story. Maybe it's my system,
maybe it's my ears (more likely, lots of years commuting with my car
system cranked).

I can't tell the difference if I'm using cheap earbuds. With better
headphones I certainly can. On my high-end home stereo, the quality loss
is very noticeable, and I pretty much stick to CDs.

Personally I prefer eMusic.com - the music is all mp3 at a higher bitrate,
at a much lower cost. Its mostly indie music, but that's what I prefer
anyway.

--
-BB-
To e-mail me, unmunge my address

Shawn <sdotcurry@bresnananotherdotnet> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

As for fidelity. I can't hear the difference between AAC at 128 kb/s
and uncompressed CD, MP3 is a different story. Maybe it's my system,
maybe it's my ears (more likely, lots of years commuting with my car
system cranked).
Maybe doing this all on a Mac makes it easier than on a PC as well.

Shawn

I can't contest the quality of your hearing, but if you are using the stock
headphones that came with /any/ player, it's undoubtedly the system. Invest
in a good pair of headphones and you'll definitely hear a difference
between compressed and uncompressed files.

Considering the amount of money already spent on the player and files, I
would suggest investing in a pair of Etymotic Er-4P's. No other bud style
headphones compare. And most open and closed systems as well.

Dave

Dave said:

Shawn <sdotcurry@bresnananotherdotnet> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

As for fidelity. I can't hear the difference between AAC at 128 kb/s
and uncompressed CD, MP3 is a different story. Maybe it's my system,
maybe it's my ears (more likely, lots of years commuting with my car
system cranked).
Maybe doing this all on a Mac makes it easier than on a PC as well.

Shawn

I can't contest the quality of your hearing, but if you are using the stock
headphones that came with /any/ player, it's undoubtedly the system. Invest
in a good pair of headphones and you'll definitely hear a difference
between compressed and uncompressed files.

I can't hear the difference on my home system, either through speakers
or headphones. Same songs, same volume (well close anyway). The only
advantage with CDs is that I can get more volume than when my iPod is
hooked in through a normal RCA line-in. Haven't tried the optical
output of my Mac through my stereo yet though.

Quoted message said:

Considering the amount of money already spent on the player and files, I
would suggest investing in a pair of Etymotic Er-4P's. No other bud style
headphones compare. And most open and closed systems as well.

$200+ Pass, hearing's not that good!

Shawn

(PeteCresswell) said:

Per BB:

Quoted message said:

That aside, its also a decent little music player. Its functionality is
pretty poor compared to the competition,

I also use mine to ferry data between client sites. I've got portable hard
drives and I've got thumb drives - but the iPod is there anyhow and it has the
capacity.

I use it as data storage as well when traveling, plus it holds and
displays my pictures.

Quoted message said:

Also, last time I rode through Valley Forge park; if I saw 100 people
walking/rollerblading/running/cycling with earbuds stuck in their ears, I'd say
that at least 85 of the wires were white.

On your left... Bam! I'd like to spend a day there watching how many
people get clipped.

--
o-o-o-o Ride-A-Lot o-o-o-o
www.schnauzers.ws

BB wrote:
<snip>

Quoted message said:

I can't tell the difference if I'm using cheap earbuds. With better
headphones I certainly can. On my high-end home stereo, the quality loss
is very noticeable, and I pretty much stick to CDs.

It's definitely a subjective thing. I can hear the difference with a
128k AAC and my preferred compression scheme, LAME using the "alt preset
standard" setting. That creates a variable bitrate file that can vary
from 96 to 320k depending on how complex that passage of audio is. It
makes reasonably sized files and they sound good to me. I've encoded
most of my 700 CDs to this format and now usually just listen to
streamed MP3s on my home stereo and don;t bother with CD much anymore.

I also bought a 30 Gb Zen Xtra on eBay with a bad hard drive for $40 and
put my own 80 Gb drive in it. I'm up to about 9000 tracks and still have
20 Gb of space left.

My car stereo can take a line input from my Zen or play data CDs filled
with MP3s, which is really convenient. At the settings I like I can fit
about 10 albums on a single CD. I usually just keep a few of those in
the car for everyday listening and only hook up the Zen for longer
trips. It keeps the original CDs safe at home as a backup too.

Quoted message said:

Personally I prefer eMusic.com - the music is all mp3 at a higher bitrate,
at a much lower cost. Its mostly indie music, but that's what I prefer
anyway.

eMusic is great. The selection isn't what the big guys have but there's
a lot of quality music available. I also like Magnatune, which is even
less mainstream than eMusic, but there's a lot of interesting music and
you can stream it all to try before you buy. I've bought several albums
from them and often listen to their stuff when I'm in the mood to hear
something different.

Matt

(PeteCresswell) wrote:
<snip>

Quoted message said:

Sounds to me like a business plan whose days are numbered.

Live and learn....

You'd think, but it looks like business is booming. It's a great
business plan as long as you're not on the consumer end. I just don't
want to be on that end of the deal, it sucks for the end user!

Matt

(PeteCresswell) said:

Per small change:

Quoted message said:

What do
I do with 4 cases of vinyl I haven't touched in 15 years that still has some
good stuff?

You can rip it to digital. I use something called "CyberCorder 2000" - but I'd
guess there are dozens of such utilities.

The catch is that, unless you rip an entire side at a time, it's something of a
time sink standing over it for each and every track and then going back to edit
the lead-ins and endings.

Use CDwave (www.CDWave.com).
It's free, allows for recording and editing, and can automatically find
the track breaks and split the file for you. It's great.

The sound quality will be affected by your stylus, turntable, amp, state
of the vinyl, and your sound card. A good sound card will make a lot of
difference because crappy ones are often REALLY bad.

Matt

Per Ride-A-Lot:

Quoted message said:

Being able to put my entire collection on one device that I can take
anywhere and listen to = priceless.

And my neighbor's collection and my wife's collection and my #1 daughter's
collection and my #2 daughter's collection.....-)

It's not so much the iPod as the device type. iPod is just one of many -
although that's the one I chose.

The killer feature is having ALL your music in one place - whether for use in
the living room, bedroom, some doctor's waiting room, or on the road.

Once you get a few thousand tracks on something like that, you can kill time
anywere just browsing.
--
PeteCresswell