Ot-AOL quoting 'style'

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

In spite of David Ds ranting and ravings and in spite of the fact
that all other ISP quoting sytles look great in AOL....I am
interested in changing the 'settings' so that my quoites look better,
so....

First, somebody copy and send me my posts as you see them. I am
curious how they look and second, I have wandered all around all the
preferences and settings menus I can find and have not found anything
that suggests how to change the settings so you guys that think
computers are more important than bicycles can read my quotes, Help
me out here!!

So David from the UK doesn't get his knickers in a knot no mo'...

Peter, your post above appears perfectly normal (duh). However, your
replies (like the one copied below) are a tad verklempt (or "overslept" as
Bill Gates suggests):

***
cartley-<< Getting a new BB and crankset for my old road bike. It is
currently
7
speed Ultegra 6400, SIS rear, friction front, non-STI. I am getting
the Ultegra 6500 crank and bottom bracket (on sale, since the 10-speed
6600 stuff is coming out). >><BR><BR>
<< I just read the instructions (always a mistake...) that come with the
crank, and it says to use only with compatible chain, CN-HG92 or
CN-7700. Is that really a big deal? I've always used Sedis chains
with good results and was planning on putting one of those on when I
get it all back together. >><BR><BR>

No problem to use a non 9s chain with this crank, we have done this dozens
of
times, using a SRAM PC-48(8s chain).
***

Again, YOUR words are formatted fine; it's what you /quote/ that's more
messed up than Bill Baka's brainwaves.

Perhaps Carl Fogel's suggestion (elsewhere) on checking a box for
"Internet-style quoting" or whatever will work? Otherwise, perhaps another
AOLer can offer help.

OK, just flapping fingers at this point...
--
BS (no, really)

On 13 Nov 2004 14:42:32 GMT, [email hidden] (Qui si parla

Campagnolo ) said:

In spite of David Ds ranting and ravings and in spite of the fact that all
other ISP quoting sytles look great in AOL....I am interested in changing the
'settings' so that my quoites look better, so....

First, somebody copy and send me my posts as you see them. I am curious how
they look and second, I have wandered all around all the preferences and
settings menus I can find and have not found anything that suggests how to
change the settings so you guys that think computers are more important than
bicycles can read my quotes, Help me out here!!

So David from the UK doesn't get his knickers in a knot no mo'...

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Dear Peter,

If the option for switching to "internet style quoting"
doesn't show up in your mail preferences, your version of
AOL may be older than 4.0--the quoting option was offered at
least that far back.

(A quick glance through my bin of ISP CD's shows that AOL is
up to at least version 9.0.)

So if you're using a version so old that it doesn't show up
in mail preferences, the only solution is to upgrade and
switch from high-wheeler to safety-bicycle.

If your hardware or operating system are so old that they
don't support AOL 4.0 or newer, then you'd have to replace
them--and you'd probably be pleased by the impressive speed
increase of even the oldest system at a used computer store.

(While I know little about AOL, I can give the example of an
MS-DOS operating system whose Windows 3.x can connect to the
internet by cable modem at full modern speed, but cannot get
mail from many ISP's or even display some sites. The ancient
Windows 3.x program lacks the necessary features.)

To see what things look like, have a friend (or librarian at
a Boulder library internet station) go to rec.bicycles.tech
through google groups and click on almost any of your posts:

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&group=rec.bicycles.tech

or http://tinyurl.com/2d5y4

In internet-style quoting, your program automatically places
a single > in front of each line of the first poster's
material, two >>'s in front of every line of the second
poster's stuff, three >>>'s for every line of the third
poster, and so on.

One advantage is that the whole block of quoted stuff is
marked off on every line, so what's quoted is obvious and
easy to skip.

(In the literary criticism business, where we often quote
one boring critic whose nonsense includes a quote from
another boring critic, whose lies included a quote from an
actual author, we use the same trick without the
greater-than signs by indenting the whole quoted passage and
then indenting the quote-within-the-quote even further.)

Another advantage is that with two or three or four
different posters all mingled together, each one is indented
to a different depth--one, two, three, or four >'s--so that
it's much easier to figure out who was mistaken about what.

Many programs even change the color of each block of quoted
text, so that the current poster's text is black, the first
quoted poster shows up in purple, the next green, the third
in orange, and so on.

The idea is to make it easy to see at glance who said what
and when the next paragraph was written by someone else.

The AOL quoting style, unfortunately, just sets off the
beginning and the end of a whole chunk with one << and
another >>. The reader has to look at the beginning of every
paragraph for a single <<, and then browse along until the
closing pair of >>'s appears, instead of being able to see
at a glance where one poster's lines begin and end.

Again, if you can get to google groups, you can explore the
whole matter without even joining--anyone can browse and see
how the AOL-style posts look versus the style used by
everyone else. If you want to try a sample post, it's free
to join (they just want a email address) and has its own
simple editor for posting:

http://tinyurl.com/2d5y4

Search for vecchio, and all your posts will show up. Browse
around a little, and I expect that you'll find that the
internet-style quoting makes like much easier. (Like any
program, google groups will baffle a new user at first, but
you can't hurt anything.)

Carl Fogel

Quoted message said:

So if you're using a version so old that it doesn't show up
in mail preferences, the only solution is to upgrade and
switch from high-wheeler to safety-bicycle.

Or you could switch to a standalone newsreader; there are plenty of
free ones around. As far as I know there's no reason a regular
newsreader shouldn't work with AOL -- regular browsers do.

--
Ray Heindl
(remove the Xs to reply to: [email hidden])

On 13 Nov 2004 20:28:37 GMT, Ray Heindl <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

So if you're using a version so old that it doesn't show up
in mail preferences, the only solution is to upgrade and
switch from high-wheeler to safety-bicycle.

Or you could switch to a standalone newsreader; there are plenty of
free ones around. As far as I know there's no reason a regular
newsreader shouldn't work with AOL -- regular browsers do.

Dear Ray,

A standalone newsreader might work, but I suspect that Peter
may be using such a--well, such a venerable operating system
that it might lead to more problems.

I'm also wary of expecting other programs to work with AOL,
which has a quirky reputation. Here's just one example of
problems with older AOL versions:

http://aroundcny.com/technofile/texts/aol-hell_00.html

Both my sisters, on the other hand, seem happy with their
AOL accounts. Of course, they may have more modern systems
than Peter and use the internet purely for private email and
shopping.

Carl Fogel

Quoted message said:

Or you could switch to a standalone newsreader; there are plenty of
free ones around. As far as I know there's no reason a regular
newsreader shouldn't work with AOL -- regular browsers do.

This is so far off topic it's funny but it won't work with AOL's email system
which is theirs and theirs alone.
Phil Brown

Ray Heindl said:

Quoted message said:

So if you're using a version so old that it doesn't show up
in mail preferences, the only solution is to upgrade and
switch from high-wheeler to safety-bicycle.

Or you could switch to a standalone newsreader; there are plenty of
free ones around. As far as I know there's no reason a regular
newsreader shouldn't work with AOL -- regular browsers do.

No, AOL gates the normal news feed into their own system, so you're stuck using
their software.

You may be able to connect to a completely different news server though. I've
heard AOL blocks this, but it's worth a try.

I heartily recommend news.individual.net. It's free, but you have to get a
username and password, which may take a few days. They carry just text-only
newsgroups, like rec.bicycles.* Find them on the web at www.news.individual.net
Get a username and password, fire up the newsreader of your choice, plug in the
settings, and give it a whirl.

Matt O.

carl Writes-<< If the option for switching to "internet style quoting"
doesn't show up in your mail preferences, your version of
AOL may be older than 4.0--the quoting option was offered at
least that far back. >><BR><BR>

Just the opposite, I have AOL for Mac, OX system 10..the latest that there is.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Otay then..
I received 5 emails that copied my quotes and posts and sorry David, I ain't
gonna change anything. If you are all sweated up about a few "<<BR>>" then
that's just too bad.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

(Qui si parla Campagnolo ) said:

carl Writes-<< If the option for switching to "internet style
quoting" doesn't show up in your mail preferences, your version of
AOL may be older than 4.0--the quoting option was offered at least
that far back. >><BR><BR>

Just the opposite, I have AOL for Mac, OX system 10..the latest that
there is.

Hmmm. If there is not a setting for correct posting using a proper
quote string in the software AOL provides you (which I would find very
surprising; it ought to be in the Preferences and would be quite a
significant oversight if it's not there), you could look at one of
many other newsreaders. Unison seems quite good; MT-NewsWatcher is
excellent and free. Thunderbird from the Mozilla project is liked by
many people, or you can use the newsreader built into Mozilla (Safari
having no such capabilities).

Your posts would be eminently more readable if you were using normal
Usenet posting styles rather than AOL's dysfunctional one, which
looks to be both weird and HTML-based (given the <BR><BR> tags that
follow every block of quoted text in your posts).

(Qui si parla Campagnolo ) said:

I received 5 emails that copied my quotes and posts and sorry David,
I ain't gonna change anything. If you are all sweated up about a few
"<<BR>>" then that's just too bad.

There are standards and conventions in Usenet which exist for a
reason, same as there are standards in bicycle design. When someone
doesn't follow those standards reasonably closely, it makes things
more difficult for others. I'm sad to see that you seem to think
that's a good thing, when you could change this in a matter of seconds
and frankly no skin off your nose.

I'll admit I don't understand your attitude. People have been asking
you to change your posting style- for years- so that they can more
easily read what you have to say. Seems to me that's a compliment to
you.

On 14 Nov 2004 15:07:58 GMT, [email hidden] (Qui si parla

Campagnolo ) said:

carl Writes-<< If the option for switching to "internet style quoting"
doesn't show up in your mail preferences, your version of
AOL may be older than 4.0--the quoting option was offered at
least that far back. >><BR><BR>

Just the opposite, I have AOL for Mac, OX system 10..the latest that there is.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Dear Peter,

Unbelievably, having that version of AOL may explain why you
can't find the option to switch to normal internet-style
quoting. Below is a post on the subject--and no, the irate
poster received no answers. Possibly an even newer version
offered a fix.

Carl Fogel

Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 20:05:17 EST
From: JonesR
Subject: AOL 5 > AOL '10.2' loses quoting style

I still use AOL 5.0 for Mac OS X (revision 4113.20) as
opposed to the newer ridiculously named version 10.2
(revision 4136.16) for one simple reason: You cannot change
quoting preferences out of the non standard default of AOL
Style quoting.

Is there a newer build available (Keyword Update says NO),
or a way to go into a preferences file hidden in OS X for
AOL 10.2, to change the quoting preferences to something
more standard for Usenet posting, if it is switchable? I
will not use the newer version of AOL until this problem is
properly addressed.

Apparently, the mail server did capture my old settings in
the new AOL, but the newsgroup reader is hobbled by <<AOL
Style Quoting>>. Any suggestions?

http://www.macintouch.com/aol5.html

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

Otay then..
I received 5 emails that copied my quotes and posts and sorry David, I ain't
gonna change anything. If you are all sweated up about a few "<<BR>>" then
that's just too bad....

And just as soon as Peter Chisholm raises our hopes that he has seen the
light, he dashes them in a fit of petulance.

--
Tom Sherman

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] wrote:
So if you're using a version so old that it doesn't show up
in mail preferences, the only solution is to upgrade and
switch from high-wheeler to safety-bicycle.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Ray Heindl <[email hidden] wrote:
Or you could switch to a standalone newsreader; there are plenty of
free ones around. As far as I know there's no reason a regular
newsreader shouldn't work with AOL -- regular browsers do.

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] wrote:
A standalone newsreader might work, but I suspect that Peter
may be using such a--well, such a venerable operating system
that it might lead to more problems.
I'm also wary of expecting other programs to work with AOL,
which has a quirky reputation. Here's just one example of
problems with older AOL versions:
http://aroundcny.com/technofile/texts/aol-hell_00.html

-snip-

That was interesting. He notes that AOL will _effect_ a
dial-up connection. So at least that's useful - if you need one.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

A Muzi said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>[email hidden] wrote:
>So if you're using a version so old that it doesn't show up
>in mail preferences, the only solution is to upgrade and
>switch from high-wheeler to safety-bicycle.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Ray Heindl <[email hidden] wrote:
Or you could switch to a standalone newsreader; there are plenty of
free ones around. As far as I know there's no reason a regular
newsreader shouldn't work with AOL -- regular browsers do.

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] wrote:
A standalone newsreader might work, but I suspect that Peter
may be using such a--well, such a venerable operating system
that it might lead to more problems.
I'm also wary of expecting other programs to work with AOL,
which has a quirky reputation. Here's just one example of
problems with older AOL versions:
http://aroundcny.com/technofile/texts/aol-hell_00.html

-snip-

That was interesting. He notes that AOL will _effect_ a
dial-up connection. So at least that's useful - if you need one.

Dear Andrew,

Here's a fill-in-your-city-or-area-code guide to free and
cheap ISP's:

http://www.all-free-isp.com/index.php

Once you see an ISP, you can click on it and get details,
including links to the ISP's dialup numbers.

It's useful for comparing details and for when you're
frustrated by an ISP that hides its list of dialup numbers.

Carl Fogel

Tim-<< When someone
doesn't follow those standards reasonably closely, it makes things
more difficult for others. I'm sad to see that you seem to think
that's a good thing, when you could change this in a matter of seconds
and frankly no skin off your nose.

I'll admit I don't understand your attitude. People have been asking
you to change your posting style- for years- so that they can more
easily read what you have to say. Seems to me that's a compliment to
you.

It hasn't been 'for years' and as I asked, I got no information nor could I
find anything in all the preferences and settings pages on the versiion(version
for Mac OX10).

I'll change it, tell me how Tim...but as I stated, the 5 examples of quoting I
received were just as I typed them with a bit of <BR> on them, something I saw
on your post on the NG as well.

Help me quote so that you can easily read it but I think it's not nearly as
problematic as you and David say.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Tim-<< Your posts would be eminently more readable if you were using normal
Usenet posting styles rather than AOL's dysfunctional one, which
looks to be both weird and HTML-based (given the >><BR><BR>

Copy one of mine and send it to me via direct email...I gotta see what you are
talking about.

As I stated, i have wandered all artound all the preferences of NG and WWW and
see nothing that refers to 'internet sytrle posting'. If it's there, HELP ME
OUT TIM!!!

I'm not gonna change newsrearders, AOL is just too easy for this computer
idiot.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Okay carl, so there is no way to change the quoting style for the AOL for Max
OSX...

If you are familiar with OSX, it also has a dual running operating system, OS9,
that is for older applications not compatible with OSX...I don't have any other
version than the AOL for OSX..

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Quoted message said:

From: vecchio

Quoted message said:

Okay carl, so there is no way to change the quoting style for the AOL for Max
OSX...

If you are familiar with OSX, it also has a dual running operating system,
OS9,
that is for older applications not compatible with OSX...I don't have any
other version than the AOL for OSX.

That post was "spaced" so as to be easy to read. Some Vecchio posts (and those
from a few other posters) get "bunched" with quotes packed into blocks of text
with no paragraphs, at least on my screen.

I use AwOL (5.0, pre-COLORS, yuck) and do the trimming, quoting etc. with
keystrokes. Time consuming. I don't see a newsreader preference for quoting
styles in my AOL glop, but there is one for email.
--TP

Tom Paterson said:

Quoted message said:

From: vecchio

Quoted message said:

Okay carl, so there is no way to change the quoting style for the
AOL for Max OSX...

If you are familiar with OSX, it also has a dual running operating
system, OS9,
that is for older applications not compatible with OSX...I don't
have any other version than the AOL for OSX.

That post was "spaced" so as to be easy to read.

That's because he didn't QUOTE anything.

Quoted message said:

Some Vecchio posts
(and those from a few other posters) get "bunched" with quotes packed
into blocks of text with no paragraphs, at least on my screen.

Those are typically replies (with quoting). Can only think of one other
poster who does similar (though not same) formatting.

Not naming names,

--
BS (no, really)