NY Times story

On Fri, 11 May 2007 12:40:22 -0400, Roger Zoul <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Pat wrote:
::
:: Didn't anyone else see it?

Got link?

I never saw it.

--
Bob in CT

"I am surprised that this story came out two days ago and no one here
has
commented on it. Basically, the gist of it was that a person's body has
a
weight that seems right for it and after dieting will return to that
weight.

There were some studies done with obese people on diets and skinny
people
being sort of force fed extra calories. Once both studies stopped, both
groups of people returned to their previous weights.

Didn't anyone else see it?"

Yes, it is as you said:

'Genes Take Charge, and Diets Fall by the Wayside'

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/08/health/08fat.html

I am surprised that this story came out two days ago and no one here has
commented on it. Basically, the gist of it was that a person's body has a
weight that seems right for it and after dieting will return to that weight.

There were some studies done with obese people on diets and skinny people
being sort of force fed extra calories. Once both studies stopped, both
groups of people returned to their previous weights.

Didn't anyone else see it?

Pat in TX

Pat said:

I am surprised that this story came out two days ago and no one here has
commented on it. Basically, the gist of it was that a person's body has a
weight that seems right for it and after dieting will return to that weight.

There were some studies done with obese people on diets and skinny people
being sort of force fed extra calories. Once both studies stopped, both
groups of people returned to their previous weights.

Didn't anyone else see it?

Yes, I saw it. The study seems flawed. They lost with 600 cal/day
diets. We know that this is non-sustainable dieting, right? Or at
least we're pretty sure.

To my understanding, even post read of that article, the key to a
sustained weight loss is a sustained diet that's in balance with your
body. But we know this. If you go Atkins, then stop and go back to
what you were doing, you will regain. With interest. If you continue
to keep your carbs at or below your critical level for maintenance,
and don't eat too much, you will maintain your loss.

Something that would be interesting might look like this:
If there is a set meter, how long does it take to reset it? And what
can you do to improve the reset?

I'm going to guess that building muscle will help reset it. I've heard
some yak about artificial sweeteners fixing it higher. I dunno if I
buy that, but it might make sense with observation.

Again, what we know is what we know, and that is it takes a
sustainable change to make a sustainable difference.

Hollywood said:

Something that would be interesting might look like this:
If there is a set meter, how long does it take to reset it? And what
can you do to improve the reset?

The adoption study showed that adopted children tended to be
overweight or not based on their biological parents propensity to
overweight.

That implies that the "set" is genetic.

Pat said:

I am surprised that this story came out two days ago and no one here has
commented on it.

Hi everyone,

When I read the article, I searched for the hint that the psychological
factors had not been ignored in that study.

Does anybody here thinks, like I do, that weight problems are, in many
case, linked to a psychological unbalance (is that a word? I mean
'disorder', but not with so strong a meaning).

For instance, I know several people that went through a metamorphosis
only after they got their freedom from a specific person that would ruin
their life whithout even wanting it.
Be it a husband they had just divorced from, be it a beloved one that
had passed away, etc...
Suddenly, these persons "felt" freedom and their habit changed without
them even noticing. And their body changed too. Like it changed in the
beginning when the problem had settled down in their life. Silently.
Effortlessly. And if you asked these persons how it dis happened, they
will just says "just like this".

These kind of 'studies' results, for me is quite a confirmation that I
might be right about what I noticed.

Anyway, the message that's sent with this article, for the moment: don't
bother losing weight: you will gain it back because you are programmed too.
All the existing pill seller are not going to be thrilled, right? But I
hope that ther will not be a following study that proves the efficiency
of any substance that could suppress the genetic fatality of weight
problems.

What do you think?

Huey

Maybe the problem with the 400 pound people is that they don't have a set
point.

Pat wrote:
|
| What I was wondering after reading the story was this: are they
| talking about people who go on year after year about 30-50 pounds
| overweight or are they including people who are in the 400 pound
| category? I see people who look like the Michelin man and think
| there must be something else going on with them to account for all of
| that weight. I have a hard time believing their bodies have 400
| pounds as a set point.
|
| Also, one of my sons has always been thin. People kept telling me,
| "Don't worry, he'll fill out when he gets into his twenties." Well,
| he's 30 now and he's still thin. He's 6'2" and about 145-150 pounds.
| No body fat that anyone can find. Somehow, I don't think he is going
| to be worrying about being obese. So, maybe the set point theory is
| right when it comes to thin people, at least.
|
| Pat in TX
|
| Pat in TX

Quoted message said:

Anyway, the message that's sent with this article, for the moment: don't
bother losing weight: you will gain it back because you are programmed
too.
All the existing pill seller are not going to be thrilled, right? But I
hope that ther will not be a following study that proves the efficiency of
any substance that could suppress the genetic fatality of weight problems.

Huey

What I was wondering after reading the story was this: are they talking
about people who go on year after year about 30-50 pounds overweight or are
they including people who are in the 400 pound category? I see people who
look like the Michelin man and think there must be something else going on
with them to account for all of that weight. I have a hard time believing
their bodies have 400 pounds as a set point.

Also, one of my sons has always been thin. People kept telling me, "Don't
worry, he'll fill out when he gets into his twenties." Well, he's 30 now
and he's still thin. He's 6'2" and about 145-150 pounds. No body fat that
anyone can find. Somehow, I don't think he is going to be worrying about
being obese. So, maybe the set point theory is right when it comes to thin
people, at least.

Pat in TX

Pat in TX

Quoted message said:

I read the NYT story and didnt care much for it at all. They took a
bunch of very overweight people and put them in the hospital and fed
them liquid diets and wouldnt give them much real food. Soon enough
they lost weight. Then they let them out of the hospital and will
power was so weak and "fat genes" were so strong that low and behold
they regained all the weight. So to these scientists this proves that
our weight is genetically determined. I dont believe this at all. In
order to lose weight a person's palate has to be retrained. He needs
a new cuisine that he can love. Its not will power and genes.

FOB said:

Maybe the problem with the 400 pound people is that they don't have a set
point.

Pat wrote:

|
| What I was wondering after reading the story was this: are they
| talking about people who go on year after year about 30-50 pounds
| overweight or are they including people who are in the 400 pound
| category? I see people who look like the Michelin man and think
| there must be something else going on with them to account for all of
| that weight. I have a hard time believing their bodies have 400
| pounds as a set point.
|
| Also, one of my sons has always been thin. People kept telling me,
| "Don't worry, he'll fill out when he gets into his twenties." Well,
| he's 30 now and he's still thin. He's 6'2" and about 145-150 pounds.
| No body fat that anyone can find. Somehow, I don't think he is going
| to be worrying about being obese. So, maybe the set point theory is
| right when it comes to thin people, at least.
|
| Pat in TX
|
| Pat in TX

"honeybunch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I read the NYT story and didnt care much for it at all. They took a
bunch of very overweight people and put them in the hospital and fed
them liquid diets and wouldnt give them much real food. Soon enough
they lost weight. Then they let them out of the hospital and will
power was so weak and "fat genes" were so strong that low and behold
they regained all the weight. So to these scientists this proves that
our weight is genetically determined. I dont believe this at all. In
order to lose weight a person's palate has to be retrained. He needs
a new cuisine that he can love. Its not will power and genes.

There was more to the story than that. More to the study than that.

Pat in TX

Quoted message said:

Hollywood said:

Something that would be interesting might look like this:
If there is a set meter, how long does it take to reset it? And what
can you do to improve the reset?

The adoption study showed that adopted children tended to be
overweight or not based on their biological parents propensity to
overweight.

That implies that the "set" is genetic.

However, having a fixed "set point" doesn't do a good job of
explaining steady weight gain. For example, someone who gains 5
pounds per year. Not a whole lot at any time (that's only 50 calories
per day above the breakeven point in calories) but after 20 years they
are 100 pounds heavier than when they started. But you should
theoretically be able to halt that by changing just one can of soda
per day from regular to diet. I think we all have an idea of how
effective that tends to be. So yes, there may well be other factors
at work.

It may also be that the "set point" takes a certain amount of time to
change and that the studies being reported on were too brief for this
effect to occur - they dealt with RAPID weight loss and RAPID gain.
But there are certainly lots of people who gain a few pounds every
year. On a Standard American Diet I was one of them. On a reduced
carbohydrate diet I lost a little at first and then held even. I've
been holding even for several years now. While it's better than
gaining, it's not as good as losing. But it suggests that how the
body works with a "set point" might depend on factors such as the type
of food being eaten. (Not proven, not with a sample of only one -
just suggestive.)

Pat said:

There was more to the story than that. More to the study than that.

Yes, there were several separate studies.

It doesn't seem like most responses here actually read them though.

Quoted message said:

Pat said:

There was more to the story than that. More to the study than that.

Yes, there were several separate studies.

It doesn't seem like most responses here actually read them though.

people regain their previous weight because they do not maintain it.
to lose weight and keep it off is a lifestyle change and people don't
seem to understand that. there is a program out there that i just
discovered that helps you lose 9-15 lbs in 9 days and then helps you
maintain it. it also helps you clean your body of all the toxins and
keep you healthy from all the "bad stuff" in our world today. go to
www.amfit.isagenix.com for more info. the site is currently under
construction for the week-end but will be up and running on monday.
thanks.

Pat wrote:
::
:: Spare us the pseudoscientific "clean your body of all the toxins"
:: garbage! That's for idiots only.

🙂

<>

Quoted message said:

people regain their previous weight because they do not maintain it.
to lose weight and keep it off is a lifestyle change and people don't
seem to understand that. there is a program out there that i just
discovered that helps you lose 9-15 lbs in 9 days and then helps you
maintain it. it also helps you clean your body of all the toxins and
keep you healthy from all the "bad stuff" in our world today. go to
@##$%%$# for more info. the site is currently under
construction for the week-end but will be up and running on monday.
thanks.

Spare us the pseudoscientific "clean your body of all the toxins" garbage!
That's for idiots only.

Quoted message said: