NY marathon people: terrain-sensitive split calculator

<<
nikerunning.com has a webpage that includes an altitude profile and
a calculator that computes splits -- taking into account terrain. For
example, based on a goal of 2:54:40 (6:40 average), the first mile
(up the verrazano narrows bridge) has a 7:19 split, the second mile a
6:15. The other miles have much less deviation from goal pace as the
first two miles are by far the greatest elevation change on the course.
The second greatest, and the most deadly is the queensboro bridge -- 6:56
going up, 6:34 going back down. Yeah, that's not an average of 6:40,
hills are so unfair like that (-;

Requires a free reg.

They also have a similar calc for chicago (dead even splits because of no
hills) and san francisco (damn, that course looks tough) marathon.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi >>

Thanks DonVon!

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Lanceandrew said:

Quoted message said:

the first mile

(up the verrazano narrows bridge)
___
..that's where they could refine/tweek things a bit. for all, the nyc marathon
has 3 starting positions designated by color (red, blue, green...i believe).
<again, they're managing 35,000+ runners>.

1/3 of he runners will have a Green Start, which is the lower level of the
Verrazano bridge. 2/3'rds (Blue and Red) will be on top of the bridge w/a
view of all of brooklyn and nyc (having no ceiling).

I have a green bib. But I have a team start, which means we're lining up behind
the elites. So I suppose I'll be on top of the bridge.

Quoted message said:

The elites men & women start at the top of the bridge as does 2/3rds of the
35K field of runners w/blue and green starts. i would guess
models/calculators are based on the top start.

Looks like it.

Quoted message said:

What does this all mean? The lower level of the bridge/is flat, the upper
level is arched up and an incline. But it also has a decline which perhaps
negates the incline...I don't know.

You don't get it all back. According to the calculator, you come out 15 seconds
behind. It's important to take this into account when looking at your splits --
it means that if you're 5 seconds faster than goal pace, you're probably going
too fast.

Quoted message said:

It would not shock me to learn the Green runners have a bit of an advantage
over the other runners due to the topology. May seem like a non-issue in a
Marathon but lots of people don't BQ by seconds....

IMO if seconds is going to make or break a BQ, and you want the BQ that badly,
you probably should pick some other race besides NY to do it. I know local
runners who took a trip to Chicago to get their qualifier.

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

Quoted message said:

the first mile

(up the verrazano narrows bridge)
___
...that's where they could refine/tweek things a bit. for all, the nyc marathon
has 3 starting positions designated by color (red, blue, green...i believe).
<again, they're managing 35,000+ runners>.

1/3 of he runners will have a Green Start, which is the lower level of the
Verrazano bridge. 2/3'rds (Blue and Red) will be on top of the bridge w/a view
of all of brooklyn and nyc (having no ceiling).

The elites men & women start at the top of the bridge as does 2/3rds of the 35K
field of runners w/blue and green starts. i would guess models/calculators are
based on the top start.

What does this all mean? The lower level of the bridge/is flat, the upper
level is arched up and an incline. But it also has a decline which perhaps
negates the incline...I don't know. The upper level runners (blue and red) run
one path for the first 4 miles or so...and the green runners run a different
path for the first 4 miles or so. They converge at around the 5 mile mark or
so having gone the same distance...but I don't know the topology of the upper
blue/red runners. I ran the green route last year under the top. This year I
will be on top and a blue runner.

I liked running Green as with this s i was not tempted to look at the city of
Brooklyn and island of Manhattan and enormity of it all. Many say if you run
up top, don't look at the cities before you ahead...as it can overhwhelm you
and distract you.

It would not shock me to learn the Green runners have a bit of an advantage
over the other runners due to the topology. May seem like a non-issue in a
Marathon but lots of people don't BQ by seconds....

Again, I am blue, but if I had my choice, I'd take green.

[Lanceanddrew]
<< Again, I am blue, but if I had my choice, I'd take green. >>

Ah, me, too.
But Blew's nice.
True, too.

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Couple of points:

Quoted message said:

1/3 of he runners will have a Green Start, which is the lower level of the
Verrazano bridge. 2/3'rds (Blue and Red) will be on top of the bridge w/a view
of all of brooklyn and nyc (having no ceiling).

The Red start is now the Orange start. One explanation I heard
(non-official) is that they changed it to more closely match the
colors of the title sponsor, ING.

Quoted message said:

The elites men & women start at the top of the bridge as does 2/3rds of the 35K
field of runners w/blue and green starts. i would guess models/calculators are
based on the top start.

I'm sure they are.

Quoted message said:

The upper level runners (blue and red) run
one path for the first 4 miles or so...and the green runners run a different
path for the first 4 miles or so. They converge at around the 5 mile mark or
so having gone the same distance...

Actually they converge at mile 8. I spectated last year at mile 7 and
they were still separate (on opposite sides of that avenue -- Fourth?
-- in Brooklyn). I think Blue and Orange converge shortly after coming
off the bridge, somewhere in mile 3.

Quoted message said:

It would not shock me to learn the Green runners have a bit of an advantage
over the other runners due to the topology. May seem like a non-issue in a
Marathon but lots of people don't BQ by seconds....

It should only make a few seconds' difference, I'd think. And as
Donovan said, if seconds count for your BQ you might look for a faster
course anyway.

Quoted message said:

Again, I am blue, but if I had my choice, I'd take green.

I'm green! Bib #3059. My first NYCM!

See y'all there!

--
Brian P. Baresch
Fort Worth, Texas, USA
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