Non-pharmaceutical alternatives to Lipitor?

[email hidden] (Mark V.) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I have a friend who has been prescribed lipitor by their doctor and
told they'll need to be on it for the rest of their life.

Does anyone know of a tested alternative to lipitor? I prefer a
response from someone who has experienced that alternative themselves
(or have a close friend or relative who responded positively) than
someone who is trying to sell something.

Thanks.

It's free, but not necessarily "alternative":

Diet and exercise.

My father in law had high blood pressure, diabetes, congestive heart
failure and high cholesterol. He was on a raft of meds, but once he
started a modest exercise regimen and modified his diet (consequently
losing about 50 lb), all four of the conditions I just mentioned
simply went away.

High blood pressure, high cholesterol, type II diabetes...all can be
worsened by obesity and inactivity, and all can (to some degree) be
helped by lifestyle modifications.

Have your friend discuss this with his/her doctor before trying it
their own.

Mark, MD

"Mark" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (Mark V.) wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I have a friend who has been prescribed lipitor by their doctor and
told they'll need to be on it for the rest of their life.

Does anyone know of a tested alternative to lipitor? I prefer a
response from someone who has experienced that alternative themselves
(or have a close friend or relative who responded positively) than
someone who is trying to sell something.

Thanks.

It's free, but not necessarily "alternative":

Diet and exercise.

My father in law had high blood pressure, diabetes, congestive heart
failure and high cholesterol. He was on a raft of meds, but once he
started a modest exercise regimen and modified his diet (consequently
losing about 50 lb), all four of the conditions I just mentioned
simply went away.

High blood pressure, high cholesterol, type II diabetes...all can be
worsened by obesity and inactivity, and all can (to some degree) be
helped by lifestyle modifications.

Have your friend discuss this with his/her doctor before trying it
their own.

Let me put a big second on that.

Last February, in the depth of a cold, bitter, winter, my cholesterol was
found to be at the upper limits of normal. AFAIAC< it was still too high,
and, I wanted to knock it down.

Since my diet is 90% on track for cholesterol lowering, I did not expect to
get the desired result from improving it. However, i did want to get more
exercise.

My schedule during the work week is pretty hectic, but i do spend most of
the time in my office these days. I let the younger guys do the early
morning surveillances.

So, I began walking the mile to work, then home for a late lunch and to get
my son off the wheelchair lift bus, and then back to the office and home
again in the evening. A total of 4 miles a day.

Instead of allowing myself 10 minutes to get out of the office, get the car,
drive home, park, etc. I allowed myself 15 minutes to walk it, thus adding
60 minutes a day of exercise.

I do it rain or shine, snow or sleet, etc.

My cholesterol dropped 40 mgs. since February.

Your mileage may vary, but, you have to add mileage (pun intended).

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It's free, but not necessarily "alternative":

Diet and exercise.

My father in law had high blood pressure, diabetes, congestive heart
failure and high cholesterol. He was on a raft of meds, but once he
started a modest exercise regimen and modified his diet (consequently
losing about 50 lb), all four of the conditions I just mentioned
simply went away.

High blood pressure, high cholesterol, type II diabetes...all can be
worsened by obesity and inactivity, and all can (to some degree) be
helped by lifestyle modifications.

Have your friend discuss this with his/her doctor before trying it
their own.

Let me put a big second on that.

Last February, in the depth of a cold, bitter, winter, my cholesterol was
found to be at the upper limits of normal. AFAIAC< it was still too high,
and, I wanted to knock it down.

That was my prescription, too, as I personally hold quasi-Christian
Science values. But her doctors have insisted that it is too high, and
that lipitor is the only solution.

[email hidden] (Mark V.) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It's free, but not necessarily "alternative":

Diet and exercise.

My father in law had high blood pressure, diabetes, congestive heart
failure and high cholesterol. He was on a raft of meds, but once he
started a modest exercise regimen and modified his diet (consequently
losing about 50 lb), all four of the conditions I just mentioned
simply went away.

High blood pressure, high cholesterol, type II diabetes...all can be
worsened by obesity and inactivity, and all can (to some degree) be
helped by lifestyle modifications.

Have your friend discuss this with his/her doctor before trying it
their own.

Let me put a big second on that.

Last February, in the depth of a cold, bitter, winter, my cholesterol was
found to be at the upper limits of normal. AFAIAC< it was still too high,
and, I wanted to knock it down.

That was my prescription, too, as I personally hold quasi-Christian
Science values. But her doctors have insisted that it is too high, and
that lipitor is the only solution.

If they're insisting that she try the drugs *before* seeing if diet
and exercise have any effect, it's time for her to seek a second
opinion (unless, of course, there's a geniune contraindication to her
exercising). Just my humble opinion, but the 'statins aren't exactly
completely benign drugs and non-pharmacologic interventions, if
effective, are always preferable in my mind.

Mark, MD

"Mark V." <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It's free, but not necessarily "alternative":

Diet and exercise.

My father in law had high blood pressure, diabetes, congestive heart
failure and high cholesterol. He was on a raft of meds, but once he
started a modest exercise regimen and modified his diet (consequently
losing about 50 lb), all four of the conditions I just mentioned
simply went away.

High blood pressure, high cholesterol, type II diabetes...all can be
worsened by obesity and inactivity, and all can (to some degree) be
helped by lifestyle modifications.

Have your friend discuss this with his/her doctor before trying it
their own.

Let me put a big second on that.

Last February, in the depth of a cold, bitter, winter, my cholesterol

was

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

found to be at the upper limits of normal. AFAIAC< it was still too

high,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and, I wanted to knock it down.

That was my prescription, too, as I personally hold quasi-Christian
Science values. But her doctors have insisted that it is too high, and
that lipitor is the only solution.

Let me ask this:

While this discussion has been going on, has she changed her diet, lifestyle
even one iota?

If not, then she should take the medication, as she will probably never make
the changes until after her first serious consequence, the one I am working
hard to avoid.

I made the original decision to change lifestyle/eating when it first became
apparfent that what i was doing was not working as well as I wanted. If she
is not motivated, then meds are her best bet, IMNSHO, non-medical, opinion.

"Mark" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

[email hidden] (Mark V.) wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> It's free, but not necessarily "alternative":
>
> Diet and exercise.
>
> My father in law had high blood pressure, diabetes, congestive heart
> failure and high cholesterol. He was on a raft of meds, but once he
> started a modest exercise regimen and modified his diet

(consequently

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> losing about 50 lb), all four of the conditions I just mentioned
> simply went away.
>
> High blood pressure, high cholesterol, type II diabetes...all can be
> worsened by obesity and inactivity, and all can (to some degree) be
> helped by lifestyle modifications.
>
> Have your friend discuss this with his/her doctor before trying it
> their own.

Let me put a big second on that.

Last February, in the depth of a cold, bitter, winter, my cholesterol

was

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

found to be at the upper limits of normal. AFAIAC< it was still too

high,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and, I wanted to knock it down.

That was my prescription, too, as I personally hold quasi-Christian
Science values. But her doctors have insisted that it is too high, and
that lipitor is the only solution.

If they're insisting that she try the drugs *before* seeing if diet
and exercise have any effect, it's time for her to seek a second
opinion (unless, of course, there's a geniune contraindication to her
exercising). Just my humble opinion, but the 'statins aren't exactly
completely benign drugs and non-pharmacologic interventions, if
effective, are always preferable in my mind.

Agreed. However, if the patient has been told and has made no effort to
change, then it is time for meds. I do not advocate waiting a few months
while the patient makes up their mind.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Mark said:

If they're insisting that she try the drugs *before* seeing if diet
and exercise have any effect, it's time for her to seek a second
opinion (unless, of course, there's a geniune contraindication to her
exercising). Just my humble opinion, but the 'statins aren't exactly
completely benign drugs and non-pharmacologic interventions, if
effective, are always preferable in my mind.

We know you don't really mean that, Mark. You evil pill-pushing
MDs never suggest wholesome, natural alternatives -- it's all part
of Evil Organized Medicine.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
"If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

[email hidden] (David Wright) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Mark said:

If they're insisting that she try the drugs *before* seeing if diet
and exercise have any effect, it's time for her to seek a second
opinion (unless, of course, there's a geniune contraindication to her
exercising). Just my humble opinion, but the 'statins aren't exactly
completely benign drugs and non-pharmacologic interventions, if
effective, are always preferable in my mind.

We know you don't really mean that, Mark. You evil pill-pushing
MDs never suggest wholesome, natural alternatives -- it's all part
of Evil Organized Medicine.

Yeah...it's all a ploy to lure new patients into my practice so I can
load 'em up with drugs and get my kickback checks from Merck and Lilly
for prescribing their drugs...

....wait...I've never made reference to exactly where I work. I guess
others have made that effort. I'll have to thank her/"them" for that.

Mark, MD

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Non-pharmaceutical alternatives to Lipitor?
From: [email hidden] (Mark)
Date: 12/5/2003 5:27 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (David Wright) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

Mark said:

If they're insisting that she try the drugs *before* seeing if diet
and exercise have any effect, it's time for her to seek a second
opinion (unless, of course, there's a geniune contraindication to her
exercising). Just my humble opinion, but the 'statins aren't exactly
completely benign drugs and non-pharmacologic interventions, if
effective, are always preferable in my mind.

We know you don't really mean that, Mark. You evil pill-pushing
MDs never suggest wholesome, natural alternatives -- it's all part
of Evil Organized Medicine.

Yeah...it's all a ploy to lure new patients into my practice so I can
load 'em up with drugs and get my kickback checks from Merck and Lilly
for prescribing their drugs...

Right, you settle for pushing aspartame.
..
http://www.doesaspartamekill.iwarp.com/contact.html

Jan

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Non-pharmaceutical alternatives to Lipitor?
From: [email hidden] (Mark)
Date: 12/5/2003 5:27 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (David Wright) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
Mark <[email hidden]> wrote:

>If they're insisting that she try the drugs *before* seeing if diet
>and exercise have any effect, it's time for her to seek a second
>opinion (unless, of course, there's a geniune contraindication to her
>exercising). Just my humble opinion, but the 'statins aren't exactly
>completely benign drugs and non-pharmacologic interventions, if
>effective, are always preferable in my mind.

We know you don't really mean that, Mark. You evil pill-pushing
MDs never suggest wholesome, natural alternatives -- it's all part
of Evil Organized Medicine.

Yeah...it's all a ploy to lure new patients into my practice so I can
load 'em up with drugs and get my kickback checks from Merck and Lilly
for prescribing their drugs...

Right, you settle for pushing aspartame.

Jan

No, Jan, that's a lie. I do not "push" aspartame in any sense of the
word; I do not encourage people to consume it, I do not sell it, and
I do not advocate it as a cure or treatment for anything.

What I *do* is discourage people from believing that nearly every
human health complaint can be traced back to aspartame.

Mark, MD

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Non-pharmaceutical alternatives to Lipitor?
From: [email hidden] (Mark)
Date: 12/6/2003 2:12 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Non-pharmaceutical alternatives to Lipitor?
From: [email hidden] (Mark)
Date: 12/5/2003 5:27 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (David Wright) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...
> In article <[email hidden]>,
> Mark <[email hidden]> wrote:
>
> >If they're insisting that she try the drugs *before* seeing if diet
> >and exercise have any effect, it's time for her to seek a second
> >opinion (unless, of course, there's a geniune contraindication to her
> >exercising). Just my humble opinion, but the 'statins aren't exactly
> >completely benign drugs and non-pharmacologic interventions, if
> >effective, are always preferable in my mind.
>
> We know you don't really mean that, Mark. You evil pill-pushing
> MDs never suggest wholesome, natural alternatives -- it's all part
> of Evil Organized Medicine.
>

Yeah...it's all a ploy to lure new patients into my practice so I can
load 'em up with drugs and get my kickback checks from Merck and Lilly
for prescribing their drugs...

Right, you settle for pushing aspartame.

Jan

No, Jan, that's a lie. I do not "push" aspartame in any sense of the
word; I do not encourage people to consume it, I do not sell it, and
I do not advocate it as a cure or treatment for anything.

What I *do* is discourage people from believing that nearly every
human health complaint can be traced back to aspartame.

Mark, MD

Uh huh.

*There is no sound scientific evidence to support the proposition that
aspartame causes the things claimed by those articles you found on the
internet.*

*Substantial* *real* *solid* *convincing* *hard* *clear-cut* *reasonable*
*significant* *credibile* *compelling* *valid*

ZZzz.

*there is no valid evidence to cause the scientific/medical community to
believe that aspartame is dangerous.*

ZZzz.

Jan

Policosanol?

BL

"As the waves pass the rock, their shape is changed. There is a hologram of
the rock within the wave that comes forward and crashes on the beach, then
there's a reflected wave back." Ralph Abraham

"I'd like to learn to windsurf." BL

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Right, you settle for pushing aspartame.

Jan

No, Jan, that's a lie. I do not "push" aspartame in any sense of the
word; I do not encourage people to consume it, I do not sell it, and
I do not advocate it as a cure or treatment for anything.

What I *do* is discourage people from believing that nearly every
human health complaint can be traced back to aspartame.

Mark, MD

Uh huh.

*There is no sound scientific evidence to support the proposition that
aspartame causes the things claimed by those articles you found on the
internet.*

*Substantial* *real* *solid* *convincing* *hard* *clear-cut* *reasonable*
*significant* *credibile* *compelling* *valid*

ZZzz.

*there is no valid evidence to cause the scientific/medical community to
believe that aspartame is dangerous.*

ZZzz.

Jan

Exactly. You lied when you claimed that I push aspartame. Nothing
you posted comes close to demonstrating that I push aspartame.

Mark, MD

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Non-pharmaceutical alternatives to Lipitor?
From: [email hidden] (Mark)
Date: 12/6/2003 7:30 PM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

[email hidden] (Jan) wrote

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>
> Right, you settle for pushing aspartame.
>
> Jan

No, Jan, that's a lie. I do not "push" aspartame in any sense of the
word; I do not encourage people to consume it, I do not sell it, and
I do not advocate it as a cure or treatment for anything.

What I *do* is discourage people from believing that nearly every
human health complaint can be traced back to aspartame.

Mark, MD

Uh huh.

*There is no sound scientific evidence to support the proposition that
aspartame causes the things claimed by those articles you found on the
internet.*

*Substantial* *real* *solid* *convincing* *hard* *clear-cut* *reasonable*
*significant* *credibile* *compelling* *valid*

ZZzz.

*there is no valid evidence to cause the scientific/medical community to
believe that aspartame is dangerous.*

ZZzz.

Jan

Exactly

That's what I thought.

Quoted message said:

*Substantial* *real* *solid* *convincing* *hard* *clear-cut* *reasonable*

Quoted message said:

*significant* *credibile* *compelling* *valid*

Quoted message said:

You lied when you claimed that I push aspartame. Nothing
you posted comes close to demonstrating that I push aspartame.

Mark, MD

You must mean nothing *Substantial* *real* *solid* *convincing* *hard*
*clear-cut* *reasonable*
*significant* *credibile* *compelling* *valid*

*;*

Jan