nice SUV article

"Zoot Katz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Somedays in some neighbourhoods people's fire places or barbeques cause the most reeking offenses
but at least they're quiet.

Unlike Zit, who reeks and is not quiet.

Stephen Harding said:

... Something more recent?

-- Running a 2-stroke lawnmore for one hour generates as much pollution as running 40 1995 cars
for the same amount of time.

-- Running a 2-stroke chainsaw for 2 hours generates as much smog forming HC pollution as
driving 10 1995 cars 250 miles each.

-- The refueling of lawn and garden equipment results in the spillage of 17 million gallons of
gasoline per year; more than the Exxon Valdez oil spill eqivalent.

Small engine machinery is a heck of a lot easier to do without than your car (no matter what
sort), and pushing a reel lawn mower is somewhat like bike commuting: you get a job done and get
exercise at the same time.

I'd worry more about my neighbor's lawn mower than his SUV!

I knew about those comparison statistics, and you do have a point about small engine pollution.
However, I disagree with your last sentence. Pollution is only one problem of SUVs. There are many
others. As one example, I'm sure my neighbor's lawn mower won't come crashing through the side door
of my car, but his SUV may.

On the balance, I prefer concentrate on the SUVs. I'll continue to chide those who approve of them.
You can work on people who use lawn mowers.

Is it a deal?

--
Frank Krygowski [email hidden]

"Frank Krygowski" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On the balance, I prefer concentrate on the SUVs. I'll continue to chide those who approve of
them. You can work on people who use lawn mowers.

Is it a deal?

Why don't you guys just get a room?

"Zoot Katz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Somedays in some neighbourhoods people's fire places or

barbeques cause

Quoted message said:

the most reeking offenses but at least they're quiet.

In some countries, lung cancer and eye disease from cooking on open fires is rampant. And many towns
have moratoriums on wood burning fireplaces and stoves -- you either can't have one at all, or the
number of them is limited, so you have to buy an existing permit. The smoke in Yosemite Valley from
all those campfires and barbeques makes me want to drive back to LA sometimes. At least CA has
banned that stinky lighter fluid. Hydrocarbon burgers anyone?

Matt O.

### On Sun, 26 Jan 2003 05:14:56 GMT, "Mark Jones" <[email hidden]> [MJ] casually decided to expound
### upon rec.bicycles.misc the following thoughts about Re: nice SUV article:

MJ> "Zoot Katz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
MJ> "]news:[email hidden]...
MJ> > Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:54:12 -0600, <[email hidden]>, "Mark Jones"
MJ> > <[email hidden]> wrote:
MJ> >
MJ> > >The government doesn't show up at our door and tell us what to buy. We go to the car dealer
MJ> > >and get what we want based on our ability to pay for it. This is our right as consumers in a
MJ> > >market based economy.
MJ> >
MJ> > Why can't people buy cars like these?
MJ> >
MJ> > smart.comsmart.comOpen ↗
MJ> Perhaps they don't meet federal safety standards or DaimlerChrysler doesn't want to sell them in
MJ> the U.S.

From what I understand, the smarts are rather safe vehicles. Don't let their size fool you. Rumour
has it that D-C is looking to import them to the US.

MJ> Every car or truck made isn't available for sale in every country on the globe. There are some
MJ> sports cars made in Europe that would be great to own, but they aren't exported to the U.S.

Tell me about it. I've been drooling after the Caterham R500 for years. Then again, that might be a
good thing as it's a car I could probably kill myself in.

--
/*===================[ Jake Khuon <[email hidden]> ]======================+
| Packet Plumber, Network Engineers /| / [~ [~ |) | | --------------- | for Effective Bandwidth
| Utilisation / |/ [_ [_ |) |_| N E T W O R K S |
+=========================================================================*/

### On Sun, 26 Jan 2003 21:14:44 GMT, Erik Freitag <[email hidden]> [EF] casually decided to
### expound upon rec.bicycles.misc the following thoughts about Re: nice SUV article:

EF> One other thing, since this thread has dealt a bit with auto makers trying to tell buyers
EF> (please don't call me a consumer - I'm not planning to eat the car) what to do, I got this
EF> message when I tried to connect to the web site with my Safari browser: "Dear Mac user, this
EF> site runs best with Internet Explorer 5.0".

I get that kind of browser-detection/descrimination [censored] too. I'm running:

Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.3a) Gecko/20021118

Luckily I can agent-spoof to most sites to get around it.

--
/*===================[ Jake Khuon <[email hidden]> ]======================+
| Packet Plumber, Network Engineers /| / [~ [~ |) | | --------------- | for Effective Bandwidth
| Utilisation / |/ [_ [_ |) |_| N E T W O R K S |
+=========================================================================*/

Quoted message said:

So, does Godwin's Law apply to "Jihad" as it does to "Fascist" and "Nazi"? Certainly, the use of
the term is just as mindless. ;-)

=v= I don't believe it refers to "fascist." The term dates back to the Roman Empire, and is derived
from the Latin for a bundle of sticks tied together, the idea being that this is stronger than
individual sticks. Accordingly, fascism combines various powerful entities: the power of wealth and
the power of the military and/or police state. Quite possibly the power of the church, as well. The
idea of subsuming oneself into a stronger bundle is reinforced with nationalism and militarism.

=v= "Godwin's Law" (which is neither Godwin's nor a law) refers specifically to mention of [censored]
and/or Nazis. It really ought to refer to _ad_hominem_ mentions of same, because there are indeed
legitimate and astute ways to refer to the historical example they set. (Not often, though.)

=v= Incidentally, did everyone notice that Former Governer Bush referred to something called
"Hitlerism" in the State of the Union Address? That's because mentioning fascism hits too close to
home for much of his Administration. <_Jym_

Stephen Harding said:

-- A chainsaw operated for two hours emits as much smog-forming hydrocarbons as a new car driven
3,000 miles.

Not much call for chainsaws in downtown LA, surely?

Guy
===
** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. chapmancentral.comchapmancentral.comOpen ↗ (BT ADSL and
dynamic DNS permitting)
NOTE: BT Openworld have now blocked port 25 (without notice), so old mail addresses may no longer
work. Apologies.

Quoted message said:

=v= I don't believe it refers to "fascist." The term dates back to the Roman Empire, and is
derived from the Latin for a bundle of sticks tied together, the idea being that this is stronger
than individual sticks.

This is the story they tell, and it's a good story, but....

The /fasces/ was the symbol of authority of the Roman magistrate, going all the way back into the
time fo the Republic. The fasces consisted in a bundle of rods about an axe (called the /securus/).
It symbolised the dual power of the magistrate: the rods being his ability to have the fasces
unbound and have those under his jurisdiction beaten--corporal punishment--and the axe his ability
to unbind the fasces and have those under his authority executed--capital punishment.

Within the boundaries of the city of Rome, the securus was removed from the fasces, it being illegal
to execute Roman citizens without trial.

The fasces were carried by /lictores/ the number of whom preceding the magistrate in question
indicated the magistrate's importance, with a magistrate with consular or proconsular power entitled
to twelve, and a dictator (standing as he did for both consuls) twenty-four. The emperors (never
really an office), being so often in occupation of the consulship, had twelve.

Satis de fascibus lictoribusque; de Bush, nolo nil dicere. hae litterae iam distant nimis de materia
huius fori.

-Luigi

"Jym Dyer" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

=v= Incidentally, did everyone notice that Former Governer Bush referred

to something called "Hitlerism" in the State of the Union Address? That's because mentioning fascism
hits too close to home for much of his Administration.

No, it's because if current President Bush said it, it would come out "Fash-sa-shizz-izz-ism". You
have to substitute better words, it's a good strategery.

Drives members of the Former Majority Party nuts, it does. They thought it was fine when Carter said
"Noo-Kyoo-Lar" but it's terrible when W says it. I guess it's because Jimmah had a degree in
NooKyooLar Physics and W got C's in Bidness Skool.

It's lots of fun to watch.

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Not much call for chainsaws in downtown LA, surely?

Nor for hockey masks, but that never stopped me.

Just zis Guy said:

Not much call for chainsaws in downtown LA, surely?

More than you'd think. The place is overcrowded with Californians and badly in need of thinning.

Chalo Colina

Hijo de la Changa said:

Drives members of the Former Majority Party nuts, it does. They thought it was fine when Carter
said "Noo-Kyoo-Lar" but it's terrible when W says it. I guess it's because Jimmah had a degree in
NooKyooLar Physics

Jimmy was one of the nuclear trained officers on my sumbarine. This was maaaany years before, since
he was the President when i was on the boat. Digging thru the ship's engineering library i found a
couple of his signatures.

.max scrubbed the toilet used by Jimmy Carter.

Frank Krygowski said:

Stephen Harding said:

... Something more recent?

-- Running a 2-stroke lawnmore for one hour generates as much pollution as running 40 1995
cars for the same amount of time.

-- Running a 2-stroke chainsaw for 2 hours generates as much smog forming HC pollution as
driving 10 1995 cars 250 miles each.

-- The refueling of lawn and garden equipment results in the spillage of 17 million gallons of
gasoline per year; more than the Exxon Valdez oil spill eqivalent.

Small engine machinery is a heck of a lot easier to do without than your car (no matter what
sort), and pushing a reel lawn mower is somewhat like bike commuting: you get a job done and get
exercise at the same time.

I'd worry more about my neighbor's lawn mower than his SUV!

I knew about those comparison statistics, and you do have a point about small engine pollution.
However, I disagree with your last sentence. Pollution is only one problem of SUVs. There are many
others. As one example, I'm sure my neighbor's lawn mower won't come crashing through the side
door of my car, but his SUV may.

I think you are worrying too much!

Quoted message said:

On the balance, I prefer concentrate on the SUVs. I'll continue to chide those who approve of
them. You can work on people who use lawn mowers.

Is it a deal?

I know there's no holding you back on your anti-SUV crusade, so ca va.

SMH

Hijo de la Changa said:

"Frank Krygowski" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

On the balance, I prefer concentrate on the SUVs. I'll continue to chide those who approve of
them. You can work on people who use lawn mowers.

Is it a deal?

Why don't you guys just get a room?

Whatsamatter?

Calm, civil disagreement getting to you?

SMH

"Stephen Harding" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On the balance, I prefer concentrate on the SUVs. I'll continue to chide

those who approve of them. You can work on people who use lawn mowers.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Is it a deal?

Why don't you guys just get a room?

Whatsamatter?

Calm, civil disagreement getting to you?

No, I just thought it was kinda romantic the way you two were divvying up the kinds of people you'd
each like peevishly to sneer at.

Hijo de la Changa said:

No, I just thought it was kinda romantic ...

I recommend that people keep their young sons away from this guy.

--
Frank Krygowski [email hidden]

"Frank Krygowski" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hijo de la Changa said:

No, I just thought it was kinda romantic ...

I recommend that people keep their young sons away from this guy.

Nobody accused you guys of being pedophiles. I just pointed out that you guys were writing little
love notes back and forth.

<not that there's anything *wrong* with that

(Bluto) said:

Quoted message said:

Not much call for chainsaws in downtown LA, surely?

Quoted message said:

More than you'd think. The place is overcrowded with Californians and badly in need of thinning.

LOL! Luckily they'll have melted the polar ice caps in a while and we can forget about most of
California :-D

Guy
===
** WARNING ** This posting may contain traces of irony. chapmancentral.comchapmancentral.comOpen ↗ (BT ADSL and
dynamic DNS permitting)
NOTE: BT Openworld have now blocked port 25 (without notice), so old mail addresses may no longer
work. Apologies.

"Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On 31 Jan 2003 19:17:57 -0800, [email hidden]

(Bluto) said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Not much call for chainsaws in downtown LA, surely?

Quoted message said:

More than you'd think. The place is overcrowded with

Californians and

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

badly in need of thinning.

LOL! Luckily they'll have melted the polar ice caps in a

while and we

Quoted message said:

can forget about most of California :-D

That's OK, all it will do is create another real estate boom in the places that are left. Better get
in on the ground floor now, of the beachfront property in Fresno.

Matt O.