Newcomer need help

Ronald Shu said:

I am new to bike NGs. I just got a new TREK 4300 Mtn. bike. I need to
order some parts (tools, cleaner,lube, cable luber, brushes etc.) for
maintenance. Would you please recommend some good mail order stores
offering good services and the lowest price.

www.nashbar.com

Art Harris

Quoted message said:

Hi, all:
I am new to bike NGs. I just got a new TREK 4300 Mtn. bike. I need
to order some parts (tools, cleaner,lube, cable luber, brushes etc.) for
maintenance. Would you please recommend some good mail order stores
offering good services and the lowest price. I much appreciate your input.

Ronald

Ronald, your best way to deal with this would be to go to your local Bike
store and buy from them. When you buy little stuff like cleaner and lube
from mail order, many times the shipping and handling costs wipe out any
savings you may think you are getting. By buying through a good local bike
shop, you will be cultivating a relationship that may prove to be more
valuable than you could estimate. And, think of this: if your local bike
shop goes out of business, how is that going to help you when you really
need them?

Pat in TX

Quoted message said:

Ronald, your best way to deal with this would be to go to your local Bike
store and buy from them. When you buy little stuff like cleaner and lube
from mail order, many times the shipping and handling costs wipe out any
savings you may think you are getting. By buying through a good local bike
shop, you will be cultivating a relationship that may prove to be more
valuable than you could estimate. And, think of this: if your local bike
shop goes out of business, how is that going to help you when you really
need them?

Pat in TX

Bad advice.
Why go out of your way to pay too much for something, in a busy bike shop when
you can buy discount and have it sitting on your front door.

www.performancebike.com
www.nashbar.com
www.coloradocyclist.com

They all carry tools and supplies. Be sure to use the discount codes for
nashbar which are posted on www.bikeforums.net, or join team performance and
get "points" faster shipping. The LBS is not necessarily your best choice, it's
more of the "koolaid" kneejerk responses that are crammed down our throats. If
your LBS is a good one, that's fine, but don't tell strangers whom you don't
know where they live just to drop all their cash off locally, there are many
bad and expensive bike shops, which may be a long drive for some people and
busy. Your foremost responsibilty is to get the best parts for the best price,
in the most convenient way.

Quoted message said:

Bad advice.
Why go out of your way to pay too much for something, in a busy bike shop

when

Quoted message said:

you can buy discount and have it sitting on your front door.

I don't know where you live, but here in Texas, it pays to have a good
relationship with a good bike shop. It has certainly saved me a ton of money
in the form of advice alone, not to mention the little things the guys do
without charging anything. I'm sorry you don't know about that. One of
these days you are going to need their help and want it quickly, and they
are going to say "Who ARE you anyway? Wait your turn at the back of the
line--and pay for every little thing."

Pat in TX

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Newcomer need help
From: "Pat" [email hidden]
Date: 9/28/2004 6:43 PM US Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Bad advice.
Why go out of your way to pay too much for something, in a busy bike shop

when

Quoted message said:

you can buy discount and have it sitting on your front door.

I don't know where you live, but here in Texas, it pays to have a good
relationship with a good bike shop. It has certainly saved me a ton of money
in the form of advice alone, not to mention the little things the guys do
without charging anything. I'm sorry you don't know about that. One of
these days you are going to need their help and want it quickly, and they
are going to say "Who ARE you anyway? Wait your turn at the back of the
line--and pay for every little thing."

Pat in TX

Why the hell would you be sorry for me, and why would you assume I pay to have
anything done? I have three bikes that I work on, and only I work on.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I don't know where you live, but here in Texas, it pays to have a good
relationship with a good bike shop. It has certainly saved me a ton of

money

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in the form of advice alone, not to mention the little things the guys do
without charging anything. I'm sorry you don't know about that. One of
these days you are going to need their help and want it quickly, and they
are going to say "Who ARE you anyway? Wait your turn at the back of the
line--and pay for every little thing."

Pat in TX

Why the hell would you be sorry for me, and why would you assume I pay to

have

Quoted message said:

anything done? I have three bikes that I work on, and only I work on.

I see. You're from New York City. Explains a lot.

Pat in TX

Quoted message said:

Pat said:

I'm sorry you don't know about that. One of
these days you are going to need their help and want it quickly, and they
are going to say "Who ARE you anyway? Wait your turn at the back of the
line--and pay for every little thing."

I've been buying bikes from a certain pair of related bike shops for
25 years - probably $ 15,000 worth. Don't have much go in for repairs
- I do my own. OTOH, if I were to take a bike in, I wouldn't expect to
go to the head of the line or have anyone bumped. What you describe,
if done for the reasons given, is unprofessional in any business.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm sorry you don't know about that. One of
these days you are going to need their help and want it quickly, and they
are going to say "Who ARE you anyway? Wait your turn at the back of the
line--and pay for every little thing."

I've been buying bikes from a certain pair of related bike shops for
25 years - probably $ 15,000 worth. Don't have much go in for repairs
- I do my own. OTOH, if I were to take a bike in, I wouldn't expect to
go to the head of the line or have anyone bumped. What you describe,
if done for the reasons given, is unprofessional in any business.

Curtis L. Russell

If a long term customer has something happen and needs it fixed before
Saturday because of an important event, then, the LBS will take that repair
out of turn. It isn't unprofessional at all. Do you not think that people
are taken in an emergency at a doctor's office? If you go to the ER at a
hospital with an acid burn to your eye, do you think they are going to say
"wait your turn"? Do you not think that if you break a tooth your dentist
will insist that you "wait your turn" behind all the people who need minor
things like cleanings? If so, you are awful naive about how the world
works.

What you and the other poster seem to forget is that the original poster
said he was a newcomer! He doesn't or can't do his own bicycle work. He
wanted to know how to ignore the LBS guys (by buying all of his stuff
online) and I said it was not a good idea because he needs to cultivate a
relationship with the bike shop guys.

Pat in TX

Pat said:

If a long term customer has something happen and needs it fixed before
Saturday because of an important event, then, the LBS will take that repair
out of turn. It isn't unprofessional at all. Do you not think that people
are taken in an emergency at a doctor's office? If you go to the ER at a
hospital with an acid burn to your eye, do you think they are going to say
"wait your turn"? Do you not think that if you break a tooth your dentist
will insist that you "wait your turn" behind all the people who need minor
things like cleanings? If so, you are awful naive about how the world
works

OK, now I understand - you are logic deprived. Taking a seriously
injured person before a minor sprain is not the same as taking a long
term customer before others in line before them. Taking a broken tooth
before a cleaning (meaningless in most dentist offices, as I haven't
seen a dentist in my life that does the cleanings) is not the same as
taking a long term customer before someone else already in line. To
compare the two is simply absurd.

Lets make it more along what you actually said (and by all means, go
back and check if your memory has failed you as badly as your logic
circuits). You're waiting in a dentist office to have a tooth
repaired. Its your first visit there and you've been waiting in pain
for two hours. A regular customer shows up without an appointment and
is immediately ushered to the chair for a dental xray while you wait
another 15 minutes.

You've been waiting for a colonoscopy for the last three hours and are
a bit irritable because you haven't eaten going on 15hours. A regular
customer shows up without an appointment and is sent back for the
procedure while you wait another hour.

Both of the last are unprofessional and simply aren't done in the vast
majority of places. Your examples are simply irrelevant.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Newcomer need help
From: "Pat" [email hidden]
Date: 9/28/2004 10:00 PM US Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I don't know where you live, but here in Texas, it pays to have a good
relationship with a good bike shop. It has certainly saved me a ton of

money

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in the form of advice alone, not to mention the little things the guys do
without charging anything. I'm sorry you don't know about that. One of
these days you are going to need their help and want it quickly, and they
are going to say "Who ARE you anyway? Wait your turn at the back of the
line--and pay for every little thing."

Pat in TX

Why the hell would you be sorry for me, and why would you assume I pay to

have

Quoted message said:

anything done? I have three bikes that I work on, and only I work on.

I see. You're from New York City. Explains a lot.

Pat in TX

Quoted message said:

Nope, but keep taking potshots at me just because I don't kiss a LBS's ass and
overpay. Bicycles REALLY aren't hard to work on.

Quoted message said:

OK, now I understand - you are logic deprived. Taking a seriously
injured person before a minor sprain is not the same as taking a long
term customer before others in line before them. Taking a broken tooth
before a cleaning (meaningless in most dentist offices, as I haven't
seen a dentist in my life that does the cleanings) is not the same as
taking a long term customer before someone else already in line. To
compare the two is simply absurd.

Okay, I had the nerve to tell you you're wrong. So, what do you do? Personal
attacks. I don't know what you're talking about the dentist, though, because
in my area, all the dentists do cleanings--dental hygeneists are something
of a dying breed. I guess you haven't been to a dentist in a long time if
you don't know that.

Quoted message said:

Lets make it more along what you actually said (and by all means, go
back and check if your memory has failed you as badly as your logic
circuits). You're waiting in a dentist office to have a tooth
repaired. Its your first visit there and you've been waiting in pain
for two hours. A regular customer shows up without an appointment and
is immediately ushered to the chair for a dental xray while you wait
another 15 minutes.

What I said had nothing to do with "waiting to have a tooth repaired." do
you think you can make your argument better simply by changing what I said
to make yourself look better?

Quoted message said:

You've been waiting for a colonoscopy for the last three hours and are
a bit irritable because you haven't eaten going on 15hours. A regular
customer shows up without an appointment and is sent back for the
procedure while you wait another hour.

I didn't say anything about a colonoscopy, either. Do you always rely on the
strawman trick to try and win an argument? It must be nice for you to
simply change the terms of the argument so that you can profit by it.

Quoted message said:

Both of the last are unprofessional and simply aren't done in the vast
majority of places. Your examples are simply irrelevant.

Curtis L. Russell

So, then, all you have to do is give absurd "examples" and then declare my
views "simply irrelevant." Sigh.
You should read what you wrote. You sound idiotic.

Pat in TX

"Pat" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Okay, I had the nerve to tell you you're wrong. So, what do you do?

Personal

Quoted message said:

attacks. I don't know what you're talking about the dentist, though,

because

Quoted message said:

in my area, all the dentists do cleanings--dental hygeneists are something
of a dying breed. I guess you haven't been to a dentist in a long time if
you don't know that.

This comes as quite a surprise to me. I've been going to the same dentist
for at least 10 years and he has NEVER cleaned my teeth. It has always been
done by the Hygienist. I guess it differs by area.

Dave

Quoted message said:

Nope, but keep taking potshots at me just because I don't kiss a LBS's ass and
overpay. Bicycles REALLY aren't hard to work on.

Interesting. I know the popular wisdom is that it is always cheaper
from the big net based dealers. But this hasn't been my experience in
real life. Many LBS's offer significant discounts to local bike clubs
and even bigger discounts to members of local race clubs.

Anyway, with these discounts I get to see and fondle stuff and pay no
more than on line. And about kissing ass I actually consider most the
of the LBS owners and staff my friends.

And for buying a bike I don't think there is any comparison. LBS's in
my town will set up and let you take out various models for long rides
so that you can make an informed individual choice. And at least on
the high end bikes that I know of the final price has been equal to
or less than on line.

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: Newcomer need help
From: [email hidden] (gds)
Date: 9/30/2004 5:25 PM US Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Nope, but keep taking potshots at me just because I don't kiss a LBS's ass

and

Quoted message said:

overpay. Bicycles REALLY aren't hard to work on.

Interesting. I know the popular wisdom is that it is always cheaper
from the big net based dealers. But this hasn't been my experience in
real life. Many LBS's offer significant discounts to local bike clubs
and even bigger discounts to members of local race clubs.

Anyway, with these discounts I get to see and fondle stuff and pay no
more than on line. And about kissing ass I actually consider most the
of the LBS owners and staff my friends.

And for buying a bike I don't think there is any comparison. LBS's in
my town will set up and let you take out various models for long rides
so that you can make an informed individual choice. And at least on
the high end bikes that I know of the final price has been equal to
or less than on line.

Doesn't mean that there are that nice of bike shops where everyone else lives.
Don't kid yourself, you're a customer.