General fitness, health and nutrition · Public discussion

New type2 progress report.

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
7 June 2004
Last activity
7 June 2004
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J David Anderso
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  1. Well, a couple of weeks down the track and after carefully
    evaluating all advice and suggestions, I have managed to
    cut daily carb intake to under 20 gms. The last few days it
    has been under 17. Lots of egg dishes with small quantities
    of lo-glycemic/lo-carb vegs, fish and lean meats. A
    frittata with smoked salmon and cheese is very tasty and
    very low carb.

    It has worked, my BGL is right down, fasting around 5.8 -
    6.5 and 1 & 2 hour post prandial at 6.9 and 5.9 approx.

    I ended up buying a copy of Kathleen's Diet Planner, and
    although there are some minor bugs, design omissions from a
    diabetic point of view, it is an excellent program for food
    tracking. The problems are mainly to do with its search
    engine (it has a thirty-five thousand plus food record
    database) as the engine will not accept wild cards and is
    very slow. You can however load all commonly used food items
    into another "favorites" database and get faster results.

    The program also tracks and graphs BG, BP, cholesterol,
    ketosis, Meds, exercise, and records all daily nutritional
    data, including calories, fat levels, carbs, protein, etc.,
    both by weight and by calorific breakdown to give running
    totals for meals, snacks and whole days, weeks etc. It even
    creates shopping lists and has a recipe database.

    I recommend it to anyone looking for management software. It
    is very quick and simple once set up. If I want a snack, or
    a cup of tea/coffee, glass of red wine etc., I only have to
    use a couple of mouse clicks to select what I am having from
    a list of commonly used items and it adds those values into
    that day's totals.

    BTW, Alan, a lot of those remaining carbs are from red wine.
    😉

    Using the program, and eating every three hours or so during
    the day, (six small meals) I have managed to get my carbs
    heavily reduced and spread fairly evenly through the day. My
    readings are good, back in the normal range, but I am
    lacking in energy, and exercising is more difficult.
    Although I have strong carbohydrate cravings my appetite is
    actually reduced when only able to select from a low carb
    menu. For my weight, height and exercise level, I should be
    eating 2300-2500 calories per day, but I am not going much
    over 1600-1700, and forcing myself to do that in order to be
    able to continue exercising.

    I have had two variations in reading, one deliberate, one
    accidental. I went out with a friend a couple of days ago
    and had a couple of beers and a meal with steak and chips.
    My post prandial readings nearly doubled and they didn't
    fully come back down for another day. The other, accidental
    spike was with diet jelly. Looking for some lo carb variety,
    I bought some packets of diet jelly, rated at zero carbs and
    less than ten calories. The same as with the beer and chips,
    my readings doubled. I had a two hour dinner reading of 5.9,
    had the jelly as a late snack an hour or so later, and my
    bedtime reading a couple of hours further on was 8.1. I
    might as well have been eating jellybeans. Has anyone else
    had a problem with diet jelly?

    I intend talking to the manufacturer tomorrow.

    Oh, yes, I am losing weight as well, although I was not
    really overweight to start with. I am losing about kilo
    every three days. I guess that with the very low carb
    intake, lower than normal calorie intake, and the exercise,
    walking and riding, I am burning up what few carb induced
    calories I have in my system and am burning body fat, a sort
    of de facto Atkins result. If I do a five kilometre walk
    after meals my BGL always drops far more rapidly than if I
    sit in front of a computer or read a book. The exercise
    makes a very noticeable difference.

    Thank you everyone for all the advice that has been offered
    on these groups. Much of it has been very valuable.

    Regards

    David

  2. "J David Anderson" <[email hidden]> wrote in
    message "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    Well, a couple of weeks down the track and after carefully


    evaluating

    Quoted message said:

    all advice and suggestions, I have managed to cut daily


    carb intake to

    Quoted message said:

    under 20 gms. The last few days it has been under 17. Lots


    of egg dishes

    Quoted message said:

    with small quantities of lo-glycemic/lo-carb vegs, fish


    and lean meats.

    Quoted message said:

    A frittata with smoked salmon and cheese is very tasty and


    very low

    Quoted message said:

    carb.

    It has worked, my BGL is right down, fasting around 5.8 -


    6.5 and 1 & 2

    Quoted message said:

    hour post prandial at 6.9 and 5.9 approx.

    The drop in bg's is a good thing but your diet seems pretty
    severe. Where for example is an adequate amount of Vitamin C
    in there? How much calcium are you taking in? Are some of
    your vegetables raw and deeply coloured? I have found myself
    to be extremely weak on an Atkin's induction type plan. Have
    you compared readings between <20 gr carb and a higher
    intake of low carb/GI vegetables? I found that there was no
    difference in bg readings for me when taking in <20 gr carb
    or eating lots of low carb (low starch) vegetables and some
    low GI fruits (in moderation). I only really notice rises in
    bg when starches are added (even in small quantities).
    Achieving euglycemia at the expense of good overall health
    doesn't make sense to me.

    My way of eating is to make sure I know all the essential
    nutrients a human body needs then create meals around
    those facts putting emphasis on foods that do not cause me
    a bg problem. "Small quantities of lo-glycemic/lo-carb
    vegs" doesn't appear to be enough to provide essential
    nutrients, particularly Vit C. Scurvy is still possible in
    a modern world.

    Quoted message said:

    I had a two hour dinner reading of 5.9, had the jelly as a


    late snack an

    Quoted message said:

    hour or so later, and my bedtime reading a couple of hours


    further on

    Quoted message said:

    was 8.1. I might as well have been eating jellybeans. Has


    anyone else

    Quoted message said:

    had a problem with diet jelly?

    No, but it is possible you had a bit of a liver dump, very
    low carb dinner, nothing in the next 4 hours except some
    diet jelly. With my diet jelly I have either strawberries or
    blueberries (I set them in the jelly) and some canned
    whipped cream. Carbs are still lowish but providing enough
    of a snack for the body to not believe I am starving.

  3. J David Anderson said:


    Well, a couple of weeks down the track and after carefully
    evaluating all advice and suggestions, I have managed to
    cut daily carb intake to under 20 gms.

    Sounds like you've gone a bit extreme David. I'll be seeing
    you tomorrow, have a chat then.

    Now that you've gone to the basics, it's time to start
    adding some carbs and nutrition back into the diet, testing
    to find when you can eat them. In my case it's the afternoon
    and evening. Remember - everything in moderation, that
    includes carbs.

    Cheers, Alan, T2 d&e, Australia. Remove weight and
    carbs to email.
    --
    Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.

  4. David,

    In my humble opinion, your diet is to radical. You are
    gambling with your health for lack of basic information. You
    are losing weight to quickly. Some of that weight is muscle
    mass, maybe up to 50% of the loss. You may also lack some
    nutrients. As a diabetic you don't want to lose muscle and
    you should exercise (resistance) while losing weight. I
    would suggest to eat 60 g carb a day, 15 for breakfast, 20
    for lunch and supper and 5g for a bedtime snack. Know your
    caloric intake, for instance 500 cal for breakfast, 700 for
    lunch and supper and 100 for snacks. Try this for two weeks
    and find out if your weight stabilizes at a desired level.
    If you can, walk 30 min one hour after your meals. This will
    get your BG down quickly if you don't have severe insulin
    resistance. I would also recommend Dr Richard K Bernstein
    book, Diabetes Solution. He writes for diabetics and
    stresses tight BG control with low carb, exercise and meds.
    His info has plenty on low carb diet dishes too. Diabetes is
    for life, so there is plenty of time to make a gradual life
    style change. It took me about a year to work out a low carb
    and exercise routine. I've been doing it now for 3.5 years
    and I love it. I have excellent BG control and plenty of
    energy. For low carb and exercise to work, it requires that
    the states of the liver, pancreas and IR are within certain
    limits. Otherwise some medication is required.

    Fred Henzi 68,T2

    "J David Anderson" <[email hidden]> wrote in
    message "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    Well, a couple of weeks down the track and after carefully
    evaluating all advice and suggestions, I have managed to
    cut daily carb intake to under 20 gms. The last few days
    it has been under 17. Lots of egg dishes with small
    quantities of lo-glycemic/lo-carb vegs, fish and lean
    meats. A frittata with smoked salmon and cheese is very
    tasty and very low carb.

    It has worked, my BGL is right down, fasting around 5.8 -
    6.5 and 1 & 2 hour post prandial at 6.9 and 5.9 approx.

    I ended up buying a copy of Kathleen's Diet Planner, and
    although there are some minor bugs, design omissions from
    a diabetic point of view, it is an excellent program for
    food tracking. The problems are mainly to do with its
    search engine (it has a thirty-five thousand plus food
    record database) as the engine will not accept wild cards
    and is very slow. You can however load all commonly used
    food items into another "favorites" database and get
    faster results.

    The program also tracks and graphs BG, BP, cholesterol,
    ketosis, Meds, exercise, and records all daily nutritional
    data, including calories, fat levels, carbs, protein,
    etc., both by weight and by calorific breakdown to give
    running totals for meals, snacks and whole days, weeks
    etc. It even creates shopping lists and has a recipe
    database.

    I recommend it to anyone looking for management software.
    It is very quick and simple once set up. If I want a
    snack, or a cup of tea/coffee, glass of red wine etc., I
    only have to use a couple of mouse clicks to select what I
    am having from a list of commonly used items and it adds
    those values into that day's totals.

    BTW, Alan, a lot of those remaining carbs are from red
    wine. 😉

    Using the program, and eating every three hours or so
    during the day, (six small meals) I have managed to get my
    carbs heavily reduced and spread fairly evenly through the
    day. My readings are good, back in the normal range, but I
    am lacking in energy, and exercising is more difficult.
    Although I have strong carbohydrate cravings my appetite
    is actually reduced when only able to select from a low
    carb menu. For my weight, height and exercise level, I
    should be eating 2300-2500 calories per day, but I am not
    going much over 1600-1700, and forcing myself to do that
    in order to be able to continue exercising.

    I have had two variations in reading, one deliberate, one
    accidental. I went out with a friend a couple of days ago
    and had a couple of beers and a meal with steak and chips.
    My post prandial readings nearly doubled and they didn't
    fully come back down for another day. The other,
    accidental spike was with diet jelly. Looking for some lo
    carb variety, I bought some packets of diet jelly, rated
    at zero carbs and less than ten calories. The same as with
    the beer and chips, my readings doubled. I had a two hour
    dinner reading of 5.9, had the jelly as a late snack an
    hour or so later, and my bedtime reading a couple of hours
    further on was 8.1. I might as well have been eating
    jellybeans. Has anyone else had a problem with diet jelly?

    I intend talking to the manufacturer tomorrow.

    Oh, yes, I am losing weight as well, although I was not
    really overweight to start with. I am losing about kilo
    every three days. I guess that with the very low carb
    intake, lower than normal calorie intake, and the
    exercise, walking and riding, I am burning up what few
    carb induced calories I have in my system and am burning
    body fat, a sort of de facto Atkins result. If I do a five
    kilometre walk after meals my BGL always drops far more
    rapidly than if I sit in front of a computer or read a
    book. The exercise makes a very noticeable difference.

    Thank you everyone for all the advice that has been
    offered on these groups. Much of it has been very
    valuable.

    Regards

    David

  5. ... but I am lacking in energy, and exercising is more
    difficult....

    Hi David,

    When doing Atkins for weight control, I noticed that I do
    not have energy. Especially in legs (going up stairways or
    so). Aldough I'm taking vitamins as supplement, I've found
    that addition of magnesium in self-disolving tablets helps
    me with this particular problem.

    Regards, Stanimir

  6. Ozgirl is right about balancing your diet, even when eating
    extremely low carb. Since your are using Kdiet, it is easy
    to track all essential (and non-essential) nutrients. You
    can make additions to your diet or use supplements to cover
    deficiencies.

    Are you aware of the "Advanced Find" feature. It makes it
    easy to find any keyword associated with foods in the
    databases.

    I have been using Kdiet for several years, it has been
    instrumental in maintaining good nutrition while low carbing
    and loosing over 60 pounds. I am now at my recommended
    weight, and have DM well under control.

    Anon type2

    "Ozgirl" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:2ifl78Flrq03U1@uni-
    berlin.de...

    Quoted message said:


    "J David Anderson" <[email hidden]> wrote in
    message "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    Well, a couple of weeks down the track and after
    carefully


    evaluating

    Quoted message said:

    all advice and suggestions, I have managed to cut daily


    carb intake to

    Quoted message said:

    under 20 gms. The last few days it has been under
    17. Lots


    of egg dishes

    Quoted message said:

    with small quantities of lo-glycemic/lo-carb vegs, fish


    and lean meats.

    Quoted message said:

    A frittata with smoked salmon and cheese is very
    tasty and


    very low

    Quoted message said:

    carb.

    It has worked, my BGL is right down, fasting
    around 5.8 -


    6.5 and 1 & 2

    Quoted message said:

    hour post prandial at 6.9 and 5.9 approx.

    The drop in bg's is a good thing but your diet seems
    pretty severe. Where for example is an adequate amount of
    Vitamin C in there? How much calcium are you taking in?
    Are some of your vegetables raw and deeply coloured? I
    have found myself to be extremely weak on an Atkin's
    induction type plan. Have you compared readings between
    <20 gr carb and a higher intake of low carb/GI vegetables?
    I found that there was no difference in bg readings for me
    when taking in <20 gr carb or eating lots of low carb (low
    starch) vegetables and some low GI fruits (in moderation).
    I only really notice rises in bg when starches are added
    (even in small quantities). Achieving euglycemia at the
    expense of good overall health doesn't make sense to me.

    My way of eating is to make sure I know all the essential
    nutrients a human body needs then create meals around
    those facts putting emphasis on foods that do not cause me
    a bg problem. "Small quantities of lo-glycemic/lo-carb
    vegs" doesn't appear to be enough to provide essential
    nutrients, particularly Vit C. Scurvy is still possible in
    a modern world.

    Quoted message said:

    I had a two hour dinner reading of 5.9, had the
    jelly as a


    late snack an

    Quoted message said:

    hour or so later, and my bedtime reading a couple
    of hours


    further on

    Quoted message said:

    was 8.1. I might as well have been eating
    jellybeans. Has


    anyone else

    Quoted message said:

    had a problem with diet jelly?

    No, but it is possible you had a bit of a liver dump, very
    low carb dinner, nothing in the next 4 hours except some
    diet jelly. With my diet jelly I have either strawberries
    or blueberries (I set them in the jelly) and some canned
    whipped cream. Carbs are still lowish but providing enough
    of a snack for the body to not believe I am starving.

  7. It would not be extreme if he has a lot of weight to loose.
    I stayed on 20g carb a day diet for 3 months, and lost 40
    pounds. Then I went on 40g carbs a day until I lost 20
    pounds more. I can now tolerate 110g carb a day with the
    aid of meds.

    Anon type2

    "Alan" <[email hidden]> wrote in
    message "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    J David Anderson said:


    Well, a couple of weeks down the track and after
    carefully evaluating all advice and suggestions, I have
    managed to cut daily carb intake to under 20 gms.

    Sounds like you've gone a bit extreme David. I'll be
    seeing you tomorrow, have a chat then.

    Now that you've gone to the basics, it's time to start
    adding some carbs and nutrition back into the diet,
    testing to find when you can eat them. In my case it's the
    afternoon and evening. Remember - everything in
    moderation, that includes carbs.

    Cheers, Alan, T2 d&e, Australia. Remove weight and carbs
    to email.
    --
    Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.

  8. On Sun, 6 Jun 2004 14:33:07 +1000, "Ozgirl" <[email hidden]>
    wrote:

    Hi Ozgirl

    Quoted message said:


    "J David Anderson" <[email hidden]> wrote in
    message "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    Well, a couple of weeks down the track and after
    carefully


    evaluating

    Quoted message said:

    all advice and suggestions, I have managed to cut daily


    carb intake to

    Quoted message said:

    under 20 gms. The last few days it has been under
    17. Lots


    of egg dishes

    Quoted message said:

    with small quantities of lo-glycemic/lo-carb vegs, fish


    and lean meats.

    Quoted message said:

    A frittata with smoked salmon and cheese is very
    tasty and


    very low

    Quoted message said:

    carb.

    It has worked, my BGL is right down, fasting around 5.8 -


    6.5 and 1 & 2

    Quoted message said:

    hour post prandial at 6.9 and 5.9 approx.

    The drop in bg's is a good thing but your diet seems pretty
    severe. Where for example is an adequate amount of Vitamin
    C in there?

    I take four thousand mg of vitamin C per day for other
    reasons, not much chance of a deficiency.

    Quoted message said:

    How much calcium are you taking in?

    I supplement calcium, vitamin D, P.A.B.A., and a few other
    things as well.

    Quoted message said:

    Are some of your vegetables raw and deeply coloured?

    Coleslaw with a whole egg mayonnaise rated at 1%
    carbohydrate (1gram in
    100) The mayonnaise is S&W brand and quite tasty. The
    coleslaw has red & white cabbage, onion, carrot and
    celery, broccoli and cauliflower in it. I used to put
    apple in it, but I have dropped that for the moment. I
    also eat raw broccoli, carrot, and raw cauliflower. I
    like the taste, I have been doing it for years. I vary
    that with home grown zucchini, eggplant, brussels
    sprouts etc. I have an organic garden. Unfortunately I
    have had to drop the tomatoes until I work all this
    out. They DO, make for a noticeable rise in my
    readings, although sun-dried ones don't seem to. I
    would have expected it to be the other way round.

    Quoted message said:

    I have found myself to be extremely weak on an Atkin's
    induction type plan. Have you compared readings between
    <20 gr carb and a higher intake of low carb/GI
    vegetables?

    Too early yet.

    I am following the advice given here, drops carbs, get the
    BG low and then add things back in while closely watching
    results. It is all a bit like a high school science
    experiment. I will start adding things next week, one new
    thing every two days until I work out what effect each thing
    has. I have no intention of staying this low, I would like
    to get back to 75-100 grams at least.

    Quoted message said:

    I found that there was no difference in bg readings for me
    when taking in <20 gr carb or eating lots of low carb (low
    starch) vegetables and some low GI fruits (in moderation).
    I only really notice rises in bg when starches are added
    (even in small quantities). Achieving euglycemia at the
    expense of good overall health doesn't make sense to me.

    Nor to me.

    Quoted message said:


    My way of eating is to make sure I know all the essential
    nutrients a human body needs then create meals around
    those facts putting emphasis on foods that do not cause me
    a bg problem.

    That is what I am aiming at, have to drop almost
    everything out in order to test each carb individually as
    I bring in back in.

    Quoted message said:

    "Small quantities of lo-glycemic/lo-carb vegs" doesn't
    appear to be enough to provide essential nutrients,
    particularly Vit C. Scurvy is still possible in a
    modern world.

    Not with vitamin supplements. I always take those, but even
    so, I am still eating small amounts of veg and fruit.
    (dried). This is only until I work out just how low I need
    to go, carb-wise to maintain acceptable BGLs.

    Quoted message said:


    Quoted message said:

    I had a two hour dinner reading of 5.9, had the
    jelly as a


    late snack an

    Quoted message said:

    hour or so later, and my bedtime reading a couple
    of hours


    further on

    Quoted message said:

    was 8.1. I might as well have been eating jellybeans. Has


    anyone else

    Quoted message said:

    had a problem with diet jelly?

    No, but it is possible you had a bit of a liver dump, very
    low carb dinner, nothing in the next 4 hours except some
    diet jelly.

    No, I take a reading every night before sleep and it hasn't
    happened before.

    Quoted message said:

    With my diet jelly I have either strawberries or
    blueberries (I set them in the jelly) and some canned
    whipped cream.

    I have tried making my own savory jelly, just gelatine
    with a diet stock base, chicken, veg, or beef. Almost zero
    carbs and quite tasty to eat. Later I can add vegs and
    meat pieces..

    Quoted message said:

    Carbs are still lowish but providing enough of a snack for
    the body to not believe I am starving.

    I snack on thin slices of low fat tasty cheese and polish
    cucumbers or julienned carrots and celery with the low
    carb mayo. (with some wine vinegar and black pepper added
    to the mayo).

    Regards

    David

  9. Anon said:

    It would not be extreme if he has a lot of weight to loose.
    I stayed on 20g carb a day diet for 3 months, and lost 40
    pounds. Then I went on 40g carbs a day until I lost 20
    pounds more. I can now tolerate 110g carb a day with the
    aid of meds.

    Anon type2

    No argument - never having done lo-carb, you know a lot more
    about it than I.

    However, he said:

    "Oh, yes, I am losing weight as well, although I was not
    really overweight to start with. I am losing about kilo
    every three days. I guess that with the very low carb
    intake, lower than normal calorie intake, and the exercise,
    walking and riding, I am burning up what few carb induced
    calories I have in my system and am burning body fat, a sort
    of de facto Atkins result. If I do a five kilometre walk
    after meals my BGL always drops far more rapidly than if I
    sit in front of a computer or read a book. The exercise
    makes a very noticeable difference."

    So I think it may be time to slow down the weight loss and
    improve the nutrition.

    Cheers, Alan, T2 d&e, Australia. Remove weight and
    carbs to email.
    --
    Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.

  10. "J David Anderson" <[email hidden]> wrote
    in message

    David, I am very leary of obtaining "nutrition from a
    bottle". This is your choice of course but already you are
    starting to show exhaustion. When that happens to me it is a
    signal that I am not feeding my body what it wants/needs. I
    have found a happy median at the moment by cutting out the
    starches etc, eating lower GI foods, but if I ever reach a
    point where I need to get my basic nutrients out of a bottle
    then I will switch to meds.

    This is only my personal opinion of what constitutes a good
    diet plan: I obtain all my nutrients from food, my bg's are
    stable and euglycemic, I don't feel tired, my muscles don't
    ache and my heart beat isn't erratic. On top of that it
    would also need to NOT cause my skin to look pasty or
    otherwise unhealthy and if necessary it would help with
    weight loss (when needed). It would also have to be "heart
    healthy" - based on current research in that area - it would
    need to keep my cholesterol and lipids within the desired
    range for a diabetic, ditto my BP readings.

    My young daughter has temporary hyperglycemia when she has
    prednisone, she only takes it rarely and for 3 days at a
    time only but it shoots her as high as 14.0, she is
    normally mid 5's. You have also changed your activities a
    bit, possibly once you get over your recent injury trauma
    you may find yourself returning to non diabetic numbers.
    There was a woman poster a while ago who had a diagnosis
    after taking a lot of prednisone, she eventually went back
    to non diabetic numbers, can't remember her name right now.
    Give me a few hours 🙂

  11. Alan said:

    No argument - never having done lo-carb, you know a lot
    more about it than I.

    However, he said:

    "Oh, yes, I am losing weight as well, although I was not
    really overweight to start with. I am losing about kilo
    every three days. I guess that with the very low carb
    intake, lower than normal calorie intake, and the exercise,
    walking and riding, I am burning up what few carb induced
    calories I have in my system and am burning body fat, a
    sort of de facto Atkins result. If I do a five kilometre
    walk after meals my BGL always drops far more rapidly than
    if I sit in front of a computer or read a book. The
    exercise makes a very noticeable difference."

    So I think it may be time to slow down the weight loss and
    improve the nutrition.

    Hi Alan, see reply to ozgirl.

    I have no intention of remaining this low, I don't feel very
    healthy at all, but I am following advice that you and a
    couple of others gave, drop it down and then add back, all
    the while test, test, testing...

    I am hoping to be able to get close to a normal ratio of
    carb, fat and protein, maybe with just a little bias toward
    low carb. I was strongly biased toward a high carb diet in
    the past, in fact, using diet planner, I ran the figures for
    my normal diet when I was in training and got a shock. I
    would sometimes exceed a kilo and a half of carbs a day.
    Huge plates of spaghetti or shell pasta with a ragu or
    marinara sauce for lunch and dinner, two or three small
    loaves of bread per day, anything up to eight or ten diet
    cokes, large bowls of muesli with eggs and toast for
    breakfast, plus a high carb dessert with almost every meal,
    and snacking in between, mostly fruit or pastry.

    You can do this when you spend two hours or more every day,
    seven days per week in hard exercise. Running, kayacking,
    riding, plus weight training. I used to be fanatical about
    it before the cancer and the accident. If I had to work
    late, and couldn't exercise, I would take my dogs and run
    at one or two in the morning just so that I could relax
    enough to sleep. When traveling I would only book hotels
    with a full gym.

    Now I need to find how each of the carbs affects me and
    devise an eating plan on those results. I guess this will
    take some time, but not too long I hope.

    Cheers

    David

    See you tomorrow.

  12. On Sun, 6 Jun 2004 22:10:42 +1000, "Ozgirl" <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:


    "J David Anderson" <[email hidden]> wrote
    in message

    David, I am very leary of obtaining "nutrition from a
    bottle".

    Hi Ozgirl. Don't take things so literally. That was a joke
    aimed at Alan, he mentioned that red wine had some
    benefits and that it was one the few things that you
    didn't have to give up.

    Quoted message said:

    This is your choice of course but already you are
    starting to show exhaustion.

    Not exhaustion, but I do lack the energy that I would
    normally expect. Considering the high carb diet that I have
    been used to for many years, it would be amazing if I
    didn't. I also have other medical problems that I haven't
    gone into detail with on these newsgroups. I am in remission
    from cancer and had a rather serious motorcycle accident
    last year, with more damage than they could easily repair.
    These have an effect, and it can be hard to work out just
    what is causing what.

    Quoted message said:

    When that happens to me it is a signal that I am not
    feeding my body what it wants/needs.

    I know that, I want carbs, both a psychological and a
    physiological need. I have to work out just what levels of
    carbs I really need, and just what sort of carbs they should
    be. That is what I am doing now, dropping almost all of them
    out of my diet and then experimentally adding different
    carbs back into my diet and watching their effect.

    Quoted message said:

    I have found a happy median at the moment by cutting out
    the starches etc, eating lower GI foods, but if I ever
    reach a point where I need to get my basic nutrients out of
    a bottle then I will switch to meds.

    I will find my happy medium too, but it is too early yet.
    BTW, I am not, and I never have been a heavy drinker, nor
    even a medium drinker. Wine with meals and the occasional
    whiskey, brandy, or martini is about my norm.

    Quoted message said:

    This is only my personal opinion of what constitutes a good
    diet plan: I obtain all my nutrients from food, my bg's are
    stable and euglycemic, I don't feel tired, my muscles don't
    ache and my heart beat isn't erratic. On top of that it
    would also need to NOT cause my skin to look pasty or
    otherwise unhealthy and if necessary it would help with
    weight loss (when needed). It would also have to be "heart
    healthy" - based on current research in that area - it
    would need to keep my cholesterol and lipids within the
    desired range for a diabetic, ditto my BP readings.

    My young daughter has temporary hyperglycemia when she has
    prednisone, she only takes it rarely and for 3 days at a
    time only but it shoots her as high as 14.0, she is
    normally mid 5's. You have also changed your activities a
    bit, possibly once you get over your recent injury trauma
    you may find yourself returning to non diabetic numbers.

    This was what my GP was suggesting in the beginning; the
    endo thinks otherwise, although he does feel that I will be
    able to manage quite well with diet and exercise.

    Quoted message said:

    There was a woman poster a while ago who had a diagnosis
    after taking a lot of prednisone, she eventually went back
    to non diabetic numbers, can't remember her name right now.
    Give me a few hours 🙂

    I have been off Prednisone for a few weeks now, but I
    was on a very high dose for five months. I was also
    receiving cortisone injections, something that wouldn't
    have help matters.

    Regards David

  13. J David Anderson said:

    See you tomorrow.

    OK 11-11:30 ish. Harvey Norman.

    Cheers, Alan, T2 d&e, Australia. Remove weight and
    carbs to email.
    --
    Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.

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