need advice on lightweight winter jacket

curious said:

Hello,
Looking for suggestions on a very lightweight winter
jacket that won't break the bank.

See my page on winter clothing:

http://www.pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/running/winter_reviews/

Quoted message said:

Typically, we have to wear many layers of clothing and
then the jacket which adds to our discomfort.

The good news is that we don't have to wear many layers. The reason I point
this out is not to be contrary, but because further down, you show some
interest in going with fewer layers. This approach is indeed a viable one, and
for me, it's the preferred one. For nearly all of my winter runs, I wear only
one layer and I run in weather as cold as single digits (fahrenheit)

The main problem is wind -- you need good wind protection. A lot of clothes
provide good thermal insulation but no wind protection. Rain is actually not
a huge problem -- if you get wet, it's not a huge problem as long as your
clothes don't absorb huge amounts of water (which undermines any thermal
insulation you might get out of them)

For the one layer approach, a windproof garment that is somewhat water
repellent is your best bet. Some good examples of windproof clothing all of
these have have a windproof front breathable back design, many are available at
reduced prices

sugoi windhibitor mid layer
sporthill explorer top

Quoted message said:

This is for near freezing temps.

If you're not even below 32, you probably don't even need wind protection.

A warm body-hugging top would do just fine. For example, the sporthill
infuzion top.

Quoted message said:

Can anyone advice on what brands are best for

Good brands are:
sporthill, sugoi, rei, hind, insport, pearl izumi, craft, moving comfort
(womens only). My favourite two are sugoi and sporthill.

Quoted message said:

lightweight clothing that doesn't require too many
layers to be worn and is also good for rainy days?

Most of the windproof clothing above will do pretty well even in the rain.
Because the clothing is made of synthetic material that doesn't sponge up
water like cotton does, you will not get drenched even when it rains.

For really heavy rain, put on a light raincoat over a light t-shirt. The
raincoat will already be pretty warm, so the layer under it should be
a light garment, preferably a "long sleeved tee".

An example (there are many) of a decent cheap raincoat is the pearl izumi
flash jacket (rei-outlet)

Quoted message said:

and any recommended stores...

http://www.rei-outlet.com/ (all the above products except sugoi)

sugoi:

http://www.greggscycles.com/
http://www.coloradocyclist.com

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

curious said:

Hello,
Looking for suggestions on a very lightweight winter
jacket that won't break the bank.

See my page on winter clothing:

http://www.pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/running/winter_reviews/

Quoted message said:

Typically, we have to wear many layers of clothing and
then the jacket which adds to our discomfort.

The good news is that we don't have to wear many layers. The reason I point
this out is not to be contrary, but because further down, you show some
interest in going with fewer layers. This approach is indeed a viable one, and
for me, it's the preferred one. For nearly all of my winter runs, I wear only
one layer and I run in weather as cold as single digits (fahrenheit)

The main problem is wind -- you need good wind protection. A lot of clothes
provide good thermal insulation but no wind protection. Rain is actually not
a huge problem -- if you get wet, it's not a huge problem as long as your
clothes don't absorb huge amounts of water (which undermines any thermal
insulation you might get out of them)

For the one layer approach, a windproof garment that is somewhat water
repellent is your best bet. Some good examples of windproof clothing all of
these have have a windproof front breathable back design, many are available at
reduced prices

sugoi windhibitor mid layer
sporthill explorer top

Quoted message said:

This is for near freezing temps.

If you're not even below 32, you probably don't even need wind protection.

A warm body-hugging top would do just fine. For example, the sporthill
infuzion top.

Quoted message said:

Can anyone advice on what brands are best for

Good brands are:
sporthill, sugoi, rei, hind, insport, pearl izumi, craft, moving comfort
(womens only). My favourite two are sugoi and sporthill.

Quoted message said:

lightweight clothing that doesn't require too many
layers to be worn and is also good for rainy days?

Most of the windproof clothing above will do pretty well even in the rain.
Because the clothing is made of synthetic material that doesn't sponge up
water like cotton does, you will not get drenched even when it rains.

For really heavy rain, put on a light raincoat over a light t-shirt. The
raincoat will already be pretty warm, so the layer under it should be
a light garment, preferably a "long sleeved tee".

An example (there are many) of a decent cheap raincoat is the pearl izumi
flash jacket (rei-outlet)

Quoted message said:

and any recommended stores...

http://www.rei-outlet.com/ (all the above products except sugoi)

sugoi:

http://www.greggscycles.com/
http://www.coloradocyclist.com

Cheers,
--
Donovan Rebbechi
http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

curious said:

Hello,
Looking for suggestions on a very lightweight winter
jacket that won't break the bank.

I'm interpreting this to be somewhere in the $50 range. I'm also
assuming that you might be upgrading in the future when you have a
better feeling for what you need - or if you need anything more. I can't
see in spending $100-$150 or more on a jacket when a $50 one may work
just as well or you haven't figured out exactly what works for you. I've
found very few garments perform as advertised so I'm hesitant to spend
the bucks until I know of a proven performer.

Quoted message said:

Typically, we have to wear many layers of clothing and
then the jacket which adds to our discomfort.

If you post a little more about your weather (usual temperature, wind,
rain / snow, etc), run duration, etc, it would help target a response.
But based on the way the question is worded, I'm assuming you're in
someplace normally warm that got an early season chill, and your runs
are probably near 1 hr or less. (I may at out-of-town meetings when you
respond, so I'm taking best shot now with assumptions.)

Are these cotton layers, by any chance? Using a couple well-selected
synthetic layers should be adequate near freezing, and you don't get the
Michelin man or Pillsbury Doughboy appearance 😉 Multiple layers
sometime tend to bind and restrict blood movement so work against you.
Stretch materials also help immensely with maneuverability. If windy
(50mph) or driving rains, then a little more care may be needed in
selecting a shell.

For instance, yesterday, I was snowshoe walking (with a little running)
at about 20F with a coolmax t-shirt, lightweight stretch fleece, and a
shell outbound, turned around and returned with t-shirt and a slightly
heavier fleece (windpro) with a little more wind protection and no
shell. (I was deliberately testing some new gear at those temperatures.)
I also may be cold adapted from running mostly in Alaska winter, so I
suspect YMMV.

Quoted message said:

This is for near freezing temps.

Can anyone advice on what brands are best for
lightweight clothing that doesn't require too many
layers to be worn and is also good for rainy days?

Many brands will have an assortment of gear - from summer up to (down?)
subzero F. The important thing is that they are synthetic. Things next
to your body should wick moisture away, then a breathable insulating
layer (if needed), and then a shell, if needed. I started with lots of
Duofold stuff from Campmor ($10-$30 range), then as my interests
expanded and I could justify spending more, I've tended to buy
Patagonia, Marmot, Sporthill, REI - but mostly on closeout sales.

Quoted message said:

and any recommended stores...

I may get some things at Wal-Mart, Sears, or running store (tends to be
pricey) *if* they have what I want, but more likely at stores like

www.REI.com (we have a local store where I get lots of running gear)

www.campmor.com
(http://tinyurl.com/4uqzs - just an example)
www.sierratradingpost.com

Plug "shell" or "wind" into their search engines. The last two have
closeouts that may be about half-price. (sometimes rei's outlet store is
also has something good)

You should be able to find something for about $50 or less.

Things advertised as "waterproof / breathable" may be neither, but they
may work ok for most rains. I've yet to see one that's reasonably
waterproof and still able to breathe sufficiently for running.

FWIW, fabrics that I like next to skin are powerdry and coolmax (or most
any t-shirt from a wicking material - I can't tell the difference except
for weight).

Insulation is usually something from Malden Mills
http://www.polartec.com/fabrics/index.php

FWIW, the layers I used yesterday were

Sporthill Catalyst - WindPro material (probably too warm above freezing
for me); ok but it has shoulder seams which may interfere with pack
(used without shell)

REI Stretch Fleece Bike Jersey - powerdry stretch - breathes well, can
wear it above freezing, use under rain gear for wet weather

Patagonia Krushell - works reasonably well for me, but not breathable
enough; water resistant but not waterproof. (can't find current source)

For rain, I use Marmot Precip (couple years old) - waterproof, not
breathable, but it provides lots of good protection in heavy driving
rains - at least in short term (haven't had it out in those conditions
for over 30 min). But it's noisy to run in everyday and doesn't breathe,
so I only use it for rain. Newer versions might be quieter and more
breathable.

You'll note that I like pockets and hoods on my shells to be able to
carry stuff and seal out the weather, respectively.

When I've compared the assortment of gear that I have, I've found that a
light shell and layers work better than some of these combined fabrics
under most conditions (a few exceptions). They're similar weights, but I
have more flexibility with the separate layers, and that's what layering
is about.

Good luck!

Dot
gear shopping during lunch breaks at meetings

--
"So many people get stuck in the routine of life that their dreams waste
away. This is about living the dream." - Cave Dog

curious said:

Hello,
Looking for suggestions on a very lightweight winter
jacket that won't break the bank.

I'm interpreting this to be somewhere in the $50 range. I'm also
assuming that you might be upgrading in the future when you have a
better feeling for what you need - or if you need anything more. I can't
see in spending $100-$150 or more on a jacket when a $50 one may work
just as well or you haven't figured out exactly what works for you. I've
found very few garments perform as advertised so I'm hesitant to spend
the bucks until I know of a proven performer.

Quoted message said:

Typically, we have to wear many layers of clothing and
then the jacket which adds to our discomfort.

If you post a little more about your weather (usual temperature, wind,
rain / snow, etc), run duration, etc, it would help target a response.
But based on the way the question is worded, I'm assuming you're in
someplace normally warm that got an early season chill, and your runs
are probably near 1 hr or less. (I may at out-of-town meetings when you
respond, so I'm taking best shot now with assumptions.)

Are these cotton layers, by any chance? Using a couple well-selected
synthetic layers should be adequate near freezing, and you don't get the
Michelin man or Pillsbury Doughboy appearance 😉 Multiple layers
sometime tend to bind and restrict blood movement so work against you.
Stretch materials also help immensely with maneuverability. If windy
(50mph) or driving rains, then a little more care may be needed in
selecting a shell.

For instance, yesterday, I was snowshoe walking (with a little running)
at about 20F with a coolmax t-shirt, lightweight stretch fleece, and a
shell outbound, turned around and returned with t-shirt and a slightly
heavier fleece (windpro) with a little more wind protection and no
shell. (I was deliberately testing some new gear at those temperatures.)
I also may be cold adapted from running mostly in Alaska winter, so I
suspect YMMV.

Quoted message said:

This is for near freezing temps.

Can anyone advice on what brands are best for
lightweight clothing that doesn't require too many
layers to be worn and is also good for rainy days?

Many brands will have an assortment of gear - from summer up to (down?)
subzero F. The important thing is that they are synthetic. Things next
to your body should wick moisture away, then a breathable insulating
layer (if needed), and then a shell, if needed. I started with lots of
Duofold stuff from Campmor ($10-$30 range), then as my interests
expanded and I could justify spending more, I've tended to buy
Patagonia, Marmot, Sporthill, REI - but mostly on closeout sales.

Quoted message said:

and any recommended stores...

I may get some things at Wal-Mart, Sears, or running store (tends to be
pricey) *if* they have what I want, but more likely at stores like

www.REI.com (we have a local store where I get lots of running gear)

www.campmor.com
(http://tinyurl.com/4uqzs - just an example)
www.sierratradingpost.com

Plug "shell" or "wind" into their search engines. The last two have
closeouts that may be about half-price. (sometimes rei's outlet store is
also has something good)

You should be able to find something for about $50 or less.

Things advertised as "waterproof / breathable" may be neither, but they
may work ok for most rains. I've yet to see one that's reasonably
waterproof and still able to breathe sufficiently for running.

FWIW, fabrics that I like next to skin are powerdry and coolmax (or most
any t-shirt from a wicking material - I can't tell the difference except
for weight).

Insulation is usually something from Malden Mills
http://www.polartec.com/fabrics/index.php

FWIW, the layers I used yesterday were

Sporthill Catalyst - WindPro material (probably too warm above freezing
for me); ok but it has shoulder seams which may interfere with pack
(used without shell)

REI Stretch Fleece Bike Jersey - powerdry stretch - breathes well, can
wear it above freezing, use under rain gear for wet weather

Patagonia Krushell - works reasonably well for me, but not breathable
enough; water resistant but not waterproof. (can't find current source)

For rain, I use Marmot Precip (couple years old) - waterproof, not
breathable, but it provides lots of good protection in heavy driving
rains - at least in short term (haven't had it out in those conditions
for over 30 min). But it's noisy to run in everyday and doesn't breathe,
so I only use it for rain. Newer versions might be quieter and more
breathable.

You'll note that I like pockets and hoods on my shells to be able to
carry stuff and seal out the weather, respectively.

When I've compared the assortment of gear that I have, I've found that a
light shell and layers work better than some of these combined fabrics
under most conditions (a few exceptions). They're similar weights, but I
have more flexibility with the separate layers, and that's what layering
is about.

Good luck!

Dot
gear shopping during lunch breaks at meetings

--
"So many people get stuck in the routine of life that their dreams waste
away. This is about living the dream." - Cave Dog

[email hidden] (curious) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Hello,
Looking for suggestions on a very lightweight winter
jacket that won't break the bank.

Typically, we have to wear many layers of clothing and
then the jacket which adds to our discomfort.

This is for near freezing temps.

Can anyone advice on what brands are best for
lightweight clothing that doesn't require too many
layers to be worn and is also good for rainy days?

I have two jackets that I use. One is a Mountain Athletics jacket,
single layer, windproof, very light, cost about 30GBP. The other is a
Fila shell, still light but very warm, which I got free from a friend
who is a Fila sponsored athlete.

However, what I want for Christmas is a gilet (don't know if this is
the same word in AmE) - i.e. a sleeveless jacket. I find that with
both my other jackets I roll the sleeves up, so it would make sense to
have a jacket without sleeves.

Depending on a) how cold it gets and b) how fast you run, you may find
that you need fewer layers than you think. I go skiing in the French
alps in January and when I go for a run I never wear more than a t
shirt, the Fila jacket and running tights. O, and for the pedants and
Miss Thrope, socks, shoes, keks etc.

Quoted message said:

and any recommended stores...

Look online for "Concurve" - they are a very reputable firm.

Edward
--
The reading group's reading group:
http://www.bookgroup.org.uk

[email hidden] (curious) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Hello,
Looking for suggestions on a very lightweight winter
jacket that won't break the bank.

Typically, we have to wear many layers of clothing and
then the jacket which adds to our discomfort.

This is for near freezing temps.

Can anyone advice on what brands are best for
lightweight clothing that doesn't require too many
layers to be worn and is also good for rainy days?

and any recommended stores...

Thank you.

For cold 20-30 F I wear a nylon pull over I got as a race freebie.
However I usually only wear a jacket in snow or really windy
conditions. Beneath the jacket I'll wear some synthetic shirt (usually
polypro).

Typically I don't wear a jacket as I find that I sweat too much in
them. I have a Sugoi cycling jacket that I'll wear when it is frigid -
below 10F. But beneath that I'll have on one, maybe 2, layers.

My advice is to reduce the layers. Sounds counter intuitive but being
less warm reduces the amount of sweat. Because sweat makes you colder.
If you are chilly in the first 6-8 minutes you should expect to warm
up. If you start out and are warm before you take a step you are
overdressed. If your shirt(s) are soaked when you get back from a run
you've overdressed.

Keep in mind everybody is different and finding out what works in the
winter is a matter of personal experiment.

Andy

Donovan Rebbechi <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

On 2004-11-01, curious <[email hidden]> wrote:

sugoi:

http://www.greggscycles.com/
http://www.coloradocyclist.com

Sugoi rocks! I have a few of their cycling garments and love them all.
Man I love my Sugio stretch pants for post running/skiing/cycling.

And ditto Sporthill. Nothing fancy it just works.

Andy

<< Look online for "Concurve" - they are a very reputable firm.

Edward >>

Honest?

_______
Blog, or dog? Who knows. But if you see my lost pup, please ping me!
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HREF="http://journals.aol.com/virginiaz/DreamingofLeonardo">http://journal
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<< >
Sugoi rocks! I have a few of their cycling garments and love them all.
Man I love my Sugio stretch pants for post running/skiing/cycling.

And ditto Sporthill. Nothing fancy it just works.

Andy >>

Is that like, an
Apres Sex thing?

_______
Blog, or dog? Who knows. But if you see my lost pup, please ping me!
<A
HREF="http://journals.aol.com/virginiaz/DreamingofLeonardo">http://journal
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