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Natural remedies crackdown in Oz

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
1 November 2003
Last activity
9 November 2003
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dickinson
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  1. Natural remedies crackdown
    http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,7731974%255E
    952,00.html

    Malcolm Cole, national political correspondent
    01nov03

    MAKERS of alternative medicines will have to provide proof that their
    products provide the claimed health benefits, under a shake-up of the
    complementary health industry.

    Manufacturers of complementary medicines will also face strict, quality
    control measures, if the recommendations of an expert review panel are
    adopted by the Federal Government.

    The panel was set up to investigate the $800 million industry after the
    widespread Pan Pharmaceuticals recall in May this year, and the
    company's subsequent collapse.

    It has called for the powers of the Therapeutic Goods Administration to
    be dramatically increased so it can test the claimed benefits of herbal
    remedies and alternative medicines.

    The panel has urged state and federal health ministers to develop a
    regulatory regime for complementary medicines. And it has warned of
    potential health dangers from combining alternative medicines with
    prescription drugs.

    Following the 1600-product Pan recall, it was revealed the safety
    testing standards for alternative medicines were significantly lower
    than the standards for pharmaceutical drugs.

    It was also revealed the makers of alternative medicines were not
    required to prove their products actually delivered the health benefits
    that they were claimed to provide.

    Committee chairman Michael Bollen said there was responsibility on all
    healthcare providers to behave ethically, and to give honest information
    about the likely benefits of their products.

    Parliamentary Secretary for Health Trish Worth said the review had
    exposed flaws in the safety standards of the complementary medicines
    industry.

    Ms Worth said she would pressure the Government to move to strengthen
    the TGA's powers, in line with the report's recommendations. And she
    would "urge my counterparts in the states and territories to introduce
    nationally consistent regulation to license practitioners of
    complementary medicines".

    The Complementary Healthcare Council said it was prepared to work with
    the Government in implementing some of the recommendations, but it
    warned that extra regulation would drive up prices.

    Council executive director Val Johanson said the industry believed it
    had "a very good regulatory system as it is".

    "And I think any changes to that regulatory system need to be looked at
    very carefully in terms of their impact to ensure they're . . .
    appropriate and beneficial in terms of consumers," she said.

    The Australian Consumers Association said the proposed new regulatory
    arrangements were "tough but fair", and would offer unprecedented
    protection to consumers.

    ACA health policy officer Martyn Goddard said alternative medicines
    should face the same regulation as prescription drugs.

    "The present regulations do not appear to recognise the basic fact that
    any substance that causes a change in bodily function is, by definition,
    a drug," he said.

    But the federal Opposition said the panel failed to examine whether the
    TGA's auditing and monitoring process for complementary medicines was
    adequate.

  2. "dickinson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    Natural remedies crackdown
    http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,7731974%255E
    952,00.html

    Malcolm Cole, national political correspondent
    01nov03

    MAKERS of alternative medicines will have to provide proof that their
    products provide the claimed health benefits...

    And, boy, does that [censored] the alties. Imagine that: having to
    prove your product does what you claim it does.

    Mark, MD

  3. "Mark" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "dickinson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message


    news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Natural remedies crackdown
    http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,7731974%255E
    952,00.html

    Malcolm Cole, national political correspondent
    01nov03

    MAKERS of alternative medicines will have to provide proof that their
    products provide the claimed health benefits...

    And, boy, does that [censored] the alties. Imagine that: having to
    prove your product does what you claim it does.

    Mark, MD

    Yes, in the U.S., Senate Bill 722 would just require "supplement"
    manufacturers and distributors to report to the FDA when their products kill
    or injure someone, and the alties are screaming that their world is coming
    to an end! Imagine if they had the burden of proving their products safe and
    effective!

    --Rich

  4. dickinson said:

    The Complementary Healthcare Council said it was prepared to work with
    the Government in implementing some of the recommendations, but it
    warned that extra regulation would drive up prices.

    Council executive director Val Johanson said the industry believed it
    had "a very good regulatory system as it is".

    This would be the Val Johanson who told a conference in Canberra that
    she was unaware that magnetic mattresses were being advertised on
    television in Australia and that things like Hulda zappers were being
    advertised in alternative medicine magazines. In fact, she claimed to
    be unaware of alternative medicine magazines at all.

    It's no wonder she thinks everything is fine.

    --
    Peter Bowditch
    The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
    The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight
    and The New Improved Quintessence of the Loon with added Vitamins and C-Q10 http://www.ratbags.com/loon
    To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

  5. (Mark) said:

    "dickinson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    Natural remedies crackdown
    http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,7731974%255E
    952,00.html

    Malcolm Cole, national political correspondent
    01nov03

    MAKERS of alternative medicines will have to provide proof that their
    products provide the claimed health benefits...

    And, boy, does that [censored] the alties. Imagine that: having to
    prove your product does what you claim it does.

    Mark, MD

    Marcus Blackmore, from the largest supplement manufacturer in
    Australia, reckons it will destroy the industry.

    --
    Peter Bowditch
    The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
    The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight
    and The New Improved Quintessence of the Loon with added Vitamins and C-Q10 http://www.ratbags.com/loon
    To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

  6. (Mark) said:
    Quoted message said:

    Natural remedies crackdown
    http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,7731974%255E
    952,00.html

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    MAKERS of alternative medicines will have to provide proof that their
    products provide the claimed health benefits...

    And, boy, does that [censored] the alties. Imagine that: having to
    prove your product does what you claim it does.

    <begin fuming and handflapping>

    Why ... why ... that's ... well, it's .... it's a bad idea. Our
    sales would drop!

    </begin fuming and handflapping>

    Tsu Dho Nimh

    --
    When businesses invoke the "protection of consumers," it's a lot like
    politicians invoking morality and children - grab your wallet and/or
    your kid and run for your life.

  7. Perhaps only 40% of alternative needs to be 'proven' as it is in mainstream.
    Anth

    "dickinson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Natural remedies crackdown
    http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,7731974%255E
    952,00.html

    Malcolm Cole, national political correspondent
    01nov03

    MAKERS of alternative medicines will have to provide proof that their
    products provide the claimed health benefits, under a shake-up of the
    complementary health industry.

    Manufacturers of complementary medicines will also face strict, quality
    control measures, if the recommendations of an expert review panel are
    adopted by the Federal Government.

    The panel was set up to investigate the $800 million industry after the
    widespread Pan Pharmaceuticals recall in May this year, and the
    company's subsequent collapse.

    It has called for the powers of the Therapeutic Goods Administration to
    be dramatically increased so it can test the claimed benefits of herbal
    remedies and alternative medicines.

    The panel has urged state and federal health ministers to develop a
    regulatory regime for complementary medicines. And it has warned of
    potential health dangers from combining alternative medicines with
    prescription drugs.

    Following the 1600-product Pan recall, it was revealed the safety
    testing standards for alternative medicines were significantly lower
    than the standards for pharmaceutical drugs.

    It was also revealed the makers of alternative medicines were not
    required to prove their products actually delivered the health benefits
    that they were claimed to provide.

    Committee chairman Michael Bollen said there was responsibility on all
    healthcare providers to behave ethically, and to give honest information
    about the likely benefits of their products.

    Parliamentary Secretary for Health Trish Worth said the review had
    exposed flaws in the safety standards of the complementary medicines
    industry.

    Ms Worth said she would pressure the Government to move to strengthen
    the TGA's powers, in line with the report's recommendations. And she
    would "urge my counterparts in the states and territories to introduce
    nationally consistent regulation to license practitioners of
    complementary medicines".

    The Complementary Healthcare Council said it was prepared to work with
    the Government in implementing some of the recommendations, but it
    warned that extra regulation would drive up prices.

    Council executive director Val Johanson said the industry believed it
    had "a very good regulatory system as it is".

    "And I think any changes to that regulatory system need to be looked at
    very carefully in terms of their impact to ensure they're . . .
    appropriate and beneficial in terms of consumers," she said.

    The Australian Consumers Association said the proposed new regulatory
    arrangements were "tough but fair", and would offer unprecedented
    protection to consumers.

    ACA health policy officer Martyn Goddard said alternative medicines
    should face the same regulation as prescription drugs.

    "The present regulations do not appear to recognise the basic fact that
    any substance that causes a change in bodily function is, by definition,
    a drug," he said.

    But the federal Opposition said the panel failed to examine whether the
    TGA's auditing and monitoring process for complementary medicines was
    adequate.

  8. I myself happen to appreciate the value of good supplements.
    I think there will be ways around this.
    Anth

    "Peter Bowditch" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    (Mark) said:

    "dickinson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message


    news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Natural remedies crackdown


    http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,7731974%255E

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    952,00.html

    Malcolm Cole, national political correspondent
    01nov03

    MAKERS of alternative medicines will have to provide proof that their
    products provide the claimed health benefits...

    And, boy, does that [censored] the alties. Imagine that: having to
    prove your product does what you claim it does.

    Mark, MD

    Marcus Blackmore, from the largest supplement manufacturer in
    Australia, reckons it will destroy the industry.

    --
    Peter Bowditch
    The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
    The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight
    and The New Improved Quintessence of the Loon with added Vitamins and


    C-Q10 http://www.ratbags.com/loon

    Quoted message said:

    To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

  9. Anth said:

    I myself happen to appreciate the value of good supplements.

    How do you know the supplement is good? How do you know that taking
    supplements will not result in new diseases?? Don't assume that
    supplements are safe because they are supplements. Have trials been
    done with supplements to show they don't result in new diseases?? If
    so please post these studies.

    The point of my asking these questions is to show the hypocrisy that
    many who claim that vaccines can cause new diseases but ignore the
    fact that most anything that they ingest in the form of supplements
    can possibly also do this. But the same folks who worry about vaccines
    don't worry about supplements. And vaccines have overwhelming evidence
    to support their efficacy in preventing illnesses and saving lives.
    Childhood vaccines are certainly not perfect but the evidence that we
    have almost certainly indicates that the positive effects far outweigh
    the negative by a large margin.

    Aloha,

    Rich

    ------------------------------------------------
    ------------------------------------------------

    The best defense to logic is ignorance.

  10. Supplements are widely tested and have shown promise in preventing disease..

    You seem to have labelled me as an anti-vaccine quack - I suggest you get
    this idea out of your mind.

    I quoted that they are not as safe as they are made out to be which is
    correct.

    Anth

    Nothing will ever be attempted, if all possible objections must be first
    overcome.
    - Samuel Johnson, 1759.

    "Rich" <,@.> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Anth said:

    I myself happen to appreciate the value of good supplements.

    How do you know the supplement is good? How do you know that taking
    supplements will not result in new diseases?? Don't assume that
    supplements are safe because they are supplements. Have trials been
    done with supplements to show they don't result in new diseases?? If
    so please post these studies.

    The point of my asking these questions is to show the hypocrisy that
    many who claim that vaccines can cause new diseases but ignore the
    fact that most anything that they ingest in the form of supplements
    can possibly also do this. But the same folks who worry about vaccines
    don't worry about supplements. And vaccines have overwhelming evidence
    to support their efficacy in preventing illnesses and saving lives.
    Childhood vaccines are certainly not perfect but the evidence that we
    have almost certainly indicates that the positive effects far outweigh
    the negative by a large margin.

    Aloha,

    Rich

    ------------------------------------------------
    ------------------------------------------------

    The best defense to logic is ignorance.

  11. Anth said:

    Perhaps only 40% of alternative needs to be 'proven' as it is in
    mainstream. Anth

    eh?

    Quoted message said:

    "dickinson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Natural remedies crackdown


    http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,7731974%255E

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    952,00.html

    Malcolm Cole, national political correspondent
    01nov03

    MAKERS of alternative medicines will have to provide proof that their
    products provide the claimed health benefits, under a shake-up of the
    complementary health industry.

    Manufacturers of complementary medicines will also face strict,
    quality control measures, if the recommendations of an expert review
    panel are adopted by the Federal Government.

    The panel was set up to investigate the $800 million industry after
    the widespread Pan Pharmaceuticals recall in May this year, and the
    company's subsequent collapse.

    It has called for the powers of the Therapeutic Goods Administration
    to be dramatically increased so it can test the claimed benefits of
    herbal remedies and alternative medicines.

    The panel has urged state and federal health ministers to develop a
    regulatory regime for complementary medicines. And it has warned of
    potential health dangers from combining alternative medicines with
    prescription drugs.

    Following the 1600-product Pan recall, it was revealed the safety
    testing standards for alternative medicines were significantly lower
    than the standards for pharmaceutical drugs.

    It was also revealed the makers of alternative medicines were not
    required to prove their products actually delivered the health
    benefits that they were claimed to provide.

    Committee chairman Michael Bollen said there was responsibility on
    all healthcare providers to behave ethically, and to give honest
    information about the likely benefits of their products.

    Parliamentary Secretary for Health Trish Worth said the review had
    exposed flaws in the safety standards of the complementary medicines
    industry.

    Ms Worth said she would pressure the Government to move to strengthen
    the TGA's powers, in line with the report's recommendations. And she
    would "urge my counterparts in the states and territories to
    introduce nationally consistent regulation to license practitioners
    of complementary medicines".

    The Complementary Healthcare Council said it was prepared to work
    with the Government in implementing some of the recommendations, but
    it
    warned that extra regulation would drive up prices.

    Council executive director Val Johanson said the industry believed it
    had "a very good regulatory system as it is".

    "And I think any changes to that regulatory system need to be looked
    at very carefully in terms of their impact to ensure they're . . .
    appropriate and beneficial in terms of consumers," she said.

    The Australian Consumers Association said the proposed new regulatory
    arrangements were "tough but fair", and would offer unprecedented
    protection to consumers.

    ACA health policy officer Martyn Goddard said alternative medicines
    should face the same regulation as prescription drugs.

    "The present regulations do not appear to recognise the basic fact
    that any substance that causes a change in bodily function is, by
    definition, a drug," he said.

    But the federal Opposition said the panel failed to examine whether
    the TGA's auditing and monitoring process for complementary
    medicines was adequate.

  12. In article <[email hidden]>,

    dickinson said:
    Anth said:

    Perhaps only 40% of alternative needs to be 'proven' as it is in
    mainstream. Anth

    eh?

    Oh, I think this is yet another variation of bemoaning that 1978
    report from OTA that was discussing how much of conventional medicine
    had been "proven" in randomized controlled trials and so on.

    It was [censored] then, and even more so now.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
    These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
    "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

  13. David Wright said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    dickinson said:
    Anth said:

    Perhaps only 40% of alternative needs to be 'proven' as it is in
    mainstream. Anth

    eh?

    Oh, I think this is yet another variation of bemoaning that 1978
    report from OTA that was discussing how much of conventional medicine
    had been "proven" in randomized controlled trials and so on.

    It was [censored] then, and even more so now.

    Oh! OK. That figures why Jan qouted it then........she has verbal
    diarrhoea.

  14. In article <[email hidden]>,

    dickinson said:
    David Wright said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    dickinson said:

    Anth wrote:
    > Perhaps only 40% of alternative needs to be 'proven' as it is in
    > mainstream. Anth

    eh?

    Oh, I think this is yet another variation of bemoaning that 1978
    report from OTA that was discussing how much of conventional medicine
    had been "proven" in randomized controlled trials and so on.

    It was [censored] then, and even more so now.

    Oh! OK. That figures why Jan qouted it then........she has verbal
    diarrhoea.

    Did Jan quote it? I went back over her last few postings and she was
    proving my point, that well over 40% of conventional medicine is
    evidence-based, and around 40% of it is based on RCTs. I'm not quite
    sure what Anth's point was, but it seemed to be that you should not
    require evidence for alt med, or something like that. When he gets
    cute about his one-line responses, his meaning is hard to divine.

    -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
    These are my opinions only, but they're almost always correct.
    "If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants
    were standing on my shoulders." (Hal Abelson, MIT)

  15. David Wright <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    dickinson said:
    David Wright said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,
    dickinson <[email hidden]> wrote:
    > Anth wrote:
    >> Perhaps only 40% of alternative needs to be 'proven' as it is in
    >> mainstream. Anth
    >
    > eh?

    Oh, I think this is yet another variation of bemoaning that 1978
    report from OTA that was discussing how much of conventional medicine
    had been "proven" in randomized controlled trials and so on.

    It was [censored] then, and even more so now.

    Oh! OK. That figures why Jan qouted it then........she has verbal
    diarrhoea.

    Did Jan quote it? I went back over her last few postings and she was
    proving my point, that well over 40% of conventional medicine is
    evidence-based, and around 40% of it is based on RCTs. I'm not quite
    sure what Anth's point was, but it seemed to be that you should not
    require evidence for alt med, or something like that. When he gets
    cute about his one-line responses, his meaning is hard to divine.

    He seems to think that the only valid proof of any medical practice is
    through randomized placebo controlled trials, and so he seems to think that
    only 40% of alt med needs to be proven through rct's for alt med to have the
    same standard of science as real medicine has. But, this is merely my
    interpretation of his posts sofar, I may very well be mistaken and if so, I
    eagerly await his own explanation.

    --

    Robert Bronsing

    Can't you see?
    It all makes perfect sense,
    expressed in dollars and cents, pounds, shillings and pence

    (R. Waters)

  16. David Wright said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    dickinson said:
    David Wright said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,
    dickinson <[email hidden]> wrote:
    > Anth wrote:
    >> Perhaps only 40% of alternative needs to be 'proven' as it is in
    >> mainstream. Anth
    >
    > eh?

    Oh, I think this is yet another variation of bemoaning that 1978
    report from OTA that was discussing how much of conventional
    medicine had been "proven" in randomized controlled trials and so
    on.

    It was [censored] then, and even more so now.

    Oh! OK. That figures why Jan qouted it then........she has verbal
    diarrhoea.

    Did Jan quote it?

    Nope. If my memory of the thread serves......it was "Anth". My
    apologies.

  17. Quoted message said:

    Subject: Re: Natural remedies crackdown in Oz
    From: [email hidden] (David Wright)
    Date: 11/5/2003 6:53 AM Pacific Standard Time
    Message-id: <[email hidden]>

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    dickinson said:
    David Wright said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,
    dickinson <[email hidden]> wrote:
    > Anth wrote:
    >> Perhaps only 40% of alternative needs to be 'proven' as it is in
    >> mainstream. Anth
    >
    > eh?

    Oh, I think this is yet another variation of bemoaning that 1978
    report from OTA that was discussing how much of conventional medicine
    had been "proven" in randomized controlled trials and so on.

    It was [censored] then, and even more so now.

    Oh! OK. That figures why Jan qouted it then........she has verbal
    diarrhoea.

    Did Jan quote it?

    After Anth posted it.

    This new hate filled debunker had nothing to say, except insults, just like his
    very first post.

    But it is OH! OK, if you post something, no questions asked. Just more oof Ye
    good ole boy and girl club thing.

    Quoted message said:

    I went back over her last few postings and she was
    proving my point, that well over 40% of conventional medicine is
    evidence-based, and around 40% of it is based on RCTs

    Best read it again.

    Quoted message said:

    I'm not quite
    sure what Anth's point was, but it seemed to be that you should not
    require evidence for alt med, or something like that. When he gets
    cute about his one-line responses, his meaning is hard to divine.

    When he gets cute,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

    Poor David.

    Jan

  18. Jan wrote with her usual spite and venom:

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Subject: Re: Natural remedies crackdown in Oz

    Quoted message said:

    This new hate filled debunker had nothing to say, except insults,
    just like his very first post.

    As I said when I first came here, I was intending to lurk and learn, but
    some of the [censored] posted here is so obviously "out of this world" that I
    just had to "de-camp".

    Quoted message said:

    But it is OH! OK, if you post something, no questions asked.

    I will ask when I need clarification, and question when I disagree. I
    *have* attempted to make some small contribution by way of the autism
    threads, and have also exercised restraint where the question of
    vaccination and autism is concerned. My opinion is that it is just *too*
    volatile a subject for those who are still in "the grieving process" and
    seeing as how it is split many a ng asunder, I tend to steer clear,
    until I am *absolutely* sure of my position on the matter

    Quoted message said:

    Just more oof Ye good ole boy and girl club thing.

    Sorry? I'm a carer to children with difficulties and also a person who
    has been told that he will "likely be medicated for life". I have tried
    alternative medicine and am here to learn, but that doesn't mean that I
    should remain quiet when something is considered by myself to be
    "dangerous preachings"......that consideration being arrived at by
    scientific evidence and not anecdotal mumbo jumbo.....(with a large
    quantity of religious fervour, bigotry and racism thrown in for good
    measure)

    Trust I make myself clear yer 'onour.

  19. Pete said:

    Marcus Blackmore, from the largest supplement manufacturer in
    Australia, reckons it will destroy the industry.

    It is strange to hear him whinging considering a senior executive of
    his company was on the expert committee that created this report, so
    one can only conclude the interests of Blackmores contributed to its
    outcomes. No doubt a higher shelf company like Blackmores can probably
    meet all the recommendations, thus any tears by Mr Blackmore I'm sure
    thinly overlays a grin of glee, much like it did when the share price
    of Blackmores rose during the Pan crisis because it was one of the
    select who didn't use them.

  20. (the watcher) said:
    Pete said:

    Marcus Blackmore, from the largest supplement manufacturer in
    Australia, reckons it will destroy the industry.

    It is strange to hear him whinging considering a senior executive of
    his company was on the expert committee that created this report, so
    one can only conclude the interests of Blackmores contributed to its
    outcomes. No doubt a higher shelf company like Blackmores can probably
    meet all the recommendations, thus any tears by Mr Blackmore I'm sure
    thinly overlays a grin of glee, much like it did when the share price
    of Blackmores rose during the Pan crisis because it was one of the
    select who didn't use them.

    Not only did the share price of Blackmore's rise, but their wholesale
    prices rose as well. As soon as they were the only game in town they
    were privately drooling at the chance to exploit Pan's problems while
    publicly whining about how the alternative industry was being
    attacked.

    --
    Peter Bowditch
    The Millenium Project http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles
    The Green Light http://www.ratbags.com/greenlight
    and The New Improved Quintessence of the Loon with added Vitamins and C-Q10 http://www.ratbags.com/loon
    To email me use my first name only at ratbags.com

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