My Experiment...

Quoted message said:

Use a thin headset spanner to hold the threaded race (immediately
below the locknut) and loosen the locknut. Tighten the threaded race
until the steering is solid then tighten the locknut down onto it
without backing off the threaded race.

Failure. The threaded race couldn't be tightened at all by hand, and it
didn't have spanner-grabby bits on to be tightened with a spanner.

I then set about buggering up the (nice) Trek. The crappy headset spanner
(or possibly the crappy headset) wasn't a good fit, and I was unable to
tighten the threaded race sufficiently to prevent all steering. At least
I'll learn how to adjust a headset properly now 🙁

23 Feb 2007 19:40 Pete Biggs said:

Another link:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/descending.html :

"What is not apparent, is that two wheeled vehicles can be controlled ONLY
by countersteer, there is no other way. Unlike a car, a bicycle cannot be
diverted from a straight path by steering the wheel to one side ...

When a stunt driver puts a car up on two wheels, ISTR the front wheels
countersteer visibly. I suspect this is because they are at a hideous
angle in two wheel mode, making the geometry VERY peculiar in terms of
castor and so on. With the significant gearing between steering wheel
and roadwheel steering axis, the former's movement should be far more
obvious than that seen on a bike's ungeared steering?

--
Tim Forcer [email hidden]
The University of Southampton, UK

The University is not responsible for my opinions

dkahn400 said:

Use a thin headset spanner to hold the threaded race (immediately
below the locknut) and loosen the locknut. Tighten the threaded race
until the steering is solid then tighten the locknut down onto it
without backing off the threaded race.

Then buy a new headset to replace the one you've just buggered up.

Quoted message said:

On Mar 2, 5:24 pm, Ben C <[email hidden]> wrote:

[...]

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

It's not a contradiction. If you're sitting in zero-gravity, you can
touch your toes. Your COM moves relative to your toes, but not relative
to the NRF.

Yes, the toes can move relative to the NRF. Are you claiming that the
contact patch does? If so, how, other than by steering?

No. The contact patch does not have to move for a rider to lean a bike
over to one side.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

A movement like that, not requiring any lateral forces from the NRF,

What sort of (lateral) movement is it that requires no lateral force?

I said lateral forces from the NRF, or in other words external lateral
forces, are not required. A rider in zero-G can move his tyres to one
side relative to his own centre of mass by applying a force.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

To put the shoe on the other foot, since you are not prepared to try
the trivial experiments I have suggested (which certainly would show
that the possibility to "just shift your centre of mass sideways" is
extremely limited), can you suggest any experiment which would
actually demonstrate the existence of such an ability at a level which
might make a perceptible difference in bicycle riding?

As I said earlier, leaning into a corner does not require clown ability.
Clowns enter the discussion only to illuminate the descriptions of why
it is possible to lean over without needing psychokinesis. We use the
same physics as the clowns, but not the same skill. They use this effect
to balance on things, I'm only suggesting that cyclists may use it to
initiate turns.

To put the shoe on the other foot, since you are not prepared to try
the trivial experiments I have suggested (which certainly would show
that the possibility to "just shift your centre of mass sideways" is
extremely limited), can you suggest any experiment which would
actually demonstrate the existence of such an ability at a level which
might make a perceptible difference in bicycle riding?

I should have made it clearer: I am not suggesting that this mechanism
of balance is used by any normal bike rider and so I don't think this
experiment is necessary.

That it might be used to initiate turns is possible. I'm not sure what
would be a good experiment to test for that.

Al C-F said:

Then buy a new headset to replace the one you've just buggered
up.

Quoted message said:

From Mark's reply it looks as though he may have to. :-)

Seriously though, it shouldn't do any damage as long as it remains
locked.

--
Dave...

In article <[email hidden]>,
dkahn400
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Al C-F said:

Then buy a new headset to replace the one you've just buggered
up.

Quoted message said:

From Mark's reply it looks as though he may have to. :-)

Seriously though, it shouldn't do any damage as long as it remains
locked.

You'd have to overtighten it considerably to lock it solid - if the
bearing faces are harder than the balls (unlikely) then the balls might
break, otherwise they're likely to leave dents in the bearing faces.