Moron French (=) Hate Armstrong

[email hidden] (Ilan Vardi) wrote in :"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Quebec has been even more restrictive regarding French language than France. There are more signs
in English in Paris and the surrounding region than there are in Montreal. In the 70's, the Quebec
separatists tried to convert all signs to French, and even French which had no English cognate,
thus they tried to remove "Stop" signs, even though this is correct French usage, as seen in
France, and adopt "Arret", which is wrong, since it means "stop" as in "bus stop", not the verb.
Also, Mountain street in Montreal became "de la Montagne", even though it was named after some guy
called Mountain, etc. These days things are more reasonable.

What's really funny about the Quebecois celebrating their French heritage is that the French seem to
view them as some sort of [censored] spawn they want nothing to do with. They say that the Quebec
French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when they visit France they are openly
mocked. I saw this happen once, fueled by alcohol, and surprised they didn't come to blows. Arret!

NS

Ilan Vardi said:

I wasn't clear in my original message: I don't hate French people or French culture, I hate
all people and all culture. Or at least, I am more sensitive to one country's faults when I
live there.

Quoted message said:

The subject of the posting was that the truly horrible people following cycling in France can be
identified by their irrational criticism of Armstrong. A lot of French people admire Armstrong,
especially this year, and even more don't care either way.

People seem to think that sports fans are supposed to be different in cycling. Well, truth be told,
they are pretty much the same as in every sport. I still hear people here blather on demonizing
Barry Bonds vs Sammy Sosa, a friend watched a recent NY Yankees World Series warm up where the
opposing team's outfielder was subjected to vicious abuse just stretching out. Fans are fans
everywhere. The ones noticing the Armstrong taunts probably would hear the same for germans were
Ullrich winning.

Quoted message said:

As for the American content on French TV, I was just watching "Friends" on France 2, on France 3
was "Remington Steele", and TF1 "Magnum P.I.". Of all the countries I've lived in, the most
restrictive, in terms of American content was Canada, recall Bob and Doug McKenzie of the "Great
White North" on SCTV, which was a parody of the fact that every television program in Canada had
to have minimum Canadian content. Quebec has been even more restrictive regarding French language
than France. There are more signs in English in Paris and the surrounding region than there are in
Montreal. In the 70's, the Quebec separatists tried to convert all signs to French, and even
French which had no English cognate, thus they tried to remove "Stop" signs, even though this is
correct French usage, as seen in France, and adopt "Arret", which is wrong, since it means "stop"
as in "bus stop", not the verb. Also, Mountain street in Montreal became "de la Montagne", even
though it was named after some guy called Mountain, etc. These days things are more reasonable.

Quoted message said:

-ilan

"Nev Shea" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

They say that the Quebec French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when they
visit France they are openly mocked.

Hey Ilan, think the French mock you because of your accent? My wife thinks the Quebecois aren't the
butt of nearly as many jokes as the Belgians.

Thinking about it, I'll bet the Dutch think the Belgians talk funny, too. Bart?

Quoted message said:

From: Nev Shea

Quoted message said:

They say that the Quebec French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when they
visit France they are openly mocked.

According to my French teacher, the Quebec dialect is closer to the old French,
i.e. it has changed less than the language used in France.

Quoted message said:

What's really funny about the Quebecois >celebrating their French heritage

(snip)

Well what isn't funny is that the Quebecois are on the short end of the socioeconomic stick in
Canada. Go to Ottowa some time, look over the river to Hull. Quite a contrast. --Tom Paterson

----- Original Message ----- From: "Ilan Vardi" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

The subject of the posting was that the truly horrible people following cycling in France can be
identified by their irrational criticism of Armstrong. A lot of French people admire Armstrong,
especially this year, and even more don't care either way.

1 a - Most [censored] you see blocking the climbs in front of the riders, and running naked are
american. b - Of the French that are involved with cycling (surprising number are not) , everyone
was excited for Lance this year. They were witnessing another historic event and they appreciated
that. c - Sensationalistic tabliod reporting is just that. It's meant for suckers to gain publicity
by controversy. Ignore and boycott it and it should fade away.

Quoted message said:

As for the American content on French TV, I was just watching "Friends" on France 2, on France 3
was "Remington Steele", and TF1 "Magnum P.I.". Of all the countries I've lived in, the most
restrictive, in terms of American content was Canada, recall Bob and Doug McKenzie of the "Great
White North" on SCTV, which was a parody of the fact that every television program in Canada had
to have minimum Canadian content. Quebec has been even more restrictive regarding French language
than France. There are more signs in English in Paris and the surrounding region than there are in
Montreal. In the 70's, the Quebec separatists tried to convert all signs to French, and even
French which had no English cognate, thus they tried to remove "Stop" signs, even though this is
correct French usage, as seen in France, and adopt "Arret", which is wrong, since it means "stop"
as in "bus stop", not the verb. Also, Mountain street in Montreal became "de la Montagne", even
though it was named after some guy called Mountain, etc. These days things are

more

Quoted message said:

reasonable.

2 - True that french and english Canada are at odds. Simply put, the french part hates the
subversive influence into their culture and the english part hates having french rammed down
their throats.

3 - France does not hate Quebecois. In fact, while we were touring France in the Loire region last
month, one of the towns was celebrating a "Quebecois" Sunday as sort of a "sister city" thing, with
a parade, cycling event, music, etc. France feels a lot more isolated than you might think. They
feel the pervasiveness of english is squeezing their cultural heritage. Recent case in point, they
banned the use of the word "e-mail" in their vocabulary and coined their own word, because "mail" is
an english term.

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Thinking about it, I'll bet the Dutch think the Belgians talk funny, too. Bart?

The Dutch have more Belgian jokes than the French, if possible. The theme is Mock The
Belgian Dumbass.

But our talking, yes they find it 'funny'. But I think in the last decades they have evolved from
finding Flemish accents plain peasantry, to a more appreciative attitude in connection to our "good
life" image. It might also be related to a decline in the quality of spoken standard Dutch in the
Netherlands itself, among younger generations.

Both Flemish and Dutch generally find Afrikaans (RSA) 'funny' in a positive way I think. It sounds
simultaneously old/authentic and living/creative.

Your wife is right. But the Belgians serve it right back at the French. "Robert Chung"
<[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Nev Shea" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

They say that the Quebec French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when they
visit France they are openly mocked.

Hey Ilan, think the French mock you because of your accent? My wife thinks the Quebecois aren't
the butt of nearly as many jokes as the Belgians.

Thinking about it, I'll bet the Dutch think the Belgians talk funny, too. Bart?

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Nev Shea said:

[email hidden] (Tom Paterson) wrote in
:"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

From: Nev Shea What's really funny about the Quebecois >celebrating their French heritage

(snip)

Well what isn't funny is that the Quebecois are on the short end of the socioeconomic stick in
Canada. Go to Ottowa some time, look over the river to Hull. Quite a contrast.

I've been to Ottawa and have no interest to go back just to take in the view of Hull. Besides, If
you look across the river from St. Louis to East St. Louis, would you draw the conclusion that
folks in Illinois are on the short end of the stick to those in Missouri?

NS

I dunno. My wife grew up in Cincinnatti, and when they look across the river at Kentucky, they,
uh, are looking at Kentucky.

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS Brooklyn, NY 718-258-5001 dentaltwins.comdentaltwins.comOpen ↗

"Bryan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:bXcWa.20744$Oz4.7001@rwcrnsc54...

Quoted message said:

----- Original Message ----- From: "Ilan Vardi" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

The subject of the posting was that the truly horrible people following cycling in France can be
identified by their irrational criticism of Armstrong. A lot of French people admire Armstrong,
especially this

year,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and even more don't care either way.

1 a - Most [censored] you see blocking the climbs in front of the riders,

and

Quoted message said:

running naked are american.

Show us proof...............when I was there.......it was mostly French.........now spread
another rumor!

Quoted message said:

b - Of the French that are involved with cycling (surprising number are not) , everyone was
excited for Lance this year. They were witnessing another historic event and they appreciated
that. c - Sensationalistic tabliod reporting is just that. It's meant for suckers to gain
publicity by controversy. Ignore and boycott it and it should fade away.

Kind of like the Artist's who blocked the road on one stage.........were they american too????

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

As for the American content on French TV, I was just watching "Friends" on France 2, on France 3
was "Remington Steele", and TF1 "Magnum P.I.". Of all the countries I've lived in, the most
restrictive, in terms of American content was Canada, recall Bob and Doug McKenzie of the "Great
White North" on SCTV, which was a parody of the fact that every television program in Canada had
to have minimum Canadian content. Quebec has been even more restrictive regarding French
language than France. There are more signs in English in Paris and the surrounding region than
there are in Montreal. In the 70's, the Quebec separatists tried to convert all signs to French,
and even French which had no English cognate, thus they tried to remove "Stop" signs, even
though this is correct French usage, as seen in France, and adopt "Arret", which is wrong, since
it means "stop" as in "bus stop", not the verb. Also, Mountain street in Montreal became "de la
Montagne", even though it was named after some guy called Mountain, etc. These days things are

more

Quoted message said:

reasonable.

2 - True that french and english Canada are at odds. Simply put, the

french

Quoted message said:

part hates the subversive influence into their culture and the english

part

Quoted message said:

hates having french rammed down their throats.

3 - France does not hate Quebecois. In fact, while we were touring France in the Loire region last
month, one of the towns was celebrating a "Quebecois" Sunday as sort of a "sister city" thing,
with a parade,

cycling

Quoted message said:

event, music, etc. France feels a lot more isolated than you might think. They feel the
pervasiveness of english is squeezing their cultural

heritage.

Quoted message said:

Recent case in point, they banned the use of the word "e-mail" in their vocabulary and coined
their own word, because "mail" is an english term.

Nev Shea <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

What's really funny about the Quebecois celebrating their French heritage is that the French seem
to view them as some sort of [censored] spawn they want nothing to do with. They say that the Quebec
French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when they visit France they are openly
mocked. I saw this happen once, fueled by alcohol, and surprised they didn't come to blows. Arret!

I can believe that of French immigrants in Quebec, but in France, French Canadians are well
regarded, and are darlings of the intellectuals as well. A huge proportion of the top pop singers in
France are French Canadians, and that's been true for quite a while.

Here is one reason for this. In general, people from Quebec will come to France to seek greater fame
and fortune, so you mostly get the best and the brightest, which give positive reinforcement for the
image of Quebec in France. On the other hand, the French who end up in Quebec are often the losers
who can't make it in France, so they are more likely to feel threatened and take it out on the
French Canadians.

-ilan

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

"Nev Shea" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

They say that the Quebec French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when they
visit France they are openly mocked.

Hey Ilan, think the French mock you because of your accent? My wife thinks the Quebecois aren't
the butt of nearly as many jokes as the Belgians.

No, I had problems when I was living in Montreal with my French accent. My parents were among the
francophile type who openly mocked French Canadians, so I responded by never losing my accent. Like
I said before, I can speak perfect french as much as I want, but if I utter one English expression
pronounced in English, then I am forever branded as an American (by the "M" portion of the
population, that is).

What do you call Newfies and French Canadians singing together? Answer: The Moron Tabernack Choir.

-ilan

"Bryan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<bXcWa.20744$Oz4.7001@rwcrnsc54>...

Quoted message said:

3 - France does not hate Quebecois. In fact, while we were touring France in the Loire region last
month, one of the towns was celebrating a "Quebecois" Sunday as sort of a "sister city" thing,
with a parade, cycling event, music, etc. France feels a lot more isolated than you might think.
They feel the pervasiveness of english is squeezing their cultural heritage. Recent case in point,
they banned the use of the word "e-mail" in their vocabulary and coined their own word, because
"mail" is an english term.

Quite true, except for that last part. In fact, almost no one uses the "official" word (courriel).
For example, I was told by a French teacher that I should stop using the term "courrier
electronique" (electronic mail, in French) because she and all her friends use the word "mail" (oh,
and it's masculine for some unknown reason). I consider her representative of the vast majority of
ignoramusses (is that how you spell it, first time I've tried to pluralise it) who direct the course
of a living language.

Speaking of odd linguistic phenomena, there are a slew of English terms in French which have been
modified for no apparent reason. I mentioned that walkie-talkie is talkie-walkie, but there are also
interesting cases of English words that do not actually exist in English, like the French word
"wheeling" which means "wheelie" in French.

-ilan

Ilan Vardi said:

I wasn't clear in my original message: I don't hate French people or French culture, I hate all
people and all culture.

"Whenever I hear the word culture, I reach for my revolver." -- Hermann Goering

Quoted message said:

These days things are more reasonable.

Not unless they can tune in to "King of the Hill."

[email hidden] (Tom Paterson) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

From: Nev Shea

Quoted message said:

They say that the Quebec French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when they
visit France they are openly mocked.

According to my French teacher, the Quebec dialect is closer to the old French,
i.e. it has changed less than the language used in France.

"i.e.,"

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

What's really funny about the Quebecois .... SNIPPED!!!

[email hidden] (Ilan Vardi) wrote in :"]news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Nev Shea <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

What's really funny about the Quebecois celebrating their French heritage is that the French seem
to view them as some sort of [censored] spawn they want nothing to do with. They say that the Quebec
French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when they visit France they are
openly mocked. I saw this happen once, fueled by alcohol, and surprised they didn't come to
blows. Arret!

I can believe that of French immigrants in Quebec, but in France, French Canadians are well
regarded, and are darlings of the intellectuals as well. A huge proportion of the top pop singers
in France are French Canadians, and that's been true for quite a while.

Here is one reason for this. In general, people from Quebec will come to France to seek greater
fame and fortune, so you mostly get the best and the brightest, which give positive reinforcement
for the image of Quebec in France. On the other hand, the French who end up in Quebec are often
the losers who can't make it in France, so they are more likely to feel threatened and take it out
on the French Canadians.

Well, I just heard that from 2 Quebecois talking about their travels in France (or maybe just
Paris), but these folks were not the best and the brightest. Then the other was a frined from
Grenoble who was busting the chops of some Quebec guy in a bar, but my friend is a pain in the ass
anyway so I shouldn't assume his actions are representative of the rest of the French population.

NS

Q- Why do Belgians say go to the toilet (le toilet) while the French say go to the toilets (les
toilets)? A- Cause in France you have to visit several toilets before you find a clean one!

"Ilan Vardi" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Nev Shea" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

They say that the Quebec French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when they
visit France they are openly mocked.

Hey Ilan, think the French mock you because of your accent? My wife

thinks

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the Quebecois aren't the butt of nearly as many jokes as the Belgians.

No, I had problems when I was living in Montreal with my French accent. My parents were among the
francophile type who openly mocked French Canadians, so I responded by never losing my accent.
Like I said before, I can speak perfect french as much as I want, but if I utter one English
expression pronounced in English, then I am forever branded as an American (by the "M" portion of
the population, that is).

What do you call Newfies and French Canadians singing together? Answer: The Moron Tabernack Choir.

-ilan

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trg said:

Q- Why do Belgians say go to the toilet (le toilet) while the French say go to the toilets (les
toilets)? A- Cause in France you have to visit several toilets before you find a clean one!

A real Belgian classic is:

Why is the French national symbol a chicken? Because it is the only bird that can stand on one leg
in [censored] and SING!

Quoted message said:

"Ilan Vardi" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Robert Chung" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

"Nev Shea" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...
> They say that the Quebec French dialect has evolved independently over the years, so when
> they visit France they are openly mocked.

Hey Ilan, think the French mock you because of your accent? My wife

thinks

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the Quebecois aren't the butt of nearly as many jokes as the Belgians.

No, I had problems when I was living in Montreal with my French accent. My parents were among the
francophile type who openly mocked French Canadians, so I responded by never losing my accent.
Like I said before, I can speak perfect french as much as I want, but if I utter one English
expression pronounced in English, then I am forever branded as an American (by the "M" portion of
the population, that is).

What do you call Newfies and French Canadians singing together? Answer: The Moron
Tabernack Choir.

-ilan

Quoted message said:

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Quoted message said:

From: [email hidden] (Ilan Vardi)

Quoted message said:

I wasn't clear in my original message: I don't hate French people or French culture, I hate all
people and all culture. Or at least, I am more sensitive to one country's faults when I live there.

Maybe you should check out this book. It is one of my favorites. tinyurl.comionbOpen ↗ Hope this
works. Bill C

While it is true that the common term being used is still "mail", the recent movement to strike it's
use (by the language police) is also true. Time will tell whether the new directive sticks.

"Ilan Vardi" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Bryan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<bXcWa.20744$Oz4.7001@rwcrnsc54>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

3 - France does not hate Quebecois. In fact, while we were touring

France

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

in the Loire region last month, one of the towns was celebrating a "Quebecois" Sunday as sort of
a "sister city" thing, with a parade,

cycling

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

event, music, etc. France feels a lot more isolated than you might

think.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

They feel the pervasiveness of english is squeezing their cultural

heritage.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Recent case in point, they banned the use of the word "e-mail" in their vocabulary and coined
their own word, because "mail" is an english term.

Quite true, except for that last part. In fact, almost no one uses the "official" word (courriel).
For example, I was told by a French teacher that I should stop using the term "courrier
electronique" (electronic mail, in French) because she and all her friends use the word "mail"
(oh, and it's masculine for some unknown reason). I consider her representative of the vast
majority of ignoramusses (is that how you spell it, first time I've tried to pluralise it) who
direct the course of a living language.

Speaking of odd linguistic phenomena, there are a slew of English terms in French which have been
modified for no apparent reason. I mentioned that walkie-talkie is talkie-walkie, but there are
also interesting cases

of

Quoted message said:

English words that do not actually exist in English, like the French word "wheeling" which means
"wheelie" in French.

-ilan