UK and Europe · Public discussion

More on bike CVT

Started by Simon Brooke · · Last activity · 7 posts · 390 views

Thread navigation

Jump through the discussion

Go to the original post, the replies on this page, or the latest preserved contribution.

Thread details

What we know about this thread

Original section
UK and Europe
Published
2 October 2005
Last activity
3 October 2005
Original author
Simon Brooke
Posts
7
Discussion status
Public discussion
Total views
390
Views / 30 days
0

The navigation and discussion metadata provide context. Posts remain in their original chronological order.

Showing posts 1–7 of 7
Posts remain in their original chronological order.

Text size
  1. Reading old Velovisions is a dangerous thing to do. On page 5 of Issue
    16 is an innocent looking article about a rowing bike - a Dutch
    recumbent propelled by a rowing action. What's interesting about this?
    Well, an extremely novel and interesting CVT system, claimed to be
    significantly /more/ efficient than conventional chain drive.

    <URL:http://www.rowingbike.com/main.php?sNewPage=The_snek>

    The critical part is an aluminium 'cone' (which has in fact has somewhat
    concave profile) in which a spiral groove is cut. The cone is driven not
    by a chain but by a steel cable, which runs in the groove. In earlier
    versions of the design the cable was wrapped one and a half turns around
    the cone, much like a sheet on a self-tailing winch. If I understand
    correctly, on the CVT version the end of the cable is actually attached
    to the small end of the cone (this works on a rowing bike with a
    reciprocal action, but obviously would not work with a pedalled bike).
    Although the transmission is stepless it is not automatic - the cone has
    to be declutched from the driven wheel to change the ratio.

    The makers of the system don't say whether they've tried wrapping a
    continuous loop of cable round two opposed cones, and clearly for that
    to work you'd need a sliding 'stripper finger' mechanism like that on a
    self-tailing winch, but it does not look infeasible.

    Reasons why might /not/ work include

    * Too much slip: the cable might slip in the groove under load and fail
    to transmit power - this may be why Thys anchor the cable end to the
    cone.

    * Too little slip: if the cable would not slip in the groove, it might
    tend to ride up too high on both cones at once putting excessive loads
    on the system

    In fact getting the right amount of tension in the cable is clearly key
    to making the whole idea work, but that might work in its favour if you
    could use cable tension to drive the lateral motion of the stripper
    fingers, which would give you fully automatic CVT.

    --
    [email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

    <p>Schroedinger's cat is <blink><strong>NOT</strong></blink> dead.</p>

  2. Simon Brooke said:

    Reading old Velovisions is a dangerous thing to do. On page 5 of Issue
    16 is an innocent looking article about a rowing bike - a Dutch
    recumbent propelled by a rowing action. What's interesting about this?
    Well, an extremely novel and interesting CVT system, claimed to be
    significantly /more/ efficient than conventional chain drive.

    <URL:http://www.rowingbike.com/main.php?sNewPage=The_snek>

    As best as I can tell from their confusing description it works because
    it is a reciprocating drive and not a continuous drive i.e you do a
    stroke and then return rather than continuously pedalling
    --
    Tony

    "I did make a mistake once - I thought I'd made a mistake but I hadn't"
    Anon

  3. "Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    <URL:http://www.rowingbike.com/main.php?sNewPage=The_snek>

    The critical part is an aluminium 'cone' (which has in fact has somewhat
    concave profile) in which a spiral groove is cut. The cone is driven not
    by a chain but by a steel cable, which runs in the groove. In earlier
    versions of the design the cable was wrapped one and a half turns around
    the cone, much like a sheet on a self-tailing winch. If I understand
    correctly, on the CVT version the end of the cable is actually attached
    to the small end of the cone (this works on a rowing bike with a
    reciprocal action, but obviously would not work with a pedalled bike).
    Although the transmission is stepless it is not automatic - the cone has
    to be declutched from the driven wheel to change the ratio.

    My understanding of it was that the cone drives the wheel through a standard
    freewheel and that the foot slider is declutched from the steel cable to
    change the ratio. Shifting the slider one way along the cable will move the
    cable 'up' the cone and shifting it the other way will move it 'down' the
    cone.

    Regards,
    John Wilton

  4. in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

    (') said:
    Simon Brooke said:

    Reading old Velovisions is a dangerous thing to do. On page 5 of
    Issue 16 is an innocent looking article about a rowing bike - a Dutch
    recumbent propelled by a rowing action. What's interesting about this?
    Well, an extremely novel and interesting CVT system, claimed to be
    significantly /more/ efficient than conventional chain drive.

    <URL:http://www.rowingbike.com/main.php?sNewPage=The_snek>

    As best as I can tell from their confusing description it works because
    it is a reciprocating drive and not a continuous drive i.e you do a
    stroke and then return rather than continuously pedalling

    That's certainly true, but it does not mean that it would be impossible
    to adapt the cone-and-spiral-groove mechanism to continuous drive.

    --
    [email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

    -- mens vacua in medio vacuo --

  5. Simon Brooke said:

    in message <[email hidden]>, Tony Raven

    (') said:
    Simon Brooke said:

    Reading old Velovisions is a dangerous thing to do. On page 5 of
    Issue 16 is an innocent looking article about a rowing bike - a
    Dutch recumbent propelled by a rowing action. What's interesting
    about this? Well, an extremely novel and interesting CVT system,
    claimed to be significantly /more/ efficient than conventional
    chain drive.

    <URL:http://www.rowingbike.com/main.php?sNewPage=The_snek>

    As best as I can tell from their confusing description it works
    because it is a reciprocating drive and not a continuous drive i.e
    you do a stroke and then return rather than continuously pedalling

    That's certainly true, but it does not mean that it would be
    impossible to adapt the cone-and-spiral-groove mechanism to
    continuous drive.

    Or possibly it could fit in between the pedalling action and that being
    converted to continuous drive, although that sounds a bit unlikely.

    --
    Ambrose

  6. If this is the same thing mentioned in Wilson's Bicycling Science
    book (the fusée) it is not CVT as Simon means it but transmission
    that varies during the stroke: the ratio gets higher at the end of
    the stroke, so your movement is stopped by the increasing
    resistance, rather than requiring reverse muscle effort from you.

    Brendan
    --
    Brendan Halpin, Department of Sociology, University of Limerick, Ireland
    Tel: w +353-61-213147 f +353-61-202569 h +353-61-338562; Room F2-025 x 3147
    [email hidden] http://www.ul.ie/sociology/brendan.halpin.html

  7. John Wilton said:


    "Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    <URL:http://www.rowingbike.com/main.php?sNewPage=The_snek>

    The critical part is an aluminium 'cone' (which has in fact has somewhat
    concave profile) in which a spiral groove is cut. The cone is driven not
    by a chain but by a steel cable, which runs in the groove. In earlier
    versions of the design the cable was wrapped one and a half turns around
    the cone, much like a sheet on a self-tailing winch. If I understand
    correctly, on the CVT version the end of the cable is actually attached
    to the small end of the cone (this works on a rowing bike with a
    reciprocal action, but obviously would not work with a pedalled bike).
    Although the transmission is stepless it is not automatic - the cone has
    to be declutched from the driven wheel to change the ratio.

    My understanding of it was that the cone drives the wheel through a standard
    freewheel and that the foot slider is declutched from the steel cable to
    change the ratio. Shifting the slider one way along the cable will move the
    cable 'up' the cone and shifting it the other way will move it 'down' the
    cone.


    I understand that declutching the foot slider arrests the cone,
    allowing you to position the slider on another part of the cable, wich
    does indeed result in the cable using another part of the cone.

    The new (CVT) system is supposed to be longer lasting too; earlier
    rowing bikes having a voracious appetite for cables and cones.

    Methinks it should be possibel to build a rowingbike with just the
    footslider and fixed handlebars. I've tried a rowingbike but found my
    arm and leg muscles too mis-matched to keep the cable between
    handlebar and footslider tensioned.

    Mark van Gorkom.

Active in the last 60 minutes

Active in this thread

0 users · 0 guests ·0 bots ·0 total

No signed-in users are active right now.

No known search crawlers active right now.