McQuaid's Last Stand ?

Keith said:

Quoted message said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the root of the problem here is
that ASO don't want Astana on board, right?

The root of the problem is money, as usual...
Unlike the UCI, the promoters experience direct financial loss when
events and teams disappear as the result of sponsor remorse. ASO and
the other organizers don't perceive they get enough value from ceding
control to UCI structures, and they're determined to protect their
franchises.
The UCI has an unimaginative figurehead who brays in simple-minded
fashion about the rules; on the continent, they know the rules usually
exist for someone else's benefit.
The organizers don't have to call McQuaid's bluff. The crisis will
reveal the internal fault line of the UCI between the federations of
the traditional cycling nations, and the federations which depend on
sucking the IOC [censored].

Keith said:

Quoted message said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the root of the problem here is
that ASO don't want Astana on board, right?

The root of the problem is money, as usual...
Unlike the UCI, the promoters experience direct financial loss when
events and teams disappear as the result of sponsor remorse. ASO and
the other organizers don't perceive they get enough value from ceding
control to UCI structures, and they're determined to protect their
franchises.
The UCI has an unimaginative figurehead who brays in simple-minded
fashion about the rules; on the continent, they know the rules usually
exist for someone else's benefit.
The organizers don't have to call McQuaid's bluff. The crisis will
reveal the internal fault line of the UCI between the federations of
the traditional cycling nations, and the federations which depend on
sucking the IOC [censored].

Dans le message de news:[email hidden],
Keith <[email hidden]> a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :

Quoted message said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the root of the problem here is
that ASO don't want Astana on board, right?

Thanks for the easy target. You are wrong. Hope this helps.
--
Sandy
Verneuil-sur-Seine FR

"Le Vin est la plus saine et la plus hygiénique des boissons."
- Louis Pasteur

Sandy said:

Dans le message de news:[email hidden],
Keith <[email hidden]> a réfléchi, et puis a déclaré :

Quoted message said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the root of the problem here is
that ASO don't want Astana on board, right?

Thanks for the easy target. You are wrong. Hope this helps.

I've heard that the root of the problem was the lack of
a well thought out plan.

Bob Schwartz

Keith said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the root of the problem here is
that ASO don't want Astana on board, right?

You're wrong.

On Mar 5, 1:15 pm, Bob Schwartz <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I've heard that the root of the problem was the lack of
a well thought out plan.

The root of the problem is that cycling thought it should be an
Olympic sport.

Dans le message de
news:[email hidden],
[email hidden] <[email hidden]> a réfléchi, et
puis a déclaré :

Quoted message said:

On Mar 5, 1:15 pm, Bob Schwartz <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I've heard that the root of the problem was the lack of
a well thought out plan.

The root of the problem is that cycling thought it should be an
Olympic sport.

Cycling should very well stop thinking.
Messy maquereaueconomic planning.
--
Sandy
--
S'endormir au volant, c'est très dangereux.
S'endormir à vélo, c'est très rare.
S'endormir à pied, c'est très con.
- Geluck, P.

Sandy said:

Messy maquereaueconomic planning.

It's time for you to stop this with a "Fin."

On Wed, 5 Mar 2008 13:33:53 -0800 (PST), [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

Keith said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the root of the problem here is
that ASO don't want Astana on board, right?

You're wrong.

Great, care to elaborate ? Obviously I was referring to what triggered
the CURRENT stand-off, so prove me wrong now.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Sandy said:

Messy maquereaueconomic planning.

It's time for you to stop this with a "Fin."

Is he thinking of mackeraleconomics (to get that stuff going again)?

--
tanx,
Howard

Whatever happened to
Leon Trotsky?
He got an icepick
That made his ears burn.

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?

ASO's decision to exclude Astana from it's events is quite petty.
Furthermore it is another example of guilt by innuendo, which has done
so much damage to cycling. It is unfaair at this point to exclude
Astana from the TDF. If the ASO has concerns about some riders on
Astana that is one thing, but to exclude the whole team is unjust.

Keith said:

Looks like he's going for the ultimate bluff herehttp://assets.rug.be/img_art/site/images/31413BE4-90E5-4751-ACF5-BEA3...
!

So is the UCI going to suspend 160 races ? Nice try, but that means
the season is over then ! Ridiculous, everyone should just tell him to
get stuffed.

Also nice to see that the UCI is dragging their feet on a "hair doping
test"...what a surprise

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the root of the problem here is
that ASO don't want Astana on board, right?

"mtb Dad" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

So what's wrong with cycling being an Olympic sport? It's the only
way many countires can get support for the sport. Look at the
struggle even cx gets in the US as a non-Olympic sport. And it did
give us a serious method to attack doping in WADA. You can't say the
traditional Euro-pro model did anything except tolerate, maybe even
encourage doping, the kind that cost those 30 young riders their heart
attacks.

It's difficult to translate the stupid stuff on this group sometime. There's
nothing wrong with cycling being an Olympic sport and but everything wrong
with the Olympic Committee dictating the rules of the game and insisting
that anyone caught using drugs (even though the tests are not really
accurate) should be totally destroyed.

The effect of WADA has been evil and not a positive force. They seem to
believe that rumors of drugging are enough to convict someone and even after
they've served their time WADA wants them barred from sports.

This is extremely bad and I personally will have nothing to do with the
Olympics or WADA until this attitude is changed.

And by the way, just so it's clear - I lost a brother to drugs so I
absolutely HATE drug users. But I'm not into making them even worse than
they really are.

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

ASO's decision to exclude Astana from it's events is quite petty.
Furthermore it is another example of guilt by innuendo, which has done
so much damage to cycling. It is unfaair at this point to exclude
Astana from the TDF. If the ASO has concerns about some riders on
Astana that is one thing, but to exclude the whole team is unjust.

The fact seems to be that Astana now doesn't even have any of those riders
that ASO might exclude. That's why they're denying entry to the "team".

Quoted message said:

So what's wrong with cycling being an Olympic sport? It's the only
way many countires can get support for the sport. Look at the
struggle even cx gets in the US as a non-Olympic sport.

dumbass,

nothing is wrong with olympic sports and the government support it
gets. but the objective then is different than professional sports,
which are meant to generate revenue and not operate off of grants.

Quoted message said:

And it did
give us a serious method to attack doping in WADA. You can't say the
traditional Euro-pro model did anything except tolerate, maybe even
encourage doping, the kind that cost those 30 young riders their heart
attacks.

yes, but you can tell by the tone of comments here and the tone of
letters to cyclingnews, velonews that peanut gallery fans aren't
really against doping. they see the current crackdown as the rights of
their hero athletes being trampled on by mean old bureaucrats.

so from the financial health of the professional side of the sport it
makes sense to drop the WADA compliance and institute an NFL-like drug
policy, ie. the way it used to be.

Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

ASO's decision to exclude Astana from it's events is quite petty.
Furthermore it is another example of guilt by innuendo, which has done
so much damage to cycling. It is unfaair at this point to exclude
Astana from the TDF. If the ASO has concerns about some riders on
Astana that is one thing, but to exclude the whole team is unjust.

The fact seems to be that Astana now doesn't even have any of those riders
that ASO might exclude. That's why they're denying entry to the "team".

It seems as though that the ASO is excluding any riders who are even
tainted with a investigation regardless of whether they have been
cleared or not..

On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 13:03:17 -0800, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com>

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

ASO's decision to exclude Astana from it's events is quite petty.
Furthermore it is another example of guilt by innuendo, which has done
so much damage to cycling. It is unfaair at this point to exclude
Astana from the TDF. If the ASO has concerns about some riders on
Astana that is one thing, but to exclude the whole team is unjust.

The fact seems to be that Astana now doesn't even have any of those riders
that ASO might exclude. That's why they're denying entry to the "team".

Prudhomme explained why Astana was excluded, they just don't trust
them anymore, can't really blame them, eh after what happened in 2006
and 2007

"Keith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

On Thu, 6 Mar 2008 13:03:17 -0800, "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo. com>

Quoted message said:

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

ASO's decision to exclude Astana from it's events is quite petty.
Furthermore it is another example of guilt by innuendo, which has done
so much damage to cycling. It is unfaair at this point to exclude
Astana from the TDF. If the ASO has concerns about some riders on
Astana that is one thing, but to exclude the whole team is unjust.

The fact seems to be that Astana now doesn't even have any of those riders
that ASO might exclude. That's why they're denying entry to the "team".

Prudhomme explained why Astana was excluded, they just don't trust
them anymore, can't really blame them, eh after what happened in 2006
and 2007

Does the name, "High Road" ring any bells?

In article <[email hidden]>,

Tom Kunich' cyclintom@yahoo. com said:

And by the way, just so it's clear - I lost a brother to drugs so I
absolutely HATE drug users. But I'm not into making them even worse than
they really are.

I hope that you meant "I hate drug use". I may not be a good Catholic
boy much of the time but that "hate the sin, love the sinner" bit is one
of the few things that I have not deviated from over the years.

jyh.

In article
<[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Keith said:

Quoted message said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the root of the problem here is
that ASO don't want Astana on board, right?

The root of the problem is money, as usual...
Unlike the UCI, the promoters experience direct financial loss when
events and teams disappear as the result of sponsor remorse. ASO and
the other organizers don't perceive they get enough value from ceding
control to UCI structures, and they're determined to protect their
franchises.

I agree that this is an important part of the problem. Imagine that you
are at the helm of ASO, which means that you are running (between other
things) the TdF and Paris-Nice. Obviously, the TdF is the one that
almost every team want to participate to. And now you see UCI come up
with this Pro Tour contraption and state that
(1) you must allow all Pro Tour teams to participate to the TdF;
(2) Pro Tour teams must participate to all races UCI says are
mandatory;
(3) UCI says that Paris-Nice is not one of these mandatory
Pro Tour races and UCI might impose another competion
in the same time period.
So, basically, UCI is using the pull of your own main event to hurt your
other races. Why should ASO go along with this? (the same obviously
applies to the organizers of the Giro and the Vuelta).

To this day I have not yet read any good argument in favor of the Pro
Tour, anything that could make me think that maybe the Pro Tour is good
for cycling after all.

jyh.