Mavic Kysiriums

Downhill Jonny said:

I purchased the SSL's a about 10 months ago, and was told that these are great wheels to ride with everyday, and not just to save for the big event. I dont consider myself a heavy rider, but have found some cracks along the rim at the spoke joins. Is this for real. Can anyone recommend a good durable wheel set (Elite or new Dura Ace Wheels)😠

Campagnolo Protons - lighter and almost half the price:-)

On 22/8/04 8:24 PM, in article
[email hidden], "ProfTournesol"

publically said:

Downhill Jonny said:

I purchased the SSL's a about 10 months ago, and was told that these are
great wheels to ride with everyday, and not just to save for the big
event. I dont consider myself a heavy rider, but have found some cracks
along the rim at the spoke joins. Is this for real. Can anyone recommend
a good durable wheel set (Elite or new Dura Ace Wheels)😠

Campagnolo Protons - lighter and almost half the price:-)

Well cheaper anyway!
--
Regards
Michael

Never argue with an idiot.
They drag you down to their level then beat you with experience.

Downhill Jonny said:

I purchased the SSL's a about 10 months ago, and was told that these are great wheels to ride with everyday, and not just to save for the big event. I dont consider myself a heavy rider, but have found some cracks along the rim at the spoke joins. Is this for real. Can anyone recommend a good durable wheel set (Elite or new Dura Ace Wheels)😠

If you want durable wheels and aren't super-concerned about weight, you can't go past good hand-built wheels. They aren't too expensive, are easy to maintain, strong as anything on the market. Try a rim from Ambrosio or Mavic, laced onto the best hub you can afford (DT, Campag Chorus/Record or Dura-Ace would be best, but lower end Campy or Shimano, or maybe American Classic are all OK). Make sure the hub has a sealed cartridge bearing, not ball and cone. Use DT spokes - straight gauge if you don't care heaps about weight and want them really strong or butted/double butted/etc if you want lighter race wheels. Bomb-proof hand built wheels should weigh about 1.8-2kg, lighter race wheels that are still reasonably strong (stronger than any pre-built) should be closer to 1.5kg.

The only Caveat: make sure you get them built by someone who really knows what they're doing - a good mechanic may even offer to maintain them, because they know nothing will go wrong if they build them right. I would normally build triple-cross back and double-cross front, and you could go 32 spoke rear, and either 32 or 28 spoke front. Your mechanic should be able to help with this stuff.

If you have to buy pre-builts (you don't, but they look prettier and some people like that...):
(1) Check the quality of the hub - a serviceable sealed cartridge bearing is critical.
(2) Make sure te spokes can be replaced relatively cheaply (not spokes that are unique to the wheel and cost $50 to replace).
(3) Check that spoke tensions can be adjusted easily (not heavily lock-tighted like some Mavic wheels).
(4) Don't buy wheels that have parallel spokes - that's just stupid! (see old shimano wheelsets).
(5) Be wary of radially laced front wheels.

I'm surprised you've had trouble with Ksyriums really, but if you want other pre-builts have a look at American Classic 420's - reasonable light, strong and well designed (don't get the 'sapim' spokes unless you're a total weight-weenie and you don't mind sacrificing a little strength).

Like Keith Bontrager says: Light, Strong, Cheap. Choose any two.

PM me if you're after hand-built wheels in Melbourne and you don't know who to go to for wheel-building.

Standard 32 spoke cross 3. Avoid all this factory built overpriced [censored].

"Downhill Jonny" <[email hidden]>
wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I purchased the SSL's a about 10 months ago, and was told that these are
great wheels to ride with everyday, and not just to save for the big
event. I dont consider myself a heavy rider, but have found some cracks
along the rim at the spoke joins. Is this for real. Can anyone recommend
a good durable wheel set (Elite or new Dura Ace Wheels)😠

Olivia Bloch said:

On 22/8/04 8:24 PM, in article
[email hidden], "ProfTournesol"

publically said:

Campagnolo Protons - lighter and almost half the price:-)

Well cheaper anyway!

Maybe he meant Campy Neutrons .. they are both lighter and cheaper than the SSC SLs. The Protons are the cheaper, heavier variant.

Personally though I'd tend towards a high-end traditional build if you're after light weight and decent practicality/ability to fix easily if something goes wrong.

I've been eyeing a wheelset of DT 240s hubs/DT RR1.1 rims/high-end DT spokes for a little while now... mmm.. Swiss. Like nice chocolate and watches. 🙂

I think Wheelcraft even makes a set like that straight off the shelf. Weight would be equivalent to Neutron/Ksyrium SLs, and they'd be cheaper and easier to maintain/repair if needed.

Roadie Scum said:

Try a rim from Ambrosio or Mavic, laced onto the best hub
you can afford (DT, Campag Chorus/Record or Dura-Ace
would be best, but lower end Campy or Shimano, or maybe
American Classic are all OK). Make sure the hub has a sealed
cartridge bearing, not ball and cone.

Any of the better Campy or Shimano hubs are great, and all are cup and cone. "Sealed bearing" simply means the hub manufacturer isn't able to make their own ball races, so use standard cartridge bearings, which are generally pressed in. They usually don't roll as well as a good cup/cone hub, aren't adjustable, and are a PITA to replace. Go for good quality cup and cone hubs, such as Shimano or Campy.

Quoted message said:

Use DT spokes - straight gauge if you don't care heaps about
weight and want them really strong or butted/double butted/etc
if you want lighter race wheels.

DT, Sapim, Wheelsmith spokes are all equally good. Don't use straight gauge spokes though, as the butted ones are much more fatigue resistant, and will build a significantly stronger wheel.

32 spokes on the rear, 32 on the front, laced 3 cross all round, with good quality eyeletted rims will last you forever, and are plenty light.

Regards,

Suzy

suzyj said:

Any of the better Campy or Shimano hubs are great, and all are cup and cone. "Sealed bearing" simply means the hub manufacturer isn't able to make their own ball races, so use standard cartridge bearings, which are generally pressed in. They usually don't roll as well as a good cup/cone hub, aren't adjustable, and are a PITA to replace. Go for good quality cup and cone hubs, such as Shimano or Campy.

Sorry, I was a little of the mark with what I wrote before. You're right about the top-end stuff. Good cup and cone are fine (better even), but sealed cartridge can be good too if replacements are available. Shimano's cup and cone are rubbish (at least in their pre built-wheels and cheaper hubs). They fill up with water. (Ask any shop you know is honest how often they have to drain (!) shimano hubs).

Quoted post said:

DT, Sapim, Wheelsmith spokes are all equally good. Don't use straight gauge spokes though, as the butted ones are much more fatigue resistant, and will build a significantly stronger wheel.

That's the theory (as expounded on the DT website). It's not the practice. Dave Macca just came back from Belgium having spent about equal amounts of time on identical wheelsets, except one is straight gauge and the other double butted. The straight gauge wheels are tip-top despite having been raced on cobbles. The others are a bit battered and have needed more regular truing. Every good mechanic I've spoken to reccomends straight gauge for stronger wheels despite the theory DT and others push about spring-like qualities and fatigue resistance. This comes from experience rather than theory.

I don't know about wheelsmith spokes, although I've heard good things. Sapim spokes are definitely not very strong - I've seen a few wheelsets go sloppy with them. That said, my race wheels are sapim; I just don't use them unless I have to climb fast.

Quoted post said:

32 spokes on the rear, 32 on the front, laced 3 cross all round, with good quality eyeletted rims will last you forever, and are plenty light.

Damn straight!

In article <[email hidden]>,

Roadie_scum said:

That's the theory (as expounded on the DT website).

It's actually the theory according to the laws of physics. Anyone's
welcome to disprove them, but no-one has claimed to have recently.

Quoted message said:

Dave Macca just came back from Belgium having spent about
equal amounts of time on identical wheelsets, except one is straight
gauge and the other double butted. The straight gauge wheels are
tip-top despite having been raced on cobbles. The others are a bit
battered and have needed more regular truing.

With all due respect to Macca, a sample of one is as good as
meaningless. If they needed regular truing, they weren't built properly
in the first place.

Quoted message said:

Every good mechanic I've
spoken to reccomends straight gauge for stronger wheels despite the
theory DT and others push about spring-like qualities and fatigue
resistance.

And what do the bad mechanics say?

I respect mechanics, just like I respect the people who build bridges.
But if I want to know if a bridge is going to stay up, I'm more
interested in the views of the engineer who designed it.

--
Shane Stanley

Quoted message said:

And what do the bad mechanics say?

I respect mechanics, just like I respect the people who build bridges.
But if I want to know if a bridge is going to stay up, I'm more
interested in the views of the engineer who designed it.

--
Shane Stanley

So what does that mean?
You want to speak to the engineer that designed the wheel?

Marty

In article <[email hidden]>,

Marty Wallace said:

So what does that mean?
You want to speak to the engineer that designed the wheel?

It means that well-meaning mechanics often practice bad engineering.

--
Shane Stanley