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Loony letter in Reading Post

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UK and Europe
Published
1 July 2004
Last activity
3 July 2004
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Just zis Guy, you know?
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  1. It's official: any of us who are against compulsion are irrational,
    obsessive and offensive, and rely on soundbytes taken out of context.
    Whereas BeHIT, presumably, are a model of decorum, and the claim of
    28,000 serious injuries which later turned out to be under 500 was
    just a slip. Like the doubling of the fatality figures. And so on.

    <url:http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/web/public.nsf/Documents/Evening_Post>

    Guy
    --
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
    http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

    88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

  2. In article <[email hidden]>,

    Just zis Guy said:

    <url:http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/web/public.nsf/Documents/Evening_Post>

    Your server appears to be slashdotted...

    ian

  3. On 1/7/04 1:15 pm, in article [email hidden],

    Just zis Guy said:

    It's official: any of us who are against compulsion are irrational,
    obsessive and offensive, and rely on soundbytes taken out of context.
    Whereas BeHIT, presumably, are a model of decorum, and the claim of
    28,000 serious injuries which later turned out to be under 500 was
    just a slip. Like the doubling of the fatality figures. And so on.

    <url:http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/web/public.nsf/Documents/Evening_Post>

    You might also want to note that no minister spoke in the debate (despite
    what the letter writer says).

    It's content free 'think of the children' platitudes that makes one reach
    for a bucket..

    ...d

  4. On Thu, 1 Jul 2004 12:23:37 +0000 (UTC), Ian G Batten
    <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    <[email hidden]>:

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    <url:http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/web/public.nsf/Documents/Evening_Post>


    Your server appears to be slashdotted...

    Working from Godalming, apparently.

    Guy
    --
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
    http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

    88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

  5. Guy did some magic stuff on his website:

    Quoted message said:



    <url:http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/web/public.nsf/Documents/Evening_Post>

    Quoted message said:


    Guy

    Well said Guy!

    I feel that those in favour of compulsion will be unswayed by your arguments
    however, since compulsive H-word wearing will most probably not actually
    affect them personally until it becomes compulsory for H-words to be worn in
    cars. Then we can watch the sparks fly!

    Terry Duckmanton
    (H-word wearer, but anti-compulsion)

  6. in message <[email hidden]>, Just zis Guy,

    you know? (') said:

    It's official: any of us who are against compulsion are irrational,
    obsessive and offensive, and rely on soundbytes taken out of context.
    Whereas BeHIT, presumably, are a model of decorum, and the claim of
    28,000 serious injuries which later turned out to be under 500 was
    just a slip. Like the doubling of the fatality figures. And so on.


    <url:http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/web/public.nsf/Documents/Evening_Post>

    Guy, if you have not already sent your draft reply, do not send it.
    Wait, cool down, and try again. Using sarcasm is not going to work to
    your benefit - the passage about the cyclesense website will only
    antagonise most readers. Also, if James Annan's analysis of the Sheikh
    and Beihk paper's statistical howler is online anywhere, it would be
    good to refer to it (isn't it on the 'letters page' of the same site
    the paper is on?). That makes you less like a lone monomaniac.

    Also, you should redraft your last sentence. For readers who believe (as
    I suspect most uninformed people do) that a bicycle helmet does offer
    protection in collision with a car, the point which you need to get
    across there (and which you fail even to allude to) is that a helmet
    would have made no difference at all.

    Finally, is there anyone else here from the Reading area who could
    supplement Guy's reply with a cool but well informed response? It would
    help enormously if there were two replies, again making Guy look less
    like a single-issue nutter. I'd write myself, but I don't think a
    letter from an address in Scotland would really help the case.

    --
    [email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

    The Conservative Party now has the support of a smaller proportion of
    the electorate in Scotland than Sinn Fein have in Northern Ireland.

  7. "Simon Brooke" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    in message <[email hidden]>, Just zis Guy,

    you know? (') said:

    It's official: any of us who are against compulsion are irrational,
    obsessive and offensive, and rely on soundbytes taken out of context.
    Whereas BeHIT, presumably, are a model of decorum, and the claim of
    28,000 serious injuries which later turned out to be under 500 was
    just a slip. Like the doubling of the fatality figures. And so on.



    <url:http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/web/public.nsf/Documents/Evening_Post>

    Quoted message said:


    Guy, if you have not already sent your draft reply, do not send it.
    Wait, cool down, and try again. Using sarcasm is not going to work to
    your benefit - the passage about the cyclesense website will only
    antagonise most readers. Also, if James Annan's analysis of the Sheikh
    and Beihk paper's statistical howler is online anywhere, it would be
    good to refer to it (isn't it on the 'letters page' of the same site
    the paper is on?). That makes you less like a lone monomaniac.

    Also, you should redraft your last sentence. For readers who believe (as
    I suspect most uninformed people do) that a bicycle helmet does offer
    protection in collision with a car, the point which you need to get
    across there (and which you fail even to allude to) is that a helmet
    would have made no difference at all.

    Finally, is there anyone else here from the Reading area who could
    supplement Guy's reply with a cool but well informed response? It would
    help enormously if there were two replies, again making Guy look less
    like a single-issue nutter. I'd write myself, but I don't think a
    letter from an address in Scotland would really help the case.

    --
    [email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

    The Conservative Party now has the support of a smaller proportion of
    the electorate in Scotland than Sinn Fein have in Northern Ireland.

    The trick with all letters to newspapers is to keep them short.
    Keep them simple. And keep them snappy. Period. Ideally much shorter
    than the letter you're replying to. The original is fairly long and
    yet it seems to have benefitted from careful editing. Basically its
    telling a massage the readers want to hear, and which reinforces their
    unthinking prejudices and assumptions. So you've got your work cut
    out before you even begin.

    Finally your claim "What killed Troy Parker was not failure to wear a
    helmet, but riding a bicycle with broken brakes off the pavement into
    the path of a car. As a parent I know what lessons I draw from this
    incident."

    Has as much chance of getting printed, as do claims that Tony Blair
    is a transvstite. And luckily for you!

    "Grieving parents continue their month long vigil outside house of
    Looney Cycling Campaigner"

    "He accused of us killing our own son, says grieving Mum of Three...."

    Police were again called to clear crowds from around the house of....

    Curious

    ...

    Quoted message said:
  8. Quoted message said:


    Finally, is there anyone else here from the Reading area who could
    supplement Guy's reply with a cool but well informed response? It would
    help enormously if there were two replies, again making Guy look less
    like a single-issue nutter. I'd write myself, but I don't think a
    letter from an address in Scotland would really help the case.

    I could write from Guildford, which is quite close. Unfortunately I am not a
    brilliant letter writer especially when I'm steamed up about the content. A
    letter signed "Purple With Rage of Guildford" tends not to have the desired
    impact when compared with carefully thought out reasoned argument. I'll give
    it go though, if you think it'll do some good.

    Purple With Rage,
    Guildford.

    PS Harrumph!

  9. On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 13:05:03 GMT, Simon Brooke <[email hidden]>

    wrote in message : said:

    Guy, if you have not already sent your draft reply, do not send it.

    All letters get a compulsory 24 hour cooling off period. You should
    have seen the first draft :-D

    Quoted message said:

    Wait, cool down, and try again. Using sarcasm is not going to work to
    your benefit - the passage about the cyclesense website will only
    antagonise most readers. Also, if James Annan's analysis of the Sheikh
    and Beihk paper's statistical howler is online anywhere, it would be
    good to refer to it (isn't it on the 'letters page' of the same site
    the paper is on?). That makes you less like a lone monomaniac.

    It is on the IP website - along with one from me, I find!

    <url:http://ip.bmjjournals.com/cgi/eletters/9/3/266>

    Guy
    --
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
    http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

    88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

  10. "Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    It's official: any of us who are against compulsion are irrational,
    obsessive and offensive, and rely on soundbytes taken out of context.

    Guy - it's "sound bite" - the letter you're replying to even has it right!

    cheers,
    clive

  11. On Thu, 1 Jul 2004 15:12:32 +0100, "Clive George"
    <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    <[email hidden]>:

    Quoted message said:

    Guy - it's "sound bite" - the letter you're replying to even has it right!

    And there was I thinking it was derived from the computer term "byte",
    being a small unit of information.

    Guy
    --
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
    http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

    88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

  12. "Clive George" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    It's official: any of us who are against compulsion are irrational,
    obsessive and offensive, and rely on soundbytes taken out of context.

    Guy - it's "sound bite" - the letter you're replying to even has it


    right!

    Quoted message said:


    cheers,
    clive

    Dunno.

    For the Web at least, "soundbyte" sounds rather appropriate.

    Curious

  13. "Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On Thu, 1 Jul 2004 15:12:32 +0100, "Clive George"
    <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    <[email hidden]>:

    Quoted message said:

    Guy - it's "sound bite" - the letter you're replying to even has it


    right!

    Quoted message said:


    And there was I thinking it was derived from the computer term "byte",
    being a small unit of information.

    Careless thoughts cost lives!

    (In case you think your spelling is correct, no, it's nothing at all to do
    with the computer term "byte" - check your dictionary...)

    cheers,
    clive

  14. "Dr Curious" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "Clive George" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    It's official: any of us who are against compulsion are irrational,
    obsessive and offensive, and rely on soundbytes taken out of context.

    Guy - it's "sound bite" - the letter you're replying to even has it


    right!

    For the Web at least, "soundbyte" sounds rather appropriate.

    Maybe - but it's still not normal. More importantly, he's used it in a
    letter intended for other media, and one which is intended to be taken
    seriously.

    cheers,
    clive

  15. "Clive George" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Dr Curious" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "Clive George" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    "Just zis Guy, you know?" <[email hidden]> wrote in


    message

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    news:[email hidden]...
    > It's official: any of us who are against compulsion are irrational,
    > obsessive and offensive, and rely on soundbytes taken out of


    context.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    Guy - it's "sound bite" - the letter you're replying to even has it


    right!

    For the Web at least, "soundbyte" sounds rather appropriate.

    Maybe - but it's still not normal. More importantly, he's used it in a
    letter intended for other media, and one which is intended to be taken
    seriously.

    Point taken

    Curious

    Quoted message said:


    cheers,
    clive

  16. In article <[email hidden]>,

    Simon Brooke said:

    Also, you should redraft your last sentence. For readers who believe (as
    I suspect most uninformed people do) that a bicycle helmet does offer
    protection in collision with a car, the point which you need to get
    across there (and which you fail even to allude to) is that a helmet
    would have made no difference at all.

    And I think that blaming the parents for the death of their child ---
    even if it's true --- is unlikely to win neutral readers over to your
    case.

    ian

  17. Experimenting with an alternative approach at:

    <url:http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/web/public.nsf/Documents/EP2>

    Guy
    --
    May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
    http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

    88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

  18. Ian G Batten said:

    In article <[email hidden]>,

    Simon Brooke said:

    Also, you should redraft your last sentence. For readers who believe (as
    I suspect most uninformed people do) that a bicycle helmet does offer
    protection in collision with a car, the point which you need to get
    across there (and which you fail even to allude to) is that a helmet
    would have made no difference at all.

    Quoted message said:

    And I think that blaming the parents for the death of their child ---
    even if it's true --- is unlikely to win neutral readers over to your
    case.

    A fair comment. Perhaps you should blame the government! Not an
    entirely puerile remark... something along the lines of:

    "although Troy /might/ be with us today had he been wearing a cycle
    helmet, the findings of Britain's leading test laboratory suggest it
    isn't very likely, whereas if the government had spent money on well
    targeted cycle training he had had the opportunity to take up he may
    well not have been in the accident in the first place, in which case
    whether or not he wore a helmet would have been immaterial. Prevention
    is better than cure, especially when the 'cure' has a dubious track
    record in curing and prevention has a good track record in preventing."

    or something... But don't imply any blame to the parents or it'll just
    hurt the Cause Of Using One's Brain.

    Pete.

    --
    Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
    Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
    Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
    net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

  19. Reply to Just zis Guy, you know?

    Quoted message said:

    Experimenting with an alternative approach at:

    <url:http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk/web/public.nsf/Documents/EP2>

    Guy

    If I may say so... I still think it's a bit too verbose for my own
    taste, & possibly for editors' as well. I'd be tempted to write
    something along the lines of:

    I don't have the same faith in politicians that Mr Watsham has, and
    compulsory cycle helmets are one issue where politicians have got it
    demonstrably wrong in the past: such laws have been tried in several
    countries, and not one country has shown an improvement in cyclist
    safety as a result.

    [That could be tidied up a bit, but at least it *is* putting blame on
    politicians, which should be popular... ;-)]

    Given all the conflicting evidence, I have no option but to join the
    British Medical Association, the Royal College of General
    Practitioners, [*lots* of other knowledgeable bodies], the National
    Cycling Strategy Board and every other cycling body in the UK in
    opposing compulsion. The best way to make cycling safer is not to
    make cyclists wear flimsy polystyrene helmets, but to get
    more people cycling; from the experience in other countries, helmet
    laws achieve the opposite effect, with no measurable improvement in
    injury rates.

    Yrs & oblig. - - -

    - and then I'd re-edit and chop another third out of it. :-)

    --
    Mark, UK.
    We hope to hear him swear, we love to hear him squeak,
    We like to see him biting fingers in his horny beak.

  20. Just zis Guy said:

    Experimenting with an alternative approach at:

    I'd be inclined leave out the extra barb on Sheikh and Bheikh for the
    sake of showing You're Nice and Keeping It Snappy. Just summat like
    "189% effective, clearly an impossible number". On the Being Nice front
    I'd also remove the "zealot" bit too. L Watsham may have the IQ of a
    fencepost when it comes to looking objectively at evidence but you'd be
    preaching to the choir as far as winning anyone over goes if you say so
    in print :-(

    Pete.
    --
    Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
    Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
    Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
    net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

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