Living with GERD (somewhat OT)

Carla,

I thought my acid reflux was caused by spicy foods. It would be worse
on the nights I ate pizza, chili over spaghetti, or mexican. As soon
as I went on low carb it cleared up.

I started getting braver and making pizza without the crust, low carb
chili without the spaghetti, and mexican without the chips.. and
still I had no problem. The one night I had 2 pieces of pizza and my
acid reflux came back with a vengeance.

For me, my acid reflux is caused by grain products. Since being off
them so long, if I eat them now.. my sinuses stop up, my face breaks
out, my acid reflux comes back, along with joint pain.

My suggestion for you is to look for a food intolerance. Remove one
food for 2 weeks then add it back. Since it is getting worse, I would
think it would be a food you started eating more of when you started
low carbing.. and it is probably something you eat every day.

Good luck in your hunt for answers,
essense

"carla" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
|
| I have noted here before that I am not one of the fortunate folk for
whom
| low-carb cleared up every conceivable ailment. Indeed, my heartburn
has
| been getting progressively worse, so I finally saw the doctor today.
She
| put me on Prilosec and recommended some lifestyle changes - I have
to figure
| out how to have dinner earlier in the day, cut back on caffeine a
bit, and
| avoid some of the more acidic foods that are heartburn triggers.
(I'm a
| little bummed about giving up the grapefruit I had so come to enjoy
a few
| times a week.)
|
| I'm not thrilled about dealing with a chronic illness - even a minor
one
| like this. I've never been one to get sick much; it took quite a
bit of
| discomfort with the heartburn to get me to the doctor at all. It
had begun
| to interfere with my work. However, I am for the moment fairly
relieved
| that my doctor thinks this is garden-variety GERD, rather than an
ulcer.
|
| I'd like to take her recommendations to heart - I am not thrilled
about
| taking drugs indefinitely, so I'd like to try to treat it with diet
and
| lifestyle changes to the extent practicable. I'd like to tap into
the store
| of experience here in asdlc - do you suffer from reflux, that didn't
clear
| up when you switched to low carb? What are you doing to manage it?
|
| --
| carla
| http://geekofalltrades.typepad.com/geek
|
|

carla wrote:
| I have noted here before that I am not one of the fortunate folk for
| whom low-carb cleared up every conceivable ailment. Indeed, my
| heartburn has been getting progressively worse, so I finally saw the
| doctor today. She put me on Prilosec and recommended some lifestyle
| changes - I have to figure out how to have dinner earlier in the day,
| cut back on caffeine a bit, and avoid some of the more acidic foods
| that are heartburn triggers. (I'm a little bummed about giving up
| the grapefruit I had so come to enjoy a few times a week.)
|

This makes no sense.

Y ou say that you are one of the unfortunates for whom low-carb did not
clear up your gerd. Then you say you were forced to give up grapefruit.
Grapefruit is not low carb, and giving it up is part of a low-carb regimen.

My acid reflux -- along with prescription meds for it -- went away when I
stopped kidding myself and started eating true low carb. It was the bananas,
grapefruit, oranges, tomatoes et. al. -- all carby foods -- that triggered
the relentless heartburn and nighttime reflux. It's been well over a year
since I had a flare up.

What other carby foods besides grapefruit are triggering your gerd? I just
can't imagine that a low-carb dinner consisting of foods like meat and green
vegetables can trigger heartburn. What is it that you're eating?

--
Peter
270/215/180
Before/Current Pix:
http://users.thelink.net/marengo/weightlosspix/weightlosspix.html

marengo said:

carla said:

I have noted here before that I am not one of the fortunate folk for
whom low-carb cleared up every conceivable ailment. Indeed, my
heartburn has been getting progressively worse, so I finally saw the
doctor today. She put me on Prilosec and recommended some lifestyle
changes - I have to figure out how to have dinner earlier in the day,
cut back on caffeine a bit, and avoid some of the more acidic foods
that are heartburn triggers. (I'm a little bummed about giving up
the grapefruit I had so come to enjoy a few times a week.)

This makes no sense.

Y ou say that you are one of the unfortunates for whom low-carb did
not clear up your gerd. Then you say you were forced to give up
grapefruit. Grapefruit is not low carb, and giving it up is part of a
low-carb regimen.

Sir, yes sir!

Really, marengo, you are an experienced and relatively smart guy who has
been around here for a while and should know that there is more than one way
to eat low carb. Many fruits form a significant portion of the diet of
folks around here who are still eating on plans that are extremely low carb
by any standard other than the head-up-the-ass "Atkins induction is the One
True Way" zealots.

Quoted message said:

My acid reflux -- along with prescription meds for it -- went away
when I stopped kidding myself and started eating true low carb. It
was the bananas, grapefruit, oranges, tomatoes et. al. -- all carby
foods -- that triggered the relentless heartburn and nighttime
reflux. It's been well over a year since I had a flare up.

How nice for you. My acid reflux didn't get noticeably better when I was
eating less than 30g carbs a day and avoiding fruit altogether. My acid
reflux did not get noticeably better or worse when I added some fruit back
into my diet.

Quoted message said:

What other carby foods besides grapefruit are triggering your gerd?

I didn't say grapefruit triggered my GERD - I said that I've been told to
avoid citrusy fruits because they are known to trigger GERD. To attempt to
answer your question, if I knew what food was triggering the problem - even
assuming there is such a food - I would cut it out. To answer the loaded
part of your question - the part that makes you look like a knee-jerk
"carbs-are-evil" pod person - other than a daily serving or two of fruit
there are quite a few things in my diet that you would consider carby,
though not a lot of any of them. I occasionally eat lentils, hummus, and
from time to time a tiny amount of rice or whole grain bread. When I had a
bad cold a few weeks ago I ate chicken noodle soup and even a few saltines.
Nevertheless, to anyone with an objective persepective, my diet can
legitimately be called low-carb.

Quoted message said:

I just can't imagine that a low-carb dinner consisting of foods like
meat and green vegetables can trigger heartburn. What is it that
you're eating?

Mostly meat, and green vegetables. Also cheese. And some fruit. But the
fact is that I am not on a strict low-carb regime by any stretch of the
imagination. I occasionally eat things that clearly would send you into
spitting fits of rage if I dared to let them cross my lips and still call
myself a low-carb eater. See above.

Nevertheless, obnoxious though it was, I will take your post to heart. I do
not believe I can sustain an extremely low carb diet such as, for example,
one in which I have to eliminate fruit completely, or avoid such foods as
lentils and chickpeas, and never have even a quarter of a cup of rice once
in a while. But, you are of the opinion that these things are connected to
my reflux, so I have to consider that as I decide how to go forward.
Managing the GERD may cause me to shift my assessment of what seems
sustainable to me and what does not. In this case, despite your judgmental
zealotry, you have gotten your point across.

--
carla
http://geekofalltrades.typepad.com/geek

marengo said:

Y ou say that you are one of the unfortunates for whom low-carb did
not clear up your gerd. Then you say you were forced to give up
grapefruit. Grapefruit is not low carb, and giving it up is part of a
low-carb regimen.

I'm going to add some more here because I can't sleep and marengo's post has
touched off a number of thoughts; I find I have more to say even after
providing a fairly lengthy response.

I began learning about low carb because I was looking for a sustainable
eating plan on which I could lose weight without feeling hungry all the time
and on which I felt I could eat enough protein to preserve lean muscle mass
to the extent possible. (A propos another thread, I freely, if bashfully,
admit to being very wimpy when it comes to feeling hunger.) I read the
South Beach Diet book and learned about the ways in which refined sugars and
starches screw with blood chemistry and make one want to eat more, while
protein and fat leaves one satiated for longer. I chose not to go on the
South Beach Diet because I needed more structure (at that time) than simply
"eat until satiety." I am firm believer in eat less - exercise more, so
essentially what I was looking for was an effective way to eat less without
distraction. When I examined my eating patterns I noticed that something
like 75% of my calorie intake was coming from carbs - bread, pasta, cereal,
potatoes, and sweets. That, combined with what I was learning about blood
sugar and satiety, made me decide that cutting those foods out of my life
was going to be an effective and manageable way to reduce calories in order
to meet my weight loss goals.

I did not get fat on fruit. I got fat on bread, pasta, and sweets. Indeed,
before I began experimenting with low carb I was eating very little fresh
fruit. Marengo admonishes that "Grapefruit is not low carb" and that
"giving it up is part of a low-carb regimen." Well, giving up grapefruit
may indeed be part of *a* low-carb regimen but I don't think it is
necessarily a part of *every* low-carb regimen.

If it were not for the GERD, I would respond to anyone who told me I was
doing it wrong by eating fruit to go take a flying leap. I have absolutely
no doubt in my mind that my diet - with some fruit, but without bread,
pasta, potatoes, and sweets - is by orders of magnitude healthier than the
diet I got fat on, and if someone wants to exclude me from his club because
I don't conform to his notion of low-carb, I could really care less. If it
turns out that the fruit is a trigger for the GERD - which it might be, even
though I had reflux when my diet was crappy and included no fruit - I'll
have to reevaluate. But it would be stupid to conclude that I suffered from
GERD because I wasn't on a "true" low carb diet.

--
carla
http://geekofalltrades.typepad.com/geek

Hi,

carla said:

I have noted here before that I am not one of the fortunate folk for
whom low-carb cleared up every conceivable ailment. Indeed, my
heartburn
has been getting progressively worse, so I finally saw the doctor
today.
She put me on Prilosec and recommended some lifestyle changes - I
have
to figure out how to have dinner earlier in the day, cut back on
caffeine a
bit, and avoid some of the more acidic foods that are heartburn
triggers.
(I'm a little bummed about giving up the grapefruit I had so come to
enjoy
a few times a week.)

SNIP

I'm sorry you're still dealing with the GERD. I remember how much
pain was involved in that.
I'd second Essence's theoretical approach here. You may be dealing
with a food intolerance.
That approach is way overdone IMO, but every once in a while an
elimination diet does someone a world of good.
In one case it ended up leading to a diagnosis of celiac disease.

Consider eliminating one food group (i.e. dairy) for a couple of weeks
and see what happens.

Good luck and take care,
Carmen

Carmen said:

I'm sorry you're still dealing with the GERD. I remember how much
pain was involved in that.
I'd second Essence's theoretical approach here. You may be dealing
with a food intolerance.
That approach is way overdone IMO, but every once in a while an
elimination diet does someone a world of good.
In one case it ended up leading to a diagnosis of celiac disease.

Consider eliminating one food group (i.e. dairy) for a couple of weeks
and see what happens.

Thanks, Carmen. I'm dreading giving up dairy but I do think you're right -
I need to do the experiment, just like I need to do the fruit experiment.

--
carla
http://geekofalltrades.typepad.com/geek

carla wrote:
:: marengo wrote:
:::
::: Y ou say that you are one of the unfortunates for whom low-carb did
::: not clear up your gerd. Then you say you were forced to give up
::: grapefruit. Grapefruit is not low carb, and giving it up is part of
::: a low-carb regimen.
:::
:: I'm going to add some more here because I can't sleep and marengo's
:: post has touched off a number of thoughts; I find I have more to say
:: even after providing a fairly lengthy response.
::
:: I began learning about low carb because I was looking for a
:: sustainable eating plan on which I could lose weight without feeling
:: hungry all the time and on which I felt I could eat enough protein
:: to preserve lean muscle mass to the extent possible. (A propos
:: another thread, I freely, if bashfully, admit to being very wimpy
:: when it comes to feeling hunger.) I read the South Beach Diet book
:: and learned about the ways in which refined sugars and starches
:: screw with blood chemistry and make one want to eat more, while
:: protein and fat leaves one satiated for longer. I chose not to go
:: on the South Beach Diet because I needed more structure (at that
:: time) than simply "eat until satiety." I am firm believer in eat
:: less - exercise more, so essentially what I was looking for was an
:: effective way to eat less without distraction. When I examined my
:: eating patterns I noticed that something like 75% of my calorie
:: intake was coming from carbs - bread, pasta, cereal, potatoes, and
:: sweets. That, combined with what I was learning about blood sugar
:: and satiety, made me decide that cutting those foods out of my life
:: was going to be an effective and manageable way to reduce calories
:: in order to meet my weight loss goals.
::
:: I did not get fat on fruit. I got fat on bread, pasta, and sweets.
:: Indeed, before I began experimenting with low carb I was eating very
:: little fresh fruit. Marengo admonishes that "Grapefruit is not low
:: carb" and that "giving it up is part of a low-carb regimen." Well,
:: giving up grapefruit may indeed be part of *a* low-carb regimen but
:: I don't think it is necessarily a part of *every* low-carb regimen.

That ("giving it up is part of a low-carb regimen"😉 is perhaps true in the
weight loss phase, but certainly not so in the maintenance phase depending,
of course, on activity level.

::
:: If it were not for the GERD, I would respond to anyone who told me I
:: was doing it wrong by eating fruit to go take a flying leap. I have
:: absolutely no doubt in my mind that my diet - with some fruit, but
:: without bread, pasta, potatoes, and sweets - is by orders of
:: magnitude healthier than the diet I got fat on, and if someone wants
:: to exclude me from his club because I don't conform to his notion of
:: low-carb, I could really care less. If it turns out that the fruit
:: is a trigger for the GERD - which it might be, even though I had
:: reflux when my diet was crappy and included no fruit - I'll have to
:: reevaluate. But it would be stupid to conclude that I suffered from
:: GERD because I wasn't on a "true" low carb diet.

Have you considered the concepts of Paleo eating? There, you remove all
grains, potatoes and beans, dairy, etc, and eat meat, fish, fowl, veggies,
nuts, and fruit (you can have some eggs, too). Moreso, you do so in the
most minimally processed way possible. I'm suggesting that perhaps the
problems stem from the little grain and/or dairy products you eat -- maybe
your body doesn't like them -- wheat and milk products are the two biggest
offenders.

One interesting thing in Cordain's Paleo book is this business about
protein. He consider's his version of Paleo to be a high protein diet. But
he says that eating a lot of protein will tend to drive you to the acidic
side, and to balance it, you need to eat more (ie, lots of)veggies (I hope I
didn't remember this part ass backwards - I don't have the book with me now
to look it up). Perhaps your problems are somehow related to the balance you
get. Maybe you can look at the amount of protein in your diet relative to
the amount of veggies and tweak a bit.

One other thing to consider is how much you eat and when. Big meals before
bedtime used to be, and likely still are, triggers for me. But I sense you
already know that.

Good luck!

essense said:

Carla,

Quoted message said:

I thought my acid reflux was caused by spicy foods. It would be worse
on the nights I ate pizza, chili over spaghetti, or mexican. As soon
as I went on low carb it cleared up.

Quoted message said:

I started getting braver and making pizza without the crust, low carb
chili without the spaghetti, and mexican without the chips.. and
still I had no problem. The one night I had 2 pieces of pizza and my
acid reflux came back with a vengeance.

Quoted message said:

For me, my acid reflux is caused by grain products. Since being off
them so long, if I eat them now.. my sinuses stop up, my face breaks
out, my acid reflux comes back, along with joint pain.

Quoted message said:

My suggestion for you is to look for a food intolerance. Remove one
food for 2 weeks then add it back. Since it is getting worse, I would
think it would be a food you started eating more of when you started
low carbing.. and it is probably something you eat every day.

I would second this suggestion. Wheat allergies in particular are far
more widespread than people realize. The symptoms aren't necessarily what
people associate with 'typical' allergies.

I can literally turn my acid reflux and other symptoms on and off by
eating/not eating wheat. No other carbiferous food has this effect.

Now, I react somewhat to even a small amount of wheat and find I have to
read labels very carefully on low-carb pseudo-bakery products.

Dan
325/211/180
Atkins since 1/1/02 (yeah, it was a New Year's Resolution)
Besetting sins: good beer, German bread, and Krispy Kremes

Quoted message said:

I have noted here before that I am not one of the fortunate folk for whom
low-carb cleared up every conceivable ailment. Indeed, my heartburn has
been getting progressively worse, so I finally saw the doctor today. She
put me on Prilosec and recommended some lifestyle changes - I have to figure
out how to have dinner earlier in the day, cut back on caffeine a bit, and
avoid some of the more acidic foods that are heartburn triggers. (I'm a
little bummed about giving up the grapefruit I had so come to enjoy a few
times a week.)

low carb helps but it does not eliminate it in me. though I did find grapefruit
to not be a problem. oranges were but not grapefruit. caffeine and diet pop do
but so does water.

I think stress is the biggest factor of it. I cured all my stomach problems for
awhile by getting fired from a job I could not stand (G)

--
Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
See http://www.knight-toolworks.com For prices and ordering instructions.

Hi Carla,
I've had GERD for years and lc didn't make it go away entirely. If I don't
take my meds, Aciphex, right now because Prevacid stopped working after
about 3 years. Prilosec didn't last longer than a few months.
If I don't take meds the first sign, for me is hiccups.
I had full blown GERD even when I was on a medicine which made eating
tasteless and which took away my appetite.
There was very little food to trigger reactions so it had to be caused by
something else. Stomach acid by itself, not a reaction of the stomach to a
particular food.
Take your meds and get it under control.
jo
nj
"carla" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have noted here before that I am not one of the fortunate folk for whom
low-carb cleared up every conceivable ailment. Indeed, my heartburn has
been getting progressively worse, so I finally saw the doctor today. She
put me on Prilosec and recommended some lifestyle changes - I have to

figure

Quoted message said:

out how to have dinner earlier in the day, cut back on caffeine a bit, and
avoid some of the more acidic foods that are heartburn triggers. (I'm a
little bummed about giving up the grapefruit I had so come to enjoy a few
times a week.)

I'm not thrilled about dealing with a chronic illness - even a minor one
like this. I've never been one to get sick much; it took quite a bit of
discomfort with the heartburn to get me to the doctor at all. It had

begun

Quoted message said:

to interfere with my work. However, I am for the moment fairly relieved
that my doctor thinks this is garden-variety GERD, rather than an ulcer.

I'd like to take her recommendations to heart - I am not thrilled about
taking drugs indefinitely, so I'd like to try to treat it with diet and
lifestyle changes to the extent practicable. I'd like to tap into the

store

Quoted message said:

of experience here in asdlc - do you suffer from reflux, that didn't clear
up when you switched to low carb? What are you doing to manage it?

--
carla
http://geekofalltrades.typepad.com/geek

"carla" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have noted here before that I am not one of the fortunate folk for whom
low-carb cleared up every conceivable ailment. Indeed, my heartburn has
been getting progressively worse, so I finally saw the doctor today. She
put me on Prilosec and recommended some lifestyle changes - I have to

figure

Quoted message said:

out how to have dinner earlier in the day, cut back on caffeine a bit, and
avoid some of the more acidic foods that are heartburn triggers. (I'm a
little bummed about giving up the grapefruit I had so come to enjoy a few
times a week.)

I'm not thrilled about dealing with a chronic illness - even a minor one
like this. I've never been one to get sick much; it took quite a bit of
discomfort with the heartburn to get me to the doctor at all. It had

begun

Quoted message said:

to interfere with my work. However, I am for the moment fairly relieved
that my doctor thinks this is garden-variety GERD, rather than an ulcer.

I'd like to take her recommendations to heart - I am not thrilled about
taking drugs indefinitely, so I'd like to try to treat it with diet and
lifestyle changes to the extent practicable. I'd like to tap into the

store

Quoted message said:

of experience here in asdlc - do you suffer from reflux, that didn't clear
up when you switched to low carb? What are you doing to manage it?

Actually, going low-carb cured my twice-a-day antacid habit!!! I take now
one or two a month now 🙂
--
ClabberHead 4.01 (aka Iron Chef Atkins)
248.5/191.5/185.0 Livin' La Vida Low-Carb since 5/1/03
Al-Team #"e" to 27 decimal places (2.71828182845904523536028747...)
"Think about how stupid the average person is, then remember half of them
are stupider than that!" - George Carlin

Daniel Hoffmeister <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I would second this suggestion. Wheat allergies in particular are far
more widespread than people realize. The symptoms aren't necessarily what
people associate with 'typical' allergies.

I can literally turn my acid reflux and other symptoms on and off by
eating/not eating wheat. No other carbiferous food has this effect.

Now, I react somewhat to even a small amount of wheat and find I have to
read labels very carefully on low-carb pseudo-bakery products.

Thanks Daniel; that's interesting. I have eaten a few wheat products
over the past several weeks, but thinking on it now I cannot really
correlate the bad episodes of reflux with those. I generally avoid
wheat products these days - the wheat-eating events are few and the
reflux events many. I've never tried low-carb "pseudo-bakery"
products (I love that term you used), so I don't have to worry about
them. It's one more thing to be vigilant about though.

--
carla
http://geekofalltrades.typepad.com

carla said:

I'm not thrilled about dealing with a chronic illness - even a minor one
like this. I've never been one to get sick much; it took quite a bit of
discomfort with the heartburn to get me to the doctor at all. It had begun
to interfere with my work. However, I am for the moment fairly relieved
that my doctor thinks this is garden-variety GERD, rather than an ulcer.

I'd like to take her recommendations to heart - I am not thrilled about
taking drugs indefinitely, so I'd like to try to treat it with diet and
lifestyle changes to the extent practicable. I'd like to tap into the store
of experience here in asdlc - do you suffer from reflux, that didn't clear
up when you switched to low carb? What are you doing to manage it?

I take Prilosec, aka Omeprazole. Prilosec is available over the counter.
Omeprazol is still a prescription (It's the generic). The folks who make
Prilosec also have a prescription medication called Nexium. Prevacid is
another prescription option.

If using insurance is cheapest, I'd ask your doc for one of the above (not
counting Prilosec OTC). If you don't have insurance, or you have a huge
co-pay, Prilosec OTC is a good option.

For on-the-spot relief, try Titralac, from 3M.

Carol

metoo said:

Hi Carla,
I've had GERD for years and lc didn't make it go away entirely. If I don't
take my meds, Aciphex, right now because Prevacid stopped working after
about 3 years. Prilosec didn't last longer than a few months.
If I don't take meds the first sign, for me is hiccups.
I had full blown GERD even when I was on a medicine which made eating
tasteless and which took away my appetite.
There was very little food to trigger reactions so it had to be caused by
something else. Stomach acid by itself, not a reaction of the stomach to a
particular food.
Take your meds and get it under control.

I've been reading this thread with interest, because I have GERD, too. It
appears that many people associate heartburn with having GERD. Heartburn
is not necessarily GERD. There is also a physical malfunction in the
esophagus. Check this out. Then, "Take your meds and get it under
control."

http://www.aboutgerd.org/characteristics.html

Carol

Damsel in dis Dress said:

I take Prilosec, aka Omeprazole. Prilosec is available over the
counter. Omeprazol is still a prescription (It's the generic). The
folks who make Prilosec also have a prescription medication called
Nexium. Prevacid is another prescription option.

If using insurance is cheapest, I'd ask your doc for one of the above
(not counting Prilosec OTC). If you don't have insurance, or you
have a huge co-pay, Prilosec OTC is a good option.

For on-the-spot relief, try Titralac, from 3M.

Thanks for the post, Carol. Interestingly, my doctor did recommend Prilosec
OTC, which I am now taking, and it turned out that the HMO pharmacy had some
kind of deal where they could treat it like a prescription and give it to me
for a small copay, a fraction of the cost of the same drug purchased in a
store.

Anyhow, I have tried not to eat dinner so late, and I have been taking the
Prilosec, and I haven't had any heartburn since the day I saw the doctor, so
I can say "so far, so good."

--
carla
http://geekofalltrades.typepad.com/geek

carla said:

Damsel in dis Dress said:

I take Prilosec, aka Omeprazole. Prilosec is available over the
counter. Omeprazol is still a prescription (It's the generic). The
folks who make Prilosec also have a prescription medication called
Nexium. Prevacid is another prescription option.

If using insurance is cheapest, I'd ask your doc for one of the above
(not counting Prilosec OTC). If you don't have insurance, or you
have a huge co-pay, Prilosec OTC is a good option.

For on-the-spot relief, try Titralac, from 3M.

Thanks for the post, Carol. Interestingly, my doctor did recommend Prilosec
OTC, which I am now taking, and it turned out that the HMO pharmacy had some
kind of deal where they could treat it like a prescription and give it to me
for a small copay, a fraction of the cost of the same drug purchased in a
store.

Anyhow, I have tried not to eat dinner so late, and I have been taking the
Prilosec, and I haven't had any heartburn since the day I saw the doctor, so
I can say "so far, so good."

I'm happy for you, Carla. GERD is a horribly painful problem. I'm glad
they've discovered these medications.

Carol