LDL too low???

Matti Narkia said:

Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:30:03 GMT in article
<[email hidden]> Matti Narkia

Quoted message said:

Thu, 30 Oct 2003 11:21:21 -0600 in article
<[email hidden]> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D."

Quoted message said:

if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a mercury
level, as it can be a contaminant and some studies suggest it to be a
risk factor for promoting atherosclerosis.

I'm under impression that the best quality _concentrated_ fish oil
products
don't contain measurable amounts of mercury or other pollutants, because
these have been removed in the molecular distillation process.

See

Impurities in Fish Oil
http://www.iherb.com/mercury.html

"... Molecular distillation is the only method (currently) that can
remove metals, pcbs and other toxins to below detectable levels for
human consumption. ..."

http://www.iherb.com/dha.html

"Purified by Molecular Distillation-"

Fish Oil Comparison http://www.dr-sears-fishoil.com/compare.asp

"True molecular distillation process removes all man made pollutants
such as PCB's, dioxins and mercury."

unfortunately, these sites also sell fish oil, and remind me of
phamaceutical reps for prescription drugs.
--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
Board Certified in Family Practice

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:46:31 GMT, Jim Chinnis <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

"Patrick Blanchard, M.D." <[email hidden]> wrote in part:

Quoted message said:

if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a mercury
level, as it can be a contaminant and some studies suggest it to be a
risk factor for promoting atherosclerosis.

I've never seen a report of mercury contamination in fish oil. Mercury
should
remain in the muscle tissue and should not be soluble in oil.
--
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

www.pubmed.gov and let me know what you find.
--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
Board Certified in Family Practice

Thu, 30 Oct 2003 12:15:44 -0600 in article
<[email hidden]> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D."

Quoted message said:

unfortunately, these sites also sell fish oil, and remind me of
phamaceutical reps for prescription drugs.

Ok, the purpose was to find some clarification for the concept.

--
Matti Narkia

Patrick Blanchard said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> > > I am a 62 yr. old T2 diabetic controlled w/1000 mg. lipitor bid.

I'm

Quoted message said:

> > > also on a beta blocker w/HCTZ and atorvastatin (Lipitor 10 mg).

My

Quoted message said:

> > > latest serum tests came in at:
> > > > > > > TC 126
> > > TG 167
> > > HDL 50
> > > LDL 42
> > > vLDL 33
> > > > > > > What are the consequences of such a low TC and LDL?

Should I consider

Quoted message said:

> > > coming off the statin and go on a fibrate like gemfibrozil to

better

Quoted message said:

> > > target my trigs (which sometimes go up to 350-400 w/my metabolic
> > > syndrome)?
> > > > > > > -Preston

this profile is at goal.

With metabolic syndrome (MetS), the triglycerides are definitely still too
high.

The weight and height are important here.

Quoted message said:

you might consider hs.CRP and homocystiene levels.

if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a mercury
level, as it can be a contaminant

Not in concentrated supplements.

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

Matti Narkia said:

Thu, 30 Oct 2003 11:21:21 -0600 in article
<[email hidden]> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D."

Quoted message said:

if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a mercury
level, as it can be a contaminant and some studies suggest it to be a risk
factor for promoting atherosclerosis.

I'm under impression that the best quality _concentrated_ fish oil products
don't contain measurable amounts of mercury or other pollutants, because
these have been removed in the molecular distillation process.

You are correct even for "regular" quality concentrated fish oil softgels.

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

"Patrick Blanchard, M.D." <[email hidden]> wrote in part:

Quoted message said:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:46:31 GMT, Jim Chinnis <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

"Patrick Blanchard, M.D." <[email hidden]> wrote in part:

Quoted message said:

if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a mercury
level, as it can be a contaminant and some studies suggest it to be a
risk factor for promoting atherosclerosis.

I've never seen a report of mercury contamination in fish oil. Mercury
should
remain in the muscle tissue and should not be soluble in oil.
--
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

www.pubmed.gov and let me know what you find.

I've looked before, as I implied. Have you ever seen a report of fish oil
supplements contaminated with mercury?
--
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

x-no-archive: yes

Quoted message said:

unfortunately, these sites also sell fish oil, and remind me of
phamaceutical reps for prescription drugs.
--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D.,

The Eades, in Protein Power, also recommend cholesterol free fish oil. They
had nothing to sell at the time they first made this recommendation. Not just
for mercury, but for removal of other pollutants as well.

Susan

x-no-archive: yes

Quoted message said:

but not a guarantee.

I'm a grownup.

I don't expect 100% guarantees in life.

You sound like Chung. Ill informed, and argumentative.

Susan

(Susan ) said:

Quoted message said:

but not a guarantee.

I'm a grownup.

I don't expect 100% guarantees in life.

You sound like Chung. Ill informed, and argumentative.

Hello there Patrick. Welcome to Susan. mainly she is a nutcase with an
axe to grind about doctors of all sorts. Do not take her ramblings
personally.

http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap030724.html
Lift well, Eat less, Walk fast, Live long.

Thu, 30 Oct 2003 18:47:37 GMT in article
<[email hidden]> Matti Narkia

Quoted message said:

First a couple of references about fish oil and cod liver oil. According to
them mercury levels in these oils seem to be negligible:

Koller H, Luley C, Klein B, Baum H, Biesalski HK.
[Contaminating substances in 22 over-the-counter fish oil and cod liver oil
preparations: cholesterol, heavy metals and vitamin A]
Z Ernahrungswiss. 1989 Mar;28(1):76-83. German.
PMID: 2718527 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=2718527&dopt=Abstract>

[snip]

Quoted message said:

van de Ven WS.
Mercury and selenium in cod-liver oil.
Clin Toxicol. 1978;12(5):579-81.
PMID: 679643 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=679643&dopt=Abstract>

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Secondly, from the same issue of NEJM a couple of studies which give
contradictory results about the association of mercury and coronary heart
disease:

Yoshizawa K, Rimm EB, Morris JS, Spate VL, Hsieh CC, Spiegelman D, Stampfer
MJ, Willett WC.
Mercury and the risk of coronary heart disease in men.
N Engl J Med. 2002 Nov 28;347(22):1755-60.
PMID: 12456851 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/347/22/1755

[snip]

Quoted message said:

Guallar E, Sanz-Gallardo MI, van't Veer P, Bode P, Aro A, Gomez-Aracena J,
Kark JD, Riemersma RA, Martin-Moreno JM, Kok FJ; Heavy Metals and Myocardial
Infarction Study Group.
Mercury, fish oils, and the risk of myocardial infarction.
N Engl J Med. 2002 Nov 28;347(22):1747-54.
PMID: 12456850 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/347/22/1747

Selenium reduces toxicity of mercury, because selenium forms tight compound
with mercury, which inactivates it. Many fish have high selenium content,
which reduces the toxicity of mercury in them. Still, if one eats a lot of
fish, it might be beneficial to take selenium supplements for precaution.

Seychelles' fish consumption is among the largest in the world. They consume
a lot of large predatory fish which typically have rather high mercury
content. Still, this has not had negative effect on the cognitive
development of the children there as has been shown in the long term
Seychelles Child Development Study, see

http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=iufd6t03mi92uc6pql9esu2lvrpkhqc9bb%404ax.com
(http://tinyurl.com/t1lp)

References about the protective effects of selenium against mercury
toxicity:

1: Frisk P, Wester K, Yaqob A, Lindh U.
Selenium protection against mercury-induced apoptosis and growth inhibition
in cultured K-562 cells.
Biol Trace Elem Res. 2003 May;92(2):105-14.
PMID: 12746570 [PubMed - in process]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=12746570&dopt=Abstract

2: Hol PJ, Vamnes JS, Gjerdet NR, Eide R, Isrenn R.
Dental amalgam and selenium in blood.
Environ Res. 2001 Dec;87(3):141-6.
PMID: 11771928 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11771928&dopt=Abstract

3: [censored] A, Barber D, Pfeiffer CJ.
Protective effects of selenium against mercury toxicity in cultured
Atlantic spotted dolphin (Stenella plagiodon) renal cells.
Arch Environ Contam Toxicol. 2001 Nov;41(4):403-9.
PMID: 11598777 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11598777&dopt=Abstract

4: Frisk P, Yaqob A, Nilsson K, Lindh U.
Selenite or selenomethionine interaction with methylmercury on uptake and
toxicity showing a weak selenite protection: studies on cultured K-562
cells.
Biol Trace Elem Res. 2001 Jun;80(3):251-68.
PMID: 11508630 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11508630&dopt=Abstract

5: Watanabe C.
[Selenium deficiency and brain functions: the significance for
methylmercury toxicity]
Nippon Eiseigaku Zasshi. 2001 Jan;55(4):581-9. Review. Japanese.
PMID: 11265129 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11265129&dopt=Abstract

6: Drasch G, Mail der S, Schlosser C, Roider G.
Content of non-mercury-associated selenium in human tissues.
Biol Trace Elem Res. 2000 Dec;77(3):219-30.
PMID: 11204464 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11204464&dopt=Abstract

7: Dietz R, Riget F, Born EW.
An assessment of selenium to mercury in Greenland marine animals.
Sci Total Environ. 2000 Jan 17;245(1-3):15-24.
PMID: 10682353 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=10682353&dopt=Abstract

8: Seppanen K, Laatikainen R, Salonen JT, Kantola M, Lotjonen S, Harri M,
Nurminen L, Kaikkonen J, Nyyssonen K.
Mercury-binding capacity of organic and inorganic selenium in rat blood and
liver.
Biol Trace Elem Res. 1998 Dec;65(3):197-210.
PMID: 9892493 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=9892493&dopt=Abstract

9: Schuurs AH, Groten J, van Dokkum W, van den Heuvel J.
[Selenium and mercury. (Un)healthy antagonism?]
Ned Tijdschr Tandheelkd. 1996 Mar;103(3):88-91. Review. Dutch.
PMID: 11921953 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11921953&dopt=Abstract

10: Molin M, Bergman B, Marklund SL, Schutz A, Skerfving S.
Mercury, selenium, and glutathione peroxidase before and after amalgam
removal in man.
Acta Odontol Scand. 1990 Jun;48(3):189-202.
PMID: 2368614 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=2368614&dopt=Abstract

11: Das SK, Giri AK, Sharma A, Talukder G.
Effects of mercury-selenium antagonism on mammalian cell division.
Cytobios. 1985;42(169S):271-8.
PMID: 4028833 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=4028833&dopt=Abstract

12: Mochizuki Y, Kobayashi T, Doi R.
Comparison of cytotoxicity of mercury-selenium and mercury compounds on
cultured cells.
Toxicol Lett. 1984 Jul;22(1):47-51.
PMID: 6235624 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=6235624&dopt=Abstract

13: Mochizuki Y, Kobayashi T, Doi R.
In vitro effects of mercury-selenium compounds on enzymes.
Toxicol Lett. 1982 Dec;14(3-4):201-6.
PMID: 7167980 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=7167980&dopt=Abstract

14: Hansen JC, Kristensen P, Al-Masri SN.
Mercury/selenium interaction. A comparative study on pigs.
Nord Vet Med. 1981 Feb;33(2):57-64.
PMID: 7232147 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=7232147&dopt=Abstract

15: Paulsson K, Lundbergh K.
The selenium method for treatment of lakes for elevated levels of mercury
in fish.
Sci Total Environ. 1989 Nov;87-88:495-507.
PMID: 2558416 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=2558416&dopt=Abstract

"... The treatment of lakes with selenium has been found to be one of
the few known methods of lowering the mercury content of fish quickly
and easily."

16: Yoshida M, Abe M, [censored] K, Kikuchi K.
Bioavailability of selenium in the defatted dark muscle of tuna.
Food Addit Contam. 2002 Oct;19(10):990-5.
PMID: 12443562 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=12443562&dopt=Abstract

"... The results indicate that the defatted DMT contains high levels
of Se in a nutritionally available form."

17: Cappon CJ, Smith JC.
Chemical form and distribution of mercury and selenium in canned tuna.
J Appl Toxicol. 1982 Aug;2(4):181-9.
PMID: 7185899 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=7185899&dopt=Abstract

18: Boyer CI Jr, Andrews EJ, deLahunta A, Bache CA, Gutenman WH, Lisk DJ.
Accumulation of mercury and selenium in tissues of kittens fed commercial
cat food.
Cornell Vet. 1978 Jul;68(3):365-74.
PMID: 668395 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=668395&dopt=Abstract

--
Matti Narkia

Matti Narkia said:

Thu, 30 Oct 2003 12:15:44 -0600 in article
<[email hidden]> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D."

Quoted message said:

unfortunately, these sites also sell fish oil, and remind me of
phamaceutical reps for prescription drugs.

Ok, the purpose was to find some clarification for the concept.

Jim has a nice point.

--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
Board Certified in Family Practice

"Patrick Blanchard, M.D." <[email hidden]> wrote in part:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> I've never seen a report of mercury contamination in fish oil. Mercury
> should
> remain in the muscle tissue and should not be soluble in oil.
> --
> Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA
>

www.pubmed.gov and let me know what you find.

I've looked before, as I implied. Have you ever seen a report of fish oil
supplements contaminated with mercury? --
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

I did not know that mercury is found only in the fish muscle, thank you for
clarifying this for me. I did find a remote study, but it certainly does
not sound worrisome. 'normal use' is not a specific term and means
different things for different people.

Mercury, along with other toxins, accumulates in the food chain, and bigger
fish tend to be more toxic, all other things being equal. But mercury should
accumulate in the muscle and not the fat, as far as I can determine.

As important as fish oil may be in improving health, I'd hate to see people
discouraged from taking it for the wrong reasons.

Thanks to Matti for explaining "molecular distillation." It still sounds like
a puffed up term for what is just low-temperature distillation. Whether it
helps to remove PCBs and such from oil isn't clear to me, though. Anyone know
what the basic step for processing fish oil is? (Beyond squeezing the
fish...lol.)
--
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 20:17:12 GMT, Jim Chinnis <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

"Patrick Blanchard, M.D." <[email hidden]> wrote in part:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> I've never seen a report of mercury contamination in fish oil.
>> Mercury should
>> remain in the muscle tissue and should not be soluble in oil.
>> --
>> Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA
>>
>
>
> www.pubmed.gov and let me know what you find.

I've looked before, as I implied. Have you ever seen a report of fish
oil
supplements contaminated with mercury? --
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

I did not know that mercury is found only in the fish muscle, thank you
for clarifying this for me. I did find a remote study, but it certainly
does not sound worrisome. 'normal use' is not a specific term and means
different things for different people.

Mercury, along with other toxins, accumulates in the food chain, and
bigger
fish tend to be more toxic, all other things being equal. But mercury
should
accumulate in the muscle and not the fat, as far as I can determine.

As important as fish oil may be in improving health, I'd hate to see
people
discouraged from taking it for the wrong reasons.

Thanks to Matti for explaining "molecular distillation." It still sounds
like
a puffed up term for what is just low-temperature distillation. Whether
it
helps to remove PCBs and such from oil isn't clear to me, though. Anyone
know
what the basic step for processing fish oil is? (Beyond squeezing the
fish...lol.)
--
Jim Chinnis Warrenton, Virginia, USA

rotfl because I slipped on all the fish oil.

This has always worried me; I was reading all the studies on eating fish
and thinking it to be concentrated in the oils. yes, PCBs are for another
topic and one to consider. But the mercury one, gosh, thanks again.

I usually tell my patients that when the cats start following them home,
then they know they are taking enough.

Fish oil has been shown to improve endothelial function of the arteries.
This is the process by which the inner lining of the artery called the
endothelium releases nitric oxide to relax blood vessels. I ocassionally
perform this evaluation in my office, but it is not well standardized as to
protocol so the interpretation of results are difficult and must be
individualized (no, I don't charge for it, but use it to help sort out the
difficult issues sometimes with metabolic syndrome). Some circles debate
that endothelial dysfunction is the first precurser to increasing CIMT, or
atheroclerosis. However, fish oil has not been proven to reduce CIMT over
time, so, go fish.

--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
Board Certified in Family Practice

Patrick Blanchard said:

Matti Narkia said:

Thu, 30 Oct 2003 11:21:21 -0600 in article
<[email hidden]> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D."

Quoted message said:

if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a mercury
level, as it can be a contaminant and some studies suggest it to be a
risk factor for promoting atherosclerosis.

I'm under impression that the best quality _concentrated_ fish oil
products
don't contain measurable amounts of mercury or other pollutants, because
these have been removed in the molecular distillation process.

measurable amounts is your key word. this does not mean 'zero'.

--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
Board Certified in Family Practice

It's pretty reassuring though. Better than measurable amounts.

Would you be similarly concerned about dental amalgam?

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

MD/PhD said:

Patrick Blanchard said:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:30:03 GMT, Matti Narkia <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Thu, 30 Oct 2003 11:21:21 -0600 in article
<[email hidden]> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D."
<[email hidden]> wrote:
>
> if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a mercury
> level, as it can be a contaminant and some studies suggest it to be a
> risk factor for promoting atherosclerosis.
>
I'm under impression that the best quality _concentrated_ fish oil
products
don't contain measurable amounts of mercury or other pollutants,

because

Quoted message said:

these have been removed in the molecular distillation process.

measurable amounts is your key word. this does not mean 'zero'.

--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
Board Certified in Family Practice

It's pretty reassuring though. Better than measurable amounts.

Would you be similarly concerned about dental amalgam?

I don't know the field well enough to make any suggestions. What do you
think?

--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
Board Certified in Family Practice

Patrick Blanchard said:

MD/PhD said:

Patrick Blanchard said:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:30:03 GMT, Matti Narkia <[email hidden]>
wrote:

> Thu, 30 Oct 2003 11:21:21 -0600 in article
> <[email hidden]> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D."
> <[email hidden]> wrote:
>>
>> if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a mercury
>> level, as it can be a contaminant and some studies suggest it to be a
>> risk factor for promoting atherosclerosis.
>>
> I'm under impression that the best quality _concentrated_ fish oil
> products
> don't contain measurable amounts of mercury or other pollutants,
because
> these have been removed in the molecular distillation process.
>

measurable amounts is your key word. this does not mean 'zero'.

--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
Board Certified in Family Practice

It's pretty reassuring though. Better than measurable amounts.

Would you be similarly concerned about dental amalgam?

I don't know the field well enough to make any suggestions. What do you
think?

Not that concerned. However, I have changed out all my fillings :-)

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/

MD/PhD said:

Patrick Blanchard said:

MD/PhD said:

"Patrick Blanchard, M.D." wrote:

> On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:30:03 GMT, Matti Narkia <[email hidden]>
> wrote:
>
> > Thu, 30 Oct 2003 11:21:21 -0600 in article
> > <[email hidden]> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D."
> > <[email hidden]> wrote:
> >>
> >> if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a

mercury

Quoted message said:

> >> level, as it can be a contaminant and some studies suggest it to

be a

Quoted message said:

> >> risk factor for promoting atherosclerosis.
> >>
> > I'm under impression that the best quality _concentrated_ fish oil
> > products
> > don't contain measurable amounts of mercury or other pollutants,
> because
> > these have been removed in the molecular distillation process.
> >
>
> measurable amounts is your key word. this does not mean 'zero'.
>
> --
> ~~~
> Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
> Board Certified in Family Practice

It's pretty reassuring though. Better than measurable amounts.

Would you be similarly concerned about dental amalgam?

I don't know the field well enough to make any suggestions. What do you
think?

Not that concerned. However, I have changed out all my fillings :-)

FMI, was it expensive and did insurance cover your procedure?

--
~~~
Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
Board Certified in Family Practice

Preston,

Re BP and Hba1c: super numbers for you! I agree with you, 9 fish oil
capsules would be unpleasant. Personally I eat either salmon or
canned herring every day. Moderate drinking (up to 2 drinks a day) may
increase HDL and (I believe) low BG, at least temporarily. Of course,
more than that is harmful. This newsgroup has scared me away from
taking my statin (Crestor 5 mg).

[email hidden] (Preston Rich) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Brad--

Sorry for the delayed response. My HbA1c is 5.5 and BP is 100/60.
Boy, that's a LOT of fish oil ;-) I'll smell like a dead grouper ;-)

-Preston

[email hidden] (Brad Sheppard) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Preston,

Re: HDL went from 42 to 50 - very good. I got mine to go from 35 to
69 - moderate drinking, eating oily fish every day,over 1

hour aerobic exercise daily, and eating moderate amounts of "good"
fats (olive oil, nuts). Two key numbers for diabetics -

Hba1c and blood pressure. How do you rate on those? Did you see the
AHA article on fish oil capsules and/or oily fish - to

combat high trig you may consume up to 9 capsules a day?
http://circ.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/full/106/21/2747

[email hidden] (Preston Rich) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Interestingly enough, in the span between this test above and my
immediately prior one, the only change I made was to drink 1 lite beer
daily w/dinner. My HDL went from 42 to 50.

-Preston

[email hidden] (Brad Sheppard) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
> Preston,
>
> Your diabetes dramatically increases your chd risk. A low ldl is good
> prevention. You might look into niaspan (increase HDL).
>
> [email hidden] (Preston Rich) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
> > Sorry. Meant to say "...controlled w/1000 mg. _Metformin_ bid."
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [email hidden] (Preston Rich) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
> > > I am a 62 yr. old T2 diabetic controlled w/1000 mg. lipitor bid. I'm
> > > also on a beta blocker w/HCTZ and atorvastatin (Lipitor 10 mg). My
> > > latest serum tests came in at:
> > >
> > > TC 126
> > > TG 167
> > > HDL 50
> > > LDL 42
> > > vLDL 33
> > >
> > > What are the consequences of such a low TC and LDL? Should I consider
> > > coming off the statin and go on a fibrate like gemfibrozil to better
> > > target my trigs (which sometimes go up to 350-400 w/my metabolic
> > > syndrome)?
> > >
> > > -Preston

"Patrick Blanchard, M.D." <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

MD/PhD said:

Patrick Blanchard said:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:35:32 -0500, Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
<[email hidden]> wrote:

> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D." wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:30:03 GMT, Matti Narkia <[email hidden]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Thu, 30 Oct 2003 11:21:21 -0600 in article
>> > <[email hidden]> "Patrick Blanchard, M.D."
>> > <[email hidden]> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> if you are concerned about too much fish oil, then consider a

mercury

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> >> level, as it can be a contaminant and some studies suggest it to

be a

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> >> risk factor for promoting atherosclerosis.
>> >>
>> > I'm under impression that the best quality _concentrated_ fish oil
>> > products
>> > don't contain measurable amounts of mercury or other pollutants,

because

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

>> > these have been removed in the molecular distillation process.
>> >
>>
>> measurable amounts is your key word. this does not mean 'zero'.
>>
>> --
>> ~~~
>> Patrick Blanchard, M.D., A.B.F.P.
>> Board Certified in Family Practice
>
> It's pretty reassuring though. Better than measurable amounts.
>
> Would you be similarly concerned about dental amalgam?

I don't know the field well enough to make any suggestions. What do you
think?

Not that concerned. However, I have changed out all my fillings :-)

FMI, was it expensive and did insurance cover your procedure?

It wasn't too expensive. No, insurance did not cover it.

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com

Brad--

Don't let this group scare you away from taking your statin. IMHO
that's a big mistake assuming you are not suffering debilitating
myositis. There are just too many positive clinical trials on this
stuff to run away from it so quickly. However, I have decided not to
add a fibtare like gemfibrozil, which would really lower my trigs on
balance, because of some of the newer trials of their combined effects
(not because of Baycor).

-Preston

[email hidden] (Brad Sheppard) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Preston,

Re BP and Hba1c: super numbers for you! I agree with you, 9 fish oil
capsules would be unpleasant. Personally I eat either salmon or
canned herring every day. Moderate drinking (up to 2 drinks a day) may
increase HDL and (I believe) low BG, at least temporarily. Of course,
more than that is harmful. This newsgroup has scared me away from
taking my statin (Crestor 5 mg).

[email hidden] (Preston Rich) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Brad--

Sorry for the delayed response. My HbA1c is 5.5 and BP is 100/60.
Boy, that's a LOT of fish oil ;-) I'll smell like a dead grouper ;-)

-Preston

[email hidden] (Brad Sheppard) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Preston,

Re: HDL went from 42 to 50 - very good. I got mine to go from 35 to
69 - moderate drinking, eating oily fish every day,over 1

hour aerobic exercise daily, and eating moderate amounts of "good"
fats (olive oil, nuts). Two key numbers for diabetics -

Hba1c and blood pressure. How do you rate on those? Did you see the
AHA article on fish oil capsules and/or oily fish - to

combat high trig you may consume up to 9 capsules a day?
http://circ.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/full/106/21/2747

[email hidden] (Preston Rich) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
> Interestingly enough, in the span between this test above and my
> immediately prior one, the only change I made was to drink 1 lite beer
> daily w/dinner. My HDL went from 42 to 50.
>
> -Preston
>
>
> [email hidden] (Brad Sheppard) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
> > Preston,
> >
> > Your diabetes dramatically increases your chd risk. A low ldl is good
> > prevention. You might look into niaspan (increase HDL).
> >
> > [email hidden] (Preston Rich) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
> > > Sorry. Meant to say "...controlled w/1000 mg. _Metformin_ bid."
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [email hidden] (Preston Rich) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...
> > > > I am a 62 yr. old T2 diabetic controlled w/1000 mg. lipitor bid. I'm
> > > > also on a beta blocker w/HCTZ and atorvastatin (Lipitor 10 mg). My
> > > > latest serum tests came in at:
> > > >
> > > > TC 126
> > > > TG 167
> > > > HDL 50
> > > > LDL 42
> > > > vLDL 33
> > > >
> > > > What are the consequences of such a low TC and LDL? Should I consider
> > > > coming off the statin and go on a fibrate like gemfibrozil to better
> > > > target my trigs (which sometimes go up to 350-400 w/my metabolic
> > > > syndrome)?
> > > >
> > > > -Preston