Ketostix: no more purple

A few things:

1. Drinking more fluids can dilute the readings.

2. Many people stop showing ketones in urine after the first few
weeks. Basically, your body adapts and stops overproducing
ketones, relying more on FFAs for fuel.

If you're doing Atkins, now is the time to find your CCLL.

"Drop 41" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I bought a bottle of Ketostix a while back and for the past 2 weeks

I have

Quoted message said:

been using them at random times during the day (any time from waking

up till

Quoted message said:

going to bed) They have registered usually "moderate" or "large"

(40-80mg)

Quoted message said:

Suddenly today it's different. No more purple. I did it this morning

and it

Quoted message said:

was "small" so I did it again just now and it's "trace"

Now - i am not using this as a serious tool but it was fun to see

the

Quoted message said:

purple. I felt like "hey, it's working" besides seeing the scale go

down

Quoted message said:

and the clothes get looser.

Should I worry that for some reason there is such a big change?

No.

Or disregard

Quoted message said:

them and not even give it another thought?

I didn't do anything differently on the diet (atkins for me) I have

been

Quoted message said:

drinking more Caffiene Free Diet Pepsi in the last few days than

normal (and

Quoted message said:

not enough water) but I do this occasionally - it's not totally

unusual.

Your body has figured out how to burn fat efficiently (or at least
that particular type of ketone-- there are 4 but the strip only tests
for one) so there is very little excess in your urine. This is
common in folks who don't overeat fat and especially quick to surface
in folks who are going back on lowcarb after a hiatus. Your body
remembers how to do it. Totally normal. (Provided of course that you
are eating less than 100 g carbs a day- including converted protien-
so your body must get calories from fat for basal function).

revek

Drop 41 wrote:

<snip>
| Suddenly today it's different. No more purple. I did it this morning
| and it was "small" so I did it again just now and it's "trace"

Being in ketosis is like being pregnant -- either you are or you aren't. In
other words, the variation of concentration of ketones in your urine does
not mean that you are any "more" or anmy "less" in ketosis. The
ketoneconcentration will vary depending on time of day tested, what you have
eaten recently and how much, how much you have had to drink, etc.
--
Peter
270/215/180
Before/Current Pix:
http://users.thelink.net/marengo/weightlosspix/weightlosspix.html

"marengo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Drop 41 wrote:

<snip>
| Suddenly today it's different. No more purple. I did it this morning
| and it was "small" so I did it again just now and it's "trace"

Being in ketosis is like being pregnant -- either you are or you aren't.

In

Quoted message said:

other words, the variation of concentration of ketones in your urine does
not mean that you are any "more" or anmy "less" in ketosis. The
ketoneconcentration will vary depending on time of day tested, what you

have

Quoted message said:

eaten recently and how much, how much you have had to drink, etc.
--
Peter
270/215/180
Before/Current Pix:
http://users.thelink.net/marengo/weightlosspix/weightlosspix.html

so if it's 2 days now with the reading saying I'm not in ketosis then I am
not, right?

I ate a bunch of ham the last 3 days. The package listed the ingredients and
didn't say sugar or anything like it so i thought it was ok - but i bet it
has sugar! I think that's the culprit - and the caff free diet pepsi. it
gives me cravings too! This is the first time in weeks that i am going
through the cabinets and fridge looking for muchies! I am thining about food
more. Not good.

i was so exited seeing the scale go down - 14lbs so far. I guess it's time
to tighten the reins again. phooey.

Quoted message said:

Drop 41 wrote:
:: "marengo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
:: news:[email hidden]...
::: Drop 41 wrote:
:::
::: <snip>
:::: Suddenly today it's different. No more purple. I did it this
:::: morning and it was "small" so I did it again just now and it's
:::: "trace"
:::
:::
::: Being in ketosis is like being pregnant -- either you are or you
::: aren't. In other words, the variation of concentration of ketones
::: in your urine does not mean that you are any "more" or anmy "less"
::: in ketosis. The ketoneconcentration will vary depending on time of
::: day tested, what you have eaten recently and how much, how much you
::: have had to drink, etc. --
::: Peter
::: 270/215/180
::: Before/Current Pix:
::: http://users.thelink.net/marengo/weightlosspix/weightlosspix.html
::
:: so if it's 2 days now with the reading saying I'm not in ketosis
:: then I am not, right?
::
:: I ate a bunch of ham the last 3 days. The package listed the
:: ingredients and didn't say sugar or anything like it so i thought it
:: was ok - but i bet it has sugar! I think that's the culprit - and
:: the caff free diet pepsi. it gives me cravings too! This is the
:: first time in weeks that i am going through the cabinets and fridge
:: looking for muchies! I am thining about food more. Not good.

Yeah, if the cravings are back then something is up. Time to reevaluation
everything, start fresh and attention more. If you add something to your
diet, pay attention to see what affect it has. Try not to make too many
changes at once, either, as that makes it hard to figure out where the
problem lies.

::
:: i was so exited seeing the scale go down - 14lbs so far. I guess
:: it's time to tighten the reins again. phooey.

"revek" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Your body has figured out how to burn fat efficiently (or at least
that particular type of ketone-- there are 4 but the strip only tests
for one) so there is very little excess in your urine. This is
common in folks who don't overeat fat and especially quick to surface
in folks who are going back on lowcarb after a hiatus. Your body
remembers how to do it. Totally normal. (Provided of course that you
are eating less than 100 g carbs a day- including converted protien-
so your body must get calories from fat for basal function).

revek

Hi Revek,

I'm facing the same problem. I was always on moderate-high ketosis all
through my first 3 weeks inspite of *LOTS* of water(started Induction
on 07/26). I stopped losing after the first week (215lbs to 210lbs =
5lbs in the first week).

I cheated a little this weekend (as in went upto about 50gms Carbs
though I intend to be in Induction for a month or two) and shot up to
212 lbs. My ketosis levels have gone down drastically and though I
register high first thing in the morning, it's trace/low throughout
the day, when it was high earlier. I have also stopped losing weight
altogether now and am a 26m, 212lbs, and consume about 1500 calories
consistently of which 65% is fat.

Now to my actual point - I found your explanation about progressively
low Ketone production quite insightful - kinda explains why low levels
of Ketones do not mean lack of Ketosis. Could you explain a little
more about how the body adapts, or point me to a link? I'm getting
frustrated here, with the low weight loss, and periodic lowering of
Ketostix levels. I would love to read further of this phenomenon.

Thanks.

"GillBates" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Now to my actual point - I found your explanation about

progressively

Quoted message said:

low Ketone production quite insightful - kinda explains why low

levels

Quoted message said:

of Ketones do not mean lack of Ketosis. Could you explain a little
more about how the body adapts, or point me to a link?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=6865775&dopt=Abstract

http://www.lowcarb.org/ketosis.html

www.lowcarbresearch.org/lcr/results.asp

I'm getting

Quoted message said:

frustrated here, with the low weight loss, and periodic lowering of
Ketostix levels. I would love to read further of this phenomenon.

As another poster said, ketosis is like being pregnant. You either
are or aren't. Higher numbers don't mean you're burning more fat. It
is merely an indicator that yes indeed you have switched from using
glucose to fat for fuel (the body doesn't "do" both at the same time,
but the switch gets progressively swifter/easier each time you bounce
between the two).

You mention 65% fat, what is your protien percentage? You are aware
that protien converts at up to 58% to carbs, right? Be careful to eat
enough protien for maintaining your current lean muscle mass, but no
more-- or carbs they may become. The prefered order the body uses for
fuel is : alcohol, carbs, protien, then fat. So if you eat too much
protien, your body will prefer to convert it to carbs rather than burn
fat. It would have the same effect of eating too many starch/sugar
carbs-- insulin dump and scrub clean the blood and store all those
calories before you can burn them.

You may wish to cut back on the protien for a bit and add a pat of
butter or seasoned olive oil to your veggies (to make up the calories)
and see if that nudges things along (if you are at all like me and
hate the math).

revek

Drop 41 said:

I bought a bottle of Ketostix a while back and for the past 2 weeks I have
been using them at random times during the day (any time from waking up till
going to bed) They have registered usually "moderate" or "large" (40-80mg)

Common in the first two weeks, but what happens in the first two weeks
does NOT define normal. The first two weeks define abnormal.

Quoted message said:

Suddenly today it's different. No more purple. I did it this morning and it
was "small" so I did it again just now and it's "trace"

Right on schedule. The sticks went from positive (but dark because
that's what happens in the first two weeks) to positive (but light
because that's what normally happens).

Quoted message said:

Now - i am not using this as a serious tool but it was fun to see the
purple. I felt like "hey, it's working" besides seeing the scale go down
and the clothes get looser.

It is a serious tool but it is NOT a race. For ketosis the sticks
are yes/no *only*. Now that they have reached their normal levels
vast amounts of effort will fail to return them to their abnormal
levels of the first two weeks.

Quoted message said:

Should I worry that for some reason there is such a big change? Or disregard
them and not even give it another thought?

Disregard this perfectly normal on schedule event.

Quoted message said:

I didn't do anything differently on the diet (atkins for me)

You should do different. Week 3 starts OWL for the best loss. Staying
low may be "safe" but it safe doesn't mean best loss. Step out in
faith!

"Doug Freyburger" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Drop 41 said:

I bought a bottle of Ketostix a while back and for the past 2 weeks I

have

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

been using them at random times during the day (any time from waking up

till

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

going to bed) They have registered usually "moderate" or "large"

(40-80mg)

Quoted message said:

Common in the first two weeks, but what happens in the first two weeks
does NOT define normal. The first two weeks define abnormal.

Quoted message said:

Suddenly today it's different. No more purple. I did it this morning and

it

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

was "small" so I did it again just now and it's "trace"

Right on schedule. The sticks went from positive (but dark because
that's what happens in the first two weeks) to positive (but light
because that's what normally happens).

Quoted message said:

Now - i am not using this as a serious tool but it was fun to see the
purple. I felt like "hey, it's working" besides seeing the scale go

down

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

and the clothes get looser.

It is a serious tool but it is NOT a race. For ketosis the sticks
are yes/no *only*. Now that they have reached their normal levels
vast amounts of effort will fail to return them to their abnormal
levels of the first two weeks.

Quoted message said:

Should I worry that for some reason there is such a big change? Or

disregard

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

them and not even give it another thought?

Disregard this perfectly normal on schedule event.

Quoted message said:

I didn't do anything differently on the diet (atkins for me)

You should do different. Week 3 starts OWL for the best loss. Staying
low may be "safe" but it safe doesn't mean best loss. Step out in
faith!

I dunno - this way worked for me last time (i lost 30lbs and kept it off for
years until i had children)

Now that I have been at it for a while I will do this a little more.
Besides - the Atkins book specifically states that the Induction phase can
be safely done for longer than 2 weeks if you need to lose a lot of weight.
I would like to lose about 30-40 lbs then maybe go to OWL. My loss hasn't
been too rapid as is now.

Drop 41 said:

Besides - the Atkins book specifically states that the Induction phase can
be safely done for longer than 2 weeks if you need to lose a lot of weight.

Safe isn't the same as best loss. The 4-phase process was designed
to outperform the more obvious staying low. Are you really here to
be "safe", or are you really here to pursue the most effective path
to loss? Are you really here to focus on the obvious, or are you
really here to learn some non-obvious stuff that works even better
than the obvious? The 4-phase process is far from obvious, but it
works extremely well.

And unfortunately the book does not supply a number for what
qualifies as "a lot". As a result everyone lays claim at having a
lot to lose, from the folks already at their ideal weight wanting a
few glamor pounds through folks with 200 to lose. Just claiming
you have a lot to lose doesn't make it so, you need to compare with
a lot of others.

Quoted message said:

I would like to lose about 30-40 lbs then maybe go to OWL.

Looking around you'll see that the folks with a lot to lose have
at least 3 times that much when they start. Realistically, "a
lot" means somewhere in the range of 100+ to lose.

Quoted message said:

My loss hasn't been too rapid as is now.

No one ever thinks they are losing rapidly. Relax. You are doing
fine! Move on to OWL and enjoy the extra variety coupled with the
extra loss. Step out in faith! Phase one worked well, so will
phases two and on.

"revek" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

You mention 65% fat, what is your protien percentage? You are aware
that protien converts at up to 58% to carbs, right? Be careful to eat
enough protien for maintaining your current lean muscle mass, but no
more-- or carbs they may become. The prefered order the body uses for
fuel is : alcohol, carbs, protien, then fat. So if you eat too much
protien, your body will prefer to convert it to carbs rather than burn
fat. It would have the same effect of eating too many starch/sugar
carbs-- insulin dump and scrub clean the blood and store all those
calories before you can burn them.

You may wish to cut back on the protien for a bit and add a pat of
butter or seasoned olive oil to your veggies (to make up the calories)
and see if that nudges things along (if you are at all like me and
hate the math).

revek

Thanks for the information Revek. I'd forgotten again that high
protein is bad too. I usually average about 100gms of Fat, 10-15gms of
Carbs, and the rest is protein. Working back from a total of about
1600 Calories a day, that gives me about 400 Calories from Protein or
40 gms of Protein, which comes to about 25% Protein intake.

To summarize, my breakdown is approx:
65%fat
25%protein
10%carbs
out of a 1500-1600 calorie diet.

Does that look about right?

Thanks in advance.

GillBates generously shared with us this little ditty:

Quoted message said:

To summarize, my breakdown is approx:
65%fat
25%protein
10%carbs
out of a 1500-1600 calorie diet.

If your numbers are correct, that looks fine. Another possibility is
eating once a day/large meals. This can also cause an insulin dump.
Also, and some may dispute this, eating not long before you sleep-- your
metabolism slows down some at that time and it may be enough that you
end up storing most of your calories.

One last thought. It is still quite early at one month. You could be
just a slow loser, or there may be massive tissue changes going on--
have you been measuring yourself as well as weighing?

--
revek
The opinions expressed are mine. Mine alone! Nobody else is
responsible for them or even endorses them--except my cat Dexter, and
he signed the power of attorney only under my threat to cut off his Cat
Chow!--Stan Brown

Thanks yet again. Yes, I read about the possible -ve effects of having
a single heavy meal or eating too late in the day on forum.lowcarb.org
and elsewhere. I try to even out my calories and eat before 7pm as
much as possible. But thanks for emphasizing that.

As for measurement, I'm going to get myself a tape measure this
weekend, a lot of people have told me over the past week that I seem
to have lost weight - though I don't show a lot of difference on the
scale - I seem to have broader shoulders probably due to the workouts
I've been doing. I'll measure myself on mybodycomp.com or something
and post the results here. My jeans definitely feel loser though - I
guess I just find it hard to convince myself that I could be losing
inches instead of weight.

Really appreciate your feedback and advice, Revek. I'm sorry for the
slow responses on my part - this is because I post through the Google
interface to Usenet (groups.google.com) and it takes 6-8 hours for my
message to show up.

Regards.

"revek" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

GillBates generously shared with us this little ditty:

Quoted message said:

To summarize, my breakdown is approx:
65%fat
25%protein
10%carbs
out of a 1500-1600 calorie diet.

If your numbers are correct, that looks fine. Another possibility is
eating once a day/large meals. This can also cause an insulin dump.
Also, and some may dispute this, eating not long before you sleep-- your
metabolism slows down some at that time and it may be enough that you
end up storing most of your calories.

One last thought. It is still quite early at one month. You could be
just a slow loser, or there may be massive tissue changes going on--
have you been measuring yourself as well as weighing?

GillBates generously shared with us this little ditty:

Quoted message said:

Really appreciate your feedback and advice, Revek. I'm sorry for the
slow responses on my part - this is because I post through the Google
interface to Usenet (groups.google.com) and it takes 6-8 hours for my
message to show up.

No sweat. It's not like I sit at the computer all day just waiting for
posts myself these days.

You can use a regular newsreader (OE, Gravity, Navigator, Forte Agent,
etc) and the free german newsserver (www.individual.net) for faster
response time if you like. Takes a couple days to set up but it's
fairly reliable.

--
revek
For the low, LOW price of $19.95 these opinions can be yours too!