Road Cycling · Public discussion

July 13th, 1967

Started by Bob Schwartz · · Last activity · 15 posts · 427 views

Thread navigation

Jump through the discussion

Go to the original post, the replies on this page, or the latest preserved contribution.

Thread details

What we know about this thread

Original section
Road Cycling
Published
13 July 2005
Last activity
17 July 2005
Original author
Bob Schwartz
Posts
15
Discussion status
Public discussion
Total views
427
Views / 30 days
0

The navigation and discussion metadata provide context. Posts remain in their original chronological order.

Showing posts 1–15 of 15
Posts remain in their original chronological order.

Text size
  1. The day began in Marseille with Roger Pingeon in yellow. It
    was hot. Colin Lewis of the British team said, "Nobody who
    wasn't there that day could imagine how hot it was."

    Tom Simpson was the leader of that British team. He was a
    former World Champion and the first British rider to wear
    the yellow jersey. He was sitting in 7th place.

    The stage went to Carpentras over Mont Ventoux. Simpson
    was one of the first riders out of the trees and onto the
    exposed slope. He weakened near the top, and he was left
    behind by the leading group. He started weaving across
    the road. Eventually he fell over, and abandoned the Tour.
    There were three tubes in his jersey pockets. One contained
    amphetamines. The other two were empty.

    There are several routes from which to approach the mountain.
    Probably the least traveled is the way from Sault to the
    southeast. If you go that way you will pass through lavender
    fields, and you will see lavender growing on the lower slopes
    of the mountain. If you are fortunate enough to experience
    freshly harvested lavender you will think that this is a
    place of exceptional peace and beauty.

    The place where Simpson fell is hard. It is dry, windswept,
    barren. Lavender does not grow there.

    I would like to think that Simpson's spirit, once freed from
    the pressures that destroyed him, went down the mountain to
    lie for a while in a field of lavender.

    Bob Schwartz
    [email hidden]

  2. "Bob Schwartz" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    The day began in Marseille with Roger Pingeon in yellow. It
    was hot. Colin Lewis of the British team said, "Nobody who
    wasn't there that day could imagine how hot it was."

    Tom Simpson was the leader of that British team. He was a
    former World Champion and the first British rider to wear
    the yellow jersey. He was sitting in 7th place.

    The stage went to Carpentras over Mont Ventoux. Simpson
    was one of the first riders out of the trees and onto the
    exposed slope. He weakened near the top, and he was left
    behind by the leading group. He started weaving across
    the road. Eventually he fell over, and abandoned the Tour.
    There were three tubes in his jersey pockets. One contained
    amphetamines. The other two were empty.

    There are several routes from which to approach the mountain.
    Probably the least traveled is the way from Sault to the
    southeast. If you go that way you will pass through lavender
    fields, and you will see lavender growing on the lower slopes
    of the mountain. If you are fortunate enough to experience
    freshly harvested lavender you will think that this is a
    place of exceptional peace and beauty.

    The place where Simpson fell is hard. It is dry, windswept,
    barren. Lavender does not grow there.

    I would like to think that Simpson's spirit, once freed from
    the pressures that destroyed him, went down the mountain to
    lie for a while in a field of lavender.

    Bob Schwartz
    [email hidden]

    Wow. It is amazing that such an aniverserary can pass without mention from
    the media. Maybe it's a good thing as Simpson was found to be using
    amphetamines which contributed to his death...in other words a cheater and
    not a champion. Celebrate the champions and forget the cheats. Sad, perhaps,
    but for the better I think.

    Laz

  3. Laz said:

    Simpson was found to be using amphetamines [...] in other words a cheater

    No cheater. There were no banned substances back then. But yes, it
    probably did contribute to his death, together with the alcohol, heat and
    exhaustion.

    --
    Firefox Browser - Rediscover the web - http://getffox.com/
    Thunderbird E-mail and Newsgroups - http://gettbird.com/

  4. "Ewoud Dronkert" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Laz said:

    Simpson was found to be using amphetamines [...] in other words a cheater

    No cheater. There were no banned substances back then. But yes, it
    probably did contribute to his death, together with the alcohol, heat and
    exhaustion.

    I'm afraid there were already banned substances in 1967. A year before
    riders woke up to discover tot their dismay that politicians whitout any
    knwoledge of bicycls racing had decided that the use of amphetamine - which
    almost everybody did - wasn't allowed anymore. On 28 june 1966 the use of
    doping in the Tour de France was for the first time in history officially
    tested. Six riders were tested, they were all positif, except Poulidor and
    futur winner Lucien Aimar. Unfortunately the samples of these two superstars
    were "lost". That's how riders learned what "cheating" meant.

    Benjo

  5. "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> wrote

    <snip>

    Welcome back!

  6. benjo maso said:

    I'm afraid there were already banned substances in 1967. [...]

    Argh, I thought they instated a list of banned substances after Simpson´s
    death.

    Good to see you posting again.

  7. benjo maso said:

    "Ewoud Dronkert" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Laz said:

    Simpson was found to be using amphetamines [...] in other words a cheater

    No cheater. There were no banned substances back then. But yes, it
    probably did contribute to his death, together with the alcohol, heat and
    exhaustion.

    I'm afraid there were already banned substances in 1967. A year before
    riders woke up to discover tot their dismay that politicians whitout any
    knwoledge of bicycls racing had decided that the use of amphetamine - which
    almost everybody did - wasn't allowed anymore. On 28 june 1966 the use of
    doping in the Tour de France was for the first time in history officially
    tested. Six riders were tested, they were all positif, except Poulidor and
    futur winner Lucien Aimar. Unfortunately the samples of these two superstars
    were "lost". That's how riders learned what "cheating" meant.

    Benjo

    What I wouldn't give to have you on the TV instead of Roll--clothes or not.

    Steve

    --
    Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
    http://www.dentaltwins.com
    Brooklyn, NY
    718-258-5001

  8. "Ewoud Dronkert" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    benjo maso said:

    I'm afraid there were already banned substances in 1967. [...]

    Argh, I thought they instated a list of banned substances after Simpson´s
    death.

    No, but it's true that it was only thanks to Simpson's death that doping
    tests became well established. Before 1966 they were officially only part of
    a general health check up. According to Jean-Marie Leblanc the immediate
    result of those new doping tests was that the Tour of 1968 (in which he
    participated) was really clean. He was completely wrong of course.

    Benjo

  9. Laz said:
    Bob Schwartz said:

    The day began in Marseille with Roger Pingeon in yellow. It
    was hot. Colin Lewis of the British team said, "Nobody who
    wasn't there that day could imagine how hot it was."

    Quoted message said:

    Wow. It is amazing that such an aniverserary can pass without mention from
    the media. Maybe it's a good thing as Simpson was found to be using
    amphetamines which contributed to his death...in other words a cheater and
    not a champion. Celebrate the champions and forget the cheats. Sad, perhaps,
    but for the better I think.

    If you're against doping because you think it can be
    damaging to the riders' health, forgetting and pretending
    its most famous victim never existed isn't much of a
    strategy.

    Sometimes, champion and cheater are not mutually exclusive.
    Few people are all good or all bad. Forget that and you are
    doomed to not understand people's motivations.

    Ben

  10. <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Laz said:
    Bob Schwartz said:

    The day began in Marseille with Roger Pingeon in yellow. It
    was hot. Colin Lewis of the British team said, "Nobody who
    wasn't there that day could imagine how hot it was."

    Quoted message said:

    Wow. It is amazing that such an aniverserary can pass without mention


    from

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    the media. Maybe it's a good thing as Simpson was found to be using
    amphetamines which contributed to his death...in other words a cheater


    and

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    not a champion. Celebrate the champions and forget the cheats. Sad,


    perhaps,

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    but for the better I think.

    If you're against doping because you think it can be
    damaging to the riders' health, forgetting and pretending
    its most famous victim never existed isn't much of a
    strategy.

    Sometimes, champion and cheater are not mutually exclusive.
    Few people are all good or all bad. Forget that and you are
    doomed to not understand people's motivations.

    Ben

    well put wisdom. but...a lot of kids look up to dead rock stars, part of
    their glory is how they died ( OD ). tell a kid at 16 that if he keeps it up
    he'll be dead at 30 and the kid thinks that's further ahead than he can
    remember so the importance gets lost. most of us here are mature enough to
    know about poor tom simpson, so that doesn't apply here so much- but there
    are lots of examples of cheats out there, and the best example are those
    that simply got booted out of the sport for cheating, so we can still wave
    bye-bye to poor tom.

    Laz

  11. benjo maso wrote

    Quoted message said:

    <snip>

    Geraard Spergen said:

    Welcome back!

    Seconded.

  12. On Wed, 13 Jul 2005 03:49:02 -0000,

    Bob Schwartz said:


    There are several routes from which to approach the mountain.
    Probably the least traveled is the way from Sault to the
    southeast. If you go that way you will pass through lavender
    fields, and you will see lavender growing on the lower slopes
    of the mountain. If you are fortunate enough to experience
    freshly harvested lavender you will think that this is a
    place of exceptional peace and beauty.

    The place where Simpson fell is hard. It is dry, windswept,
    barren. Lavender does not grow there.

    I would like to think that Simpson's spirit, once freed from
    the pressures that destroyed him, went down the mountain to
    lie for a while in a field of lavender.

    Beautiful post, thanks.

    --
    Theodore (Ted) Heise <[email hidden]> Bloomington, IN, USA

  13. benjo maso said:

    No, but it's true that it was only thanks to Simpson's death that doping
    tests became well established. Before 1966 they were officially only part of
    a general health check up. According to Jean-Marie Leblanc the immediate
    result of those new doping tests was that the Tour of 1968 (in which he
    participated) was really clean. He was completely wrong of course.

    Well, hurrah! you're posting; here's hoping you're doing so with
    increasing comfort(!!!).

    We know a little (maybe) about Tommy Simpson's death (perhaps he was
    slighted in view of the upcoming Stage 15?), but what about other
    riders of earlier times? Compared to EPO, how "dangerous" was the
    doping of yore? --TP

  14. On 07/16/2005 11:06 PM, in article
    [email hidden], "[email hidden]"

    Quoted message said:
    benjo maso said:

    No, but it's true that it was only thanks to Simpson's death that doping
    tests became well established. Before 1966 they were officially only part of
    a general health check up. According to Jean-Marie Leblanc the immediate
    result of those new doping tests was that the Tour of 1968 (in which he
    participated) was really clean. He was completely wrong of course.

    Well, hurrah! you're posting; here's hoping you're doing so with
    increasing comfort(!!!).

    We know a little (maybe) about Tommy Simpson's death (perhaps he was
    slighted in view of the upcoming Stage 15?), but what about other
    riders of earlier times? Compared to EPO, how "dangerous" was the
    doping of yore? --TP

    Strychnine, chloroform, cocaine, heroin, ether ...

    It was far more dangerous.

    --
    Steven L. Sheffield
    stevens at veloworks dot com
    bellum pax est libertas servitus est ignoratio vis est
    ess ay ell tea ell ay kay ee sea eye tee why you ti ay aitch
    aitch tee tea pea colon [for word] slash [four ward] slash double-you
    double-yew double-ewe dot veloworks dot com [foreword] slash

  15. epoSteven L. Sheffield" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On 07/16/2005 11:06 PM, in article
    [email hidden],
    "[email hidden]"

    Quoted message said:
    benjo maso said:

    No, but it's true that it was only thanks to Simpson's death that doping
    tests became well established. Before 1966 they were officially only
    part of
    a general health check up. According to Jean-Marie Leblanc the immediate
    result of those new doping tests was that the Tour of 1968 (in which he
    participated) was really clean. He was completely wrong of course.

    Well, hurrah! you're posting; here's hoping you're doing so with
    increasing comfort(!!!).

    We know a little (maybe) about Tommy Simpson's death (perhaps he was
    slighted in view of the upcoming Stage 15?), but what about other
    riders of earlier times? Compared to EPO, how "dangerous" was the
    doping of yore? --TP

    Strychnine, chloroform, cocaine, heroin, ether ...

    It was far more dangerous.

    Depends. The main danger has never been the products, but they way they were
    used. Of course, strychnine or arsenic are very risky, but they knew it and
    used it al,ost always in very small doses. Amphetamine was more dangerous,
    in the fist place for it's effects on long term (risk of heart failure). Epo
    was especially dangerous because almost nobody knew about the possible
    effects, just because they had to take secretely. Of course, there were
    already several doctors who knew a lot about it, especially in Italy, but
    they were difficult to consult and expensive and in the years epo was
    introduced in the sports (1987-1990) a lot of riders were just experimenting
    knowing nothing, with several tragic results.

    Benjo

Active in the last 60 minutes

Active in this thread

0 users · 0 guests ·0 bots ·0 total

No signed-in users are active right now.

No known search crawlers active right now.