It's Not Me

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
| It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
|
| "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the press is
| upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."
|
|

In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns were
directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until today, it
hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during a monolog.
It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong said the
French football team were [censored]."

Here's the direct url-

"trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
| "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| [email hidden]...
|| It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
||
|| "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the press is
|| upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."
||
||
|
| In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns were
| directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until today,
it
| hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during a
monolog.
| It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong said the
| French football team were [censored]."
|
|

|
|

"trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
| It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
|
| "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the press is
| upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."
|
|

In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns were
directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until today,
it
hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during a
monolog.
It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong said the
French football team were [censored]."

Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston Churchill
used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess what kind
of people are making racist jokes.

Benjo

"trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
| It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
|
| "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the press is
| upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."
|
|

In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns were
directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until today,
it
hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during a
monolog.
It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong said the
French football team were [censored]."

You're a rather poor apologist for the UberAssHole. He wasn't forced to say
the joke. You don't think if he had said no, they would have inserted
aother in the monologue? Anyway, it was reported in context in France, that
is, That it was said during an awards ceremony:

Tous leurs joueurs ont testé positif... au fait d'être des trous du cul", a
déclaré Armstrong à propos des Bleus, lors de l'enregistrement d'une
cérémonie de remise de prix sportifs qui doit être diffusée sur la chaîne
sportive ESPN dimanche, selon le "Los Angeles Daily News".

Ces propos intervenaient parmi plusieurs remarques sarcastiques dont
Armstrong s'est fendu en qualité d'hôte de la cérémonie. Mais à la question
de savoir s'il n'avait pas été un peu loin à l'encontre des Français,
l'ancien champion a assuré après l'enregistrement que "s'ils (les Français)
vivaient avec moi et m'entendaient à la maison, ils sauraient que c'était le
niveau en dessous".

http://fr.sports.yahoo.com/16072006/29/lance-armstrong-tra-te-les-bleus-de-trous-du.html

Also:

Ces propos intervenaient parmi plusieurs remarques sarcastiques dont
Armstrong s'est fendu en qualité d'hôte de la cérémonie. Mais à la question
de savoir s'il n'avait pas été un peu loin à l'encontre des Français,
l'ancien champion a assuré après l'enregistrement que "s'ils (les Français)
vivaient avec moi et m'entendaient à la maison, ils sauraient que c'était le
niveau en dessous".
http://permanent.nouvelobs.com/cgi/edition/qobs_imprime?cle=20060716.OBS5240

Lance Armstrong, ce n'est pas un secret de polichinelle, nourrit à l'égard
de la France et des organisateurs du Tour en particulier un sentiment de
haine manifeste. Non, il n'a pas apprécié du tout que le pays l'ayant vu
ressusciter sur son vélo le traite de la sorte après ses exploits à
répétition. On l'a donc vu évoquer, pendant un an sur les plateaux de
télévision américains, le dopage, le cyclisme, la France, et dernière sortie
en date, la semaine dernière : l'équipe de France de football. Avec à chaque
fois cette similitude : l'agressivité de ses propos à l'égard de la France.

Pour évoquer les faits, Lance Armstrong aurait lancé, la semaine dernière,
dans une émission sur la chaîne câblée ESPN : «Tous les joueurs de l'équipe
de France de football ont été testés positifs.comme étant des trous du cul».
Pas besoin de disserter dessus, donc, pour comprendre que Lance Armstrong n'a
plus vraiment d'amour pour un pays qu'il jugeait autrefois comme sa seconde
maison. Dans le même style, il avait notamment déclaré : «Si je revenais sur
le Tour, ce serait le meilleur moyen d'emmerder les Français.»

Sources AFP

http://gametefemelle.typepad.com/nobrain/s_h_o_r_t_n_a_w_a_k/

On Tue, 18 Jul 2006 11:43:50 GMT, "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:

"It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the press is
upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."

I'm glad "my" UberAssHole is picking up speed !

I watched the monologue

this is shamefule but what can you do...I hope Texas has better stuff
in store for the future...

"benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| news:[email hidden]...
| > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > |
| > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the press is
| > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."
| > |
| > |
| >
| > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns were
| > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until
today,
| > it
| > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during a
| > monolog.
| > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong said the
| > French football team were [censored]."
|
|
| Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
Churchill
| used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess what kind
| of people are making racist jokes.
|
| Benjo
|

Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against les Bleus.
It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract), but one
which our society has no place for.

The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of a show
of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly non-white
but because Zidane headbutted an opponent

Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but that's
probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a different
view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world. But the
way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.

B. Lafferty said:

It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:

"It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the press is
upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."

Not a very good show. Lance is in no threat to Leno much less any good stand up.
But it was a show, someone needs to grow a sense of humor.

Do the french do stand up?

Ron

"trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| news:[email hidden]...
| > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > |
| > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the press
is
| > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."
| > |
| > |
| >
| > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns were
| > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until
today,
| > it
| > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during a
| > monolog.
| > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong said
the
| > French football team were [censored]."
|
|
| Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
Churchill
| used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess what
kind
| of people are making racist jokes.
|
| Benjo
|

Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against les
Bleus.
It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract), but
one
which our society has no place for.

The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of a
show
of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly non-white
but because Zidane headbutted an opponent

Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but that's
probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a different
view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world. But the
way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.

I desagree.
There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I even could
agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].

In what the remark portrayed here in France is a distortion ?

<Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| [email hidden]...
| > "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > |
| > | "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > | news:[email hidden]...
| > | > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > | > |
| > | > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the
press
| > is
| > | > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns
were
| > | > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until
| > today,
| > | > it
| > | > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during a
| > | > monolog.
| > | > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong said
| > the
| > | > French football team were [censored]."
| > |
| > |
| > | Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
| > Churchill
| > | used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess what
| > kind
| > | of people are making racist jokes.
| > |
| > | Benjo
| > |
| >
| > Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against les
| > Bleus.
| > It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract), but
| > one
| > which our society has no place for.
| >
| > The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of a
| > show
| > of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly
non-white
| > but because Zidane headbutted an opponent
| >
| > Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
| >
| > I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but
that's
| > probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a different
| > view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world. But
the
| > way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.
| >
| >
|
| I desagree.
| There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I even
could
| agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].
|

For better or worse, for the majority of Americans, Zidane IS l'equipe de
France. He's the only player whose name they've ever heard and the only
thing they know about him is the headbutt. This is a frigging sports show
and the presenter is telling jokes about sports and sports figures. He's
making fun of probably the most significant thing to happen during the World
Cup. Not making a declaration of his feelings.

But perhaps you're right. After all, the class of Barthez I'm sure more than
makes up for Zizou's character defaults 🙂

"trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| [email hidden]...
| > "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > |
| > | "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > | news:[email hidden]...
| > | > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > | > |
| > | > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the
press
| > is
| > | > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the
show."
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns
were
| > | > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until
| > today,
| > | > it
| > | > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during
a
| > | > monolog.
| > | > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong
said
| > the
| > | > French football team were [censored]."
| > |
| > |
| > | Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
| > Churchill
| > | used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess
what
| > kind
| > | of people are making racist jokes.
| > |
| > | Benjo
| > |
| >
| > Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against les
| > Bleus.
| > It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract),
but
| > one
| > which our society has no place for.
| >
| > The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of a
| > show
| > of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly
non-white
| > but because Zidane headbutted an opponent
| >
| > Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
| >
| > I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but
that's
| > probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a
different
| > view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world. But
the
| > way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.
| >
| >
|
| I desagree.
| There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I even
could
| agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].
|

For better or worse, for the majority of Americans, Zidane IS l'equipe de
France.

?????

For Americans, French, Spanish, Italian aso, Zidane is "someone", and not a
country.

He's the only player whose name they've ever heard and the only

Quoted message said:

thing they know about him is the headbutt. This is a frigging sports show
and the presenter is telling jokes about sports and sports figures. He's
making fun of probably the most significant thing to happen during the
World
Cup. Not making a declaration of his feelings.

Come on ! Sorry but we don't buy it.
He insulted France and not Zidane alone.

Are you aware of something called "French Bashing" in the USA ?

As correctly remembered the NYT :

"No other national or ethnic group appears to get the same continually
negative treatment in print media reserved for France and the French, with
the possible exception of Arabs or Palestinians, and even there, the
treatment is not so much cultural as political, linked to a specific context
or event. If one were to substitute, for example, "Mexican" or "Japanese" or
"Indian" for "French", what would reader reaction be?".

Excuse, mais non seulement Lance s'est montré grotesque, ridicule et
haineux, de plus incapable d'assumer ses dires ...quel manque de courage

Quoted message said:

But perhaps you're right. After all, the class of Barthez I'm sure more
than
makes up for Zizou's character defaults 🙂

"trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| [email hidden]...
| > "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > |
| > | "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > | news:[email hidden]...
| > | > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > | > |
| > | > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the
press
| > is
| > | > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the
show."
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns
were
| > | > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until
| > today,
| > | > it
| > | > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during
a
| > | > monolog.
| > | > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong
said
| > the
| > | > French football team were [censored]."
| > |
| > |
| > | Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
| > Churchill
| > | used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess
what
| > kind
| > | of people are making racist jokes.
| > |
| > | Benjo
| > |
| >
| > Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against les
| > Bleus.
| > It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract),
but
| > one
| > which our society has no place for.
| >
| > The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of a
| > show
| > of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly
non-white
| > but because Zidane headbutted an opponent
| >
| > Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
| >
| > I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but
that's
| > probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a
different
| > view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world. But
the
| > way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.
| >
| >
|
| I desagree.
| There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I even
could
| agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].
|

For better or worse, for the majority of Americans, Zidane IS l'equipe de
France. He's the only player whose name they've ever heard and the only
thing they know about him is the headbutt. This is a frigging sports show
and the presenter is telling jokes about sports and sports figures. He's
making fun of probably the most significant thing to happen during the
World
Cup. Not making a declaration of his feelings.

But perhaps you're right. After all, the class of Barthez I'm sure more
than
makes up for Zizou's character defaults 🙂

The feeling that a group, a categorie, a nation, etc., is inferior is
usually based or maintained on the assumption that the worst behaviour of
one of it's members is representative of the category as a whole, while the
best behaviour of one of the members of their own group is representative
for all of them. Ergo: the fact that Armstrong is suggesting that the
misconduct of one of the French players is means that all of them are
[censored], indicates more or less his opinion of the French team as a whole,
and since it is representing the French nation, one can hardly be surprised
that the French may think that Armstrong has a very low opinion of them.
Which of course is his right, although just before visiting France it would
have been better to mask it a little or at least to present it with a
somewhat better taste.

Benjo

<Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| [email hidden]...
| > "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > |
| > | "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > | news:[email hidden]...
| > | > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > | > |
| > | > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the
press
| > is
| > | > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the show."
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns
were
| > | > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until
| > today,
| > | > it
| > | > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during a
| > | > monolog.
| > | > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong said
| > the
| > | > French football team were [censored]."
| > |
| > |
| > | Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
| > Churchill
| > | used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess what
| > kind
| > | of people are making racist jokes.
| > |
| > | Benjo
| > |
| >
| > Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against les
| > Bleus.
| > It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract), but
| > one
| > which our society has no place for.
| >
| > The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of a
| > show
| > of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly
non-white
| > but because Zidane headbutted an opponent
| >
| > Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
| >
| > I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but
that's
| > probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a different
| > view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world. But
the
| > way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.
| >
| >
|
| I desagree.
| There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I even
could
| agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].
|
| In what the remark portrayed here in France is a distortion ?
|
|

Yes. Here's what l'Equipe wrote, which was pretty much the same as all the
other new outlets-

Interrogé dans une émission de télévision qui doit être diffusée dimanche
aux Etats-Unis, Armstrong s'en est pris de manière assez virulente aux
joueurs de l'équipe de France de football. «Tous leurs joueurs ont été
testés positifs... comme étant des trous-du-cul» a-t-il déclaré lors de
l'interview.

It was not an interview. That's not a distortion, that's just wrong. It was
a joke in a monologue of a Sports award show. Not indicating that is like
stating that Jonathan Swift said that the English should eat Irish babies
(which is what he wrote in A Modest Proposal) without indicate that the
remark was said as satire.

When it's reported using words like "L'Américain accuse", "l'Américain
affirme", "a attaqué Armstrong," "s'est expliqué le septuple vainqueur de la
Grande Boucle...", "a déclaré Armstrong ", and never reported as a blague,
much less giving an idea of the environment in which it was said, it is a
distortion.

"trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

<Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| [email hidden]...
| > "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de
| > news: [email hidden]...
| > |
| > | "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > | news:[email hidden]...
| > | > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de
| > | > news: [email hidden]...
| > | > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > | > |
| > | > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the
press
| > is
| > | > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the
| > | > | show."
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two
| > | > putdowns
were
| > | > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least
| > | > until
| > today,
| > | > it
| > | > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said
| > | > during a monolog.
| > | > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong
| > | > said
| > the
| > | > French football team were [censored]."
| > |
| > |
| > | Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
| > Churchill
| > | used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess
| > | what
| > kind
| > | of people are making racist jokes.
| > |
| > | Benjo
| > |
| >
| > Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against
| > les Bleus.
| > It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to
| > contract), but one
| > which our society has no place for.
| >
| > The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context
| > of a show
| > of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly
non-white
| > but because Zidane headbutted an opponent
| >
| > Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
| >
| > I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but
that's
| > probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a
| > different view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of
| > the world. But
the
| > way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.
| >
| >
|
| I desagree.
| There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I
| even
could
| agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].
|

For better or worse, for the majority of Americans, Zidane IS l'equipe
de France.

I always thought that 'stupid bigotry' is a pleonasm, but Armstrong has
proven that there exists, indeed, an especially moronic kind.

"trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| [email hidden]...
| > "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > |
| > | "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > | news:[email hidden]...
| > | > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > | > |
| > | > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the
press
| > is
| > | > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the
show."
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns
were
| > | > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until
| > today,
| > | > it
| > | > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during
a
| > | > monolog.
| > | > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong
said
| > the
| > | > French football team were [censored]."
| > |
| > |
| > | Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
| > Churchill
| > | used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess
what
| > kind
| > | of people are making racist jokes.
| > |
| > | Benjo
| > |
| >
| > Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against les
| > Bleus.
| > It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract),
but
| > one
| > which our society has no place for.
| >
| > The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of a
| > show
| > of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly
non-white
| > but because Zidane headbutted an opponent
| >
| > Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
| >
| > I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but
that's
| > probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a
different
| > view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world. But
the
| > way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.
| >
| >
|
| I desagree.
| There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I even
could
| agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].
|
| In what the remark portrayed here in France is a distortion ?
|
|

Yes. Here's what l'Equipe wrote, which was pretty much the same as all
the
other new outlets-

Interrogé dans une émission de télévision qui doit être diffusée dimanche
aux Etats-Unis, Armstrong s'en est pris de manière assez virulente aux
joueurs de l'équipe de France de football. «Tous leurs joueurs ont été
testés positifs... comme étant des trous-du-cul» a-t-il déclaré lors de
l'interview.

It was not an interview. That's not a distortion, that's just wrong.

It is worst. In an interview you can say something that you later regret.
It can be said during an agressive interview.
The fact that it was not an interview, but a wise insult show the way Lance
is.

It was

Quoted message said:

a joke in a monologue of a Sports award show. Not indicating that is like
stating that Jonathan Swift said that the English should eat Irish babies
(which is what he wrote in A Modest Proposal) without indicate that the
remark was said as satire.

When it's reported using words like "L'Américain accuse", "l'Américain
affirme", "a attaqué Armstrong," "s'est expliqué le septuple vainqueur de
la
Grande Boucle...", "a déclaré Armstrong ", and never reported as a
blague,
much less giving an idea of the environment in which it was said, it is a
distortion.

For me it is not distortion. He said "[censored]", correctly translated in the
french news papers as "trouduc" .

trg said:

stating that Jonathan Swift said that the English should eat Irish babies
(which is what he wrote in A Modest Proposal) without indicate that the
remark was said as satire.

I thought we had already established that eating babies was banned by
WADA due to the performance enhancing effects of their stem cells.

"benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| news:[email hidden]...
| > <Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > |
| > | "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | [email hidden]...
| > | > "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > |
| > | > | "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > | > | news:[email hidden]...
| > | > | > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de
news:
| > | > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > | > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > | > | > |
| > | > | > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the
| > press
| > | > is
| > | > | > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the
| > show."
| > | > | > |
| > | > | > |
| > | > | >
| > | > | > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two
putdowns
| > were
| > | > | > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least
until
| > | > today,
| > | > | > it
| > | > | > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said
during
| > a
| > | > | > monolog.
| > | > | > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong
| > said
| > | > the
| > | > | > French football team were [censored]."
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | > | Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
| > | > Churchill
| > | > | used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess
| > what
| > | > kind
| > | > | of people are making racist jokes.
| > | > |
| > | > | Benjo
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against
les
| > | > Bleus.
| > | > It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract),
| > but
| > | > one
| > | > which our society has no place for.
| > | >
| > | > The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of
a
| > | > show
| > | > of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly
| > non-white
| > | > but because Zidane headbutted an opponent
| > | >
| > | > Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
| > | >
| > | > I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but
| > that's
| > | > probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a
| > different
| > | > view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world.
But
| > the
| > | > way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.
| > | >
| > | >
| > |
| > | I desagree.
| > | There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I even
| > could
| > | agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].
| > |
| >
| > For better or worse, for the majority of Americans, Zidane IS l'equipe
de
| > France. He's the only player whose name they've ever heard and the only
| > thing they know about him is the headbutt. This is a frigging sports
show
| > and the presenter is telling jokes about sports and sports figures. He's
| > making fun of probably the most significant thing to happen during the
| > World
| > Cup. Not making a declaration of his feelings.
| >
| > But perhaps you're right. After all, the class of Barthez I'm sure more
| > than
| > makes up for Zizou's character defaults 🙂
|
| The feeling that a group, a categorie, a nation, etc., is inferior is
| usually based or maintained on the assumption that the worst behaviour of
| one of it's members is representative of the category as a whole, while
the
| best behaviour of one of the members of their own group is representative
| for all of them. Ergo: the fact that Armstrong is suggesting that the
| misconduct of one of the French players is means that all of them are
| [censored], indicates more or less his opinion of the French team as a
whole,
| and since it is representing the French nation, one can hardly be
surprised
| that the French may think that Armstrong has a very low opinion of them.
| Which of course is his right, although just before visiting France it
would
| have been better to mask it a little or at least to present it with a
| somewhat better taste.
|
| Benjo
|
|

By that reasoning, joking that Chirac is an [censored] is equivalant to saying
that the French are [censored], since as President of the Republique he
represents France and the French (even more than les Bleus. And joking that
the Eiffel Tower is a big [censored] is saying that France (or the French) is a
[censored] because it also represents for some France and the French people. And
all the French that insulted Bush (not even joking) were insulting Americans
in general.

I don't buy it.

I'm not "surprised" that the remark was taken as it was. But I'm
disappointed that is was consistantly (without exception) distorted. As the
joke itself, that misrepresentation helps no one.

"B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> wrote...

Quoted message said:

You're a rather poor apologist for the UberAssHole.

Typical ad hominem [censored]. Has nothing to do with his argument.

Quoted message said:

He wasn't forced to say the joke. You don't think if he had said no, they
would have inserted aother in the monologue? Anyway, it was reported in
context in France, that is, That it was said during an awards ceremony:

It was a joke in the context of humour. The crowd responded in kind. Had it
been a gay joke or a black joke, the PC in them would have responded
differently. You and Montesquiou can get your shorts tied in a bunch if you
like, but [censored] on you if can't take a joke. Some of the humour that makes
me laugh hardest on those rare moments when I watch South Park is the
religious humour.

-- Snippy the Wunderkind

<Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| [email hidden]...
| > <Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > |
| > | "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | [email hidden]...
| > | > "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > |
| > | > | "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > | > | news:[email hidden]...
| > | > | > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de
news:
| > | > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > | > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > | > | > |
| > | > | > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the
| > press
| > | > is
| > | > | > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the
| > show."
| > | > | > |
| > | > | > |
| > | > | >
| > | > | > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two
putdowns
| > were
| > | > | > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least
until
| > | > today,
| > | > | > it
| > | > | > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said
during
| > a
| > | > | > monolog.
| > | > | > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong
| > said
| > | > the
| > | > | > French football team were [censored]."
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | > | Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
| > | > Churchill
| > | > | used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess
| > what
| > | > kind
| > | > | of people are making racist jokes.
| > | > |
| > | > | Benjo
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against
les
| > | > Bleus.
| > | > It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract),
| > but
| > | > one
| > | > which our society has no place for.
| > | >
| > | > The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of
a
| > | > show
| > | > of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly
| > non-white
| > | > but because Zidane headbutted an opponent
| > | >
| > | > Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
| > | >
| > | > I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but
| > that's
| > | > probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a
| > different
| > | > view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world.
But
| > the
| > | > way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.
| > | >
| > | >
| > |
| > | I desagree.
| > | There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I even
| > could
| > | agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].
| > |
| > | In what the remark portrayed here in France is a distortion ?
| > |
| > |
| >
| > Yes. Here's what l'Equipe wrote, which was pretty much the same as all
| > the
| > other new outlets-
| >
| > Interrogé dans une émission de télévision qui doit être diffusée
dimanche
| > aux Etats-Unis, Armstrong s'en est pris de manière assez virulente aux
| > joueurs de l'équipe de France de football. «Tous leurs joueurs ont été
| > testés positifs... comme étant des trous-du-cul» a-t-il déclaré lors de
| > l'interview.
| >
| > It was not an interview. That's not a distortion, that's just wrong.
|
| It is worst. In an interview you can say something that you later regret.
| It can be said during an agressive interview.
| The fact that it was not an interview, but a wise insult show the way
Lance
| is.
|
|
| It was
| > a joke in a monologue of a Sports award show. Not indicating that is
like
| > stating that Jonathan Swift said that the English should eat Irish
babies
| > (which is what he wrote in A Modest Proposal) without indicate that the
| > remark was said as satire.
| >
| > When it's reported using words like "L'Américain accuse", "l'Américain
| > affirme", "a attaqué Armstrong," "s'est expliqué le septuple vainqueur
de
| > la
| > Grande Boucle...", "a déclaré Armstrong ", and never reported as a
| > blague,
| > much less giving an idea of the environment in which it was said, it is
a
| > distortion.
| >
| >
|
| For me it is not distortion. He said "[censored]", correctly translated in
the
| french news papers as "trouduc" .
|
|
|

It's a distortion of meaning, which is more serious than mistranslating a
phrase, which could be excused by incompetance. What's important in
reporting is that the readers understand the meaning, not that they have the
most faithful traslation word for word.

And attributing it to an interview is as I said a serious distortion by the
french press for which you haver no answer.

Montesquiou said:

"trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

<Montesquiou> a écrit dans le message de news:
[email hidden]...
|
| "trg" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| [email hidden]...
| > "benjo maso" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > [email hidden]...
| > |
| > | "trg" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
| > | news:[email hidden]...
| > | > "B. Lafferty" <[email hidden]> a écrit dans le message de news:
| > | > [email hidden]...
| > | > | It's always them. UberAssHole quoted on Eurosport:
| > | > |
| > | > | "It's a little bit funny, it's a little bit serious... if the
press
| > is
| > | > | upset, they don't understand the point... it's part of the
show."
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | > In this case he's right. In his monologue, his first two putdowns
were
| > | > directed at himself. I can say that here in France, at least until
| > today,
| > | > it
| > | > hadn't been reported that his statement was a joke he said during
a
| > | > monolog.
| > | > It was just reported that "during an interview, Lance Armstrong
said
| > the
| > | > French football team were [censored]."
| > |
| > |
| > | Of course it was a joke, and of course it was serious. As Winston
| > Churchill
| > | used to say: a joke is a very serious thing. For instance, guess
what
| > kind
| > | of people are making racist jokes.
| > |
| > | Benjo
| > |
| >
| > Yes, very serious. This is proof that Armstrong is biased against les
| > Bleus.
| > It's a very rare sickness (especially for a non-French to contract),
but
| > one
| > which our society has no place for.
| >
| > The remark was about a team of football players. Said the context of a
| > show
| > of, by, and for athletes. Not because they are French, or mainly
non-white
| > but because Zidane headbutted an opponent
| >
| > Churchill liked his cigars. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
| >
| > I'm not defending the joke. Personally I didn't find it funny, but
that's
| > probably partly because I live in France and I probably have a
different
| > view on Zidane and what he did then much of the rest of the world. But
the
| > way the remark has been portrayed here in France is a distortion.
| >
| >
|
| I desagree.
| There is a difference between to say that Zidane is an [censored] (I even
could
| agree with him), and calling the Bleus ( those the French) [censored].
|

For better or worse, for the majority of Americans, Zidane IS l'equipe de
France.

?????

For Americans, French, Spanish, Italian aso, Zidane is "someone", and not a
country.

He's the only player whose name they've ever heard and the only

Quoted message said:

thing they know about him is the headbutt. This is a frigging sports show
and the presenter is telling jokes about sports and sports figures. He's
making fun of probably the most significant thing to happen during the
World
Cup. Not making a declaration of his feelings.

Come on ! Sorry but we don't buy it.
He insulted France and not Zidane alone.

Are you aware of something called "French Bashing" in the USA ?

As correctly remembered the NYT :

"No other national or ethnic group appears to get the same continually
negative treatment in print media reserved for France and the French, with
the possible exception of Arabs or Palestinians, and even there, the
treatment is not so much cultural as political, linked to a specific context
or event. If one were to substitute, for example, "Mexican" or "Japanese" or
"Indian" for "French", what would reader reaction be?".

Y'all need to get ovah y'selves.

Ron