In preparation for winter.....

"Flat Earth Society" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Any recommendations with respect to kit and/or walks for a walkers first

winter?

Sofa, duvet, bathrobe, remote control, mug of chocolate, complete set of
Stargate SG-1 DVDs.

Or were you asking about if you wanted to go outside? :-)
--
"For me, irony is very simply the means of foregrounding
the perspectivality of my Lacanian self-text."
- B. Comfort in soc.sexuality.general

On 29 Sep 2004 05:23:16 -0700, [email hidden] (Flat Earth

Society) said:

Any recommendations with respect to kit and/or walks for a walkers first winter?

In the three or four years that I have taken up serious walking again
(after a gap of 15 years) the quantity of my winter kit has grown
exponentially.

From summer waking gear including boots, waterproofs, gaiters, fleece,
hat, gloves, sleeping bag, mat and tent I would recommend the
following order of priority.

#1 windproof fleece, warm hat and gloves
#2 B2 boots, crampons, cheap tough gaiters* and ice axe
#3 Paramo~ smock and salopettes and waterproof over-gloves
#4 4-season tent and sleeping bag

*always wear tough gaiters with crampons. On my second walk in
crampons I speared my waterproof trousers.

~or other suitable brand

Winter's great. I find it's easier to stay warm in winter than to stay cool
in summer. Paramo clothing is great in winter and I'm looking forward to a
nice cold snap coming.

The lack of light is probably more of a problem than the lower temperatures
so make sure your navigation is up to scratch and get a reliable headtorch.

Cheers, Jiffy

Flat Earth Society wrote

Quoted message said:

Any recommendations with respect to kit and/or walks for a walkers first

winter?

Hills without crags are always good for learning about the basics
of winter walking. Even in the worst weathers they're still relatively
safe. There's plenty to be found if you look hard enough.

Chris

<snip>

Quoted message said:

#2 B2 boots, crampons, cheap tough gaiters* and ice axe
#3 Paramo~ smock and salopettes and waterproof over-gloves
#4 4-season tent and sleeping bag

*always wear tough gaiters with crampons. On my second walk in
crampons I speared my waterproof trousers.

I've gone for Paramo gaiters. Hardly cheap at £45 but they are easily
repairable.

Cheers, Jiffy

Jiffy said:

<snip>

Quoted message said:

#2 B2 boots, crampons, cheap tough gaiters* and ice axe
#3 Paramo~ smock and salopettes and waterproof over-gloves
#4 4-season tent and sleeping bag

*always wear tough gaiters with crampons. On my second walk in
crampons I speared my waterproof trousers.

I've gone for Paramo gaiters. Hardly cheap at £45 but they are easily
repairable.

My speared waterproof over-trousers were 10.99 from Blacks. I'd
really hate to spear £45 gaiters, even if they can be stitched up.

C L Imber said:

Jiffy said:

<snip>

Quoted message said:

#2 B2 boots, crampons, cheap tough gaiters* and ice axe
#3 Paramo~ smock and salopettes and waterproof over-gloves
#4 4-season tent and sleeping bag

*always wear tough gaiters with crampons. On my second walk in
crampons I speared my waterproof trousers.

I've gone for Paramo gaiters. Hardly cheap at £45 but they are easily
repairable.

My speared waterproof over-trousers were 10.99 from Blacks. I'd
really hate to spear £45 gaiters, even if they can be stitched up.

I'm amazed you waited to your second trip. IMHO *everyone* nails a trooser
first time in crampons and falls over - it's a rite of passage.

I'm looking to get some new waterproof overtrousers. A couple of
weeks ago my cheap (£10 ish) waterproof overtrousers failed miserably
to keep the water out on a 5-6 hour walk in the rain.

I don't want to spend a ridiculous amount of money - I went in a few
shops yesterday around Covent Garden and they were selling pairs for
just shy of £200. Ouch!

I'm thinking around the £50 mark - maybe a bit more, happily a bit
less. I have seen a pair of Berghaus 'Aquafoil' Waterproof
Overtrousers for £55. They claim to be "Fully waterproof, windproof
and breathable". Does anybody have any experience of these? Are they
*really* fully waterproof? I have also seen a pair of Lowe Alpine
triple point trousers (I think they may have been called 'Storm Pant'😉
for about the same. Anyone have any experience with these?

I'm not too bothered about how breathable they are, as I tend not to
sweat much. But they must be waterproof!!!

Any advice is greatly appreciated - review sites are good, but it's
always great to hear from 'real' users.

Cheers,

Michael S

I noticed that Message-ID:
<[email hidden]> from Michael S
contained the following:

Quoted message said:

I'm not too bothered about how breathable they are, as I tend not to
sweat much. But they must be waterproof!!!

IME, it doesn't matter if you don't sweat. You get wet from the inside
due to condensation.

--
Geoff Berrow (put thecat out to email)
It's only Usenet, no one dies.
My opinions, not the committee's, mine.
Simple RFDs http://www.ckdog.co.uk/rfdmaker/

Michael S said:

I'm thinking around the £50 mark - maybe a bit more, happily a bit
less. I have seen a pair of Berghaus 'Aquafoil' Waterproof
Overtrousers for £55. They claim to be "Fully waterproof, windproof
and breathable". Does anybody have any experience of these? Are they
*really* fully waterproof?

That's a loaded term. It means the fabric will keep out water to a
certain hydrostatic head. That does not mean they won't leak through
the zips or will stop water wicking down through your trousers, so
"fully waterproof" is a fair description but does not guarantee you'll
be dry.

Quoted message said:

I'm not too bothered about how breathable they are, as I tend not to
sweat much. But they must be waterproof!!!

You'd be surprised how much you do sweat over a few hours walking.
You'll probably be pretty well soaked after that sort of time in
non-breathable over trousers. And it's quite possible you'll out-sweat
even breathable ones.

Quoted message said:

Any advice is greatly appreciated

Start off with your basic trousers being something that's comfortable
when they're wet. I like Tracksters in part because of this, it has to
be relentless deluge before they become a liability without
overtrousers, and they dry out in minutes. This is all an advantage
even if you do wear overtrousers. Close fitting stretch fabrics that
move with you have the edge as they take body heat directly to get them
dry, and they don't slap against your legs when they're soaked. Lighter
is better too.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

The message <[email hidden]>
from Geoff Berrow <[email hidden]> contains these words:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm not too bothered about how breathable they are, as I tend not to
sweat much. But they must be waterproof!!!

Quoted message said:

IME, it doesn't matter if you don't sweat. You get wet from the inside
due to condensation.

Which begs the question where the moisture is coming from if not from
sweat. Even if the air outside is fully saturated any that finds its way
to the warmer side of the waterproof won't be even before it is diluted
by the supposedly drier air surrounding that strange anomaly, the non
sweating body.

--
Roger
Looking North over the Aire Valley (and Marley Gasworks) to Rombolds Moor
Top Posters killfiled on sight

Geoff Berrow <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

I noticed that Message-ID:
<[email hidden]> from Michael S
contained the following:

Quoted message said:

I'm not too bothered about how breathable they are, as I tend not to
sweat much. But they must be waterproof!!!

IME, it doesn't matter if you don't sweat. You get wet from the inside
due to condensation.

Not in Paramo lined waterproofs! They are £100, less any discount you
can squeeze, and are one of my best buys.
Not overtrousers - you can wear them all day, and not just out in the
hills, I wear them for knocking around generally in very cold or wet
weather.
--
Gordon

Gordon said:

Not in Paramo lined waterproofs!

<pedantry> Paramo isn't a fabric, it's a company, and it isn't the
specific lining fabric but the /combination/ of the lining and the outer
that makes Paramo's waterproof stuff waterproof. </pedantry>

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Michael S ([email hidden]) wrote:
: I'm looking to get some new waterproof overtrousers. A couple of
: weeks ago my cheap (£10 ish) waterproof overtrousers failed miserably
: to keep the water out on a 5-6 hour walk in the rain.
: I don't want to spend a ridiculous amount of money - I went in a few
: shops yesterday around Covent Garden and they were selling pairs for
: just shy of £200. Ouch!

If you don't mind camouflage colours you can get army surplus goretex
trousers for under 30 quid.
www.forcesreunited.org.uk/shop/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=43&cat=Goretex

Blair.

Peter Clinch <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Gordon said:

Not in Paramo lined waterproofs!

<pedantry> Paramo isn't a fabric, it's a company, and it isn't the
specific lining fabric but the /combination/ of the lining and the outer
that makes Paramo's waterproof stuff waterproof. </pedantry>

I meant the lined, waterproof trousers sold under the Paramo label!

Not the trousers lined with Paramo. :-)

They did away with over trousers, except in summer.
--
Gordon

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 18:31:31 +0100, Gordon <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Peter Clinch <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Gordon said:

Not in Paramo lined waterproofs!

<pedantry> Paramo isn't a fabric, it's a company, and it isn't the
specific lining fabric but the /combination/ of the lining and the outer
that makes Paramo's waterproof stuff waterproof. </pedantry>

I meant the lined, waterproof trousers sold under the Paramo label!

Not the trousers lined with Paramo. :-)

That would have been Paramo-lined!

--

Paul

(Watch this space)

Paul <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 18:31:31 +0100, Gordon <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Peter Clinch <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Gordon wrote:

> Not in Paramo lined waterproofs!

<pedantry> Paramo isn't a fabric, it's a company, and it isn't the
specific lining fabric but the /combination/ of the lining and the outer
that makes Paramo's waterproof stuff waterproof. </pedantry>

I meant the lined, waterproof trousers sold under the Paramo label!

Not the trousers lined with Paramo. :-)

That would have been Paramo-lined!

I'm looking into a new material called Trampo - that should help me to
reach greater heights.
--
Gordon

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 19:44:22 +0100, Gordon <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Paul <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

On Wed, 20 Oct 2004 18:31:31 +0100, Gordon <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Peter Clinch <[email hidden]> wrote
>Gordon wrote:
>
>> Not in Paramo lined waterproofs!
>
><pedantry> Paramo isn't a fabric, it's a company, and it isn't the
>specific lining fabric but the /combination/ of the lining and the outer
>that makes Paramo's waterproof stuff waterproof. </pedantry>
>

I meant the lined, waterproof trousers sold under the Paramo label!

Not the trousers lined with Paramo. :-)

That would have been Paramo-lined!

I'm looking into a new material called Trampo - that should help me to
reach greater heights.

Groan!!!

--

Paul

(Watch this space)

On 20/10/04 7:33 pm, in article [email hidden],

Paul said:

That would have been Paramo-lined!

Whatever, Paramo trousers are superb for wet and wintery conditions!

--
Andy Howell
Birmingham, UK