I've been hit

On 6 May 2004 14:27:03 -0700, [email hidden] (Scott Sawyer)

Quoted message said:

The bottom line is that I'm ok, but I would at least like to get a new
bike out of the deal. Does anyone have advice on how to proceed from
here?

I'd file a lawsuit.

In article <[email hidden]>,

Scott Sawyer said:

Yesterday afternoon, I was traveling north on a secondary city street
(Merriman Rd in Akron Ohio) that has only a few stop lights along its
length. The street is a false flat, and I was going down hill at about
21 - 23 mph. A car failed to yield and pulled out from a driveway in
front of me. I hit the front fender of the car, and flew head over
heels over the hood, and landed in the opposite lane of traffic.
Fortunately, I was able to get up and hobble to the side of the road.

My injuries are relatively minor. I was seen in the emergency room to
get stitches on my right shin. Otherwise, I have painfully bruised
both lower legs, and I have some roadrash on both legs and arms. I
never hit my head on either the car or the pavement.

My bike, a 2000 Cannondale R600, is trashed. The right leg of the
carbon fiber fork is broken in two places, and the right chainstay is
completely broken in two. The big chainring now has a 90 degree bend.

The driver was cited for failure to yield. I was not feeling well at
the time, and I didn't get her name or telephone number, although
those things will be on the police report.

The bottom line is that I'm ok, but I would at least like to get a new
bike out of the deal. Does anyone have advice on how to proceed from
here?

Her insurance company is praying you don't talk to a lawyer.

--Paul

6 May 2004 14:27:03 -0700,
<[email hidden]>,

(Scott Sawyer) said:

The bottom line is that I'm ok, but I would at least like to get a new
bike out of the deal. Does anyone have advice on how to proceed from
here?

Don't sign anything. It's too soon to know that you're okay.

http://bicycleaustin.info/justice/whattodo.html
--
zk

Here's some more reading for you.

http://www.massbikeboston.org/resources/crash.htm
--
zk

Scott Sawyer said:

Yesterday afternoon, I was traveling north on a secondary city street
(Merriman Rd in Akron Ohio) that has only a few stop lights along its
length. The street is a false flat, and I was going down hill at
about 21 - 23 mph. A car failed to yield and pulled out from a
driveway in front of
me. I hit the front fender of the car, and flew head over heels over the
hood, and landed in the opposite lane of traffic. Fortunately, I was
able to get up and hobble to the side of the road.
My injuries are relatively minor. I was seen in the emergency room to
get stitches on my right shin. Otherwise, I have painfully bruised both
lower legs, and I have some roadrash on both legs and arms. I never hit
my head on either the car or the pavement.
My bike, a 2000 Cannondale R600, is trashed. The right leg of the carbon
fiber fork is broken in two places, and the right chainstay is
completely broken in two. The big chainring now has a 90 degree bend.
The driver was cited for failure to yield. I was not feeling well at the
time, and I didn't get her name or telephone number, although those
things will be on the police report.
The bottom line is that I'm ok, but I would at least like to get a
new bike out of the deal. Does anyone have advice on how to proceed
from here?
Best regards, Scott Sawyer

a) Get a copy of the police report ASAP! You can then reach out to the
offending driver to see if she'll make you whole without the whole
legal thing. She should have insurance that she can use to cover this
(auto insurance);

b) I hope/I'm glad you're well. Fat lot of bad luck that was. ("I-I-I I
just didn't see you." We all know that story.)

c) If the driver was cited, you're right: her info will be on the police
report. This will be your friend in (sorry) Small Claims Court, if
you _have to_ sue her for your new (work with me here) R5000 bike!
(here's a picture, in case you lost yours:

http://tinyurl.com/3gqdr

😄

d) Meanwhile, check with your homeowner's/renter's insurance whether
you're covered under your own policy, letting _them_ sue her, or her
insurance company, for you. They may be willing to go that route.

Again, glad you're relatively okay. Sorry about the bike....

You should come out whole in this one.....

Keep us posted, huh?

Neil

--

Zoot Katz said:

6 May 2004 14:27:03 -0700,
<[email hidden]>,

(Scott Sawyer) said:

The bottom line is that I'm ok, but I would at least like to get a
new bike out of the deal. Does anyone have advice on how to proceed
from here?

Don't sign anything. It's too soon to know that you're okay.
http://bicycleaustin.info/justice/whattodo.htmlhttp://bicycleaustin.inf-
o/justice/whattodo.html
--
zk

I hate to admit it, but that's great advice. If you can find a cycling
attorney nearby, at least you can get a sense of all of your rights, and
(to ZK's point) make sure you're protected if you aren't as alright as
you think.....

--

Scott Sawyer said:

The bottom line is that I'm ok, but I would at least like to get a new
bike out of the deal. Does anyone have advice on how to proceed from
here?

My first reaction would be to @$%& her insurance company long and hard. Get a
lawyer and bleed em for all they are worth. Insurance companies, IMO are
nothing more than greedy extortionists that deserve to be raped.

Glad you weren't seriously hurt, and as others have said, wait a while and
see what still hurts in a week or 2.

You will probably have to replace the bike yourself and collect the $ for it
later, it could take a while to get a settlement.

neil0502 [/i]

BI hate to admit it said:

of your rights, and (to ZK's point) make sure you're protected if you
aren't as alright as you think.....

Scott - if you have the time, skills, and ambition you can get a pretty
reasonable settlement yourself.

Otherwise you see a lawyer, they take 1/3 and get you probably the same
amount for almost no work on your part. You should definitely go this
route if you miss any time from work or have medical bills.

The driver's insurance has probably already given this info to their
lawyers, and their job is to give you as little money as possible,
remember that. They are experts at games you didn't know existed and
they might be able to screw you out of everything or even pay for the
scratches on the car!

Also, the more the insurance company has to pay you, the more the
driver's insurance rates will go up... that's important revenge. (OK,
I'm not positive about that but it makes sense.

I was hit 19 years ago, broken shoulder blade, some lost wages and bike
repair. I think it was $20k settlement and I got $13.3k.

--

Quoted message said:

[email hidden]

wrote in part:

---description of crash and damage snipped--

Quoted message said:

The bottom line is that I'm ok, but I would at least like to get a new
bike out of the deal. Does anyone have advice on how to proceed from
here?

1- Save any and all bills/receipts for the damages you've incurred.
2- Get a copy of the crash report.
3- Contact the other involved party.
4- Contact that party's insurance company.
5- Here's the hard part... wait. Wait to be sure that no injuries were
overlooked in the ER. Wait for the insurance company's settlement offer.
6- Go from there. Expect to do a little negotiating but don't expect a brand
new Seven and a six figure settlement. The crash you describe should not cause
you undue financial stress but it's not like winning the lottery either. Be
fair to both yourself and them.
7- If all the above fails, hire an attorney.

As an aside- my own experiences with insurance companies have apparently been
different than those of other posters that have replied here. No, they are not
benevolent entities but they *are* businesses and niggling over what to them is
a minor claim when it could lose them a current client (the driver), future
clients (you and all your family and friends), as well as generating bad
word-of-mouth ("Yeah, I'd *never* use that insurance company. They don't pay
claims."😉 is simply bad business.
Best of luck and glad you weren't seriously injured.

Regards,
Bob Hunt

Scott,

You have earned a new bike. Take your broken bike to a
reputable shop and get an estimate, signed by the
head mechanic there, which will show the cost to
replace your machine, not with a similar used machine,
but with a new one (if applicable this estimate should
also include the cost to have the shop remove the old
parts and put them on a new frame). With the police
report handy, contact the woman's insurance company
and give them this estimate, any bills for medical care
and lost wages. After a few weeks, which should give
any hidden injuries a chance to show, the insurance
company should send you a check matching your
request. That is the amount that is owed you. When you cash the check it
signals your acceptance of the
deal, so...If they try to shortchange you, threaten
lawyer, if they still shortchange you, get a lawyer and
get as much as you can, I guess. But you shouldn't (and I don't think you are)
look at this as a chance to
make some extra cash as some others suggest. Doing that is a karma foul
punishable by an even more
severe crack-up. Just count yourself as lucky you weren't vegetableized and
move on (with your shiny
new bike).

Robert

neil0502 said:

Zoot Katz said:

6 May 2004 14:27:03 -0700,
<[email hidden]>,

(Scott Sawyer) said:

The bottom line is that I'm ok, but I would at least like to get a
new bike out of the deal. Does anyone have advice on how to proceed
from here?

Don't sign anything. It's too soon to know that you're okay.
http://bicycleaustin.info/justice/whattodo.htmlhttp://bicycleaustin.inf-
o/justice/whattodo.html
--
zk

I hate to admit it, but that's great advice. If you can find a cycling
attorney nearby, at least you can get a sense of all of your rights, and
(to ZK's point) make sure you're protected if you aren't as alright as
you think.....

Make sure you get yourself checked out properly too. I had a
less-spectacular car-caused crash a couple of years ago. Was worried
I might have broken my scaphoid bone in my wrist. First GP thought it
was OK; I was still worried, got an X-ray a week later that showed it
WAS broken! If it wasn't detected, that bone would have never healed,
just died and gone arthritic etc...

Quoted message said:

Her insurance company is praying you don't talk to a lawyer.

Her insurance company have already talked to their lawyers, and have already
outlined a plan to screw you out of everything. Have they called you on the
phone yet and tried to get you to screw yourself?

This is war. Get a good lawyer, or you're dead already.
C.Q.C.

(Hunrobe) said:

1- Save any and all bills/receipts for the damages you've incurred.
2- Get a copy of the crash report.
3- Contact the other involved party.
4- Contact that party's insurance company.
5- Here's the hard part... wait. Wait to be sure that no injuries were
overlooked in the ER. Wait for the insurance company's settlement offer.
6- Go from there. Expect to do a little negotiating but don't expect a brand
new Seven and a six figure settlement. The crash you describe should not cause
you undue financial stress but it's not like winning the lottery either. Be
fair to both yourself and them.
7- If all the above fails, hire an attorney.

As an aside- my own experiences with insurance companies have apparently been
different than those of other posters that have replied here. No, they are not
benevolent entities but they *are* businesses and niggling over what to them is
a minor claim when it could lose them a current client (the driver), future
clients (you and all your family and friends), as well as generating bad
word-of-mouth ("Yeah, I'd *never* use that insurance company. They don't pay
claims."😉 is simply bad business.
Best of luck and glad you weren't seriously injured.

Wow, I find myself agreeing with Bob. Depending on the insurance
adjuster, you may actually get enough to get a Seven. I'd add a
couple of things to Bob's list:
0.5- Take pictures of your injuries. Vivid, graphic, show all the
bruises and stitches.
4.1- Go see the adjuster ASAP. Wear all braces, bandages, etc.. If
you're hurting, let them see that.
4.5- Take your bike, or what's left of it, to a bike shop and ask for
a written estimate on what it would take to repair it. You might also
get them to note the price of a comparable new model.
5.5- Replace your helmet (if you were wearing one), any equipment or
clothing that was damaged, and save the receipts.

When you get to (6), make sure the insurance adjuster includes all
your costs, including clothing, bike, ambulance (if appropriate),
hospital, and doctors. Given a choice between "pain and suffering" or
a lawyer, they may offer you a very nice bike. (I was offered a nice
settlement, and actually argued them down. Interesting experience.)

Pat

<snip>

Quoted message said:

...If they try to shortchange you, threaten
lawyer, if they still shortchange you, get a lawyer and
get as much as you can, I guess. But you shouldn't (and I don't think you

are)

Quoted message said:

look at this as a chance to
make some extra cash as some others suggest. Doing that is a karma foul
punishable by an even more
severe crack-up.

Karma? Sorry, no offense, but no such thing exists. There is, however,
greed and evil in the world. Insurance is a business, and they will
shortchange people who are not ready. Their job is to maximize profits.
They are not nice benevolent people, they specialize in screwing everyone
and everything and are much better at it than any decent human is. Who do
you thing is going to pay for 9/11? God forbid the CEO's of these insurance
companies have to drive anything less than a $100,000 Mercedes.

Oh, and if you do believe in Karma ... think about this, you've already been
screwed by insurance companies your whole life in ways you can't even
imagine. It's payback time now.

C.Q.C.

Quoted message said:

The bottom line is that I'm ok, but I would at least like to get a new
bike out of the deal. Does anyone have advice on how to proceed from
here?

Best regards,
Scott Sawyer

Repeat after me
I WANT MY LAWYER
YO NESSICITO ME ABOGADRO

"Q." <LostVideos-AT-hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Her insurance company is praying you don't talk to a lawyer.

Her insurance company have already talked to their lawyers, and have

already

Quoted message said:

outlined a plan to screw you out of everything. Have they called you on

the

Quoted message said:

phone yet and tried to get you to screw yourself?

This is war. Get a good lawyer, or you're dead already.
C.Q.C.

This is complete B.S. This is the kind of B.S. I listened to when I got hit
by a car quite severely about 18 months ago and it made my life more
miserable than it needed to be. In the end, I was reasonable and the
responsible party's insurance company was reasonable.

There are guidelines and standard procedures for these kinds of things. You
are entitled to almost immediate reimbursement for your property losses and,
on top of that, anything from three to five times your medical bills, lost
wages and the like. If your demands are within those reasonable guidelines,
things should go reasonably smoothly. Not fast, but reasonably smoothly.

These guidelines have applied to friends of mine who have had minor
incidents where the settlements totaled as low as $12,000 including property
.... all the way to mine which was ... well ... more than ten times that.

Yes, they may try a trick or two along the way. When they sent me a check
to replace my bike about a month after their driver totaled mine, they also
sent a "Property release form" in which the fine print released them from
any obligation to pay medical expenses. It was a stupid and sleazy move on
their part and, once I let them know I wasn't going to tolerate that kind of
[censored], that was the end of it.

From there on in it was smooth sailing and all the horror stories about me
needing a lawyer to fight their lawyers was nothing but pure fiction. If
you've got some common sense, you can handle it. And if things do go awry,
you can get a lawyer involved later if you need to. But it doesn't make any
sense to just give away 1/3 of your settlement to get a lawyer involved if
you know the basic guidelines and use a little common sense.

I ended up with a settlement beyond my wildest imagination. I'm not greedy
and wasn't out to screw anybody. I just wanted fair reimbursement and
compensation for my losses. I ended up with exactly that. And I never
hired an attorney.

Bob C.

Quoted message said:

Does anyone have advice on how to proceed from
here?

Best regards,
Scott Sawyer

First of all - I'm glad you weren't seriously hurt. I hope the injuries you do
have heal swiftly and completely.

If you were on the UK side of the pond, I'd be suggesting you call the
CTC(Cyclists' Touring Club) if you were a member and get their most excellent
legal people at work - as this comes as a perk of membership. Are there lawyers
on your side of the pond who specialise in working for cyclists? If so, get
one. Photograph your bike - as a record of the damage + your injuries. Get your
lawyer to start working for you - keep receipts of every expense you incur as a
result of this.

Lawyers are sometimes necessary - sadly.

Best wishes, helen s

--This is an invalid email address to avoid spam--
to get correct one remove fame & fortune
h*$el*$$e*nd**$o$ts**i*$*$m*m$o*n*s@$*a$o*l.c**$om$

--Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off--

psycholist said:

Quoted message said:

This is war. Get a good lawyer, or you're dead already.

Bob C. said:

This is complete B.S. This is the kind of B.S. I listened to when I got hit
by a car quite severely about 18 months ago and it made my life more
miserable than it needed to be. In the end, I was reasonable and the
responsible party's insurance company was reasonable.

Bob - thanks for this. I was getting further reinforcement to my view that
I'm really glad I don't live in the US. Your story has partially restored
my faith in basic human decency and justice.

--
Mark.

"psycholist" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Q." <LostVideos-AT-hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Her insurance company is praying you don't talk to a lawyer.

Her insurance company have already talked to their lawyers, and have

already

Quoted message said:

outlined a plan to screw you out of everything. Have they called you on

the

Quoted message said:

phone yet and tried to get you to screw yourself?

This is war. Get a good lawyer, or you're dead already.
C.Q.C.

This is complete B.S. This is the kind of B.S. I listened to when I got

hit

Quoted message said:

by a car quite severely about 18 months ago and it made my life more
miserable than it needed to be. In the end, I was reasonable and the
responsible party's insurance company was reasonable.

There are guidelines and standard procedures for these kinds of things.

You

Quoted message said:

are entitled to almost immediate reimbursement for your property losses

and,

Quoted message said:

on top of that, anything from three to five times your medical bills, lost
wages and the like. If your demands are within those reasonable

guidelines,

Quoted message said:

things should go reasonably smoothly. Not fast, but reasonably smoothly.

These guidelines have applied to friends of mine who have had minor
incidents where the settlements totaled as low as $12,000 including

property

Quoted message said:

... all the way to mine which was ... well ... more than ten times that.

Yes, they may try a trick or two along the way. When they sent me a check
to replace my bike about a month after their driver totaled mine, they

also

Quoted message said:

sent a "Property release form" in which the fine print released them from
any obligation to pay medical expenses. It was a stupid and sleazy move

on

Quoted message said:

their part and, once I let them know I wasn't going to tolerate that kind

of

Quoted message said:

[censored], that was the end of it.

How can you sit there and berate me, when you freely admit they tried to
screw you right off the bat???

Quoted message said:

From there on in it was smooth sailing and all the horror stories about me
needing a lawyer to fight their lawyers was nothing but pure fiction.

Pure fiction huh? You were lucky, they only tried ONCE to screw you and you
caught it. Some people aren't that lucky and get reamed ... it's not
fiction, it REALLY HAPPENS. That big fat bank account you're so proud of
may make you feel better about yourself but that doesn't mean other people
make out as well as you do.

C.Q.C.