How to improve commuting time?

On Sat, 28 Oct 2006 21:47:27 +0100, "Adam Lea" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

I started cycling to work last May. At first it took me just over an hour
but during the summer I got that down to 55 minutes in and (at best) just
under 50 minutes back. However progress has stalled since then and my times
are starting to creep back up again towards 1 hour. I would like to improve
my fitness to the point where I could get the time down to 45 minutes (I
think this is probably as fast as I could ever go on my route). What is the
best way to go about this? Is it to try doing longer rides or try increasing
the intensity on my current route? I have a 24 speed mountain bike (three
sets of eight gears) with road tyres and I don't use the top chainring on
the front as I don't seem to be able to get the cadence up enough.

Can you give some more information? How long have you been cycling, how
much do you weigh, how hilly is the route, how dependent is the speed on
traffic and other incidentals?

At age 28, no physical problems, under 160lbs, you should be able to
average over 20mph on the flats with no problem.

Quoted message said:

One other thing is that when I cycle in three times in a row I seem to wake
up exhausted the next day (it is almost as though I am accumulating fatigue
each day) and end up taking the car. This cannot be due to a lack of food as

Remember we improve during (and as a result of) rest! Are you getting
plenty of good sleep?

Quoted message said:

I eat six times a day (around 3000-3500 cals). Has anyone got any advice on
how to keep energy levels high? I find it hard to believe that at the age of
28, 100 miles of cycling a week and weight training 2-3 times a week I can't
manage more than about 80 miles over three days without running out of steam
whereas there are people like Simon Brooke who have all sorts of health
problems but can easily manage 100 miles per day and 400 meter climbs
without too much trouble.

Can anyone help me out?

How long have you been lifting weights? What lifts do you do? How long is a
session?

Quoted message said:

Thanks

Adam

(trying to reduce car dependence)

Adam Lea said:

I started cycling to work last May. At first it took me just over an
hour but during the summer I got that down to 55 minutes in and (at
best) just under 50 minutes back. However progress has stalled since
then and my times are starting to creep back up again towards 1 hour.
I would like to improve my fitness to the point where I could get
the time down to 45 minutes (I think this is probably as fast as I
could ever go on my route). What is the best way to go about this? Is
it to try doing longer rides or try increasing the intensity on my
current route? I have a 24 speed mountain bike (three sets of eight
gears) with road tyres and I don't use the top chainring on the front
as I don't seem to be able to get the cadence up enough.

Increasing the intenisty on some days will improve your strength and fitness
in general and will eventually make each ride easier. And an occasional
long ride helps with endurance.

Your MTB may be fine for the commute, but an exciting road bike would
inspire you to "give it some more welly" - which will do wonders for your
fitness, if my experience is anything to go by.

Quoted message said:

One other thing is that when I cycle in three times in a row I seem
to wake up exhausted the next day (it is almost as though I am
accumulating fatigue each day) and end up taking the car. This cannot
be due to a lack of food as I eat six times a day (around 3000-3500
cals). Has anyone got any advice on how to keep energy levels high?

But is it the right sort of cals? Perhaps the dietry experts here could
advise on what to eat.

Quoted message said:

I find it hard to believe that at the age of 28, 100 miles of cycling a
week and weight training 2-3 times a week I can't manage more than
about 80 miles over three days without running out of steam whereas
there are people like Simon Brooke who have all sorts of health
problems but can easily manage 100 miles per day and 400 meter climbs
without too much trouble.

Endurance improves with age! :-) Seriously, that's really true. Nothing
wrong with not cycling every day, either.

~PB, eating a Pot Noodle and chocolate after test-riding my bike that I just
finished building today

Adam Lea wrote on 28/10/2006 21:47 +0100:

Quoted message said:

I started cycling to work last May. At first it took me just over an hour
but during the summer I got that down to 55 minutes in and (at best) just
under 50 minutes back. However progress has stalled since then and my times
are starting to creep back up again towards 1 hour. I would like to improve
my fitness to the point where I could get the time down to 45 minutes (I
think this is probably as fast as I could ever go on my route). What is the
best way to go about this? Is it to try doing longer rides or try increasing
the intensity on my current route? I have a 24 speed mountain bike (three
sets of eight gears) with road tyres and I don't use the top chainring on
the front as I don't seem to be able to get the cadence up enough.

One other thing is that when I cycle in three times in a row I seem to wake
up exhausted the next day (it is almost as though I am accumulating fatigue
each day) and end up taking the car. This cannot be due to a lack of food as
I eat six times a day (around 3000-3500 cals). Has anyone got any advice on
how to keep energy levels high? I find it hard to believe that at the age of
28, 100 miles of cycling a week and weight training 2-3 times a week I can't
manage more than about 80 miles over three days without running out of steam
whereas there are people like Simon Brooke who have all sorts of health
problems but can easily manage 100 miles per day and 400 meter climbs
without too much trouble.

Can anyone help me out?

When I first came back to cycling it took a couple of years before my
times stopped improving i.e. it takes a much longer time than you might
think. You can overtrain which might be your problem if you are racing
for good times three times a week, especially if I estimate your
distances right at about 14 miles each way. At that distance, depending
on the terrain and roads that's not too bad a time. Try not trying so
hard, take it a little slower on some days and let it build up steadily

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

<[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Can you give some more information? How long have you been cycling, how
much do you weigh, how hilly is the route, how dependent is the speed on
traffic and other incidentals?

At age 28, no physical problems, under 160lbs, you should be able to
average over 20mph on the flats with no problem.

I currently weigh about 11 stone (down from 12 stone 6 months ago). I have
the ectomorph type body (slim, hard to gain weight). I have been cycling
frequently since the end of April, prior to that I only used the bike for
occasional local journeys. I have owned a bike since I was at university
(about 8 years ago) but mainly used it for local journeys (<3 miles).

My commute starts about here:

http://www.streetmap.co.uk/newmap.srf?x=518310&y=133285&z=4&sv=518310,133285&st=4&ar=Y&mapp=newmap.srf&searchp=newsearch.srf

and ends here:

http://www.streetmap.co.uk/newmap.srf?x=510525&y=142610&z=4&sv=510525,142610&st=4&ar=Y&mapp=newmap.srf&searchp=newsearch.srf

going via Warnham station, Warnham, the A29, Walliswood, and finally Forest
Green. The route back goes via Ewhurst Green, Rowhook the A281 and back
through Warnham from the south west side. The contours will give you an idea
of the hilliness.

The major slowdowns are getting over the A24 Horsham bypass (70mph limit
dual carriageway) and getting over the railway line at Warnham station which
involves carrying the bike down steps, under a subway and back up steps as
the level crossing is blocked off. Other than that the route is rural in
nature so no traffic lights, little traffic and very few junctions to worry
about. The terrain could be described as undulating with a 90m height gain
in the last mile (this is mainly why the outward and return times differ).

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

One other thing is that when I cycle in three times in a row I seem to
wake
up exhausted the next day (it is almost as though I am accumulating
fatigue
each day) and end up taking the car. This cannot be due to a lack of food
as

Remember we improve during (and as a result of) rest! Are you getting
plenty of good sleep?

Not always but I can't do a lot about this as I have no control about when I
have to get up in the morning and I can't get off to sleep very quickly when
I go to bed.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I eat six times a day (around 3000-3500 cals). Has anyone got any advice
on
how to keep energy levels high? I find it hard to believe that at the age
of
28, 100 miles of cycling a week and weight training 2-3 times a week I
can't
manage more than about 80 miles over three days without running out of
steam
whereas there are people like Simon Brooke who have all sorts of health
problems but can easily manage 100 miles per day and 400 meter climbs
without too much trouble.

Can anyone help me out?

How long have you been lifting weights? What lifts do you do? How long is
a
session?

I have been lifting for about 3 1/2 years now. When I started I weighed 9
stone which was classed as underweight for a 6' man. Through weight training
and a 4000 calorie diet I managed to get up to just over 12 stone and
improved my strength. I have sinced dropped back to 11 stone as a result of
utility cycling. I do the basic compound lifts: squats, deadlifts, bench
press, rows, overhead pressing. A session typically lasts 45 minutes to an
hour. I have had a bit of a layoff recently which unfortunatly has resulted
in a significant strength drop which I am currently trying to remedy.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Thanks

Adam

(trying to reduce car dependence)

Quoted message said:

At age 28, no physical problems, under 160lbs, you should be able to
average over 20mph on the flats with no problem.

No problem? Maybe if it's dead flat with a tailwind. 20mph real-world
average on your own requires busting your guts out for anyone other than a
very fit seriously keen cyclist. I think 15 to 17 mph is more of a
reasonable target to suggest; a bit lower for anyone on an MTB, and lower
still if lots of heavy traffic is involved.

~PB

Pete Biggs wrote on 28/10/2006 23:28 +0100:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

At age 28, no physical problems, under 160lbs, you should be able to
average over 20mph on the flats with no problem.

No problem? Maybe if it's dead flat with a tailwind. 20mph real-world
average on your own requires busting your guts out for anyone other than a
very fit seriously keen cyclist. I think 15 to 17 mph is more of a
reasonable target to suggest; a bit lower for anyone on an MTB, and lower
still if lots of heavy traffic is involved.

I agree.

--
Tony

"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using
his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
- Leonardo da Vinci

"Adam Lea" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I started cycling to work last May. At first it took me just over an hour
but during the summer I got that down to 55 minutes in and (at best) just
under 50 minutes back. However progress has stalled since then and my times
are starting to creep back up again towards 1 hour. I would like to improve
my fitness to the point where I could get the time down to 45 minutes (I
think this is probably as fast as I could ever go on my route). What is the
best way to go about this? Is it to try doing longer rides or try
increasing the intensity on my current route? I have a 24 speed mountain
bike (three sets of eight gears) with road tyres and I don't use the top
chainring on the front as I don't seem to be able to get the cadence up
enough.

One other thing is that when I cycle in three times in a row I seem to
wake up exhausted the next day (it is almost as though I am accumulating
fatigue each day) and end up taking the car. This cannot be due to a lack
of food as I eat six times a day (around 3000-3500 cals). Has anyone got
any advice on how to keep energy levels high? I find it hard to believe
that at the age of 28, 100 miles of cycling a week and weight training 2-3
times a week I can't manage more than about 80 miles over three days
without running out of steam whereas there are people like Simon Brooke
who have all sorts of health problems but can easily manage 100 miles per
day and 400 meter climbs without too much trouble.

Can anyone help me out?

Road bike. I'm much quicker on my very sheddy road bike on the road than I
am on my flash MTB (yes, even with the MTB on road tyres). Dunno if it's
geometry improving the aerodynamics, the narrower tyres, the less sealed up
bearings, longer gearing or what.

Pete Biggs said:

Quoted message said:

At age 28, no physical problems, under 160lbs, you should be able to
average over 20mph on the flats with no problem.

No problem? Maybe if it's dead flat with a tailwind. 20mph real-world
average on your own requires busting your guts out for anyone other than a
very fit seriously keen cyclist. I think 15 to 17 mph is more of a
reasonable target to suggest; a bit lower for anyone on an MTB, and lower
still if lots of heavy traffic is involved.

~PB

The OP was asking about why his speed was deteriorating and that was to
give him a rough guide. I average almost 18mph on the flat for 10 miles and
I'm no youngster. I often see younger guys go flying by me, so it's news to
me that a 28y.o. cycling for two hours a day three to five days a week for
7 months would not be 'very fit' and able to crank 20?

BTW what about 'flat' isn't 'dead flat'? ;-)

"Adam Lea" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I started cycling to work last May. At first it took me just over an hour
but during the summer I got that down to 55 minutes in and (at best) just
under 50 minutes back. However progress has stalled since then and my times
are starting to creep back up again towards 1 hour.

I reckon this is entirely normal. I'm definitely slower in winter than
summer. Cold legs work less well.

Quoted message said:

I would like to improve my fitness to the point where I could get the
time down to 45 minutes (I think this is probably as fast as I could ever
go on my route). What is the best way to go about this? Is it to try doing
longer rides or try increasing the intensity on my current route?

Both will help. Riding with others is probably the best way to get you
faster - especially if they're just a bit faster than you :-) It'll help
with the mental bit - encouraging you to put that extra effort in which is
all to easy to avoid otherwise. (that'll be my problem :-( )

cheers,
clive

"Doki" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Road bike. I'm much quicker on my very sheddy road bike on the road than I
am on my flash MTB (yes, even with the MTB on road tyres). Dunno if it's
geometry improving the aerodynamics, the narrower tyres, the less sealed
up bearings, longer gearing or what.

"less weight" maybe.

Jc.

"Josey" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Doki" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Road bike. I'm much quicker on my very sheddy road bike on the road than
I am on my flash MTB (yes, even with the MTB on road tyres). Dunno if
it's geometry improving the aerodynamics, the narrower tyres, the less
sealed up bearings, longer gearing or what.

"less weight" maybe.

Could be, but I would think my road bike and MTB are pretty similar weights.
Probably 5lbs in it at the most. It could be that I run 23mm tyres on the
road bike and most MTB slicks are around 1.5". Schwalbe city jets in
particular seem to take on a strange profile and slither about when
cornering which doesn't help cornering speeds.

Josey said:

"Doki" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

Road bike. I'm much quicker on my very sheddy road bike on the road than I
am on my flash MTB (yes, even with the MTB on road tyres). Dunno if it's
geometry improving the aerodynamics, the narrower tyres, the less sealed
up bearings, longer gearing or what.

"less weight" maybe.

Jc.

I know that is what is slowing me down. I'm on a Trek MTB, which was
never built for speed anyway, but having 18 stone of me on the top
means my average speed to work (16 mile round trip) is 16mph, and on
longer rides (30-40 miles), 15+mph.

If I weighed less, I could probably go that bit quicker. But then,
more riding means less weight means faster means more riding....

Quoted message said:

The OP was asking about why his speed was deteriorating and that was
to give him a rough guide. I average almost 18mph on the flat for 10
miles and I'm no youngster. I often see younger guys go flying by me,
so it's news to me that a 28y.o. cycling for two hours a day three to
five days a week for 7 months would not be 'very fit' and able to
crank 20?

I bet most of those guys slow down a while after they've overtaken you :-)
20mph average is world away from 18mph -- and I reckon requires either a
particularly aero position or an extremely fit person. The OP is on a
mountain bike.

I rarely average more than 17mph and rarely get overtaken by a cyclist whom
I couldn't keep up with without increasing my overall average speed --
though admittedly I don't cycle much in places and times where there's a lot
of serious competitive cyclists out training, etc. But the OP is talking
about commuting and general fitness rather than training for racing.

Quoted message said:

BTW what about 'flat' isn't 'dead flat'? ;-)

Joking aside, I always wonder what exactly people mean by "flat". They
can't mean really flat since few roads in the UK really are flat. The
slightest gradients make a big difference to average speed.

~PB

In article <[email hidden]>

Adam Lea said:

I started cycling to work last May. At first it took me just over an hour
but during the summer I got that down to 55 minutes in and (at best) just
under 50 minutes back. However progress has stalled since then and my times
are starting to creep back up again towards 1 hour. I would like to improve
my fitness to the point where I could get the time down to 45 minutes (I
think this is probably as fast as I could ever go on my route). What is the
best way to go about this? Is it to try doing longer rides or try increasing
the intensity on my current route? I have a 24 speed mountain bike (three
sets of eight gears) with road tyres and I don't use the top chainring on
the front as I don't seem to be able to get the cadence up enough.

Get a proper road bike, or modify the ATB with a closer-ratio cassette,
seriously narrow tyres and tri-bars.

Quoted message said:

One other thing is that when I cycle in three times in a row I seem to wake
up exhausted the next day (it is almost as though I am accumulating fatigue
each day) and end up taking the car.

That's not surprising if you do each ride as hard as you can - a proper
training schedule mixes hard days, easy days and rest days. This varies
from person to person, but basically you shouldn't do more than two
consecutive days of hard training - hard training can be either a power
workout (sprinting or weights) or an aerobic workout (distance or
circuits).

Quoted message said:

This cannot be due to a lack of food as
I eat six times a day (around 3000-3500 cals). Has anyone got any advice on
how to keep energy levels high?

Avoid foods with a high glycaemic index during the day - these will
cause your blood sugar levels to fluctuate more than lower GI foods.
But high GI foods are good for topping up during long rides or recovery
after a workout, hence our fondness of fruitcake. Make sure you're
getting enough protein too - my favourite of scrambled eggs and (reduced
sugar reduced salt) baked beans on toast washed down with skimmed milk
provides lots of medium-GI carbs and all the essential amino acids

Quoted message said:

I find it hard to believe that at the age of
28, 100 miles of cycling a week and weight training 2-3 times a week I can't
manage more than about 80 miles over three days without running out of steam

You're trying too hard. Try something like

Mon: Gentle commute.
Tues: Gym
Wed: Gentle commute
Thu: Sprint the hills
Fri: Gym
Sat: Go shopping
Sun: 50+ miles neither gentle nor racing

Quoted message said:

whereas there are people like Simon Brooke who have all sorts of health
problems but can easily manage 100 miles per day and 400 meter climbs
without too much trouble.

There's no substitute for putting in the miles, getting your setup and
technique so good you're more comfortable on the bike than off it,
pacing yourself at a level that you can ride all day (too slow can be
just as bad as too fast after a couple of hours), listening to your body
so you eat and drink when you need to ...

On 2006-10-29, Pete Biggs <[email hidden]> wrote:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

Joking aside, I always wonder what exactly people mean by "flat". They
can't mean really flat since few roads in the UK really are flat.

In parts of Cambridgeshire they really are flat as a pancake for miles
and miles.