How much would you pay?

"Mark Romero" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

$34.12
--
Slacker

"Mark Romero" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

It's all carbon fiber, I assume.

Does it have knobby tires? Metal cranks? Telescopic fork?

Let's see some photos. Sounds interesting.

-=B=-

seriously,

$3500

"Slacker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Mark Romero" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

$34.12
--
Slacker

"Mark Romero" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

Tuppence ha'penny....it's a brit ting ;-)

Dave says:

Quoted message said:

Tuppence ha'penny....it's a brit ting ;-)

I'll go as far as a tanner.

Steve

"Stephen Baker" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave says:

Quoted message said:

Tuppence ha'penny....it's a brit ting ;-)

I'll go as far as a tanner.

Steve

Flash B*stard!!

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

Nothing, because it would be the wrong size.

12lbs is ridiculous. The lightest road bikes are around 14 lbs... and you don't want anything that
light if you plan on having a bike that handles well.

-John Morgan

"Mark Romero" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

That's one heavy-ass frame! What's it made of, hand-forged solid lead?

/s

"John Morgan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Q1n9b.54822$cj1.31711@fed1read06...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

Nothing, because it would be the wrong size.

12lbs is ridiculous. The lightest road bikes are around 14 lbs... and you don't want anything that
light if you plan on having a bike that handles well.

12 lbs is only ridiculous if you use off-the-shelf components and current consumer-oriented
technologies. I can imagine some exotic designs employing a carbon monocoque frame. Use dry ceramic
bearings or Oilite sleeve bearings, Ti bolts, Vectran or Ti spokes, beryllium-laminated carbon rims
- yeah, you could do it. It would be insanely expensive, and almost completely custom engineered and
manufactured; but it would be rideable. There would definitely be some reliability vs. weight
trade-offs.

You can save a lot of weight in key areas. The tires, for instance, could be a urethane-coated
single-layer Kevlar casing with a very thin low-density rubber tread bonded to it. We're talking
about ~220 gram tubeless knobbies, but with a short lifespan. The cranks and BB would have to be an
integrated design like XTR; but even more radical. Make it a carbon single-ring, integrated
concentric-tubular beryllium BB design with Oilite sleeve bearings, and you probably could stay
under 400 grams for the crank+BB. You'd save 140 grams by not having a front derailleur. Make the Ti
cassette 11-34, and the chainring 30T, and it would be pretty reasonably geared. (This is a concept
bike, remember.)

I'm not saying you could make a *bombproof* 12lb bike; but you could make a reasonably trailworthy
bike in the 12 lb range. Not sure why you'd want to do it; but you could do it. The materials do
exist to make it possible. I put together a spreadsheet to test out some configurations, and it's
definitely possible, even using some off-the-shelf components (saddle, rear der, brakes, BB, etc)

Sounds like fun, though. I'd like to see somebody try this.

-=B=-

"B. Sanders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:C2o9b.467040$uu5.81088@sccrnsc04...

Quoted message said:

"John Morgan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Q1n9b.54822$cj1.31711@fed1read06...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

Nothing, because it would be the wrong size.

12lbs is ridiculous. The lightest road bikes are around 14 lbs... and

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

don't want anything that light if you plan on having a bike that handles well.

12 lbs is only ridiculous if you use off-the-shelf components and current consumer-oriented
technologies. I can imagine some exotic designs

employing

Quoted message said:

a carbon monocoque frame. Use dry ceramic bearings or Oilite sleeve bearings, Ti bolts, Vectran or
Ti spokes, beryllium-laminated carbon

rims -

Quoted message said:

yeah, you could do it. It would be insanely expensive, and almost

completely

Quoted message said:

custom engineered and manufactured; but it would be rideable. There would definitely be some
reliability vs. weight trade-offs.

You can save a lot of weight in key areas. The tires, for instance, could be a urethane-coated
single-layer Kevlar casing with a very thin

low-density

Quoted message said:

rubber tread bonded to it. We're talking about ~220 gram tubeless knobbies, but with a short
lifespan. The cranks and BB would have to be an integrated design like XTR; but even more radical.
Make it a carbon single-ring, integrated concentric-tubular beryllium BB design with Oilite sleeve
bearings, and you probably could stay under 400 grams for the crank+BB. You'd save 140 grams by
not having a front derailleur. Make the

Ti

Quoted message said:

cassette 11-34, and the chainring 30T, and it would be pretty reasonably geared. (This is a
concept bike, remember.)

I'm not saying you could make a *bombproof* 12lb bike; but you could make

a

Quoted message said:

reasonably trailworthy bike in the 12 lb range. Not sure why you'd want

to

Quoted message said:

do it; but you could do it. The materials do exist to make it possible. I put together a
spreadsheet to test out some configurations, and it's definitely possible, even using some
off-the-shelf components (saddle,

rear

Quoted message said:

der, brakes, BB, etc)

Sounds like fun, though. I'd like to see somebody try this.

-=B=-

I reckon it's a troll question and the bike is one of those amusing mini-bikes that stands about 18"
high...... ;-) Dave.

"Dave" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"B. Sanders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:C2o9b.467040$uu5.81088@sccrnsc04...

Quoted message said:

"John Morgan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:Q1n9b.54822$cj1.31711@fed1read06...

Quoted message said:

> Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built

hardtail

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

> weighing in at only 12lbs!!!?

Nothing, because it would be the wrong size.

12lbs is ridiculous. The lightest road bikes are around 14 lbs... and

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

don't want anything that light if you plan on having a bike that

handles

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

well.

12 lbs is only ridiculous if you use off-the-shelf components and

current

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

consumer-oriented technologies. I can imagine some exotic designs

employing

Quoted message said:

a carbon monocoque frame. Use dry ceramic bearings or Oilite sleeve bearings, Ti bolts, Vectran
or Ti spokes, beryllium-laminated carbon

rims -

Quoted message said:

yeah, you could do it. It would be insanely expensive, and almost

completely

Quoted message said:

custom engineered and manufactured; but it would be rideable. There

would

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

definitely be some reliability vs. weight trade-offs.

You can save a lot of weight in key areas. The tires, for instance,

could

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

be a urethane-coated single-layer Kevlar casing with a very thin

low-density

Quoted message said:

rubber tread bonded to it. We're talking about ~220 gram tubeless knobbies, but with a short
lifespan. The cranks and BB would have to be

an

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

integrated design like XTR; but even more radical. Make it a carbon single-ring, integrated
concentric-tubular beryllium BB design with

Oilite

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

sleeve bearings, and you probably could stay under 400 grams for the crank+BB. You'd save 140
grams by not having a front derailleur. Make

the

Quoted message said:

Ti

Quoted message said:

cassette 11-34, and the chainring 30T, and it would be pretty reasonably geared. (This is a
concept bike, remember.)

I'm not saying you could make a *bombproof* 12lb bike; but you could

make

Quoted message said:

a

Quoted message said:

reasonably trailworthy bike in the 12 lb range. Not sure why you'd want

to

Quoted message said:

do it; but you could do it. The materials do exist to make it possible.

I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

put together a spreadsheet to test out some configurations, and it's definitely possible, even
using some off-the-shelf components (saddle,

rear

Quoted message said:

der, brakes, BB, etc)

Sounds like fun, though. I'd like to see somebody try this.

-=B=-

I reckon it's a troll question and the bike is one of those amusing mini-bikes that stands about
18" high...... ;-)

A guy can dream, can't he?

It makes me happy to think about 12-lb carbon bikes. I'm just a bike tech geek, I guess.

-=B=-

do we have to include medical costs for after it snaps in two?

--

"Mark Romero" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

"Mark Romero" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

Lemme guess...bamboo?!?

(Have any of the 1 billion bicycle riding Chinese folks ever wondered about the frame potential of
that weed in their backyard? One with a weight per strength ratio exceeding carbon.)

Incredibly strong in compression: scaffolds 20+ stories. Equally strong in tension: bridges.
Moderately strong torsionally: furniture.

Be interesting to see what an engineered bamboo bike - frame, stems, handlebars, shock, spokes -
would weigh and how it would perform relative to its chrome-moly > aluminum > titanium >
graphite/kevlar/carbon cousins. Talk about low tech.

Just make sure you apply the Thompson's Water Sealer before you go riding. At 90% cellulose, its
slime waiting to happen.

Actually pre-preg bamboo might be the ticket. High pressure autoclave epoxy injection followed by
vacuum bagging.

Or how about synthetic bamboo? Better, stronger, perfectly uniform and cheap. Make it at home in
your kitchen. Open packet, add water. Presto, Chia bike al fresco.

Sorry, got a fever...fading....

Hugh

"JSNTG" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Lemme guess...bamboo?!?

(Have any of the 1 billion bicycle riding Chinese folks ever wondered

about

Quoted message said:

the frame potential of that weed in their backyard? One with a weight per strength ratio exceeding
carbon.)

Incredibly strong in compression: scaffolds 20+ stories. Equally strong in tension: bridges.
Moderately strong torsionally: furniture.

Be interesting to see what an engineered bamboo bike - frame, stems, handlebars, shock, spokes -
would weigh and how it would perform relative

to

Quoted message said:

its chrome-moly > aluminum > titanium > graphite/kevlar/carbon cousins. Talk about low tech.

There are a few bamboo bikes around.
americanbamboo.orgBambooBicycle.htmlOpen ↗

The problems would seem to be at the juncture points. Hub/spoke/rim, seat/tube, all manner of
bearings, etc.

Pete

"B. Sanders" <[email hidden]> wrote

Quoted message said:

Use dry ceramic bearings or Oilite sleeve bearings, Ti bolts, Vectran or Ti spokes,
beryllium-laminated carbon rims - yeah, you could do it.

[...]

Quoted message said:

You can save a lot of weight in key areas. The tires, for instance, could be a urethane-coated
single-layer Kevlar casing with a very thin low-density rubber tread bonded to it. We're talking
about ~220 gram tubeless knobbies, but with a short lifespan. The cranks and BB would have to be
an integrated design like XTR; but even more radical. Make it a carbon single-ring, integrated
concentric-tubular beryllium BB design with Oilite sleeve bearings, and you probably could stay
under 400 grams

Except that the emphasis on beryllium here is totally misplaced. Be has a couple of characteristics
that make it totally unsuitable for the purposes you outline above. First of all, the brittleness
would make it nearly useless for a "beryllium-lamminated carbon rim", a pipe dream if there ever was
one. As far as a bottom bracket component the way you describe, the hype outpaces the reality. Yes,
Be has phenomenal stiffness strength-to-weight ratio, but (and this is not widely appreciated) only
with respect to tension and shear. Its strength with respect to torsional forces is extremely low.
Look it up. A bike built like you say would self-destruct within a half mile of offroad riding.

And I'd love to see how you plan on bonding urethane to kevlar. I thought you claimed you knew what
you were talking about.

CC

Corvus Corvax scrawled in bright red lipstick:

Quoted message said:

And I'd love to see how you plan on bonding urethane to kevlar. I thought you claimed you knew
what you were talking about.

CC

maybe this site will tell you thistothat.comthistothat.comOpen ↗

P.

"Penny S" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Corvus Corvax scrawled in bright red lipstick:

Quoted message said:

And I'd love to see how you plan on bonding urethane to kevlar. I thought you claimed you knew
what you were talking about.

CC

maybe this site will tell you thistothat.comthistothat.comOpen ↗

Had you checked, you'd see neither substance is listed. Cute site tho.

"John Morgan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:Q1n9b.54822$cj1.31711@fed1read06...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Anyone out there....how much would you pay for a custom built hardtail weighing in at only
12lbs!!!?

Nothing, because it would be the wrong size.

12lbs is ridiculous. The lightest road bikes are around 14 lbs... and you don't want anything that
light if you plan on having a bike that handles well.

-John Morgan

Check out the 2nd pic from the bottom. singletrackworld.comarticle.phpOpen ↗

If my math is correct, it would seem to be under 11 pounds.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

12lbs is ridiculous. The lightest road bikes are around 14 lbs... and

you

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

don't want anything that light if you plan on having a bike that handles well.

12 lbs is only ridiculous if you use off-the-shelf components and current consumer-oriented
technologies. I can imagine some exotic designs

employing

Quoted message said:

a carbon monocoque frame. Use dry ceramic bearings or Oilite sleeve bearings, Ti bolts, Vectran or
Ti spokes, beryllium-laminated carbon

rims -

Quoted message said:

yeah, you could do it. It would be insanely expensive, and almost

completely

Quoted message said:

custom engineered and manufactured; but it would be rideable. There would definitely be some
reliability vs. weight trade-offs.

LOL, listen to yourself. You're just giving me a round-about definition of RIDICULOUS.

<snip 2 more paragraphs of foolishness>

-John Morgan