Helmetless

Tony Raven said:

maybe that feeling of insecurity is what makes it safer.

That's it! Someone here called it a 're-calibration' of your risk awareness.

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
..

Quoted message said:

I spent much more time checking traffic and being cautious.

That's what us helmetless people do all the time.

--
Simon M.

Tony Raven said:

Since all the hullabaloo over helmets and coming to the realisation that what
I had always assumed to be self evident wasn't, I have taken to riding on road
sans helmet (still wear one off-road). Today was my first big helmetless
excursion in London on the Brommie and I have to say it felt most insecure. I
spent much more time checking traffic and being cautious. Maybe years of
conditioning are hard to get rid of or maybe that feeling of insecurity is
what makes it safer.

That feeling of insecurity is good. If only motorists had the same thing.

Tony Raven said:

..... I spent much more time checking
traffic and being cautious.

rather than, I'll be OK if I get hit, I'm wearing my helmet.

On Mon, 24 May 2004 18:10:10 +0100, "Tony Raven"
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

Today was my first big helmetless
excursion in London on the Brommie and I have to say it felt most insecure. I
spent much more time checking traffic and being cautious.

And thus your nothelmet Saved Your Life[tm] ;-)

Guy
--
May contain traces of irony. Contents liable to settle after posting.
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

88% of helmet statistics are made up, 65% of them at Washington University

"Zog The Undeniable" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:40b231c7.0@entanet...

Quoted message said:

Tony Raven said:

Since all the hullabaloo over helmets and coming to the realisation that

what

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I had always assumed to be self evident wasn't, I have taken to riding

on road

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

sans helmet (still wear one off-road). Today was my first big

helmetless

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

excursion in London on the Brommie and I have to say it felt most

insecure. I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

spent much more time checking traffic and being cautious. Maybe years

of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

conditioning are hard to get rid of or maybe that feeling of insecurity

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

what makes it safer.

That feeling of insecurity is good. If only motorists had the same thing.

A very good point.

Too add to this, I work at a kart track, and I find it most amusing (and
slightly worrying) when the driver of the car which happily did 50mph + on
the road to the circuit (not necessarily dangerously) is absolutely
terrified of doing 25mph in the low-end karts we use at the circuit -
presumably partly because of the lower seating position (which gives more of
an impression of speed), and partly because of the lack of car-style safety
devices (seat belts, crumple zones and so on).

Tony Raven said:

I spent much more time checking
traffic and being cautious. Maybe years of conditioning are hard to
get rid of or maybe that feeling of insecurity is what makes it safer.

But will it last? Or will you gradually feel more secure as you forget
all about the helmet?

~PB

Simonb said:

Tony Raven said:

maybe that feeling of insecurity is what makes it safer.

That's it! Someone here called it a 're-calibration' of your risk awareness.

And I'll bet that in time when you are used to the feeling that something
is missing, you'll no longer feel insecure. What'll happen to that
recalibration then?

I feel insecure driving my car in the driveway without a seatbelt. Not, I
suppose, because I am more likely to be injured without one, but simply
because there's always a feeling that something is missing, and wrong.
I'm sure that if I drove my car in the driveway lots, I'd lose that
feeling of insecurity entirely.

--
Trevor Barton

In message <[email hidden]>, Simon Mason
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
.

Quoted message said:

I spent much more time checking traffic and being cautious.

That's what us helmetless people do all the time.

Hmm, I sometimes ride with a helmet and sometimes, don't (approx 50/50
ish) I can't say I've noticed any difference, but then, maybe I'm just
used to both.
--
Chris French, Leeds

Nathaniel Porter said:

"Zog The Undeniable" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:40b231c7.0@entanet...

Quoted message said:

Tony Raven said:

Since all the hullabaloo over helmets and coming to the realisation that

what

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I had always assumed to be self evident wasn't, I have taken to riding

on road

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

sans helmet (still wear one off-road). Today was my first big

helmetless

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

excursion in London on the Brommie and I have to say it felt most

insecure. I

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

spent much more time checking traffic and being cautious. Maybe years

of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

conditioning are hard to get rid of or maybe that feeling of insecurity

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

what makes it safer.

That feeling of insecurity is good. If only motorists had the same thing.

A very good point.

Too add to this, I work at a kart track, and I find it most amusing (and
slightly worrying) when the driver of the car which happily did 50mph + on
the road to the circuit (not necessarily dangerously) is absolutely
terrified of doing 25mph in the low-end karts we use at the circuit -
presumably partly because of the lower seating position (which gives more of
an impression of speed), and partly because of the lack of car-style safety
devices (seat belts, crumple zones and so on).

Oh, I dunno. I've been karting a couple of times (and I'd greatly
reccommend it as great fun) and the lack of belts etc didn't worry
me at all - I reasoned that it must be pretty safe without them otherwise
they'd be fitted either by legislation of by the owner's fear of being
sued. That, and the "Ah well, it's not my kart if I break it" led to me
winning on one occasion!

--
Trev

"Trevor Barton" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Nathaniel Porter said:

"Zog The Undeniable" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:40b231c7.0@entanet...

Quoted message said:

Tony Raven wrote:

> Since all the hullabaloo over helmets and coming to the realisation

that

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

what

Quoted message said:

> I had always assumed to be self evident wasn't, I have taken to

riding

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

on road

Quoted message said:

> sans helmet (still wear one off-road). Today was my first big

helmetless

Quoted message said:

> excursion in London on the Brommie and I have to say it felt most

insecure. I

Quoted message said:

> spent much more time checking traffic and being cautious. Maybe

years

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

of

Quoted message said:

> conditioning are hard to get rid of or maybe that feeling of

insecurity

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

is

Quoted message said:

> what makes it safer.

That feeling of insecurity is good. If only motorists had the same

thing.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

A very good point.

Too add to this, I work at a kart track, and I find it most amusing (and
slightly worrying) when the driver of the car which happily did 50mph +

on

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the road to the circuit (not necessarily dangerously) is absolutely
terrified of doing 25mph in the low-end karts we use at the circuit -
presumably partly because of the lower seating position (which gives

more of

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

an impression of speed), and partly because of the lack of car-style

safety

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

devices (seat belts, crumple zones and so on).

Oh, I dunno. I've been karting a couple of times (and I'd greatly
reccommend it as great fun) and the lack of belts etc didn't worry
me at all - I reasoned that it must be pretty safe without them otherwise
they'd be fitted either by legislation of by the owner's fear of being
sued. That, and the "Ah well, it's not my kart if I break it" led to me
winning on one occasion!

Absolutely.

But some a surprising amount of people do seem genuinly terrified when doing
a speed in a kart in controlled circumstances which they would consider a
crawl if they were doing it in their car on the public highway

Nathaniel Porter said:

But some a surprising amount of people do seem genuinly terrified when doing
a speed in a kart in controlled circumstances which they would consider a
crawl if they were doing it in their car on the public highway

Well, fair enough. I get scared at speeds on my inline skates which
wouldn't even get me off the ground if I were in a commercial
airliner.

Not that I (often) get off the ground on skates either, admittedly.

-dan

--
"please make sure that the person is your friend before you confirm"

Just zis Guy said:

On Mon, 24 May 2004 18:10:10 +0100, "Tony Raven"
<[email hidden]> wrote in message
<[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

Today was my first big helmetless
excursion in London on the Brommie and I have to say it felt most insecure. I
spent much more time checking traffic and being cautious.

And thus your nothelmet Saved Your Life[tm] ;-)

Just like this lady's notseatbelt saved hers:

http://www.topgear.com/content/my_topgear/prangs/05/03/

Natural selection must have been looking the other way.

Not that I am in any way advocating the non-wearing of seatbelts - you
won't catch me without mine!

--
Mark.

Pete Biggs said:

But will it last? Or will you gradually feel more secure as you forget
all about the helmet?

That's what's happened with me as I've been wearing mine less and less.
Of late I'll only wear it on the Muni, though it would be on if I was
MTBing too.
My first big helmet free excursion in years was the shakedown cruise of
the Streetmachine. Turned up at Ardrossan for the Arran ferry with the
bike in the back of the car, took out the bike, luggage, and... damn!
forgot my lid! Should I carry on? Didn't come all this way to turn
around, rode for years without one, let's just get on with it... Quite
odd at first, as Tony reported, but going up 1000' of continuous climb
on a May day I ended up rather glad I'd forgotten it.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch University of Dundee
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Medical Physics, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

"Tony Raven" <[email hidden]> wrote:

| Since all the hullabaloo over helmets and coming to the realisation that what
| I had always assumed to be self evident wasn't, I have taken to riding on road
| sans helmet (still wear one off-road). Today was my first big helmetless
| excursion in London on the Brommie and I have to say it felt most insecure. I
| spent much more time checking traffic and being cautious. Maybe years of
| conditioning are hard to get rid of or maybe that feeling of insecurity is
| what makes it safer.

That's why I 'em FUD-caps.

BTW, the caution about other traffic doesn't wear off with
familiarity. It stays at exactly the right level since there's nothing
now in the way to skew the reasoning process.

--
Patrick Herring, Sheffield, UK
http://www.anweald.co.uk

Patrick Herring said:

BTW, the caution about other traffic doesn't wear off with
familiarity. It stays at exactly the right level since there's nothing
now in the way to skew the reasoning process.

Neat theory but it's too simple, IMO.

There is *over*-caution immediately after giving up the helmet because
your head feels very different so you can't stop thinking about how
"vulnerable" you are. But, IME, that does evaporate after you get used to
the way your head feels and behaviour then normalises.

But going back to how it is when wearing a helmet...........

I've always had some trouble with the risk compensation theory with
bicycle helmets (on-road at least) because, at least with well-experienced
or informed cyclists*, there are plenty of fears to keep you in check
*before* worrying about hitting your head. I don't want to fall or crash
because I'm quite likely to badly graze my arms and legs, sprain a wrist
and wreck my bike. I don't want any of those things happening at all! So
I don't want to crash at all. Head protection is very much a secondary
consideration, in fact so much so that I don't bother wearing one any more
for normal cycling**.

Actually I did once hit my head in a cycling accident whilst not wearing a
helmet, but the experience only reinforces my view as the head injury
didn't actually cause me any problems (apart from forgetting the
circumstances of the crash). It was the damage to my back and bike that
put me out of action for a long time. Of course the head injury could
have been worse if the impact was worse, but as we know, bicycle helmets
can't actually provide much protection anyway. The experience also made
me modify my behaviour, considerably, but I fear that I'm slowly returning
to my old ways.

Still, knowing my head is better protected wouldn't make me want to risk
busting my arms and legs and bike any more. But perhaps this does not
apply to people who regard those sort of injuries as trivial, so Helmet
Risk Compensation Theory probably apply to them.

* people who know that other injuries are more common than head injuries.

** I did for a year or so: got fed up with getting overheated (vents only
work when moving, and moving at a good speed). I don't believe I took any
more risks when I wore one for regular cycling. However, I would wear one
again if I deliberately wanted to take more risks for more special kinds
of cycling, eg. for racing or chain gang type riding or hard-core
off-roading.

~PB

Pete Biggs said:

Tony Raven said:

I spent much more time checking
traffic and being cautious. Maybe years of conditioning are hard to
get rid of or maybe that feeling of insecurity is what makes it safer.

But will it last? Or will you gradually feel more secure as you forget
all about the helmet?

Well, maybe he'll stop worrying about the helmet and start feeling
insecure if he doesn't check the traffic instead...

Roger