Headset threads?

"David Kerber" <ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside of
the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded headset? I'm
putting together a beater bike, and I can't quite get all
the wiggle out of the fork when it's installed and the
headset is tightened down as far as it will go. Another
1/8" of threads would do it, though, so I plan on buying a
die and cutting a bit more length of threads.

I've checked the bearings and races, and they are in
decent shape.

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You'll probably find that the cost of the appropriate tools
to cut the steerer threads is more than you're willing to
bear for your "beater bike". Either have a bike shop do it
for you, or take the fork to a local machinist and show him
how much more threads you need. He can cut them on his lathe
easily. That's what I did when I had the same problem and it
was done in about 15 minutes while I waited. Cost me about
$20. BTW, don't worry about the groove that runs down the
length of the steerer to interteract with the tab on the
washer that goes under the headset nut. You don't need that
effect, so just file the tab off of the washer, if it's
still there.

Cal

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

"David Kerber" <ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside
of the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded
headset? I'm putting together a beater bike, and I can't
quite get all the wiggle out of the fork when it's
installed and the headset is tightened down as far as it
will go. Another 1/8" of threads would do it, though, so
I plan on buying a die and cutting a bit more length of
threads.

I've checked the bearings and races, and they are in
decent shape.

Quoted message said:

You'll probably find that the cost of the appropriate
tools to cut the steerer threads is more than you're
willing to bear for your "beater bike".

I've already got a tap and die set, just no die in that
size. If I knew what the threads were, I'd price the die and
then make the decision.

Quoted message said:

Either have a bike shop do it for you, or take the fork to
a local machinist and show him how much more threads you
need. He can cut them on his lathe easily. That's what I
did when I had the same problem and it was done in about
15 minutes while I waited. Cost me about $20. BTW, don't
worry about the groove that runs down the length of the
steerer to interteract with the tab on the washer that
goes under the headset nut. You don't need that effect, so
just file the tab off of the washer, if it's still there.

Thanks for the suggestion!

--
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the newsgroups if possible).

David Kerber ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside of
the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded headset? I'm
putting together a beater bike, and I can't quite get all
the wiggle out of the fork when it's installed and the
headset is tightened down as far as it will go. Another
1/8" of threads would do it, though, so I plan on buying a
die and cutting a bit more length of threads.

I've checked the bearings and races, and they are in
decent shape.

The die will be quite expensive. Consider simply installing
a spacer under the top nut.

Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles habcycles.comhabcycles.comOpen ↗ Home of
the $695 ti frame

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

David Kerber ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside of
the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded headset?
I'm putting together a beater bike, and I can't quite get
all the wiggle out of the fork when it's installed and
the headset is tightened down as far as it will go.
Another 1/8" of threads would do it, though, so I plan on
buying a die and cutting a bit more length of threads.

I've checked the bearings and races, and they are in
decent shape.

The die will be quite expensive. Consider simply
installing a spacer under the top nut.

What would that be, just a large washer? I don't see how
that would help: the top threaded race (the one with the
knurled edge) is bottoming out on the threads before it
takes up all the play in the headset. The locknut on top of
it still has some room, though. Maybe a spacer under the
bottom race to raise it up just a bit?

--
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the newsgroups if possible).

In article <[email hidden]>,
ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net says...

Quoted message said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside of
the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded headset? I'm
putting together a beater bike, and I can't quite get all
the wiggle out of the fork when it's installed and the
headset is tightened down as far as it will go. Another
1/8" of threads would do it, though, so I plan on buying a
die and cutting a bit more length of threads.

I've checked the bearings and races, and they are in
decent shape.

The price of such a die is quite high. It makes more sense
to take it to a competent shop that has the right tool and
can do this for you.
-------------
Alex

In article <[email hidden]>,
ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net says...

Quoted message said:

I've already got a tap and die set, just no die in that
size. If I knew what the threads were, I'd price the die
and then make the decision.

the cutter is the most expensive part. Also, are you sure
you tap and die set has the proper size handle to hold such
a large die?
----------------
Alex

David Kerber <ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

"David Kerber" <ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside
of the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded
headset?

<snip>

It's probably 1" x 24tpi if it's a more recent bike. Older
bikes might be French or British thread. Check the Harris
Cyclery pages if you have doubts.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

You'll probably find that the cost of the appropriate
tools to cut the steerer threads is more than you're
willing to bear for your "beater bike".

I've already got a tap and die set, just no die in that
size. If I knew what the threads were, I'd price the die
and then make the decision.

Here's a selection: biketoolsetc.comindex.cgiOpen ↗
d=594510960559&c=Tools&sc=Fork&tc=Column%20Threading%20Dies
or tinyurl.com2zd2aOpen ↗

Cheap dies are about $20- but they're only good for chasing
existing threads. It may still be better to have new threads
cut at the local bike shop.

Jeff

If the adjusting race has bottomed on the available threads, but is
very close to working, one non-cutting option might be to find a
taller cups, one with much more stack height. The thread is 1-inch x
24 tpi for one-inch columns. Park Tool does make a die and handle
set: parktool.comFTS 1.shtmlOpen ↗

"David Kerber" <ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside of
the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded headset? I'm
putting together a beater bike, and I can't quite get all
the wiggle out of the fork when it's installed and the
headset is tightened down as far as it will go. Another
1/8" of threads would do it, though, so I plan on buying a
die and cutting a bit more length of threads.

I've checked the bearings and races, and they are in
decent shape.

--
Remove the ns_ from if replying by e-mail (but keep posts
in the newsgroups if possible).

Hey David,

I'd agree with Alex et al. It's probably best just to take
it to a bike shop and let them cuts some threads. It's
easier than the alternatives and it'll likely only cost $10-
$15. The die is a huge affair and quite costly. And you'll
likely never use it again! Even an old pro like me would
suck it up and take it to a shop rather than buy the die.
And it's not worth fudging around with headsets..just cut it
and be done with it.

Cheers!

Scott..

On Wed, 12 May 2004 08:03:43 -0400, David Kerber

ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside of
the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded headset? I'm
putting together a beater bike, and I can't quite get all
the wiggle out of the fork when it's installed and the
headset is tightened down as far as it will go. Another
1/8" of threads would do it, though, so I plan on buying a
die and cutting a bit more length of threads.

I've checked the bearings and races, and they are in
decent shape.

If you think you have the tools and know-how to cut these
threads, you should also have the tools and know-how to
measure the threads yourself. Since you had to ask here, I
would recommend paying someone else to do it.

Quoted message said:

David Kerber ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside of
the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded headset? I'm
putting together a beater bike, and I can't quite get all
the wiggle out of the fork when it's installed and the
headset is tightened down as far as it will go. Another
1/8" of threads would do it, though, so I plan on buying a
die and cutting a bit more length of threads. I've checked
the bearings and races, and they are in decent shape.

Mark Hickey said:

The die will be quite expensive. Consider simply
installing a spacer under the top nut.

A regular USA 1" x 24 die is $6.84 Umpiloted. (J+L
Industrial, DIE-12883M)

If his top race can't go down far enough, a headset with
more lower stack is one solution. Paying a frame service
shop $25 or $30 for a little longer thread may be a better
value than buying an unpiloted die - which will drift even
over a couple of threads.

--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1
April, 1971

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net says...

Quoted message said:

I've already got a tap and die set, just no die in that
size. If I knew what the threads were, I'd price the die
and then make the decision.

Alex Rodriguez said:

the cutter is the most expensive part. Also, are you sure
you tap and die set has the proper size handle to hold
such a large die?

It is a standard 2" handle - as a plumber would use. The
handle ($20) is more than the die ($7) but both are cheap.

A piloted system by Campagnolo, Silva, Cobra, Zeus or even
VAR is expensive indeed. I know because I own all of those.
Generally in the $300 to $400 range - each!

yellowjersey.orgtools.htmlOpen ↗ sixth and seventh
photos show these tools.

--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1
April, 1971

In article <[email hidden]>, David Kerber

ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

David Kerber ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net said:

What are the standard threads (the ones on the outside
of the steerer tube) for an older-style threaded
headset? I'm putting together a beater bike, and I
can't quite get all the wiggle out of the fork when
it's installed and the headset is tightened down as far
as it will go. Another 1/8" of threads would do it,
though, so I plan on buying a die and cutting a bit
more length of threads.

I've checked the bearings and races, and they are in
decent shape.

The die will be quite expensive. Consider simply
installing a spacer under the top nut.

? I've trouble visualizing that.

Quoted message said:

What would that be, just a large washer? I don't see how
that would help: the top threaded race (the one with the
knurled edge) is bottoming out on the threads before it
takes up all the play in the headset. The locknut on top
of it still has some room, though. Maybe a spacer under
the bottom race to raise it up just a bit?

I wouldn't go that route. It's beneficial to have the crown
race seated firmly onto the fork steerer and placing a
spacer/washer beneath the race leaves less of the steerer
tube crown race seat available to the crown race.

My recommendation: If you only require a few millimeters of
thread, swap out the headset (either both headset cups or
just one) with another having a higher stack height.
Typically, headsets with roller bearings in the lower cup
have greater stack heights than those using balls in boths
cups. I"ve had occasion to resort to this solution in the
past and it's worked well. It's definitely preferable to
cutting extra threads.

luke

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
ns_dkerber@ns_ids.net says...

Quoted message said:

I've already got a tap and die set, just no die in that
size. If I knew what the threads were, I'd price the die
and then make the decision.

the cutter is the most expensive part. Also, are you sure
you tap and die set has the proper size handle to hold
such a large die?

Since the threads are already there and I'd just be
cutting them a little further down the tube, a 12"
crescent wrench would be fine (you couldn't start new
threads that way, though).

However, since my LBS only wants $12 to do this job, I've
decided not to bother with the die. Even if I could find
one, which is looking doubtful right now, it would cost
around $20.

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A Muzi said:

It is a standard 2" handle - as a plumber would use. The
handle ($20) is more than the die ($7) but both are cheap.

Where do you get fork thread dies that cheap? And is that
only for 1"-24 or also for 1-1/8"-26?

Chalo Colina

-snip my erroneous prices, sorry-

Chalo said:

Where do you get fork thread dies that cheap? And is that
only for 1"-24 or also for 1-1/8"-26?

J + L Industrial, the place I've been buying drill bits,
files, emery, taps, cutting fluid, lathe tools, air tools,
burrs, blades, chucks, etc for twenty five years. We get
overnight delivery from a local warehouse and open billing.
2000 page catalog that you'd probably use, Chalo.

jlindustrial.comjlindustrial.comOpen ↗

I erred by not reading over to the proper column on page
219.

The die is $30, part number DSP76550C. The handle
DHO18507C is $7.07.

Back to Mr Kerber's problem.

I own such a die and a handle for it. Useless for this.
It's nearly impossible to cut new threads on a bicycle
fork as the tool wants to drift to the side . The 'bike'
brands ( I also own Campagnolo, VAR, Zeus, Silva and
Cobra) are expensive specialty tools which are piloted to
stay centered.

--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1
April, 1971