He's right though - unfortunately.

Simon Mason came up with the following;:

Quoted message said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

Absolutely.

--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!

Fantic 307 Trials on ebay 4558564657
Beamish 250 Trials on ebay 4558566146

Simon Mason said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

I see cyclists and car-drivers go through red-lights on a daily basis.
The cyclists often hop onto the kerb, at the stop line, and ride on
the pavement and over the pedestrian crossing then back onto the road
after the junction. This annoys me, as it gives the impression that
cyclists are immune to the Highway Code and the law. However, it
rarely interferes with my use of the road (apart from making me very
wary of just which direction the next hooter is going to come from).

Car red-light-jumpers, on the other hand, *DO* get in my way because
they may jump a light on the road which crosses my direction of travel
and they end up blocking the part of the road that I am about to drive
onto. I regularly (ie daily) have cars coming from my right, across
my direction of travel, when my light is on Green. These cars are
usually going faster than the speed limit - presumably because it's
dangerous to go *slowly* through a red light!

I'm sure this has ony really started to be a very regular occurrence
in the last couple of years. I'd ban 'em (and burn the bodies,
obviously).

Judith

At Sat, 25 Jun 2005 11:45:27 +0100, message
<[email hidden]> was posted by "Simon Mason"
<[email hidden]>, including some, all or none of the
following:

Quoted message said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:
http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

Get in there quick, Simon, with the RAC survey stats cited by Tony.
Point out that no road user group is immune form lawbreaking, and that
picking and choosing the laws you choose to complain about others
breaking is not very helpful. Most of us here are strongly in favour
of *everybody* obeying the rules.

Guy
--
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

"To every complex problem there is a solution which is
simple, neat and wrong" - HL Mencken

"Simon Mason" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

--
Simon Mason

Cyclists go through red lights for the same reason car drivers do.
People break laws that they think they can get away with.
I drive 16,000 miles per year (mainly) in London; cycle about 3,000 and see
far more laws broken by car drivers than by cyclists.
On the other hand there are more cars than cycles, so perhaps the proportion
of law breakers is the same.

I have noticed that motorists tend to moan about cyclists and cyclists about
motorists!

Paul.

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

"Simon Mason" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

Cyclists go through red lights for the same reason car drivers do.
People break laws that they think they can get away with.

Utter, utter, nonsense.

--
Mike

Simon Mason said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

I'd hate to see him get worked up over something that really matters,
like tuneless whistling or grocers apostrophe's.

--
James Annan
see web pages for email
http://www.ne.jp/asahi/julesandjames/home/
http://julesandjames.blogspot.com/

"James Annan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Simon Mason said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

I'd hate to see him get worked up over something that really matters, like
tuneless whistling or grocers apostrophe's.

To my mind there is nothing worse than the twisted few who try to introduce
commonsense into Usenet threads.

in message <[email hidden]>, Judith

(') said:

Simon Mason said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

I see cyclists and car-drivers go through red-lights on a daily basis.
The cyclists often hop onto the kerb, at the stop line, and ride on
the pavement and over the pedestrian crossing then back onto the road
after the junction. This annoys me, as it gives the impression that
cyclists are immune to the Highway Code and the law. However, it
rarely interferes with my use of the road

This is not an excuse. Unfortunately I don't know what one does about
it. Possibly some more generally available basic training for cyclists,
and possibly the police should be empowered, when the encounter a
cyclist engaging in idiocy to offer them the alternative of going on
basic training or facing prosecution.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other
;; languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and riffle their
;; pockets for new vocabulary -- James D. Nicoll

Paul - censored said:

Simon Mason came up with the following;:

Quoted message said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

Absolutely.

I'm out with my eleven year old daughter today in West London, she
passed her Cycling Proficiency about 9 months ago and is reliable. We
decide to use some busier and more complicated roads for practice, so we
did a few small roundabouts on a "B" road, some traffic light filtered
left and right turns, down a shared use path [1] and then a nice piece
of urban "A" road with lots of big red buses and an 75cm wide farcility
full of drain covers which she intelligently ignored. We stop at a red
light at a busy junction. She is nicely placed in the primary riding
position so she can't easily be left-hooked. I'm a few feet behind so I
can watch and provide the sort of unwanted advice that fathers do.

A POB speeds through the gap between me and her, and her and the kerb
and straight across the junction.

"Dad", she says, "Why did that man do that?"

Answers on a postcard to...

Julesh

[1] If anyone is concerned that I might have been risking her life I
will point out that the shared use path is not that popular with
pedestrians as it passes through the middle of a sewerage works!

Chris Eilbeck said:

Julesh said:

A POB speeds through the gap between me and her, and her and the
kerb and straight across the junction.

POB?

P erson O n B ike. as opposed to a cyclist.

--
yours S

Nihil curo de ista tua stulta superstitione

Julesh said:

A POB speeds through the gap between me and her, and her and the kerb
and straight across the junction.

POB?

Chris
--
Chris Eilbeck

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]
says...

Quoted message said:

mb said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

"Simon Mason" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:
>
> http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm
>

Cyclists go through red lights for the same reason car drivers do.
People break laws that they think they can get away with.

Utter, utter, nonsense.

Why is that utter, utter nonsense? Makes perfect sense to me. People do
all sorts of minor things that might be against the law but do so because
of a perceived notion that they can get away with it.

If you need to ask...

--
Mike

"Simon Mason" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

He is. Why don't you, as a known local cycling advocate, write a follow up
letter saying just that.

T

Julesh came up with the following;:

Quoted message said:

Paul - censored said:

Simon Mason came up with the following;:

Quoted message said:

Main letter in local rag about red light jumpers:

http://www.simonmason.karoo.net/zmail2.htm

Absolutely.

We stop at a red
light at a busy junction. She is nicely placed in the primary riding
position so she can't easily be left-hooked. I'm a few feet behind so I
can watch and provide the sort of unwanted advice that fathers do.

Isn't it a great feeling, teaching the kids and watching them gain
confidence.

Quoted message said:

A POB speeds through the gap between me and her, and her and the kerb
and straight across the junction.

"Dad", she says, "Why did that man do that?"

buggeredifiknowson ... 😉

--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!

Fantic 307 Trials on ebay 4558564657
Beamish 250 Trials on ebay 4558566146

soup said:

Chris Eilbeck said:

Julesh said:

A POB speeds through the gap between me and her, and her and the
kerb and straight across the junction.

POB?

P erson O n B ike. as opposed to a cyclist.

As someone who cycles sometimes, drives at others and walks too I'm
not sure I like the distinction implied by that.

Chris
--
Chris Eilbeck

Chris Eilbeck said:

soup said:

P erson O n B ike. as opposed to a cyclist.

As someone who cycles sometimes, drives at others and walks too I'm
not sure I like the distinction implied by that.

The line is drawn between those who have some idea what they're doing
and respect for the law, and those who don't.

The amount you cycle is irrelevant. OK?

But drivers ignore/fail to notice red lights much more than other
drivers think they do.

Only today I watched a driver start off and go through a red that he
was expecting to turn green. It didn't - the ped phase happened instead.

Colin McKenzie

mb said:

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

mb said:

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...
>Cyclists go through red lights for the same reason car drivers do.
>People break laws that they think they can get away with.

Utter, utter, nonsense.

Why is that utter, utter nonsense? Makes perfect sense to me. People do
all sorts of minor things that might be against the law but do so because
of a perceived notion that they can get away with it.

If you need to ask...

I do too. IME Paulmouk is exactly right - with the proviso that the
percentage of road users operating on this basis (what they can get
away with) is not 100. It's pretty high, though.

Colin McKenzie

In article <[email hidden]>,
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

mb said:

In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]

Quoted message said:

mb wrote:
>In article <[email hidden]>,
>[email hidden] says...
>>Cyclists go through red lights for the same reason car drivers do.
>>People break laws that they think they can get away with.
>
>Utter, utter, nonsense.

Why is that utter, utter nonsense? Makes perfect sense to me. People do
all sorts of minor things that might be against the law but do so because
of a perceived notion that they can get away with it.

If you need to ask...

I do too. IME Paulmouk is exactly right - with the proviso that the
percentage of road users operating on this basis (what they can get
away with) is not 100. It's pretty high, though.

Where's the proof?
This is complete and utter tosh, don't judge people by your own morals.

--
Mike

At Sat, 25 Jun 2005 21:50:25 +0100, message
<[email hidden]> was posted by
Colin McKenzie <[email hidden]>, including some, all or none of
the following:

Quoted message said:

drivers ignore/fail to notice red lights much more than other
drivers think they do

I can only think of one traffic light on my commute which I have never
seen any car or bus driver jump. I have seen a lot of car drivers
stop at this light and turn right or left, but they always stop.

It is clearly marked "buses, taxis and cycles only"...

Guy
--
http://www.chapmancentral.co.uk

"To every complex problem there is a solution which is
simple, neat and wrong" - HL Mencken