Handlebar-mounted GPS

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 18:37:30 -0400, Dave Stallard <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Anybody have any recommendations on these models? Is the 8
MB limit confining in terms of the fraction of the Earth's
surface area it can hold a map for? 😉 This is for day
rides, rather than a cross the USA trip. I'm told the 8 MB
has better screen resolution than the 24 MB.

Dave

The screens are identical.

8MB will be fine if you only use it to ride, in the same
places. If you're like many GPS users, you'll probably end
up using it for more than cycling. loading maps via a serial
connection takes a while, the Vista will allow you to load a
large area and maybe never have to futz with it again. I'd
go with the Vista (24 MB).

The only real advantage to the 8MB model is slightly better
battery life, as the compass and altimeter use some power.
If you end up not using the unit as much as you'd like, the
24 MB GPS will probably fetch a greater percentage of the
original cost in resale value..

I recently sold my 24MB eTrex Vista, after several years of
pleasurable use, in favor of a 56MB color GPS60CS. The 60CS
is the eighth unit I've owned.

Barry

Quoted message said:

Anybody have any recommendations on these models?

Yeah, I have a recommendation, but you won't like it. Don't
get them. They are fine units, for what they do. But think
about it. Do you really need GPS to ride a bike?

Only, I think, in the wilderness, do you intend to
ride there?

I've never had a location problem that I couldn't resolve
with a map and a compass, and in most cases the compass was
valuable but not vital.

Your mileage may vary, objects in your mirror may be closer
than they appear, etc.

Look into land navigation and orienteering before you buy a
GPS unit, is my advice.

Also, read this,
logicsouth.comland nav.htmOpen ↗

It is a lot cheaper than GPS and it uses no electricity.
Even if you do go with GPS it pays to know this.

In the days of sail, it was the mark of an officer that he
knew how to navigate, this was the class distinction, heh.

It would pay you to know how to navigate without GPS.

--

_______________________ALL AMIGA IN MY
MIND_______________________ ------------------"Buddy Holly,
the Texas Elvis"------------------ __________306.350.357.38-

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

[email hidden]__________

In article <[email hidden]>,

Eric S. Sande said:

It would pay you to know how to navigate without GPS.

And there's a certain fanciful, romanciful mystique to
getting lost, sometimes.

I wish I could get a little lost and go on a li'l
exploration trek, but I'd have to go much further afield
than I have time or money for these days.

As a cyclocomputer addict, I'm not one to discourage
anyone from their choice of gadgetry, though. But if I had
the wherewithal to buy a really good GPS, I'd be more
inclined to put it towards a reasonably good camera. And
take pix of interesting places I might stumble across. But
that's just me.

good ride, Tom

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Eric S. Sande said:

Quoted message said:

Anybody have any recommendations on these models?

Yeah, I have a recommendation, but you won't like it.
Don't get them. They are fine units, for what they do. But
think about it. Do you really need GPS to ride a bike?

No, not at all. This would just be for fun. And to figure
out how to get back on a main road after straying off into
this intriguing little side roads.

Dave

Eric S. Sande wrote in part:

<<

Quoted message said:

Anybody have any recommendations on these models?

Yeah, I have a recommendation, but you won't like it. Don't
get them. They are fine units, for what they do. But think
about it. Do you really need GPS to ride a bike?

Only, I think, in the wilderness, do you intend to
ride there?

<snip>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

And anyway it is illegal to ride a bike in the wilderness,
as it is defined by the federal government.

Also the OP should consider that the GPS numbers won't mean
much if the map is wrong, as maps often are.

Robert

In article <[email hidden]>,

Dave Stallard said:

No, not at all. This would just be for fun.

In that case, go for it, and use it unwisely :-)

Fun is underestimatedly good.

- Tom

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On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 19:22:21 -0700, [email hidden] (Tom Keats)

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, "Eric S. Sande"

Quoted message said:

It would pay you to know how to navigate without GPS.

And there's a certain fanciful, romanciful mystique to
getting lost, sometimes.

I wish I could get a little lost and go on a li'l
exploration trek, but I'd have to go much further afield
than I have time or money for these days.

As a cyclocomputer addict, I'm not one to discourage
anyone from their choice of gadgetry, though. But if I had
the wherewithal to buy a really good GPS, I'd be more
inclined to put it towards a reasonably good camera. And
take pix of interesting places I might stumble across. But
that's just me.

try being on the other side of the world, in a country where
you can't read the signs very well. you'll be glad you have
that little GPS in

at one time you could get a cable for the Canon line of
digital cameras which would connect to a Garmin GPS for
date/time/position stamping.

Michael J. Klein Please replace mousepotato with
asiancastings

On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 23:01:30 -0400, Dave Stallard <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Eric S. Sande said:

Quoted message said:

Anybody have any recommendations on these models?

Yeah, I have a recommendation, but you won't like it.
Don't get them. They are fine units, for what they
do. But think about it. Do you really need GPS to
ride a bike?

No, not at all. This would just be for fun. And to figure
out how to get back on a main road after straying off into
this intriguing little side roads.

for some reason my news server didn't retain the
original post....

if you are going to get a GPS, you should get one which
allows you to do whatever you may intend to do with it later
on. the thing about having a GPS is that you start to find
other uses for it, some recreational, and perhaps some
professional. the GPS should have sufficient memory to
handle uploaded maps and also be universally accepted as a
standard. for these reasons I would recommend the Garmin
eTrex Vista (after owning and using Garmin GPS models
professionally for 10 years).

that being said, there are some PDA solutions which are also
good. however, i have never dropped my PDA from a moving
vehicle, or taken it on the high seas in a storm, both of
which my Garmins have experienced with no ill effects. the
PDA itself is probably not robust enough to handle some of
the field uses.

whatever you decide to purchase, make sure that you have a
computer interface and the interconnect cable. this will
make managing and creating waypoints and routes a lot more
convenient, not to mention being able to back them up. i was
on a tropical island off the SE coast of Taiwan when my GPS
decided to reset in my pocket because of pressure on the
particular button combination which resets the unit. i lost
all of my waypoint and route data collected to that point.

Michael J. Klein Please replace mousepotato with
asiancastings

In article <[email hidden]>,

Michael J. Klein said:

try being on the other side of the world, in a country
where you can't read the signs very well.

Yeah. :-) That would be heavenly.

One of these days I'm /gonna/ do Iceland. I feel I'm
predilected to do so, when the timing is right.

Quoted message said:

you'll be glad you have that little GPS in

I'd rather opportunely meet nice ppl on the roadside. From
what I've read, cycle touring can be as isolated or as
socially interactive as one wants.

I don't want no gizmos tearing me away from fellow ppl.

- Tom

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Tom Keats said:

Michael J. Klein said:

try being on the other side of the world, in a country
where you can't read the signs very well.

Yeah. :-) That would be heavenly.

One of these days I'm /gonna/ do Iceland. I feel I'm
predilected to do so, when the timing is right.

Quoted message said:

you'll be glad you have that little GPS in

Quoted message said:

I'd rather opportunely meet nice ppl on the roadside. From
what I've read, cycle touring can be as isolated or as
socially interactive as one wants.

I don't want no gizmos tearing me away from fellow ppl.

In some places, your fellow ppl (not all ppl are nice) will
steal your stuff and leave you for dead at the side of the
road/trail. In one such case the only thing that saved my
baby son was the fact that he was twice as big as the fellow
ppl and a lot angrier.

Not always, but sometimes it's better to stay away from
fellow ppl.

--
Cheers, Bev
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Rule 18: Always tip your hat before striking a lady.

In article <[email hidden]>,

The Real Bev said:

In some places, your fellow ppl (not all ppl are nice)
will steal your stuff and leave you for dead at the side
of the road/trail. In one such case the only thing that
saved my baby son was the fact that he was twice as big as
the fellow ppl and a lot angrier.

Not always, but sometimes it's better to stay away from
fellow ppl.

In that case, it's better to stay home and watch TV, and
hang the bike up for good.

I hear it's possible to work one's way from NS to Iceland,
washing dishes etc on tramp freighters.

good ride, Tom

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B a r r y said:

Quoted message said:

trip. I'm told the 8 MB has better screen resolution than
the 24 MB.

The screens are identical.

Display resolution from one Etrex model to the next is
not the same.

Example: Etrex: 128 x 64 Etrex Venture: 288 x 160

See garmin.comcompare.jspOpen ↗ for specs.

I've been happy with my Etrex Venture for mountain biking,
recording my track and creating the map as I ride. I haven't
tried any map downloading, nor any automated route creation
with it (does it even do automated routing?), so I don't
know how good it would be for pre-planned road rides with
downloaded maps. At worst, you could (on your PC) create
waypoints at each turn and add them to a route.

The Etrex handlebar mount (works on all Etrex models) is
secure and robust.
--
Rick Onanian

(R15757) said:

Also the OP should consider that the GPS numbers won't mean
much if the map is wrong, as maps often are.

GPS numbers mean exactly where you are, regardless of maps.

That's a strength of GPS: if the map on which you've
depended for the last 100 miles is wrong, and it's paper,
you're screwed. If said map is in a GPS, as least you can
easily get back to your last accurate waypoint.
--
Rick Onanian

Eric S. Sande said:

Yeah, I have a recommendation, but you won't like it. Don't
get them. They are fine units, for what they do. But think
about it. Do you really need GPS to ride a bike?

I've never had a location problem that I couldn't resolve
with a map and a compass, and in most cases the compass was
valuable but not vital.

The purpose of GPS routing on roads is to save time; also, a
GPS is more compact than a pile of paper maps, and the Etrex
series is more robust than paper too -- works fine in heavy
rain for example.

It's great for purposely getting lost and having an easy way
back, too.

Quoted message said:

It would pay you to know how to navigate without GPS.

It does indeed pay. It's nice to know how to (and be
equipped to) navigate both ways. Fail safe navigation beats
getting lost when your map blows away in the wind (or gets
rained on, or it's the wrong map) as well as it beats the
broken GPS or the valley with no signal.
--
Rick Onanian

Dave Stallard <[email hidden]> wrote in news:c6hehe$bk8e5$1@ID-
178518.news.uni-berlin.de:

Quoted message said:

I'm looking to get a GPS with map display for my bike,
to mount on the handlebars. This would be a unit that
lets you download maps from the Internet onto via USB
connection. Garmin Etrex has an 8 MB and a 24 MB model,
the latter more expensive with altimeter and barometer,
which I don't really need (though the altimeter would
be cute).

Hi, Dave. I've had the basic Garmin eTrex unit without
mapping for a while now and am very happy with it. Although
it doesn't have mapping capabilities I've found that just
plugging in a few waypoints for interesting places along my
planned route is plenty to keep me oriented. And not having
a detailed map leaves lots of opportunity to explore those
"blank" areas on the track display (but without worrying
about getting lost). So, like me, maybe you'd be happy with
a simpler, cheaper unit.

Rick Onanian said:

Eric S. Sande said:

It would pay you to know how to navigate without GPS.

It does indeed pay. It's nice to know how to (and be
equipped to) navigate both ways. Fail safe navigation
beats getting lost when your map blows away in the wind
(or gets rained on, or it's the wrong map) as well as it
beats the broken GPS or the valley with no signal.

I sail a boat that has GPS on it, and I'd have to say that
the technology has done more to teach me proper estimation
of sea conditions for navigation purposes (tides, drift,
course over ground versus course made good, bearing versus
heading, etc.) than any reading of navigation books.

I've played with a little hand held model on my bike but in
general have not really found it to be especially useful,
except in those situations where you get to the point you
have no clue as to which way is home.

That happens very rarely for my type of riding and location.
I usually end up getting home via an "unanticipated route"
and have yet to starve to death from poor navigation.

SMH

Dave Stallard <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

I'm looking to get a GPS with map display for my bike,
to mount on the handlebars. This would be a unit that
lets you download maps from the Internet onto via USB
connection. Garmin Etrex has an 8 MB and a 24 MB model,
the latter more expensive with altimeter and barometer,
which I don't really need (though the altimeter would
be cute).

Anybody have any recommendations on these models? Is the 8
MB limit confining in terms of the fraction of the Earth's
surface area it can hold a map for? 😉 This is for day
rides, rather than a cross the USA trip. I'm told the 8 MB
has better screen resolution than the 24 MB.

Geez,

You seem to have brought out the luddite crowd. A quick
search of the group archives will show that I have in fact
recommended that one do primary reliance on paper maps and
non-electronic navigation aids. That said, I have a GPS and
use it extensively while cycling. I use it as and adjunct
navigation tool, a database of information, a recorder of
trips, and other things.

As others have pointed out, one of the beauties of the
GPS's you will want to consider is they are waterproof, and
easy to use in situations where paper maps are problematic.
Two years ago we were caught in a horrendous storm in
Italy, in an area where roads were poorly signed, and with
my friend getting
ill. We needed to get to town, fast, and the maze of
umarked roads was a problem. We ducked under an
awning, consulted the paper map to find the shortest
route to the nearest town, and figured out the
landmarks and made sure we could follow the same on
the GPS. Tucked the map safely away in waterproof bag
and followed our electronic 'nose' into town without a
hitch. Many times recently we have done the same -
easy to use and follow in conditions where paper maps
will become oatmeal in your hands.

And do not listen to those who think you should rely on
'ppl'. 'ppl' may not be friendly, may not speak the same
language, and often are nowhere in sight when you need them.
I was lost once in the Amazon basin, probably 50-60 km from
the nearest 'town'; if I waited to ask 'ppl' where go I
would still be there - but probably not alive. And with
canopies going hundreds of feet above you, and just occasion
'trails' through the jungle regular navigation aids were not
much help. If I had a GPS I would have gotten out faster; as
it was I had to navigate by sound - using aural cues to
locate the main river in the area then follow it upstream to
a 'village'. 'ppl', visual cues, etc. were useless.

Another use of the GPS is finding things. I use a download
map set that has data about the areas, including
location/address/phone number of hotels, restaurants, car
rental agencies, train stations, stores, etc. We used that
once, again in Italy, to locate a train station when caught
in an electrical storm. We used it just yesterday to locate
a place for dinner.

As far as a GPS unit, you want a couple of things. 1) you
want to be able to download maps, routes, data, and upload
tracks. To do this you need an interface that can be
connected to a computer, and lots of memory. Forget the
idea of 'download maps from the Internet'. The two major
GPS companies have proprietary formats and to really get
an extensive map set you need to buy theirs. Figure that
into the cost.
2) You want one that is rugged. My eTrex Legend survived
my (hit and run) accident that left me unconscious with
three missing teeth, two broken arms, and a lot less
skin. There is a piece of the case that got 'sanded'
down by the road, but has not missed a beat in the two
years since the accident. 3) You want one that is
waterproof. 4) you want one that is relatively small.
4) you want one that gets good reception. Finally, be
willing to compromise. The units with the most memory
are either relatively large and/or not all that suited
to downloaded maps and/or not all that
rugged/waterproof. I thought of moving to the Garmin
GPSMAP 60CS recently; lots more memory, color,
supposedly better reception; but it is much larger than
the eTrex Legend/Vista, and I cannot live with
something that big on my bars.

Good luck,

- rick

On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 10:18:39 -0400, Rick Onanian <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

B a r r y said:

Quoted message said:

trip. I'm told the 8 MB has better screen resolution than
the 24 MB.

The screens are identical.

Display resolution from one Etrex model to the next is not
the same.

Example: Etrex: 128 x 64 Etrex Venture: 288 x 160

Where did he ask about the yellow eTrex?

The OP stated that he thought the Venture has a better
screen than the Vista. They are identical. Why confuse him?

Barry

"Rick Warner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Dave Stallard <[email hidden]> wrote in message

news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I'm looking to get a GPS with map display for my bike,
to mount on the handlebars. This would be a unit that
lets you download maps from the Internet onto via USB
connection. Garmin Etrex has an 8 MB and a 24 MB model,
the latter more expensive with altimeter and barometer,
which I don't really need (though the altimeter would be
cute).

Anybody have any recommendations on these models? Is
the 8 MB limit confining in terms of the fraction of
the Earth's surface area it can hold a map for? 😉
This is for day rides, rather than a cross the USA
trip. I'm told the 8 MB has better screen resolution
than the 24 MB.

Geez,

You seem to have brought out the luddite crowd. A quick
search of the group archives will show that I have in fact
recommended that one do primary reliance on paper maps and
non-electronic navigation aids. That said, I have a GPS
and use it extensively while cycling. I use it as and
adjunct navigation tool, a database of information, a
recorder of trips, and other things.

As others have pointed out, one of the beauties of the
GPS's you will want to consider is they are waterproof,
and easy to use in situations where paper maps are
problematic. Two years ago we were caught in a horrendous
storm in Italy, in an area where roads were poorly signed,
and with my friend getting
ill. We needed to get to town, fast, and the maze of
umarked roads was a problem. We ducked under an
awning, consulted the paper map to find the shortest
route to the nearest town, and figured out the
landmarks and made sure we could follow the same on
the GPS. Tucked the map safely away in waterproof
bag and followed our electronic 'nose' into town
without a hitch. Many times recently we have done
the same - easy to use and follow in conditions
where paper maps will become oatmeal in your hands.

And do not listen to those who think you should rely on
'ppl'. 'ppl' may not be friendly, may not speak the same
language, and often are nowhere in sight when you need
them. I was lost once in the Amazon basin, probably 50-60
km from the nearest 'town'; if I waited to ask 'ppl' where
go I would still be there - but probably not alive. And
with canopies going hundreds of feet above you, and just
occasion 'trails' through the jungle regular navigation
aids were not much help. If I had a GPS I would have
gotten out faster; as it was I had to navigate by sound -
using aural cues to locate the main river in the area then
follow it upstream to a 'village'. 'ppl', visual cues,
etc. were useless.

Another use of the GPS is finding things. I use a download
map set that has data about the areas, including
location/address/phone number of hotels, restaurants, car
rental agencies, train stations, stores, etc. We used that
once, again in Italy, to locate a train station when
caught in an electrical storm. We used it just yesterday
to locate a place for dinner.

As far as a GPS unit, you want a couple of things. 1) you
want to be able to download maps, routes, data, and upload
tracks. To do this you need an interface that can be
connected to a computer, and lots of memory. Forget the
idea of 'download maps from the Internet'. The two major
GPS companies have proprietary formats and to really get
an extensive map set you need to buy theirs. Figure that
into the cost.
2) You want one that is rugged. My eTrex Legend survived
my (hit and run) accident that left me unconscious
with three missing teeth, two broken arms, and a lot
less skin. There is a piece of the case that got
'sanded' down by the road, but has not missed a beat
in the two years since the accident. 3) You want one
that is waterproof. 4) you want one that is
relatively small. 4) you want one that gets good
reception. Finally, be willing to compromise. The
units with the most memory are either relatively
large and/or not all that suited to downloaded maps
and/or not all that rugged/waterproof. I thought of
moving to the Garmin GPSMAP 60CS recently; lots more
memory, color, supposedly better reception; but it is
much larger than the eTrex Legend/Vista, and I cannot
live with something that big on my bars.

Good luck,

- rick

I use the Garmin GPS72. Not only is it waterproof but it
floats. Handy for my canoeing trips! I use mine all the time
for nighttime mountain bike rides in the bush, which we have
every Wednesday night. Also for our exploring trips on
Saturday afternoons which usually finish well after dark.

Marty