Haleakala Climb

HGL said:

Can anybody share experiences climbing Haleakala. What is the average grade,
how long a ride, what level of fitness, what is the weather like? Is it
doable in July? Can decent bikes be rented foe the climb? Thanks.

There have been several threads here, along with links to web sites.
groups.google.com

--
Lynn Wallace http://www.xmission.com/~lawall
I have nothing but contempt and anger for those who betray the
trust by exposing the name of our sources. They are, in my view,
the most insidious of traitors."
George H.W. Bush, April 16, 1999,

HGL said:

Can anybody share experiences climbing Haleakala. What is the average grade,
how long a ride, what level of fitness, what is the weather like? Is it
doable in July? Can decent bikes be rented foe the climb? Thanks.

http://groups.google.com/groups/search?q=Haleakala+bicycle&qt_s=Search

HGL <[email hidden]> wrote in news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Can anybody share experiences climbing Haleakala. What is the
average grade, how long a ride, what level of fitness, what is the
weather like? Is it doable in July? Can decent bikes be rented foe
the climb? Thanks.

I drove up Haleakala a couple of weeks ago (unfortunately in a car, not a
bike). I saw about a dozen road cyclists riding up; some younger and
some with white hair. The average grade is only 5% (10000 feet vertical
over 40 miles) with no steep sections, so the climb is more about
endurance than strength. Weather tends to be sunny in the morning and
evening, cloudy at the top during mid-day.

I made the climb about 15 years ago. I did it in October, so wasn't in
peak form, but was in good shape. I lived at 5,000', so that probably
made it easier. I took about 6 hours to climb of which was 5 hours of
riding time. I started at sunrise to beat the heat. It averages about
4 - 5%. The toughest part for me was the last 1/2 mile from the
lookout to the summit, but the rest was very gradual.

I think that anybody who does a fair bit of cycling and is in
reasonable shape should be able to make the climb. Make sure you bring
warm clothes, as the beginning of the descent can be quite cool, until
you get to lower elevations. I was quite warm on the climb, but cooled
off very quickly on the descent and had to put a jacket on and wished
I had full fingered gloves for the first part of the descent as I
found it cold on the fingers, until about 8,000 feet. Also, bring lots
of water.

Colin

HGL said:

Can anybody share experiences climbing Haleakala. What is the average grade,
how long a ride, what level of fitness, what is the weather like? Is it
doable in July? Can decent bikes be rented foe the climb? Thanks.

Mike Schwab said:

Quoted message said:

Can anybody share experiences climbing Haleakala. What is the
average grade, how long a ride, what level of fitness, what is the
weather like? Is it doable in July? Can decent bikes be rented foe
the climb?

http://groups.google.com/groups/search?q=Haleakala+bicycle&qt_s=Search

And while you're on Maui, not that the island has almost no ocean
tides (about an inch on the north and south shore). This made clear
to me that the tides do not occur the way they teach in school or do
so inadvertently. Earth's sun and moon cause the oceans to move
laterally oscillating east and west. They do not perceptibly "raise
and lower" the ocean.

Tidal currents well up against the land impinging on north-south
running shores. These tidal currents are readily apparent when
swimming, as are colorful fish and sea turtles. I found the tidal
aspect of the Islands an interesting sidelight to my visit. An
unexpected discovery.

http://www.topozone.com/map.asp?z=4&n=2292471&e=786125&size=l&datum=nad83

Jobst Brandt

[email hidden] wrote in news:44ab4891$0$34513
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Mike Schwab said:

Quoted message said:

Can anybody share experiences climbing Haleakala. What is the
average grade, how long a ride, what level of fitness, what is the
weather like? Is it doable in July? Can decent bikes be rented foe
the climb?

http://groups.google.com/groups/search?q=Haleakala+bicycle&qt_s=Search

And while you're on Maui, not that the island has almost no ocean
tides (about an inch on the north and south shore). This made clear
to me that the tides do not occur the way they teach in school or do
so inadvertently. Earth's sun and moon cause the oceans to move
laterally oscillating east and west. They do not perceptibly "raise
and lower" the ocean.

Tidal currents well up against the land impinging on north-south
running shores. These tidal currents are readily apparent when
swimming, as are colorful fish and sea turtles. I found the tidal
aspect of the Islands an interesting sidelight to my visit. An
unexpected discovery.

http://www.topozone.com/map.asp?z=4&n=2292471&e=786125

&size=l&datum=nad83

Quoted message said:

Jobst Brandt

Tides do occur as they teach in school, but they are not really a back
and forth sloshing as much as a cyclic sloshing. That means there are
places where the tidal elevation is relatively small, called amphidromic
points, and these points are kinda in the center of an ocean basin since
the tide sloshes around the center. Sorta. I think they get moved
around by topography of the ocean basin and the geometry of the
continents as well. The cyclic, rather than straight back and forth,
nature of tides is caused by the rotation of the Earth. If the Earth
were stationary, then tides would slosh back and forth in what is called
a seiche wave. Of course, if the Earth didn't rotate then one side would
be so hot as to not have liquid water and the other side would be so cold
as to have frozen water. That would suck.

Here is a way cool animation of the difference between a seiche wave and
the tidal oscillation:

http://tinyurl.com/z4vh3

The important point of the animation is that you can see the tidal
oscillation is a level change. There's no change in sea level in Hawaii
because it is an amphidromic point in the Pacific. Here is a map showing
the amphidromic points of the world's oceans, and let me tell you was I
relieved when I saw that Hawaii does indeed sit right next to an
amphidromic point so I didn't have to erase everything I just wrote.

http://tinyurl.com/gylmd

--
Bill Asher

In article <[email hidden]>,

Quoted message said:

Mike Schwab said:

Quoted message said:

Can anybody share experiences climbing Haleakala. What is the
average grade, how long a ride, what level of fitness, what is the
weather like? Is it doable in July? Can decent bikes be rented foe
the climb?

http://groups.google.com/groups/search?q=Haleakala+bicycle&qt_s=Search

And while you're on Maui, not that the island has almost no ocean
tides (about an inch on the north and south shore). This made clear
to me that the tides do not occur the way they teach in school or do
so inadvertently. Earth's sun and moon cause the oceans to move
laterally oscillating east and west. They do not perceptibly "raise
and lower" the ocean.

The way a certain high school (biology) teacher explained it to me went
thus:

combined gravitational perturbations by the sun & moon causes the
water in oceanic basins to slosh back & forth like a slightly
agitated cup of tea (she was a Scot who particularly enjoyed a
lovely cup of tea.)

If the tide is high on one side of such a basin, it'll be
correspondingly low on the other side, and negligible in
the middle. Local features can, however, affect tides to
an extent.

That "cup of tea" imagery always stuck with me.

cheers,
Tom

--
-- Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca

William Asher said:

Quoted message said:

And while you're on Maui, not that the island has almost no ocean
tides (about an inch on the north and south shore). This made clear
to me that the tides do not occur the way they teach in school or do
so inadvertently. Earth's sun and moon cause the oceans to move
laterally oscillating east and west. They do not perceptibly "raise
and lower" the ocean.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Tidal currents well up against the land impinging on north-south
running shores. These tidal currents are readily apparent when
swimming, as are colorful fish and sea turtles. I found the tidal
aspect of the Islands an interesting sidelight to my visit. An
unexpected discovery.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

http://www.topozone.com/map.asp?z=4&n=2292471&e=786125&size=l&datum=nad83

Quoted message said:

Tides do occur as they teach in school, but they are not really a
back and forth sloshing as much as a cyclic sloshing. That means
there are places where the tidal elevation is relatively small,
called amphidromic points, and these points are kinda in the center
of an ocean basin since the tide sloshes around the center. Sorta.

Quoted message said:

I think they get moved around by topography of the ocean basin and
the geometry of the continents as well. The cyclic, rather than
straight back and forth, nature of tides is caused by the rotation
of the Earth. If the Earth were stationary, then tides would slosh
back and forth in what is called a seiche wave. Of course, if the
Earth didn't rotate then one side would be so hot as to not have
liquid water and the other side would be so cold as to have frozen
water. That would suck.

Quoted message said:

Here is a way cool animation of the difference between a seiche wave and
the tidal oscillation:

Quoted message said:

http://tinyurl.com/z4vh3

That animation is exactly what I said. The oceans slosh mainly in the
east-west direction and rise because they impinge on land masses. The
bay of Fundy is a great example of how this sloshing works. The sun
and moon do not lift the water more at the narrow end of this inlet,
the lateral motion shoves the water up there.

Quoted message said:

The important point of the animation is that you can see the tidal
oscillation is a level change. There's no change in sea level in
Hawaii because it is an amphidromic point in the Pacific. Here is a
map showing the amphidromic points of the world's oceans, and let me
tell you was I relieved when I saw that Hawaii does indeed sit right
next to an amphidromic point so I didn't have to erase everything I
just wrote.

Quoted message said:

http://tinyurl.com/gylmd

There is no change in sea level because the water only moves laterally
and because the world has a tilt to its axis this is not purely
east-west. In any event, the water does not rise and fall because the
sun and moon "lift" it. It rises and falls because it sloshes back
and forth and runs up against land masses just as your URL's show.

This is not what is taught in schools or what is generally believed
after having "learned" that works that way.

Jobst Brandt

Tom Keats said:

Quoted message said:

And while you're on Maui, not that the island has almost no ocean
tides (about an inch on the north and south shore). This made
clear to me that the tides do not occur the way they teach in
school or do so inadvertently. Earth's sun and moon cause the
oceans to move laterally oscillating east and west. They do not
perceptibly "raise and lower" the ocean.

Quoted message said:

The way a certain high school (biology) teacher explained it to me
went thus:

Quoted message said:

combined gravitational perturbations by the sun & moon causes the
water in oceanic basins to slosh back & forth like a slightly
agitated cup of tea (she was a Scot who particularly enjoyed a
lovely cup of tea.)

Quoted message said:

If the tide is high on one side of such a basin, it'll be
correspondingly low on the other side, and negligible in the middle.
Local features can, however, affect tides to an extent.

Quoted message said:

That "cup of tea" imagery always stuck with me.

Ooh! How did your teacher get away with that? That sounds like
heresy in the teaching of oceans and tides. As I said, I was
surprised to notice that there were no significant tides in Maui and
it finally struck me how it works after having my doubts about what I
was told in school.

Jobst Brandt

HGL said:

Can anybody share experiences climbing Haleakala. What is the average grade,
how long a ride, what level of fitness, what is the weather like? Is it
doable in July? Can decent bikes be rented foe the climb? Thanks.

10F difference between summer and winter, so anytime you can ride it.
http://www.chainreaction.com/haleakala.htm

"[email hidden]" <[email hidden]> wrote in
news:[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

10F difference between summer and winter, so anytime you can ride
it. http://www.chainreaction.com/haleakala.htm

That may be true on average, but weather does vary a lot from day to day
and snow on the summit is a lot more common during the winter than during
the summer. Check the weather forecast before heading out.