GPS: upgrading from an eMap

Quoted message said:

It still works OK, but my gadget-desire is building and I'm considering
asking Santa (aka the wife) for a new GPS. I'm considering either the
GPSMAP 60CS or the Etrex Vista C.

Has anyone made a similar jump? What advantages/disadvantages do you
find with the newer one compared to the eMap?

I mainly use my GPS for walking, but ocassionally use it in the car.

I have found the 60CS memory to be quite restrictive - 56MB effective
capacity is about half what's required to contain the mainland UK.

Since I live in the South but plan routes to eg the Lakes/Scotland etc,
I need more map capacity than the 60 supplies. I don't know for certain
but istr that the Vista has around half the capacity of the 60CS. If
this is true then IMO that's not enough.

Quoted message said:

Again, any significant differences?

Of course I can read reviews etc, but I always like to read experts'
opinions, hence the reason I'm asking here.

Or ... should I just wait a while until I can get a GPS with a built-in
OS map. Would I be waiting for ever?

We don't know ;-) OS topo mapping for the GPSMAP 60 etc has been
promised for a while now. When it'll arrive is anyones guess, and I
haven't heard how mempry intensive it'll be either...

hth,

--
Boo

Glenn Proctor said:

Hi

I've been using a Garmin eMap, mostly for walking, for the last 5 years
or so.

It still works OK, but my gadget-desire is building and I'm considering
asking Santa (aka the wife) for a new GPS. I'm considering either the
GPSMAP 60CS or the Etrex Vista C.

Has anyone made a similar jump? What advantages/disadvantages do you
find with the newer one compared to the eMap?

I mainly use my GPS for walking, but ocassionally use it in the car.
Again, any significant differences?

Of course I can read reviews etc, but I always like to read experts'
opinions, hence the reason I'm asking here.

Or ... should I just wait a while until I can get a GPS with a built-in
OS map. Would I be waiting for ever?

TIA

Glenn.

You could consider what I've been using - a Navman 4100 which has no
display or controls apart from an on/off switch. It uses bluetooth to
communicate with my pda (an ipaq 4150) which is running OziExplorerCE.
This effectively gives me a gps with full detail OS maps (or whatever
I've scanned) in full colour on a nice big display. OziExplorerCE is
excellent and well worth £20. The GPS stays in the top of my pack, the
pda lives in an aquapac in a jacket pocket or clipped to my belt. I've
been using this set up for about a month now and so far it works very well.

The only real downside IMHO is that a pda has a glass display and
wouldn't cope well with being sat on. I keep it in an aquapac all the
time I'm out walking/camping as I suspect it wouldn't like to be rained
on, the aquapac also gives a degree of cushioning to the pda.

Tony

Boo said:

Quoted message said:

It still works OK, but my gadget-desire is building and I'm
considering asking Santa (aka the wife) for a new GPS. I'm considering
either the GPSMAP 60CS or the Etrex Vista C.

Has anyone made a similar jump? What advantages/disadvantages do you
find with the newer one compared to the eMap?

I mainly use my GPS for walking, but ocassionally use it in the car.

I have found the 60CS memory to be quite restrictive - 56MB effective
capacity is about half what's required to contain the mainland UK.

I've been using an 8Mb(!) eMap for the past 5 years, so I'm used to only loading
in some of the Mapsource maps. 56Mb would be a nice upgrade!

Quoted message said:

We don't know ;-) OS topo mapping for the GPSMAP 60 etc has been
promised for a while now. When it'll arrive is anyones guess, and I
haven't heard how mempry intensive it'll be either...

Well that's encouraging, I'd just hate to buy a GPSMAP 60 this Xmas and then
have the OS-enabled GPSMAP 61 (or whatever) come out a month later!

Glenn.

Tony Walsh said:

You could consider what I've been using - a Navman 4100 which has no
display or controls apart from an on/off switch. It uses bluetooth to
communicate with my pda (an ipaq 4150) which is running OziExplorerCE.
This effectively gives me a gps with full detail OS maps (or whatever
I've scanned) in full colour on a nice big display. OziExplorerCE is
excellent and well worth £20. The GPS stays in the top of my pack, the
pda lives in an aquapac in a jacket pocket or clipped to my belt. I've
been using this set up for about a month now and so far it works very well.

I have considered this, as I already have a Palm Tungsten T3 and there are
various add-on GPS solutions for it for around the 100 quid mark. I don't think
you can get OziExplorer for the Palm but there may be something similar.

My concerns are that, although it's a bit long in the tooth, my eMap has *never*
let me down, and I'm nervous about using a PDA/BT GPS combination that's likely
to run out of batteries / crash / refuse to work / get dropped & smash at the
wrong moment!

Glenn.

Glenn Proctor said:

My concerns are that, although it's a bit long in the tooth, my eMap has
*never* let me down, and I'm nervous about using a PDA/BT GPS
combination that's likely to run out of batteries / crash / refuse to
work / get dropped & smash at the wrong moment!

Glenn.

That worries me also but apart from the higher risk of physical damage
to the pda, I don't think the extra risk amounts to much - but time will
tell... In any case I always take a printed A4 map and compass anyway
just in case so I'd be no worse off than I was a couple of years ago
before I started using a gps.
I wouldn't like to go back to using a conventional gps. Having a moving
OS map to refer to is just in a different league.
Taking a pda has other uses of course e.g. surfing (via a BT/GPRS phone)
for the weather forecast so I can see the BBC's rainfall radar and judge
for myself what's coming is very handy. Checking photos is easier on a
pda screen than using the preview display on a camera. Then there's
e-books, games, music...
Gadget heaven!

Tony

Glenn Proctor said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I mainly use my GPS for walking, but ocassionally use it in the car.

60CS is great in the car, the Vista C wouldn't be so good because of the
patch aerial which requires it to be held horizontal. The 60CS works
best vertically so that's ideal for the car.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I have found the 60CS memory to be quite restrictive - 56MB effective
capacity is about half what's required to contain the mainland UK.

Which maps are you using?

Quoted message said:

I've been using an 8Mb(!) eMap for the past 5 years, so I'm used to
only loading in some of the Mapsource maps. 56Mb would be a nice
upgrade!

The whole UK is approximately 37 meg in MapSource, but the new
auto-routing features of the 60CS don't work with it unfortunately.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

We don't know ;-) OS topo mapping for the GPSMAP 60 etc has been
promised for a while now. When it'll arrive is anyones guess, and I
haven't heard how mempry intensive it'll be either...

Well that's encouraging, I'd just hate to buy a GPSMAP 60 this Xmas
and then have the OS-enabled GPSMAP 61 (or whatever) come out a month
later!

I'm still looking forward to the topo mapping. The 76CS will no doubt
be best for memory capacity, but it is a tad bulky, even though the
screen is the same size as the 60CS. The Vista C screen is a little
smaller.

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk
http://www.wildwales.fsnet.co.uk

Quoted message said:

Which maps are you using?

European City Select v6.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I've been using an 8Mb(!) eMap for the past 5 years, so I'm used to
only loading in some of the Mapsource maps. 56Mb would be a nice
upgrade!

The whole UK is approximately 37 meg in MapSource, but the new
auto-routing features of the 60CS don't work with it unfortunately.

AIUI, Mapsource is the name of the program, the maps vary widely in
capability and cost but they all use Mapsource to select maps, edit
routes & waypoints etc and to download to the GPS. IDK if Mapsource
will be the program that supports the new UK OS topo mapping when it
arrives but I presume so.

The whole of mainland UK comes to 148.2MB in ECS6 (which does support
the autorouting capabilities in the 60CS). Autorouting is fab btw, and
the capability of the 60CS to re-route when you take a wrong turn takes
much of the stress and fiddle out of a car journey to an unfamiliar
destination.

--
Boo

Quoted message said:

You could consider what I've been using - a Navman 4100 which has no
display or controls apart from an on/off switch. It uses bluetooth to
communicate with my pda (an ipaq 4150) which is running OziExplorerCE.
This effectively gives me a gps with full detail OS maps (or whatever
I've scanned) in full colour on a nice big display. OziExplorerCE is
excellent and well worth £20. The GPS stays in the top of my pack, the
pda lives in an aquapac in a jacket pocket or clipped to my belt. I've
been using this set up for about a month now and so far it works very well.

I certainly have considered it and would already own one if it were not
for the fact that the Navman and its ilk do not run from AA cells.

I'd use my Smartphone (Orange C500) in place of the iPaq thus killing 2
birds with the same 80 gramme stone. What puts me off (apart from the
pencell issue) is the fact that battery life with Bluetooth turned on
all the time will be pretty rotten. The tests I have seen for iPaqs and
their ilk give around 5.5 hours use, which compares very poorly to the
24 hours from a GPSMAP 60.

The fragility and water damage issues I'll address by means of a Boxit
case for the Smartphone. Heavy but bulletproof.

As I say this all depends upon the arrival of a pencell-operated "mouse"
style GPS with bluetooth. If you hear of one let me know.

--
Boo

Boo said:

I certainly have considered it and would already own one if it were not
for the fact that the Navman and its ilk do not run from AA cells.

The 4100 uses 3 AAA cells and the claimed battery life is 30 hours
although mine hasn't managed to pass 25 hours (I'm using nimh batteries).

Quoted message said:

I'd use my Smartphone (Orange C500) in place of the iPaq thus killing 2
birds with the same 80 gramme stone. What puts me off (apart from the
pencell issue) is the fact that battery life with Bluetooth turned on
all the time will be pretty rotten. The tests I have seen for iPaqs and
their ilk give around 5.5 hours use, which compares very poorly to the
24 hours from a GPSMAP 60.

I have had 10 hours use from my ipaq by not using the backlight which is
the main current drain. By using an external pack of 4 AA cells to
recharge the ipaq's internal battery overnight it becomes quite usable.
I've done a 3-day trip by doing this and still had some battery life
to spare. I haven't been very systematic yet at finding what sort of
life I'm getting by recharging from external batteries overnight but
will post details when I have some figures.

Tony

Boo said:

Quoted message said:

Which maps are you using?

European City Select v6.

Is there not just a UK version?

Quoted message said:

AIUI, Mapsource is the name of the program, the maps vary widely in
capability and cost but they all use Mapsource to select maps, edit
routes & waypoints etc and to download to the GPS.

Yes of course.

Quoted message said:

The whole of mainland UK comes to 148.2MB in ECS6 (which does support
the autorouting capabilities in the 60CS). Autorouting is fab btw,
and the capability of the 60CS to re-route when you take a wrong turn
takes much of the stress and fiddle out of a car journey to an
unfamiliar destination.

Where's the cheapest place I can get hold of one?

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk
http://www.wildwales.fsnet.co.uk

Quoted message said:

The 4100 uses 3 AAA cells

Yers...

Quoted message said:

and the claimed battery life is 30 hours
although mine hasn't managed to pass 25 hours (I'm using nimh batteries).

Oh, I didn't know it was as good as that. 25 hours from NiMH AAA cells
isn't too shoddy at all. I still don't like 'em though (AAA cells I mean).

Quoted message said:

I have had 10 hours use from my ipaq by not using the backlight which is
the main current drain. By using an external pack of 4 AA cells to
recharge the ipaq's internal battery overnight it becomes quite usable.
I've done a 3-day trip by doing this and still had some battery life to
spare. I haven't been very systematic yet at finding what sort of life
I'm getting by recharging from external batteries overnight but will
post details when I have some figures.

I'd be very interested to hear the results when you've got them.

--
Boo

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Which maps are you using?

European City Select v6.

Is there not just a UK version?

I presume so, I bought all of Europe with an eye to future trips abroad...

Quoted message said:

Where's the cheapest place I can get hold of one?

Don't know. I got my 60CS and City select frpm GPSCity. They do the SW
seperately
<http://www.gpscity.com/gps/brados/4335.3.11448036286032344784/cseuropev6.html>
but it's still £200 quid. I was stung by customs and ended up paying
£80 on top of my $850ish (for a 60CS, handlebar mount, car mount and
power cable and the software). Came to £550ish all in, you win some
you lose some :-(

--
Boo

Boo wrote:
<http://www.gpscity.com/gps/brados/4335.3.11448036286032344784/cseuropev
6.html>

Quoted message said:

but it's still £200 quid.

Jeez! Is that for the whole of Europe? I only want the UK. I'm not
paying £200 for it.

Paul
--
http://www.wilderness-wales.co.uk
http://www.wildwales.fsnet.co.uk

"Paul Saunders" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Where's the cheapest place I can get hold of one?

Paul

http://www.globalpositioningsystems.co.uk/viewprod.php?product_id=1999&category_id=76&pp_id=0

Possibly? It's where I got mine. One way you could cut costs is to sell your
other access code and copy the disks and sell on. I have thought about doing
this but I'm not sure about the hassle of getting involved with strangers
and their strangeness, if you follow me.

Alan

Tony Walsh said:

You could consider what I've been using - a Navman 4100 which has no
display or controls apart from an on/off switch. It uses bluetooth to
communicate with my pda (an ipaq 4150) which is running OziExplorerCE.
This effectively gives me a gps with full detail OS maps (or whatever
I've scanned) in full colour on a nice big display. OziExplorerCE is
excellent and well worth £20. The GPS stays in the top of my pack, the
pda lives in an aquapac in a jacket pocket or clipped to my belt. I've
been using this set up for about a month now and so far it works very well.

Having done some research (the handheld GPS market is much more varied than then
I last looked into this about 5 years ago!) I'm warming to the idea of a BT GPS
paired up with my Palm Tungsten T3; using something like the Navman + PDA for
both walking and in the car.

How do you use the Navman when walking? Does it need to be exposed to the sky or
is it happy enough in the top of a bag? They say it comes with neck & arm straps
- is it rainproof?

The only problem I can see is battery life on the PDA - the T3 is a great
machine but the screen, processor and BT eat batteries like mad. There are
various external solutions though - time for more research!

Glenn.

In article <[email hidden]>, Glenn Proctor
<[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

Tony Walsh said:

You could consider what I've been using - a Navman 4100 which has no
display or controls apart from an on/off switch. It uses bluetooth to
communicate with my pda (an ipaq 4150) which is running OziExplorerCE.
This effectively gives me a gps with full detail OS maps (or whatever
I've scanned) in full colour on a nice big display. OziExplorerCE is
excellent and well worth £20. The GPS stays in the top of my pack, the
pda lives in an aquapac in a jacket pocket or clipped to my belt. I've
been using this set up for about a month now and so far it works very well.

Having done some research (the handheld GPS market is much more varied
than then I last looked into this about 5 years ago!) I'm warming to
the idea of a BT GPS paired up with my Palm Tungsten T3; using
something like the Navman + PDA for both walking and in the car.

How do you use the Navman when walking? Does it need to be exposed to
the sky or is it happy enough in the top of a bag? They say it comes
with neck & arm straps - is it rainproof?

The only problem I can see is battery life on the PDA - the T3 is a
great machine but the screen, processor and BT eat batteries like mad.
There are various external solutions though - time for more research!

Glenn.

I seem to remember that some of the available BlueTooth GPS receivers
also can act as data loggers so it will behave like a normal GPS
recording the tracklog as you go along. You then just fire up the PDA
when you need to see your position but don't waste PDA power just for
logging.

--

Dominic Sexton
http://www.dscs.demon.co.uk/

Glenn Proctor said:

How do you use the Navman when walking? Does it need to be exposed to
the sky or is it happy enough in the top of a bag? They say it comes
with neck & arm straps - is it rainproof?

I just stick mine in the top pocket of my pack. It gets a nice clear
view of the sky from there. Not sure about its rainproofness but it only
needs to be taken out if the batteries go flat.

Quoted message said:

The only problem I can see is battery life on the PDA - the T3 is a
great machine but the screen, processor and BT eat batteries like mad.
There are various external solutions though - time for more research!

I've been using one of these:
http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=108719
I'm not sure how many hours extra use it gives to my pda but so far its
been enough for 3 day trips using 4 nimh AA cells. I find it works best
when the batteries and pda are warm so I do the recharging inside my
sleeping bag.
Surprisingly BT doesn't seem to use a lot of power not on mine anyway.
Keeping the screen brightness down and setting it to switch off the
backlight after 10 secs is the most important thing to improve battery life.

Tony

Tony Walsh said:

I just stick mine in the top pocket of my pack. It gets a nice clear view of
the sky from there. Not sure about its rainproofness but it only needs to be
taken out if the batteries go flat.

So it's fully enclosed by the material of the pack and still gets a GPS signal?
That's pretty good.

Quoted message said:

I've been using one of these:
http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=108719
I'm not sure how many hours extra use it gives to my pda but so far its
been enough for 3 day trips using 4 nimh AA cells. I find it works best
when the batteries and pda are warm so I do the recharging inside my
sleeping bag.

Interesting; the connector on the Palm isn't USB so that particular one won't
work, but I'm sure it's possible to get something similar that takes AA/AAA
batteries.

Quoted message said:

Surprisingly BT doesn't seem to use a lot of power not on mine anyway.
Keeping the screen brightness down and setting it to switch off the
backlight after 10 secs is the most important thing to improve battery
life.

The screen on the T3 is one of the transflective(sp) ones which needs the
backlight to be on for anything to display at all, hence the power drain. I'm
looking at one of these http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=105700 which
apparently greatly increases the usage time.

You mentioned you use an Aquapac - do you find this OK? Is it the regular one or
the PDA one with the fold-over front cover?

Glenn.

Glenn Proctor said:

So it's fully enclosed by the material of the pack and still gets a GPS
signal? That's pretty good.

yes I've had no problems with losing signal

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I've been using one of these:
http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=108719
I'm not sure how many hours extra use it gives to my pda but so far
its been enough for 3 day trips using 4 nimh AA cells. I find it works
best when the batteries and pda are warm so I do the recharging inside
my sleeping bag.

Interesting; the connector on the Palm isn't USB so that particular one
won't work, but I'm sure it's possible to get something similar that
takes AA/AAA batteries.

I use a usb-ipaq cable to make the connection.
http://www.ipaqrepair.co.uk/view_product.php?product=279

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Surprisingly BT doesn't seem to use a lot of power not on mine anyway.
Keeping the screen brightness down and setting it to switch off the
backlight after 10 secs is the most important thing to improve battery
life.

The screen on the T3 is one of the transflective(sp) ones which needs
the backlight to be on for anything to display at all, hence the power
drain. I'm looking at one of these
http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=105700 which apparently greatly
increases the usage time.

You mentioned you use an Aquapac - do you find this OK? Is it the
regular one or the PDA one with the fold-over front cover?

I'm using the one with the fold over cover as I think it gives a bit of
extra protection to the display. I've been thinking of putting a sheet
of aluminium inside the fold-over bit to give a bit of extra protection.
The cover also has a pocket for putting t6he stylus in.

Tony