Good stuff from Jan

"Bill C" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://www.velonews.com/diaries/rider/articles/8245.0.html

Quoted message said:

and friends as he has with himself. The lack of a ruthless killer
instinct has given Lance his record run, but I still think Jan is a
better human being.
Bill C

Amen. He's not a bad cyclist either.

Anybody have any links or info about what happened between him and Gabby?

J.V. said:

"Bill C" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://www.velonews.com/diaries/rider/articles/8245.0.html

Quoted message said:

and friends as he has with himself. The lack of a ruthless killer
instinct has given Lance his record run, but I still think Jan is a
better human being.
Bill C

Amen. He's not a bad cyclist either.

Anybody have any links or info about what happened between him and Gabby?

No, but I haven't been wading through the German magazines since my
ability is declining.
I think that Jan's love for the nightlife and spotlight killed it.
Everything I've seen says that Gabby is totally grounded in her family,
village, and community. She's not cut out to be a star wife, or star.
I can't fault her. The match just didn't work in the long run.
Bill C

Bill C said:

J.V. said:

"Bill C" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

http://www.velonews.com/diaries/rider/articles/8245.0.html

Quoted message said:

and friends as he has with himself. The lack of a ruthless killer
instinct has given Lance his record run, but I still think Jan is a
better human being.
Bill C

Amen. He's not a bad cyclist either.

Anybody have any links or info about what happened between him and Gabby?

No, but I haven't been wading through the German magazines since my
ability is declining.
I think that Jan's love for the nightlife and spotlight killed it.

This story:

http://www.bild.t-online.de/BTO/sport/aktuell/2005/05/15/ullrich__trennung/jan__ullrich__trennung.html

suggests that the couple simply drifted apart over time, due mostly to
the amount of time Ullrich's career kept him away from home, though it
also mentions Gaby's aversion to the limelight. Ullrich's 2002
shenanigens clearly put a strain on the relationship -- Gaby said at the
time she wasn't sure she could cope -- but they agreed to patch things
up and try a "new beginning", including a move to Switzerland and a
baby, but that was apparently not enough to keep them together. There
don't appear to be any other women, or other "dirty laundry", involved,
and Jan has provided generously for Gaby and the baby. He's living
alone in the house in Switzerland and Gaby has returned to her parents
with the kid.

Chris Menzel

Chris Menzel said:

Bill C said:

J.V. said:

"Bill C" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> http://www.velonews.com/diaries/rider/articles/8245.0.html

> and friends as he has with himself. The lack of a ruthless killer
> instinct has given Lance his record run, but I still think Jan is a
> better human being.
> Bill C
>

Amen. He's not a bad cyclist either.

Anybody have any links or info about what happened between him and Gabby?

No, but I haven't been wading through the German magazines since my
ability is declining.
I think that Jan's love for the nightlife and spotlight killed it.

This story:

http://www.bild.t-online.de/BTO/sport/aktuell/2005/05/15/ullrich__trennung/jan__ullrich__trennung.html

suggests that the couple simply drifted apart over time, due mostly to
the amount of time Ullrich's career kept him away from home, though it
also mentions Gaby's aversion to the limelight. Ullrich's 2002
shenanigens clearly put a strain on the relationship -- Gaby said at the
time she wasn't sure she could cope -- but they agreed to patch things
up and try a "new beginning", including a move to Switzerland and a
baby, but that was apparently not enough to keep them together. There
don't appear to be any other women, or other "dirty laundry", involved,
and Jan has provided generously for Gaby and the baby. He's living
alone in the house in Switzerland and Gaby has returned to her parents
with the kid.

Chris Menzel

Check out the 'photo album' link - then see the second or third photo
for a laugh.

-RJ

ronaldo_jeremiah said:

Check out the 'photo album' link - then see the second or third photo
for a laugh.

http://bilder.bild.t-online.de/BTO/sport/fotogalerie/allgemein/jan__ullrich__frau__150505/pfeife__proj,property=Bild.jpg
"2002: Zur Katar-Rundfahrt hat ihn Gaby begleitet. Ullrich gönnt sich in
einem Zelt-Restaurant einen Zug aus der Wasserpfeife
Foto: dpa"

--
Firefox Web Browser - Rediscover the web - http://getffox.com/
Thunderbird E-mail and Newsgroups - http://gettbird.com/

ronaldo_jeremiah said:

Quoted message said:

http://www.bild.t-online.de/BTO/sport/aktuell/2005/05/15/ullrich__trennung/jan__ullrich__trennung.html

Quoted message said:

Check out the 'photo album' link - then see the second or third photo
for a laugh.

Even better, click on 'Die besten Bilder' and check the gallery on the
lower left. It explains why soccer is more popular than cycling.

Bob Schwartz
[email hidden]

Bob Schwartz said:

Even better, click on 'Die besten Bilder' and check the gallery on the
lower left. It explains why soccer is more popular than cycling.

http://www.bild.t-online.de/BTO/sport/fotogalerie/fussball/geilsten__fans__170605/galerie__brasilien__fans,templateId=renderFGKoerper,Picture=0.html

thinking of brasil...

http://www.office-humour.com/g/i/2524/

Bill C said:

but I still think Jan is a better human being.

*** You met them both and spent some time with them, huh.

Cool.

---
k e i t h a l e x a n d e r
http://www.nootrope.net
http://www.keithalexander.com/blog
http://www.modernamerican.com

- - e n d t r a n s m i s s i o n - -

Keith Alexander® said:

Bill C said:

but I still think Jan is a better human being.

*** You met them both and spent some time with them, huh.

Cool.

---
k e i t h a l e x a n d e r
http://www.nootrope.net
http://www.keithalexander.com/blog
http://www.modernamerican.com

- - e n d t r a n s m i s s i o n - -

No but when even Lance's friends say that he is hard to deal with, and
will eventually get [censored] at you no matter what then it's pretty
simple to contrast that with all the people around Jan including some I
do know personally who say he's a great guy and pretty laid back.
Lance is a totally driven type A and will do whatever he has to, to
get what he wants. If your in the way too bad.
The new book we were talking about here the other day made that really
clear in the interview with the author. The people I know around
Telekom all have good things to say about Jan and would defend him to
the death.
Sometimes you don't have to know people personally when there is lots
of public evidence about their character.
Bill C

"Chris Menzel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Bill C said:

J.V. said:

"Bill C" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
> http://www.velonews.com/diaries/rider/articles/8245.0.html

> and friends as he has with himself. The lack of a ruthless killer
> instinct has given Lance his record run, but I still think Jan is a
> better human being.
> Bill C
>

Amen. He's not a bad cyclist either.

Anybody have any links or info about what happened between him and
Gabby?

No, but I haven't been wading through the German magazines since my
ability is declining.
I think that Jan's love for the nightlife and spotlight killed it.

This story:

http://www.bild.t-online.de/BTO/sport/aktuell/2005/05/15/ullrich__trennung/jan__ullrich__trennung.html

suggests that the couple simply drifted apart over time, due mostly to
the amount of time Ullrich's career kept him away from home, though it
also mentions Gaby's aversion to the limelight. Ullrich's 2002
shenanigens clearly put a strain on the relationship -- Gaby said at the
time she wasn't sure she could cope -- but they agreed to patch things
up and try a "new beginning", including a move to Switzerland and a
baby, but that was apparently not enough to keep them together. There
don't appear to be any other women, or other "dirty laundry", involved,
and Jan has provided generously for Gaby and the baby. He's living
alone in the house in Switzerland and Gaby has returned to her parents
with the kid.

Reading that I see that I had entirely the wrong idea about who the star was
and who the stay at home.

On Wed, 22 Jun 2005 02:01:37 GMT, "Tom Kunich" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Reading that I see

*** No one here seems to know how to snip.

My head hurts.

Kurgan, that's a straight line for you...

---
k e i t h a l e x a n d e r
http://www.nootrope.net
http://www.keithalexander.com/blog
http://www.modernamerican.com

- - e n d t r a n s m i s s i o n - -

Bill C said:

http://www.velonews.com/diaries/rider/articles/8245.0.html
Maybe it's Jan's Achille's Heel that he really cares about the people
around him, and doesn't think he's the star. Jan needs his support
system, but he's always been at least as concerned with his teamates
and friends as he has with himself. The lack of a ruthless killer
instinct has given Lance his record run, but I still think Jan is a
better human being.
Bill C

I can't remember who it was, but he said about jan, 'he's too nice.' I
also like that he has his weaknesses like chocolate or whatever. He's
one of us.He has his own weaknesses to overcome- it makes him more
empathetic.OTOH, don't underestimate a determined german.

Quoted message said:

I also like that he has his weaknesses like chocolate or whatever.

*** Surely you jest.

---
k e i t h a l e x a n d e r
http://www.nootrope.net
http://www.keithalexander.com/blog
http://www.modernamerican.com

- - e n d t r a n s m i s s i o n - -

Bill C said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

- - e n d t r a n s m i s s i o n - -

No but when even Lance's friends say that he is hard to deal with, and
will eventually get [censored] at you no matter what then it's pretty
simple to contrast that with all the people around Jan including some I
do know personally who say he's a great guy and pretty laid back.
Lance is a totally driven type A and will do whatever he has to, to
get what he wants. If your in the way too bad.
The new book we were talking about here the other day made that really
clear in the interview with the author. The people I know around
Telekom all have good things to say about Jan and would defend him to
the death.
Sometimes you don't have to know people personally when there is lots
of public evidence about their character.
Bill C

But "better human being"? I guess that whole LAF thing and kajillion
dollars doesn't count for much.

D

David Ferguson said:

But "better human being"? I guess that whole LAF thing and kajillion
dollars doesn't count for much.

http://www.booknoise.net/armstrong/qanda.html

Robert Chung said:

David Ferguson said:

But "better human being"? I guess that whole LAF thing and kajillion
dollars doesn't count for much.

http://www.booknoise.net/armstrong/qanda.html

Great article, thanks for the link.

I'm not sure if you posted it to support the "human being" idea or not
but it doesn't detract, from what I can tell, from his quality as a
"human being".

I know a couple people just like him. Super competitive and aloof to
most. Skeptical, suspicious and untrusting. But they are all super
loyal and forthright. People that I consider great "human beings".
That seems to apply to Lance. Not to mention that kajillion dollars
for cancer thing.

Jan is a great guy from everything I've seen. Someone who would be
great to hang out with. There's no taking that away from him. Everyone
seems to like him a lot. But that doesn't make him a "better human
being".

I'm a fan of them both.

D

David Ferguson said:

Bill C said:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

- - e n d t r a n s m i s s i o n - -

No but when even Lance's friends say that he is hard to deal with, and
will eventually get [censored] at you no matter what then it's pretty
simple to contrast that with all the people around Jan including some I
do know personally who say he's a great guy and pretty laid back.
Lance is a totally driven type A and will do whatever he has to, to
get what he wants. If your in the way too bad.
The new book we were talking about here the other day made that really
clear in the interview with the author. The people I know around
Telekom all have good things to say about Jan and would defend him to
the death.
Sometimes you don't have to know people personally when there is lots
of public evidence about their character.
Bill C

But "better human being"? I guess that whole LAF thing and kajillion
dollars doesn't count for much.

D

I didn't say that Lance doesn't have his good points, and he has a lot
including the ones you mentioned, but giving money to charity doesn't
make you a good person. Bill Gates, Nike, and Wal-Mart all give lots of
money to charity but also have ruthless reprehensible practices that
make people question them. Even Lance's friends say that he's
intolerant, judgemental, condescending to people he doesn't think are
as good as him, inflexible etc...I don't consider those to be good
traits. I don't think anybody should treat people that way.
I respect everything he's done, and agree he does a ton of good for
people, but when even his best friend is saying that he's miserable to
be around, and nasty to everyone when things aren't going exactly his
way then I don't consider that a ringing endorsement of his character.
Read through the interview. He demands absolute loyalty but will cut
even his friends loose as soon as they [censored] him off or are no longer
useful. That's reprehensible.
Bill C

Bill C said:

David Ferguson said:

Bill C said:

Quoted message said:

>
> - - e n d t r a n s m i s s i o n - -
No but when even Lance's friends say that he is hard to deal with, and
will eventually get [censored] at you no matter what then it's pretty
simple to contrast that with all the people around Jan including some I
do know personally who say he's a great guy and pretty laid back.
Lance is a totally driven type A and will do whatever he has to, to
get what he wants. If your in the way too bad.
The new book we were talking about here the other day made that really
clear in the interview with the author. The people I know around
Telekom all have good things to say about Jan and would defend him to
the death.
Sometimes you don't have to know people personally when there is lots
of public evidence about their character.
Bill C

But "better human being"? I guess that whole LAF thing and kajillion
dollars doesn't count for much.

D

I didn't say that Lance doesn't have his good points, and he has a lot
including the ones you mentioned, but giving money to charity doesn't
make you a good person. Bill Gates, Nike, and Wal-Mart all give lots of
money to charity but also have ruthless reprehensible practices that
make people question them. Even Lance's friends say that he's
intolerant, judgemental, condescending to people he doesn't think are
as good as him, inflexible etc...I don't consider those to be good
traits. I don't think anybody should treat people that way.
I respect everything he's done, and agree he does a ton of good for
people, but when even his best friend is saying that he's miserable to
be around, and nasty to everyone when things aren't going exactly his
way then I don't consider that a ringing endorsement of his character.
Read through the interview. He demands absolute loyalty but will cut
even his friends loose as soon as they [censored] him off or are no longer
useful. That's reprehensible.
Bill C

I read the interview. I didn't gather that he cuts his friends loose
as soon as they are no longer useful.

And the discussion isn't whether or not he's a great friend but
whether he's a "better human being" or not. As a "human being", 100
years from now people won't remember Jan. But they will remember
Lance.

I guess it all comes down to one's definition of what makes a good
"human being".

D