GOMLs in The Lake District?

On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 16:36:44 GMT, Roger <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Did the Potter Fell walk this am and for once started off by following
AWs actual route. Near Side House there was a sign saying a Bridleway
had been officially diverted (now that takes some political clout,
particularly in a National Park) and shortly thereafter when the track
ceased to be a PROW there was a large notice stating no public right of
way, no access. No matter, the mist was down and I pressed on.
The walk was briefly enlivened by my waypoint for Brunt Knott being
entered wrongly in the gps but the way forward wasn't particularly
difficult until the section between Nameless 1266' and Ulgraves where
the gaps in the wall that AW notes have been repaired and the already
substantial wall protected on the inside with a run of sheep netting
with 4 strands of barbed wire above rather than the customary one. I
took the easy way out (reluctantly as it meant leaving the ridge) and
walked round the enclosure to a track that bypassed it but my troubles
were not yet over. The track was barred by a locked gate with the top
rail liberally festooned with barbed wire. After leaving the summit of
Ulgraves I came across another barb wired gate (leading back onto the
track I had been following previously) but some kind soul had stripped
part of that back. I went the opposite way round Gurnal Dubs to AWs
directions to see what a prominent notice said. (Private ground, private
fishing).

It being a Sunday I thought it unwise to try and park next to the church
in Kentmere so less than a week after suggesting that Sadgill was not
the right place to do Hollow Moor from (and to get there early) I was
parked there eating my lunch and wondering how on earth 12 cars could be
parked without hindering access. There were half a dozen there when I
arrived and one of those was actually parked on one fork of the track so
I had to reverse up the steep grass by the bench (4 wheel drive does
come in handy sometimes).

Another uneventful walk, this time below the clag but I did notice a
proliferation of notices directed at green laners (follow the code),
cyclists (don't cause conflict, keep off the footpaths) and walkers
(most of the land is privately owned, keep to the footpaths). I have
seen the green lane notices before but I don't recall seeing any of the
others previously in other parts of the Lake District.

We should approach such signs with the same fervour that Martin
approaches cairns. And as for barbed wire on gates - that sets my
wire-cutting hand itching. It clearly isn't intended to keep stock in.

--

R
o
o
n
e
y

Quoted message said:

(Private ground, private fishing).
and walkers (most of the land is privately owned, keep to the footpaths).

footpaths, private, RoW, so onfusing sometimes.
Keeping to the footpaths will often mean not keeping to the RoW

North of Pen-y-ghent towards the next Nuttal, whose name escapes me,
is a wall with gate, the gate stated "PRIVATE LAND", so what, I think,
the land on both sides is private land, almost everywhere is private
land, why a sign to state the bloody obvious.
but it was enough for me to get the map out, and for me to see that a
RoW went across this private land.
Bloody cheek thinks I, an attempt at intimidation,
(as it happened the RoW was on the other side of the fence, Harveys
shows it one side, OS the other)
but what was the sign trying to tell me, when I see a sign saying its
private, it makes me wonder why they state that, maybe there is
importance in what it doesnt state, that is, its access rights.

When does the CROW act start in the Lakes? Here in the Peaks it's improves
things in many tricky areas where you had to either risk being shouted at or
go around.

We had it quite good before, but it's the icing on the cake now.

The message <[email hidden]>
from "Lewis" <[email hidden]> contains these words:

Quoted message said:

When does the CROW act start in the Lakes? Here in the Peaks it's improves
things in many tricky areas where you had to either risk being shouted
at or
go around.

I have some vague idea it was to be next March and was hoping to leave
the more obscure Outlying Fells till then but unfortunately I am running
out of other options. :-)

Quoted message said:

We had it quite good before, but it's the icing on the cake now.

Yes, on the bigger hills in the Lake District I have never had any
problems with access and ISTR that The Nab is about the only one where
it might have been likely in times past.

--
Roger Chapman so far this year 134 summits
New - 105 (Marilyns 14, Sweats 5, Outlying Fells 93)
Repeats - 29 (Marilyns 11, Sweats 21, Wainwrights 16, Outlying Fells 2)

Roger said:

Did the Potter Fell walk this am and for once started off by

following

Quoted message said:

AWs actual route. Near Side House there was a sign saying a Bridleway
had been officially diverted (now that takes some political clout,
particularly in a National Park) and shortly thereafter when the

track

Quoted message said:

ceased to be a PROW there was a large notice stating no public right

of

Quoted message said:

way, no access.

I did this walk in August - I didn't believe the sign to be a real one,
merely a 'scare' tactic by a farmer. Do you think the sign looked
official? See this walk and route map here:

http://www.stridingedge.net/Walks/2004/8%20August/26.8.04.htm

the section between Nameless 1266' and Ulgraves where

Quoted message said:

the gaps in the wall that AW notes have been repaired and the already
substantial wall protected on the inside with a run of sheep netting
with 4 strands of barbed wire above rather than the customary one. I
took the easy way out

This section was a complete nightmare - I did some major acrobatics to
get over these ones!

Quoted message said:

It being a Sunday I thought it unwise to try and park next to the

church

Quoted message said:

in Kentmere so less than a week after suggesting that Sadgill was not
the right place to do Hollow Moor from (and to get there early)

I did it from Green Quarter - great views from there the day I went.
See it here:

http://www.stridingedge.net/Walks/2004/10%20October/15.10.04.htm
Regards,

Sean

Quoted message said:

Yes, on the bigger hills in the Lake District I have never had any
problems with access and ISTR that The Nab is about the only one where
it might have been likely in times past.

The infamous current example is that nutter in Ennerdale... Cunning
approaches to Great Bourne etc....

Richard Webb

RJ Webb wrote on Sun, 12 Dec 2004 21:11:20 GMT....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yes, on the bigger hills in the Lake District I have never had any
problems with access and ISTR that The Nab is about the only one where
it might have been likely in times past.

The infamous current example is that nutter in Ennerdale... Cunning
approaches to Great Bourne etc....

Yes, I was going to mention him and ask whether he was still current.
What cunning approaches would you recommend?

--
Tim Jackson
[email hidden]
(Change '.invalid' to '.co.uk' to reply direct)
Absurd patents: visit http://www.patent.freeserve.co.uk

Tim Jackson said:

Yes, I was going to mention him and ask whether he was still current.
What cunning approaches would you recommend?

http://users.rcn.com/skmurphy/EQ%20Wirecutters.jpg

--

R
o
o
n
e
y

(RJ Webb) said:

Quoted message said:

Yes, on the bigger hills in the Lake District I have never had any
problems with access and ISTR that The Nab is about the only one where
it might have been likely in times past.

The infamous current example is that nutter in Ennerdale...

But he's flouting the existing rules so CRoW isn't going to make too
much difference, except to the numbers of laws he's ignoring ...

--
York Alpine Club - http://www.yorkalpineclub.org.uk
Recent Photos - http://climbing.me.uk
Old Photos - http://www.simon-caldwell.co.uk
My Brother's Photos - http://www.caldwellcreations.co.uk

Quoted message said:

But he's flouting the existing rules so CRoW isn't going to make too
much difference, except to the numbers of laws he's ignoring ...

Which rules and how does he flout them ?
what exactly does he do

The message <[email hidden]>
from "Sean McMahon" <[email hidden]> contains these words:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Did the Potter Fell walk this am and for once started off by

following

Quoted message said:

AWs actual route. Near Side House there was a sign saying a Bridleway
had been officially diverted (now that takes some political clout,
particularly in a National Park) and shortly thereafter when the

track

Quoted message said:

ceased to be a PROW there was a large notice stating no public right

of

Quoted message said:

way, no access.

Quoted message said:

I did this walk in August - I didn't believe the sign to be a real one,
merely a 'scare' tactic by a farmer. Do you think the sign looked
official? See this walk and route map here:

Quoted message said:

http://www.stridingedge.net/Walks/2004/8%20August/26.8.04.htm

I read off line so cannot easy refer to links but there is no law
against landlords (or tenants) putting up notices but trespassing is not
usually a crime.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

the section between Nameless 1266' and Ulgraves where
the gaps in the wall that AW notes have been repaired and the already
substantial wall protected on the inside with a run of sheep netting
with 4 strands of barbed wire above rather than the customary one. I
took the easy way out

Quoted message said:

This section was a complete nightmare - I did some major acrobatics to
get over these ones!

That was about the most disobliging fence I have ever come across. Put
up in extreme spit no doubt by the perp. would have saved much time and
effort in just putting in a few stiles on the obvious line.

I decided not to bother as AW didn't make a mountain of the molehills on
the link between Nameless 1266 and Ulgraves :-)

--
Roger Chapman so far this year 134 summits
New - 105 (Marilyns 14, Sweats 5, Outlying Fells 93)
Repeats - 29 (Marilyns 11, Sweats 21, Wainwrights 16, Outlying Fells 2)

The message <[email hidden]>
from [email hidden] (RJ Webb) contains these words:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yes, on the bigger hills in the Lake District I have never had any
problems with access and ISTR that The Nab is about the only one where
it might have been likely in times past.

Quoted message said:

The infamous current example is that nutter in Ennerdale... Cunning
approaches to Great Bourne etc....

I hadn't heard about that (or forgot it) but then I did Great Bourne
from Buttermere and then finished my Wainwright round over Starling Dodd
(IIRC). Red Pike being the first of my never-to-be-completed 2nd round.
:-)

--
Roger Chapman so far this year 134 summits
New - 105 (Marilyns 14, Sweats 5, Outlying Fells 93)
Repeats - 29 (Marilyns 11, Sweats 21, Wainwrights 16, Outlying Fells 2)

Rooney <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

We should approach such signs with the same fervour that Martin
approaches cairns. And as for barbed wire on gates - that sets my
wire-cutting hand itching. It clearly isn't intended to keep stock in.

Adjacent to stiles is the worst place for barbed wire, but to be fair I
suppose the wire on gates is designed to stop idiots climbing the gate
at the latch end and postponing the inevitable sag which all the gates
do eventually.
--
Gordon Harris

The message <[email hidden]>
from Gordon Harris <[email hidden]> contains these words:

Quoted message said:

Adjacent to stiles is the worst place for barbed wire, but to be fair I
suppose the wire on gates is designed to stop idiots climbing the gate
at the latch end and postponing the inevitable sag which all the gates
do eventually.

And you have a believable explanation for the generous helping of barbed
wire along the rest of the gate?

Actually I think I did climb the gate at the padlock end as I thought
the wooden rails looked less likely to resign that end. I'd rather not
think about what it would have been like if the rail I was standing on
had done departed while I was straddling the gate. The gate had probably
been doctored but funnily enough I didn't even think of lifting it off
its hinge pins on this occasion.

--
Roger Chapman so far this year 134 summits
New - 105 (Marilyns 14, Sweats 5, Outlying Fells 93)
Repeats - 29 (Marilyns 11, Sweats 21, Wainwrights 16, Outlying Fells 2)

Carl said:

Quoted message said:

But he's flouting the existing rules so CRoW isn't going to make too
much difference, except to the numbers of laws he's ignoring ...

Which rules and how does he flout them ?
what exactly does he do

He attempts to stop people using a public footpath. I think guns have
been involved but I can't find any links, I'm sure someone will help
out.

--
York Alpine Club - http://www.yorkalpineclub.org.uk
Recent Photos - http://climbing.me.uk
Old Photos - http://www.simon-caldwell.co.uk
My Brother's Photos - http://www.caldwellcreations.co.uk

Tim Jackson said:

RJ Webb wrote on Sun, 12 Dec 2004 21:11:20 GMT....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Yes, on the bigger hills in the Lake District I have never had any
problems with access and ISTR that The Nab is about the only one where
it might have been likely in times past.

The infamous current example is that nutter in Ennerdale... Cunning
approaches to Great Bourne etc....

Yes, I was going to mention him and ask whether he was still current.
What cunning approaches would you recommend?

Only been there once(Ennerdale Horseshoe), and went up Great Bourne
from NY109159 Roughly following the burn on the 1:50K map. Sadly
this is a [censored] route for mass use and will erode one day - hopefully
it will be safe to go up the sensible way before then

Richard Webb

Roger <[email hidden]> writes

Quoted message said:

The message <[email hidden]>
from Gordon Harris <[email hidden]> contains these words:

Quoted message said:

Adjacent to stiles is the worst place for barbed wire, but to be fair I
suppose the wire on gates is designed to stop idiots climbing the gate
at the latch end and postponing the inevitable sag which all the gates
do eventually.

And you have a believable explanation for the generous helping of barbed
wire along the rest of the gate?

I should have said that I hate barbed wire anywhere, I suppose.

And can I apologise for the badly constructed sentence in my previous
post? :-(

Quoted message said:

Actually I think I did climb the gate at the padlock end as I thought
the wooden rails looked less likely to resign that end. I'd rather not
think about what it would have been like if the rail I was standing on
had done departed while I was straddling the gate. The gate had probably
been doctored but funnily enough I didn't even think of lifting it off
its hinge pins on this occasion.

--
Gordon Harris