ghostly bicycles around town

Quoted message said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are silvery/white (ghostly)

painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and such with signs on
them that say cyclist hit here and so on.

That would creep me out. Drive on rural roads in Mexico and you see little
wooden crosses along the way where people have died in accidents. Aren't there
better ways to encourage safety than to create roadside distractions like this?

(TopCounsel) said:

That would creep me out. Drive on rural roads in Mexico and you see little
wooden crosses along the way where people have died in accidents. Aren't there
better ways to encourage safety than to create roadside distractions like this?

Here in Rhode Island, little wooden crosses are common. They are
often festooned with flowers, notes, and so forth. The new thing,
though, is putting out wrecked cars with signs about drunk
driving...very much analogous to the bike example concerned in this
thread.

There's also some monuments.

Personally, I don't think they are a big issue as distractions, and
I do think they are a nice way to remind people.
--
Rick Onanian

curt said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are silvery/white
(ghostly) painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and such
with signs on them that say cyclist hit here and so on. The whole bike is
painted, tires and all. I was wondering is this only in Pittsburgh? I sort
of like them because they make drivers aware of us, but they are a sad
reminder and kind of eerie.

Curt

It actually started in St. Louis and was later brought to Pittsburgh.
You can read a Post Gazette article here:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04148/322514.stm

They also have a website at http://www.ghostbike.org/ but their choice
of background is rather rough on the eyes.

- khill

TopCounsel said:

Quoted message said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are silvery/white (ghostly)

painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and such with signs on
them that say cyclist hit here and so on.

That would creep me out. Drive on rural roads in Mexico and you see little
wooden crosses along the way where people have died in accidents. Aren't there
better ways to encourage safety than to create roadside distractions like this?

The roadside crosses are important because they aren't just warnings,
they're shrines. In Mexico its a tradition to place a shrine where
someone died.

More importantly, I think the roadside crosses they have a great effect
on people. When I've been driving down some desert roads, I usually
notice the driver easing on the gas and relaxing a bit, even if it's me.

Incidentally, I saw a Star of David once.

(TopCounsel) said:

That would creep me out. Drive on rural roads in Mexico and you see little
wooden crosses along the way where people have died in accidents. Aren't there
better ways to encourage safety than to create roadside distractions like this?

My son's college roommate pointed out one difference between Minnesota
and Wisconsin. In Wisconsin, if there's a fatal automobile crash,
someone puts up a wooden cross with a wreath of flowers. In
Minnesota, someone puts up a stop sign.

Wow, thanks. That is what I have been seeing. Interesting idea.

Curt

"khill" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

curt said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are silvery/white
(ghostly) painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and

such

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

with signs on them that say cyclist hit here and so on. The whole bike

is

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

painted, tires and all. I was wondering is this only in Pittsburgh? I

sort

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

of like them because they make drivers aware of us, but they are a sad
reminder and kind of eerie.

Curt

It actually started in St. Louis and was later brought to Pittsburgh.
You can read a Post Gazette article here:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04148/322514.stm

They also have a website at http://www.ghostbike.org/ but their choice
of background is rather rough on the eyes.

- khill

I see the crosses here to.

Curt

"TopCounsel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are silvery/white

(ghostly)

Quoted message said:

painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and such with

signs on

Quoted message said:

them that say cyclist hit here and so on.

That would creep me out. Drive on rural roads in Mexico and you see

little

Quoted message said:

wooden crosses along the way where people have died in accidents. Aren't

there

Quoted message said:

better ways to encourage safety than to create roadside distractions like

this?

Quoted message said:

I see the crosses here to.

Don't get carried away, we don't die all that often.

--

_______________________ALL AMIGA IN MY MIND_______________________
------------------"Buddy Holly, the Texas Elvis"------------------
__________306.350.357.38>>[email hidden]__________

"TopCounsel" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are

silvery/white (ghostly)

Quoted message said:

painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and such

with signs on

Quoted message said:

them that say cyclist hit here and so on.

Has that resulted in cycling increasing, or decreasing?

Has it resulted ion the perception that anyone who cycles must be a
foolhardy idiot?

Perhpas we need crosses wherever somebody has had a heart attack

Jeremy Parker

Curt said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are silvery/white
(ghostly) painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and
such with signs on them that say cyclist hit here and so on. The whole
bike is painted, tires and all. I was wondering is this only in
Pittsburgh? I sort of like them because they make drivers aware of us,
but they are a sad reminder and kind of eerie.
Curt

Does this really make drivers more aware of cyclist or just scare off
cyclists from riding on the road? If they did this in my area I'm sure
my wife and family would start chastising me because the roads are too
dangerous for bikes.

Dan.

--

"BanditManDan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Curt said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are silvery/white
(ghostly) painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and
such with signs on them that say cyclist hit here and so on. The whole
bike is painted, tires and all. I was wondering is this only in
Pittsburgh? I sort of like them because they make drivers aware of us,
but they are a sad reminder and kind of eerie.
Curt

Does this really make drivers more aware of cyclist or just scare off
cyclists from riding on the road? If they did this in my area I'm sure
my wife and family would start chastising me because the roads are too
dangerous for bikes.

Dan.

Good question. I don't know, but I would suspect a little of each. When I
see them I do get a little weirded out by it, but I think car drivers see
them and maybe it plants a seed...not sure. They are a scary color. Really
ghostly and it makes quite an impression. Pittsburgh is a tough place to
ride a bicycle if you need to get some places, but there are some trail
systems getting in place and that helps if you need to get cross town. Wish
there were more trails around.. I am trying to ride mine in place of a car
and sometimes it is pretty wild out there. I am glad I am riding my
mountain bike for this type of thing and ride my road bike on the weekends
for long rides.

Curt

"Eric S. Sande" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I see the crosses here to.

Don't get carried away, we don't die all that often.

It does have an effect, but I am just a careful cyclist, or try to be. I
have mixed feelings over the ghost cycles around.

Curt

BanditManDan said:

Curt said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are silvery/white
(ghostly) painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and
such with signs on them that say cyclist hit here and so on. The whole
bike is painted, tires and all. I was wondering is this only in
Pittsburgh? I sort of like them because they make drivers aware of us,
but they are a sad reminder and kind of eerie.

Does this really make drivers more aware of cyclist or just scare off
cyclists from riding on the road? If they did this in my area I'm sure
my wife and family would start chastising me because the roads are too
dangerous for bikes.

I'm afraid that is exactly what would happen in many households. The only
way to have the desired effect would be to have a unique designation for
each kind of traffic death - a wrecked car for car-only, a statue of a
pedestrian for a run-down pedestrian, etc.

If that were done, then the bicycles wouldn't even get noticed because there
would be so few (comparatively).

Austin
--
I'm pedaling as fast as I durn well please!
There are no X characters in my address

TopCounsel said:

Quoted message said:

I live in Pittsburgh, PA and around the city there are silvery/white (ghostly)

painted bicycles around that are chained to phone polls and such with signs on
them that say cyclist hit here and so on.

That would creep me out. Drive on rural roads in Mexico and you see little
wooden crosses along the way where people have died in accidents. Aren't there
better ways to encourage safety than to create roadside distractions like this?

One sees such memorials in Germany too. They seemed to be everywhere in
Wurtemburg when I was there (1980's).

AustinMN said:

BanditManDan said:

Does this really make drivers more aware of cyclist or just scare off
cyclists from riding on the road? If they did this in my area I'm sure
my wife and family would start chastising me because the roads are too
dangerous for bikes.

I'm sure they're scaring some people away from cycling. And I'm
continually amazed that dedicated cyclists go to such efforts to make
cycling sound dangerous. How foolish!

Quoted message said:

I'm afraid that is exactly what would happen in many households. The only
way to have the desired effect would be to have a unique designation for
each kind of traffic death - a wrecked car for car-only, a statue of a
pedestrian for a run-down pedestrian, etc.

If that were done, then the bicycles wouldn't even get noticed because there
would be so few (comparatively).

Well, this group is making up for the lack of cycling fatalities by
putting out _extra_ bikes that have nothing to do with fatalities.

In other words, make people think there are more fatalities than there
are. Wonderful. :-/

Quoting from http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04148/322514.stm

"Quartuccio said the group compiled information about accident sites,
coming up with more than 14. They allocated the bicycles first to places
where fatal accidents had occurred -- such as the 4100 block of Irvine
Street in Hazelwood, where Robert Hemelrick, 32, of Hazelwood, was
struck and killed Jan. 27 -- and then to sites where their members had
been hit.

They followed that with places thought to be the most visible."

--
--------------------+
Frank Krygowski [To reply, remove rodent and vegetable dot com,
replace with cc.ysu dot edu]

Frank Krygowski <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Well, this group is making up for the lack of cycling fatalities by
putting out _extra_ bikes that have nothing to do with fatalities.

In other words, make people think there are more fatalities than there
are. Wonderful. :-/

Quoting from http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04148/322514.stm

"Quartuccio said the group compiled information about accident sites,
coming up with more than 14. They allocated the bicycles first to places
where fatal accidents had occurred -- such as the 4100 block of Irvine
Street in Hazelwood, where Robert Hemelrick, 32, of Hazelwood, was
struck and killed Jan. 27 -- and then to sites where their members had
been hit.

They followed that with places thought to be the most visible."

Frank,

Maybe you understand the context of the bit you're quoting here, but
to those who haven't read the whole article I think it can be a bit
misleading.

In the first place, the whole idea of the ghost bike project is to put
the ghost bikes in places where there have been motor vehicle-bicycle
collisions of ANY sort, not just fatalities.

For more about the white bikes see:
http://www.confluenceweb.org/article.asp?articleID=174&page=1
http://www.pbase.com/terbo/brokenbikes

Second, what you say plus the quotation you use could lead the
unsuspecting reader to the conclusion that they are just putting up
the bikes in random places because they had more bikes than collision
spots.

In fact, the situation was just the reverse. They had more collision
spots than bicycles to place. So after placing bicycles where
fatalities had happened and where bicycle club members had been hit
(but not killed), they then selected **from among the remaining places
where collisions had occurred** the ones they thought would have
greatest visibility.

Here's a more complete quote from the article that puts the bit you
quoted (above) into a somewhat different context:

---
After getting the word out through conversations and the Internet,
Ghost Bike Pittsburgh received as donations 14 broken bicycles
destined for the scrap heap.

The group smashed the bikes, slathered them with white house paint and
"deployed" them Monday between about 9:30 p.m. and midnight.

Quartuccio said the group compiled information about accident sites,
coming up with more than 14. They allocated the bicycles first to
places where fatal accidents had occurred -- such as the 4100 block
of Irvine Street in Hazelwood, where Robert Hemelrick, 32, of
Hazelwood, was struck and killed Jan. 27 -- and then to sites where
their members had been hit.

They followed that with places thought to be the most visible.
---

--Brent
bhugh [at] mwsc.edu

Brent Hugh said:

Frank,

Maybe you understand the context of the bit you're quoting here, but
to those who haven't read the whole article I think it can be a bit
misleading.

In the first place, the whole idea of the ghost bike project is to put
the ghost bikes in places where there have been motor vehicle-bicycle
collisions of ANY sort, not just fatalities.

Hmm. OK, on re-reading, I now see that.

I still wonder about the ultimate effect of this effort. Will it do
more to encourage cooperative driving, or will it do more to confirm
what's already in so many minds: "Damn - bicycling's dangerous. I'm
not getting on a bike. And let my kid ride a bike? Forget it!"

As Austin said, maybe we need similar monuments for other road users -
but not just fatalities. A pedestrian statue everywhere a pedestrian
got injured. A car statue everywhere a motorist got injured.

The city would soon be clogged with statues, and only a small percentage
would be bikes.

An unintended benefit: All the car and ped statues would provide
artistic traffic calming!

--
--------------------+
Frank Krygowski [To reply, remove rodent and vegetable dot com,
replace with cc.ysu dot edu]

Curt, I am a reporter doing a story on ghostbikes. Please contact me
via email if you could help. I just want to talk to a Pittsburgh
cyclist. I'm wrapping this up Tuesday.