getting a V02 max and lactate test

bikeguy said:

I've arranged for a V02 max test (on a bike of course) next friday. The test will start at 175 watts and increment by 50 watts (or 25, I'm not sure now my Finnish isn't that great yet) every 2 minutes and there will be no breaks in between. A Wmax will be calculated from the the last workload I'm not able to complete using standard formulas. They'll measure the oxygen use from my breathing into a mask and lactate concentration will be taken from blood samples. Since there are no breaks in between I'll probably get lactate info on when I hit Wmax without any submaximal values.

Should be interesting, I have this feeling that my air drag is really bad and am curious to see how many watts I can actually put out. I've been training a lot recently and have seen some astounding improvements in my endurance, probably can TT 20 km at 40 km/hr or so now on a somewhat hilly course when last summer I could only hold for about 4 km.

I find your discussion immensely interesting and would like to hear the followthrough on this one. Yes, you do have excellent VO2 uptake, whether or not you are aerodynamic with a sustained 40 kph at 20 k and hills to boot. I hope you remember to post the results here. I bet many people would like to hear how this works and your thoughts on the whole process of testing max sustained wattage.

bikeguy said:

I've arranged for a V02 max test (on a bike of course) next friday. The test will start at 175 watts and increment by 50 watts (or 25, I'm not sure now my Finnish isn't that great yet) every 2 minutes and there will be no breaks in between. A Wmax will be calculated from the the last workload I'm not able to complete using standard formulas. They'll measure the oxygen use from my breathing into a mask and lactate concentration will be taken from blood samples. Since there are no breaks in between I'll probably get lactate info on when I hit Wmax without any submaximal values.

Should be interesting, I have this feeling that my air drag is really bad and am curious to see how many watts I can actually put out. I've been training a lot recently and have seen some astounding improvements in my endurance, probably can TT 20 km at 40 km/hr or so now on a somewhat hilly course when last summer I could only hold for about 4 km.

He he!! get ready for some pain!!! 🙂

ed073 said:

He he!! get ready for some pain!!! 🙂

You've done it? 😄

gntlmn said:

You've done it? 😄

Yep. Tough day.

I wasn't even allowed to ride to the test, had to drive, park and walk. Then when you're underway, not content to push you to time-trial like pace and power, they jam this big scuba-diving thing in your mouth towards the end of each level to measure something or another.

It was combined with a muscle biopsy test as well, but that's another even uglier story.

How much does that cost?

sparknote_s said:

How much does that cost?

Aaah....that was the only reason I did it. It was free. Part of a research program with a local university....they were looking for trained athletes for some study or another and you got to keep your results from the test.
Considering the equipment, time, staff (3 people looking after me) etc, it wouldn't come cheap.

Maybe you could ring some schools in your area and see if they are looking for guinea pigs??

ed073 said:

Aaah....that was the only reason I did it. It was free. Part of a research program with a local university....they were looking for trained athletes for some study or another and you got to keep your results from the test.
Considering the equipment, time, staff (3 people looking after me) etc, it wouldn't come cheap.

Maybe you could ring some schools in your area and see if they are looking for guinea pigs??

What about the information? Was it surprising? Do you figure you could have come up with much the same result with a heart rate monitor and power meter on your own?

gntlmn said:

What about the information? Was it surprising? Do you figure you could have come up with much the same result with a heart rate monitor and power meter on your own?

not surprising, interesting. Thing is, without regular tests throughout the season, there is no way of telling if you are progressing. so a one-off is good, but really is only a starting point.
I was more powerful than I thought I would be and my max HR was much higher than I thought it would be.

I nearly spewed into that mouth thing.

gntlmn said:

You've done it? 😄

Done loads, conducted lots, all great fun ;-)

just to point out -- not sure if this is what ed073 meant, but a VO2max test will go significantly beyond what you can sustain for TT power

ric

ric_stern/RST said:

Done loads, conducted lots, all great fun ;-)

just to point out -- not sure if this is what ed073 meant, but a VO2max test will go significantly beyond what you can sustain for TT power

ric

that's fo shizzo.....I had to be held up when I finished.

I did the test. I have to say that breathing through that infernal tube is different (and worse) than breathing normally and I'm sure it negatively affected my result. Also they used a strap over the ankles not a clipless and there weren't fans blowing on me, there was a pile of sweat when I finished that had dripped down. There was a pile of goo in the mouth piece after I took it off, I felt like I was suffocating at the end. Anyway I maxxed at 375 watts at about 180 bpm, started at 75 watts and went in 25 watt increments every 2 minutes with no breaks inbetween, lactate was taken from my finger every 2 minutes. They also took lactate during a recovery period of 8 minutes at 100 watts at 2,4 and 8 minutes to see how it was being removed from my system. I maintained 70 rpm through the easy wattages and went up to 87 rpm through the hard part. My legs went first but my lungs weren't far behind.

I don't have anything else right now than the Wmax, they said they'll mail the full results to me later. My bodyweight has fallen to 73.3 kg (they measured it before the test) . I've lost about 7 kg since I started cycling seriously.

yes, I'm bikeguy just logging in as bikeguy2 as I can't remember my password to my first account right now.

OK, I have the full results now....

body weight 73.3 kg, height 184 cm

minutes watts HR V02 L/min V02/kg R VEO2 STPD lactate
(mmol/L)

2:00 75 98 1.31 17.9 0.69 15.9 20.7 1.3
4:00 100 107 1.80 24.6 0.75 15.7 28.1 1.5
6:00 125 117 1.98 27.1 0.84 18.52 36.6 ?
8:00 150 122 2.17 29.7 0.88 19.07 41.4 1.3 (?)
10:00 175 134 2.65 36.2 0.89 18.90 49.9 1.3
12:00 200 142 2.87 39.2 0.90 19.15 54.9 1.4
14:00 225 153 3.24 44.3 0.94 21.01 68.1 1.7
16:00 250 160 3.46 47.2 0.98 21.82 75.4 2.3
18:00 275 167 3.79 51.8 1.01 22.48 85.2 3.3
20:00 300 173 3.85 52.5 1.06 26.36 101.4 5.3
22:00 325 176 4.25 58.1 1.10 28.76 122.4 7.1
24:00 350 179 4.30 58.8 1.13 33.75 144.1 10.0
26:00 375 183 4.40 60.2 1.17 36.8 166.8 14.4

they said my Wobla is 282 watts and W Lt is 203 watts. That's watts at onset of blood lactate accumalation and watts at lactate threshold for those who don't know the terms.

Gotta go.

Hurts just reading that.....🙂

That table didn´t show up the way I typed it. To summarize, HR max 183 bpm, VO2 max was 60.2 ml kg min-1, lactate was 14.4 mmol liter at max. The values line up left to right with the headings which were supposed to appear aligned in columns but didn't, R is the ratio of exhaust C02 to exhaust O2. I'm curious about my flatlined VO2 at 325-375 watts. I have no idea what STPD is. I don't know how they calculated the lactate threshold but I get about 230ish watts when I look at the graph they gave me and search for the spot where lactate rises 1 mmol liter over the baseline from 40_60% mhr as I read in High Performance Cycling. OBLA they give as the point where lactate rises above 4 mmol liter so that number should be right.

Looking at my numbers it looks like just plain old VO2 max is my weakness as well as a tendency to accumalate too much lactate at 75% of Wmax. On the plus side I seem to be able to tolerate the lactate pretty well.

When I did the test they said I was allowed to maintain anywhere from 60 and up rpm so I don't know maybe the 87 rpm I did wasn't optimal, it was hard as heck to press on the pedals at 375 watts. The bike was rocking quite a bit too at 350-375 watts.

Hi again, just confirming indeed that I am bikeguy and bikeguy2 as I am travelling between two places and forgot my password last week.

Ed073, I don't think 40 km/hr over 20 km is good at all. I just saw in the newspaper that Tyler Hamilton TT'ed 50 kph over 48 km, now that is GOOD. As for the hills, they are only max 300 m long at 3% or so, ok so maybe my idea of a hill isn't the same as yours. Looking at any one of the mountainous 100+ km long Tour de France stages, I'd say I'd be lucky to just finish one of them. Right now I burn out fast after 20 km and indeed I feel like the whole damn thing is just a slow burn out.

However, compared to the typical cyclist, I can haul.

As regards the Wmax and V02 max test I have a few thoughts: the cooling should simulate that of riding, i.e the cooling should scale to an equivalent estimated velocity actually riding a bike, say using fans blowing from the front.

I felt that the tube and mouthpiece interfered with my V02 uptake as quite a bit of saliva found it's way into the mouthpiece and I felt that I had to do more work just sucking air through that tube and pushing it out. I suppose nothing much really can be done about that. During the test at 350-375 watts, some air escaped around the mouthpiece so that probably threw off the results a bit.

I'm thinking just a straight Wmax test with lactate samples and no gas analyzing equipment probably gives a better idea of true on the road performance.

Well there you have it, I would appreciate some advice on improving my oxygen uptake (V02). Personally, I've found that shorter, very brutal runs that make me go completely out of breath have the most effect on me. Is this a good idea to try and raise my V02 max?

Ric, have any comments on my strengths/weaknesses?

bikeguy said:

Hi again, just confirming indeed that I am bikeguy and bikeguy2 as I am travelling between two places and forgot my password last week.

Ed073, I don't think 40 km/hr over 20 km is good at all. I just saw in the newspaper that Tyler Hamilton TT'ed 50 kph over 48 km, now that is GOOD. As for the hills, they are only max 300 m long at 3% or so, ok so maybe my idea of a hill isn't the same as yours. Looking at any one of the mountainous 100+ km long Tour de France stages, I'd say I'd be lucky to just finish one of them. Right now I burn out fast after 20 km and indeed I feel like the whole damn thing is just a slow burn out.

However, compared to the typical cyclist, I can haul.

As regards the Wmax and V02 max test I have a few thoughts: the cooling should simulate that of riding, i.e the cooling should scale to an equivalent estimated velocity actually riding a bike, say using fans blowing from the front.

I felt that the tube and mouthpiece interfered with my V02 uptake as quite a bit of saliva found it's way into the mouthpiece and I felt that I had to do more work just sucking air through that tube and pushing it out. I suppose nothing much really can be done about that. During the test at 350-375 watts, some air escaped around the mouthpiece so that probably threw off the results a bit.

I'm thinking just a straight Wmax test with lactate samples and no gas analyzing equipment probably gives a better idea of true on the road performance.

Well there you have it, I would appreciate some advice on improving my oxygen uptake (V02). Personally, I've found that shorter, very brutal runs that make me go completely out of breath have the most effect on me. Is this a good idea to try and raise my V02 max?

Ric, have any comments on my strengths/weaknesses?

my high school recently got a vo2 max testing machine. Its very interesting. I have tried it on both a treadmill and on my road bike and have gotten 72 and 71 as my max vo2. i think it would be interesting to get some sort of mobile testing machine. We also have a lactate tester and are just waiting for a new set of teststrips to come.