From the Local Paper

Scott <[email hidden]> wrote in news:40f3f65c$0$1456
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Synopsis: Too Many bikers on local, winding, hilly roads. Locals are
complaining.

There are too many cars on my local roads. Who do I complain to?

Ken said:

Scott <[email hidden]> wrote in news:40f3f65c$0$1456
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Synopsis: Too Many bikers on local, winding, hilly roads. Locals are
complaining.

There are too many cars on my local roads. Who do I complain to?

I guess it would depend on whether the drivers are also
living on those local roads.

I think the locals have a valid point. They are being repeatedly
invaded by swarms of bikers, some of whom seem to be acting like
they're Boston drivers rather than visitors to a bucolic dale. We
used to be members of a CSA* in the Vermont Valley -- the roads
are your typical barely 2-car width wide, sharp, blind turns and
I'm-a-teen-can-I-get-air-on-this-bump hills. It is not a place to
demo your machismo over your fellow biker by covering a mile or
2 in 1/2 a second less than your companion.

Who would want their rural mail delivery suspended or road closed so
there can be a bike race? Once, I suppose, would be okay. But
according to the article, it's happening repeatedly. That is
not being a good neighbor.

Scott
*Community Supported Agriculture
See <http://members.terracom.net/~erpperk/vvalley/> for the Vermont
Valley farm, or <http://www.harmonyvalleyfarm.com/> for the CSA we now
belong to.

The point that you missed is do you or the locals complain so of motor
traffic? Yaah, no one gores the ox they ride.

I wonder it they refused the 'outside' help after the recent weather
outbreak?

"Scott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| Ken wrote:
| > Scott <[email hidden]> wrote in news:40f3f65c$0$1456
| > [email hidden]:
| >
| >>Synopsis: Too Many bikers on local, winding, hilly roads. Locals are
| >>complaining.
| >
| >
| > There are too many cars on my local roads. Who do I complain to?
|
| I guess it would depend on whether the drivers are also
| living on those local roads.
|
| I think the locals have a valid point. They are being repeatedly
| invaded by swarms of bikers, some of whom seem to be acting like
| they're Boston drivers rather than visitors to a bucolic dale. We
| used to be members of a CSA* in the Vermont Valley -- the roads
| are your typical barely 2-car width wide, sharp, blind turns and
| I'm-a-teen-can-I-get-air-on-this-bump hills. It is not a place to
| demo your machismo over your fellow biker by covering a mile or
| 2 in 1/2 a second less than your companion.
|
| Who would want their rural mail delivery suspended or road closed so
| there can be a bike race? Once, I suppose, would be okay. But
| according to the article, it's happening repeatedly. That is
| not being a good neighbor.
|
| Scott
| *Community Supported Agriculture
| See <http://members.terracom.net/~erpperk/vvalley/> for the Vermont
| Valley farm, or <http://www.harmonyvalleyfarm.com/> for the CSA we now
| belong to.
|

Doug Huffman said:

The point that you missed is do you or the locals complain so of motor
traffic? Yaah, no one gores the ox they ride.

I rather doubt it. No one drives through the Vermont Valley,
with 2 exceptions: People who live there (and therefore are known
by their neighbors) and people who are lost, and therefore are
driving very slowly because they are unfamiliar with the serpentine
roads. 😉 The lack of traffic and steep hills are what attracts
bikers, I would say. It the roads weren't littered with gravel
from driveways, it would be almost ideal (too hilly for me, though).

Quoted message said:

I wonder it they refused the 'outside' help after the recent weather
outbreak?

Have I been sleeping? I don't recall a tornado in SW Dane County --
well, a serious one -- since Barneveld in the mid 80s. But recent
means different things to different people.

Scott

Scott <[email hidden]> wrote in news:40f40046$0$1456
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

I think the locals have a valid point. They are being repeatedly
invaded by swarms of bikers, some of whom seem to be acting like
they're Boston drivers rather than visitors to a bucolic dale.

If the cyclists are speeding, running stop signs, passing unsafely, etc., then
the cops should enforce local laws. If the cyclists are law abiding, then they
have every right to use roads built with public tax dollars. If the locals
think the roads are unsafe, they should press their elected officials for
saftey improvements.

Scott said:

Doug Huffman said:

The point that you missed is do you or the locals complain so of motor
traffic? Yaah, no one gores the ox they ride.

I rather doubt it. No one drives through the Vermont Valley,
with 2 exceptions: People who live there (and therefore are known
by their neighbors) and people who are lost, and therefore are
driving very slowly because they are unfamiliar with the serpentine
roads. 😉 The lack of traffic and steep hills are what attracts
bikers, I would say. It the roads weren't littered with gravel
from driveways, it would be almost ideal (too hilly for me, though).

Quoted message said:

I wonder it they refused the 'outside' help after the recent weather
outbreak?

Have I been sleeping? I don't recall a tornado in SW Dane County --
well, a serious one -- since Barneveld in the mid 80s. But recent
means different things to different people.

Scott

We had several come through just a few weeks ago. Tore out a whole lot
of trees and damaged some buildings. A week or two later we had a fun
little earthquake too, 4.something. It's been a fun summer.

Scott said:

<http://www.madison.com/wsj/home/local/index.php?ntid=6749&ntpid=2>

Synopsis: Too Many bikers on local, winding, hilly roads. Locals are
complaining.

Scott

For the most part cyclists and motorists are pretty good to each other
around here (Madison) but there are the occasional irritants on both
sides. I've been in group rides that have gotten pulled over (30+
riders being pulled over is an interesting experience) by the cops
because someone complained that they couldn't easily pass even though
the group was being as polite as it could. Usually the cops are pretty
good about it and are just obligated to respond to the call.

On the other hand there are a few riders who needlessly take up an
entire lane, blow through controlled intersections and generally [censored]
everyone off.

The roads to the south west that are getting the attention are popular
and are probably just seeing more total bike traffic and thus more of
the irritating minority on both sides of the fence.

Overall Dane county and specifically Madison is very very bike friendly.
I've never once been intentionally hassled by a car in the 4 years
I've been here. If you do feel shy about traffic there are enough
dedicated bike paths to easily get close to anywhere in town.

I was on a ride once which went down a fairly narrow country road to a rest
stop, and then returned on the same road, so there were bikes strung out on
both sides for a couple of miles. It was impossible for a car to go
through. In laying out a route, this should be avoided.

kantspel said:

Scott said:

Doug Huffman said:

The point that you missed is do you or the locals complain so of motor
traffic? Yaah, no one gores the ox they ride.

I rather doubt it. No one drives through the Vermont Valley,
with 2 exceptions: People who live there (and therefore are known
by their neighbors) and people who are lost, and therefore are
driving very slowly because they are unfamiliar with the serpentine
roads. 😉 The lack of traffic and steep hills are what attracts
bikers, I would say. It the roads weren't littered with gravel
from driveways, it would be almost ideal (too hilly for me, though).

Quoted message said:

I wonder it they refused the 'outside' help after the recent weather
outbreak?

Have I been sleeping? I don't recall a tornado in SW Dane County --
well, a serious one -- since Barneveld in the mid 80s. But recent
means different things to different people.

Scott

We had several come through just a few weeks ago. Tore out a whole lot
of trees and damaged some buildings. A week or two later we had a fun
little earthquake too, 4.something. It's been a fun summer.

Yeah, but that was in Madison, about a mile west of my house,
not south of Black Earth in the Vermont Valley. 🙂 I slept
through the temblor, though.

Scott

Heavens! Wouldn't want to discommode a motorist now, would we? Not even
for the minutes for the two streams of slow traffic - do the physics and see
how many minutes until at least one side of the road is clear.

Where does an 800 kilogram canary sleep? Where ever it wants to. Where do
a thousand cyclists ride...? Where does a motorist drive?

"Leo Lichtman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| I was on a ride once which went down a fairly narrow country road to a
rest
| stop, and then returned on the same road, so there were bikes strung out
on
| both sides for a couple of miles. It was impossible for a car to go
| through. In laying out a route, this should be avoided.
|
|

Doug Huffman said:

Heavens! Wouldn't want to discommode a motorist now, would we? Not even
for the minutes for the two streams of slow traffic - do the physics and see
how many minutes until at least one side of the road is clear.

On a large century, perhaps for hours. Case in point would be the
first rest stop at the Seagull Century. If that was a through street,
it would be a problem and there would be plenty of complaints. The
last checkpoint - traditionally the ice cream stop - has occasionally
had incidents in the past, although it is doubled up for a very short
distance.

Curtis L. Russell
Odenton, MD (USA)
Just someone on two wheels...

Thanks for the 'exceptional' anecdote but I think Madison, Wisconsin was the
venue in discussion.

I'll refer here to Chapter Eight of John Forester's Bicycle Transportation
as a guide to the engineering/physics.

"Curtis L. Russell" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
| On Wed, 14 Jul 2004 16:21:21 -0400, "Doug Huffman"
| <[email hidden]> wrote:
|
| >Heavens! Wouldn't want to discommode a motorist now, would we? Not even
| >for the minutes for the two streams of slow traffic - do the physics and
see
| >how many minutes until at least one side of the road is clear.
|
| On a large century, perhaps for hours. Case in point would be the
| first rest stop at the Seagull Century. If that was a through street,
| it would be a problem and there would be plenty of complaints. The
| last checkpoint - traditionally the ice cream stop - has occasionally
| had incidents in the past, although it is doubled up for a very short
| distance.
|
| Curtis L. Russell
| Odenton, MD (USA)
| Just someone on two wheels...

Quoted message said:

Subject: Re: From the Local Paper
From: Scott [email hidden]
Date: 7/13/2004 10:31 AM US Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <[email hidden]>

Ken said:

Scott <[email hidden]> wrote in news:40f3f65c$0$1456
[email hidden]:

Quoted message said:

Synopsis: Too Many bikers on local, winding, hilly roads. Locals are
complaining.

There are too many cars on my local roads. Who do I complain to?

I guess it would depend on whether the drivers are also
living on those local roads.

I think the locals have a valid point. They are being repeatedly
invaded by swarms of bikers, some of whom seem to be acting like
they're Boston drivers rather than visitors to a bucolic dale. We
used to be members of a CSA* in the Vermont Valley -- the roads
are your typical barely 2-car width wide, sharp, blind turns and
I'm-a-teen-can-I-get-air-on-this-bump hills. It is not a place to
demo your machismo over your fellow biker by covering a mile or
2 in 1/2 a second less than your companion.

Who would want their rural mail delivery suspended or road closed so
there can be a bike race? Once, I suppose, would be okay. But
according to the article, it's happening repeatedly. That is
not being a good neighbor.

Scott

Pave some bike lanes, everybody wins.

Doug Huffman said:

Thanks for the 'exceptional' anecdote but I think Madison, Wisconsin was the
venue in discussion.

I'll refer here to Chapter Eight of John Forester's Bicycle Transportation
as a guide to the engineering/physics.

I was talking to a fellow biker downstairs in my building
who rides regularly in western Dane County -- he's okay for
a Republican Recumbent Rider 😉 -- and he says the problem
is FIBs from Chicago who come up and train for the
Madison Ironman Competition.

That explained everything.

Scott