Australia and New Zealand · Public discussion

From Amsterdam with Lerv (long...)

Started by flyingdutch · · Last activity · 16 posts · 1,990 views

Thread navigation

Jump through the discussion

Go to the original post, the replies on this page, or the latest preserved contribution.

Thread details

What we know about this thread

Original section
Australia and New Zealand
Published
12 February 2006
Last activity
14 February 2006
Original author
flyingdutch
Posts
16
Discussion status
Public discussion
Total views
1,990
Views / 30 days
0

The navigation and discussion metadata provide context. Posts remain in their original chronological order.

Showing posts 1–16 of 16
Posts remain in their original chronological order.

Text size
  1. and apologies to Mr Fleming...

    Got back Sat arvo, but sitting here at 5am still unable to convince body it's sleep time...

    Observations/comments of cycling liff in Amsterdam in no particular order/preference

    99% of bikes are black
    0.5% are red
    90% are steel
    9.99% are Alu. Saw one CF and one Ti roady out in countryside

    80% are 700c
    other 15% made up (fietsbikes of these differing shapes and sizes so differing wheels sizes. I probably spotted a dozen mtb's in 2 weeks. no sh1t.
    5-10% were folding bikes. Lots. They have recently introduced rebates for commuters on both PT tickets and folders to encourage more use of both.
    They had a fleet of them modern rickshaw thingies that have recently been launched in Melb.
    Saw 4 fixies. 3 of em couriers (of course). They were the only ones riding tyres narrower than the standard 38mm tyres. Whilst 99% of surfaces are really good, the inner, inner areas are cobbled AND there are [censored] of tramtracks!
    Quite a few 'Swiss army bikes'. never black. red, orange, blue, yellow. noice.
    Only saw roadies out in country (more on that later)

    SS rules! probably 90% are SS.
    The fietsbikes and 'modern' or upmarket bikes may include Sachs 5or7 or Shimano NexusInter8 hubs.

    Bikes are cheap!
    200euro gets you a fully recoe'd 2ndhand
    300euro gets you a '[/URL] basic' bike
    300-500 gets you a retro 'grandma bike' with glossy black paint, gold and red pinstriping/decals, basket, rack, guards, lights and bonus style points
    500-1000 gets you 'modern' city bike complete with as above but also hub gears, hub dynamo, Alu framehere

    99% bikes have guards, lights, dynamo, enclosed chain/running mech
    springy seats, and laid back angles angles to make JKennedy swoon

    99% of bikes are VERY upright. Way comfy and you can really sightee on these things. slow speed stability is awesome. Everybody rides and uses phones, smokes or rides no handed to keep hands warm in pockets.
    Bike handling skills would put the best roady to shame. watching a 70+ yr-old woman do a trackstand at lights is common

    During the day (at a guess) 95 of bikes ar parked on the street. to anything. Poles, canal fences, trees, fences or the vast supply of bike racks. Dedicated bikeparking stations are common place. i saw only 4 underground/large car parking places, even out in the business district/s.
    7,500 bikes are parked every day in front of Grand Centraal Station on the 'bike island'. Possibly half of these arrive by train or Ferry. This facility is free.

    Next to this is a OV-fietsbike station, a secure valet service bike parking facility that can house approx 2000? This costs 2.75euro/day and includes security/creditcard, fulltime staff, repairs available and 3monthly bike-service. They also provide a bikehire service that is self serve and at over 100 railways stations (in only 3 years). SMS or creditcard access to bikes stored in lockers.
    see more

    Locking your bike is mandatory. 80,000 bikes are stolen annually.
    Many are sold at 'the bike bridge' for as little as 5euro by junkies. The rest get dumped in the canals. There is a special bike-barge with a huge mechanical arms to clear al lthe bikes. I watched as it lifted up approx 8 bikes with one lift and plonked em on the bank.
    The locks used in Oz would be (mainly) laughed at in Holland.
    99% of bikes have O-Locks
    90% also use a D-Lock or muvva-fecking huge chain lock (I'm talking links made of 10mm steel here folks! probably weighs more than the bike).
    Didnt see one Kryptonite.
    Saw quite a few of these. wicked. the handlebars can be removed to become one huge folding-D-lock.
    [URL=http://www.sharedutchdesign.nl/images/milan/2005/d14.jpg]GIANT 'lock-bike'.
    Most people seemed to keep bikes indoors after hours, or had lockers/sheds at apartments or used a low-quality bike and locked the bejeezus out of it! (see swiss bike locking up technique above).

    Riding Environment. Wow!
    Am awaiting figures ( i met Fietsersbond (Cyclists Union) whilst there)
    on what % and kms are 'Copenhagen' style paths or onroad.
    In Inner Amsterdam The impression was 50-50 split.
    The further out this figure actually went further toward more offroad paths!!! Further out the rural network is staggering. Something like 1500km (this is in a country approx 50% of Tassie) of dedicated bike 'roads', mainly along the top of the river/sea/polder(reclaimed lands)-hugging dykes. Their version of Beach Rd is 'The Waal trail'. Basically one continuous road/path along the dyke-top next to the Waal river which goes from Rotterdam on the coast to the German Border; 200km long and chokkers with roadies.
    I am a cautious conver to the 'CH' lanes. can they be 'retrofitted' to Melbourne tho? Well they were in far less space in Amsterdam...

    The network actually IS a network; not poor' patronising version aka Oz, but bits connect. They go thru intersections. In many cases they actually command intersections!
    Cars MUST giveway to bike on the obigatory red lanes/paths. AND THEY DO!!! Took me 3 days to get used to this. freaky.
    If on the main road of a Tintersection the CH lanes go 'over' the sidestreet, are clearly marked with their own white lines and i many cases are raised, like ped crossings.
    There are bikelights. Next to all/most car traffic lights and repeated on post at waist height. Many have buttons to push however these are largely irrelevant bcos all light phases are influenced by bikes.
    At crossings there are sensor wires in the surface to acivate lights. On outer are straight/faster flowing lane sthese sensors are 25-50m before the intersection so much of the time the lights are already green by the time you get there. It took me a week to figure out it wasnt my pychic powers but these triggers doing this! Absolutely amazing! Have i mentioned i love this place?
    Many of the larger intersections also have 'countdown' lights, with a visible descending number telling you how much longer till green (30 or 10sec). ONLY peds and bikes get these 😄

    Road rules, lights, peds etc are all treated with an 'organic' respect.
    People dont yell, i heard probably one horn in 2 weeks!, and ped's dont wander about on the bikelanes.
    Police presence is amazingly low. they are 90% 0n bikes when they are out but the camera system is monitored centrally and mounted cops are dispatched quickly.
    Confession time! Dutchy got fined. For riding a bike in Amsterdam!!
    Actually it was on one of the few ped-only (read commercial-[censored]-tourist-'ghettos'😉 streets about. 30euro. I managed to get it cancelled when i complained to their superior dude the next day, suggesting it wasnt a great bit of advertising to tourists.
    PS Fri-Sunday avoid. the place is flooded with brain-dead pommie bogans who come over on cheap travel and dont bother with accomodation but lurk in the same 8 block area in coffee shops and the redlight district. Usually best avoided anyhow due to too rubber necking going on 🙄

    PS their tax rate is lower than ours. Their NAtional health bill is approx 1/3rd of ours yet their pubic services and welfare system makes us look like barbarians. Petrol costs the equivalent of $2oz/litre. Small cars are de rigeur.

    I'm sure there's a zillion things i have forgotten, due to info-overload and jetlag. Lots of pix and video shot which hopefully you all may get an opp to see in nearish future (more on that later...) Did i mention i love this place?

    "Sick of flying"Dutch

  2. Is BV council getting an edited version of this?

  3. W0000!

    I'll think of a pertinent comment later on. See any Swiss Army Bread Bags? :p

  4. ghostgum said:

    Is BV council getting an edited version of this?


    why edit it?

    When i get a chance I'm gonna put together a DVD of all the video footage and pix and hand out copies to all other board members and as many staff as i can

  5. flyingdutch said:

    watching a 70+
    yr-old woman do a trackstand at lights is common

    that's it, i'm off to amsterdam asap

    --
    Peter McCallum
    Mackay Qld AUSTRALIA

  6. On 2006-02-12, flyingdutch (aka Bruce)
    was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:

    Quoted message said:

    PS their tax rate is lower than ours. Their NAtional health bill is
    approx 1/3rd of ours yet their pubic services and welfare system makes
    us look like barbarians.

    1/3rd per capita? Or, what is the population of the Netherlands?

    --
    TimC
    My cats are forbidden from walking on my computer keyboard on the desk
    when I'm asdfjjhhkl;ljfd.;oier' puyykmm4hbdm9lo9j USING IT. --unknown

  7. TimC said:

    1/3rd per capita? Or, what is the population of the Netherlands?

    13% of their tax bill is spent on health. ours is 37%

    population is 16.5million

  8. On 2006-02-13, flyingdutch (aka Bruce)
    was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:

    Quoted message said:


    TimC said:

    1/3rd per capita? Or, what is the population of the Netherlands?

    13% of their tax bill is spent on health. ours is 37%

    And I'll bet the bloody communists don't have an enormous expenditure
    on their army too 🙂

    Quoted message said:

    population is 16.5million

    Same as us, within astronomer's errors.

    OK, so now I have to choose between living in the Netherlands and New
    Zealand.

    --
    TimC
    "These people [spam fighters] will go to the lowest depths,"
    -- Tom Cowles, spammer and convicted thief.

  9. On 2006-02-13, Gemma_k (aka Bruce)
    was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
    ....

    Quoted message said:

    Cyclist hit side of bonnet, does a spectacular lar slide across it and lands
    pretty much on his feet.
    "You fscuker!" cyclist was yelling (in english) "You could have fscuking
    killed me"
    The car driver got out, and said "Sorry I didn't see you" "You should have
    lights on, how was I supposed to see you" (in english)
    "You fscker!"
    etc etc.

    Heh.

    Quoted message said:

    It was hilarious at the time, we had been marvelling at the cyclists
    everywhere and how different it was, till then - the sameness to home was
    remarkeable. SMIDSY because SIDSY....

    SIDSY?

    --
    TimC
    Look - a diversion! It's shiny! -- Daniel Stone

  10. Was this trip business or pleasure? Both by the looks it. Im trying to get back there to live. Miracles are needed

    flyingdutch said:


    Everybody rides and uses phones, smokes or rides no handed to keep hands warm in pockets.Bike handling skills would put the best roady to shame. watching a 70+ yr-old woman do a trackstand at lights is common


    Thats so true, my bike handling skills improved alot. Id have no excuse when after a night out id see these stilleto healed vixens, squeazing through McEwen sized gaps in a group of bikes.

    Quoted post said:


    Cars MUST giveway to bike on the obigatory red lanes/paths. AND THEY DO!!! Took me 3 days to get used to this. freaky.


    i lived there for a year and a half and in most of that time i would hardly believe the car would actually give way.

    Quoted post said:


    It took me a week to figure out it wasnt my pychic powers but these triggers doing this! Absolutely amazing! Have i mentioned i love this place?


    I do too, but there are other sides to living there, that would make you laugh and cry. I wont get into those now, theres too much lurv in this thread.

    Quoted post said:


    Road rules, lights, peds etc are all treated with an 'organic' respect.
    People dont yell, i heard probably one horn in 2 weeks!, and ped's dont wander about on the bikelanes.
    Police presence is amazingly low. they are 90% 0n bikes when they are out but the camera system is monitored centrally and mounted cops are dispatched quickly.
    Confession time! Dutchy got fined. For riding a bike in Amsterdam!!
    Actually it was on one of the few ped-only (read commercial-[censored]-tourist-'ghettos'😉 streets about. 30euro. I managed to get it cancelled when i complained to their superior dude the next day, suggesting it wasnt a great bit of advertising to tourists.


    Was it the Calverstraat where you were fined? a big shopping street?

    I guess Police presence is quite low but my experiences with them there were never good. I dont think i look like a shady character but i was bothered by them alot. With useless questioning and the one time i was hit off my bike was a police van on a bike path being too impatient and just bullied past, knocking me and a lady in front of me on our arses. They just kept on driving too. I remember they had a major crackdown on riding without lights this time last year, i knew a few people that were fined 100 euros for it!

    Quoted post said:


    PS Fri-Sunday avoid. the place is flooded with brain-dead pommie bogans who come over on cheap travel and dont bother with accomodation but lurk in the same 8 block area in coffee shops and the redlight district. Usually best avoided anyhow due to too rubber necking going on 🙄


    Thats so true. Its mostly off their head tourists that are doing the whole public drunkedness etc... I dunno how more of them dont drown in a canal. Maybe thats a solution, natural culling of bothersome tourists. They were also generally the peds that would be all over the bike paths. It actually fun rather than frustrating, scaring the pants of this English front row forward with a simple ring of a girly bell.

  11. "TimC" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On 2006-02-13, Gemma_k (aka Bruce)
    was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
    ...

    Quoted message said:

    Cyclist hit side of bonnet, does a spectacular lar slide across it and


    lands

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    pretty much on his feet.
    "You fscuker!" cyclist was yelling (in english) "You could have fscuking
    killed me"
    The car driver got out, and said "Sorry I didn't see you" "You should


    have

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    lights on, how was I supposed to see you" (in english)
    "You fscker!"
    etc etc.

    Heh.

    Quoted message said:

    It was hilarious at the time, we had been marvelling at the cyclists
    everywhere and how different it was, till then - the sameness to home


    was

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    remarkeable. SMIDSY because SIDSY....

    SIDSY?


    Sorry I didn't See You vs
    Sorry Mate I Didn't See You

  12. Gemma_k said:

    Sorry I didn't See You vs
    Sorry Mate I Didn't See You

    whatever. not relevant in Nederlands. Driver has automatic liability if striking a cyclist or ped, especially if a child or elderly. Even if cyclsit's fault partial fault is laid at motorists' feet. hence the giving way is far more prevalent

    AND there is no space for them to have backyards 😄

  13. flyingdutch said:

    not relevant in Nederlands. Driver has automatic liability if
    striking a cyclist or ped, especially if a child or elderly. Even if
    cyclsit's fault partial fault is laid at motorists' feet. hence the
    giving way is far more prevalent

    Is it not a case of "unless the driver (or whoever) can prove it was the
    cyclist's fault"? They were talking about making this law in the UK (for
    insurance purposes only I think) a few years back. You should have heard
    the moaning from drivers! It never came to happen unfortunately.

    Graeme

  14. "Graeme Dods" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    flyingdutch said:

    not relevant in Nederlands. Driver has automatic liability if
    striking a cyclist or ped, especially if a child or elderly. Even if
    cyclsit's fault partial fault is laid at motorists' feet. hence the
    giving way is far more prevalent

    Is it not a case of "unless the driver (or whoever) can prove it was the
    cyclist's fault"? They were talking about making this law in the UK (for
    insurance purposes only I think) a few years back. You should have heard
    the moaning from drivers! It never came to happen unfortunately.


    That is my understanding too - the 'onus of proof' rests with the driver as
    far as insurance goes. They have to prove they're innocent. (guilty until
    proven innocent). The other difference to here is that the motorvehicle's
    3rd party personal insureance (govt provided) extends to a vulnerable user -
    cyclist.

  15. Gemma_k said:

    That is my understanding too - the 'onus of proof' rests with the driver as
    far as insurance goes. They have to prove they're innocent. (guilty until
    proven innocent). The other difference to here is that the motorvehicle's
    3rd party personal insurance (govt provided) extends to a vulnerable user -
    cyclist.

    I'll get this confirmed but was told that unless on a major motorway, even if cyclist at fault, the onus is still on driver to allow for errant movement of kids/elderly/cyclists (i think/guess this may be due to lower speed limits in built up areas also?)

  16. flyingdutch said:


    SS rules! probably 90% are SS.
    The fietsbikes and 'modern' or upmarket bikes may include Sachs 5or7 or
    Shimano NexusInter8 hubs.

    Of course, you only need a single speed when you ride along a single
    gradient...

    --
    BrettS

Active in the last 60 minutes

Active in this thread

0 users · 0 guests ·0 bots ·0 total

No signed-in users are active right now.

No known search crawlers active right now.