Friction shifting Vs Index

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Fx199) said:

I have bikes that have both.
Often an index shifter will be vauge or ratchet, whereas with
my friction shifter I can always get it just right.
Might sound crazy but does anyone PREFER friction??

I like shifters that just plain work well.

That said, one of my old bikes has a nice set of
friction stem shifters that I'm quite taken with.

cheers,
Tom

--
-- Nothing is safe from me.
Above address is just a spam midden.
I'm really at: tkeats [curlicue] vcn [point] bc [point] ca

Tom Keats said:

In article <[email hidden]>,

(Fx199) said:

I have bikes that have both.
Often an index shifter will be vauge or ratchet, whereas with
my friction shifter I can always get it just right.
Might sound crazy but does anyone PREFER friction??

I like shifters that just plain work well.

I agree. My friction shifters worked perfectly and shifted well all of
the time. I should have moved them to the bar ends for better access.
However, my index shifters kick ass when they're properly tensioned and
the cables are clean.

Quoted message said:

That said, one of my old bikes has a nice set of
friction stem shifters that I'm quite taken with.

cheers,
Tom

Have also used both...

When properly adjusted "click" shifters are accurate, fast, and require no
"back shifting"

However,

I have broken three sets of index shifters of various makes and models...and
I have never broken a plain 'ol friction setup...

28 Sep 2004 01:16:27 GMT,
<[email hidden]>,

(Fx199) said:

Might sound crazy but does anyone PREFER friction??

My Shimanot thumb shifters can go either way. But, after trying
indexed shifting for a few months, I left them in friction mode.
And I don't much like my SRAM twist grips either.
OTOH, I love my Campagnolo bar cons.
--
zk

brian said:

When properly adjusted "click" shifters are accurate, fast, and require no
"back shifting"

i agree, if they are properly adjusted index shifters work great. if,
however, they are not, it is my experience that they do not. i've never had
a particularly long bicycle commute (30 minutes or so) and the most of the
rest of my riding tends to be (or rather tended to be until recently when i
moved out of seattle) in-city riding with not a whole lot of shifting
anyways.
i feel that, with a bit of practice most people are capable of shifting more
quickly and effeciently than an index shifter can shift for them. i will
say, however, that reaching between your legs to shift at 20mph in traffic
is pretty scary.

"Fx199" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have bikes that have both.
Often an index shifter will be vauge or ratchet, whereas with
my friction shifter I can always get it just right.
Might sound crazy but does anyone PREFER friction??

I've recently purchased 2, virtually unused, old bikes, both with friction
shifters. I rode both for a while, as they were, just to reacquaint myself
with 25 year old technology. It was OK, but not really fun. I think a bike
should "disappear beneath you", and these drivetrains didn't do that at
all. Some index shifting gets a bit balky and vague, but I've found bar-end
shifters to be always crisp and precise. After converting these old bikes
they were a joy to ride, before that, they were a bit of a chore.

I prefer friction for the front and index for the rear.

Fx199 said:

I have bikes that have both.
Often an index shifter will be vauge or ratchet, whereas with
my friction shifter I can always get it just right.
Might sound crazy but does anyone PREFER friction??

It's ok when you're sitting down and have plenty of time to
fiddle around, but try it when you're standing or sprinting.
Indexing makes it possible to shift whenever you like.

--
bpo gallery at http://www4.tpgi.com.au/users/mvw1/bpo

Fx199 said:

I have bikes that have both.
Often an index shifter will be vauge or ratchet, whereas with my friction
shifter I can always get it just right. Might sound crazy but does anyone
PREFER friction??

Index is great, I'm especially taken with bikes that have internal hub
gearing and indexing--totally lets you focus on the road.

My road bike is friction because I like the simplicity of it and the
virtually silent shifting. The reliability is a huge plus. I do use a
modern cassette and chain, which helps shifting enormously. Being able to
get replacement parts for a couple bucks is nice. I ride alone and do ride
fast, but if I miss one out of a hundred shifts, it's not going to kill me
to adjust the lever--I'm not in that much of a hurry. I've ridden friction
so long that it pretty much feels "indexed" anyway. I just know exactly
how far to move the lever--it's no different than playing an instrument.

Perhaps my next bike will have indexing, I've always disabled it in the
past because I hate the the sound of it. LOL Maybe somebody can come up
with clack-free indexing for me?

Both types of gearing can be enjoyable for different reasons, just keep
them adjusted and lubricated.

😄

ad6mj said:

I prefer friction for the front and index for the rear.

Must...resist. Must...resist.

Bill "restraint" S.

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Fx199 said:

I have bikes that have both.
Often an index shifter will be vauge or ratchet, whereas with my

friction

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

shifter I can always get it just right. Might sound crazy but does

anyone

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

PREFER friction??

Index is great, I'm especially taken with bikes that have internal hub
gearing and indexing--totally lets you focus on the road.

My road bike is friction because I like the simplicity of it and the
virtually silent shifting. The reliability is a huge plus. I do use a
modern cassette and chain, which helps shifting enormously.

Yes, but modern cassettes are designed to shift easily, making them more
prone to unintended shifts if not perfectly centered.

Quoted message said:

Being able to
get replacement parts for a couple bucks is nice.

Other than "brifters", index shifting parts are pretty cheap these days.
The difference between a friction-only DT shifter and an indexed/friction
selectable one is trivial.

Quoted message said:

I ride alone and do ride
fast, but if I miss one out of a hundred shifts, it's not going to kill

me

Quoted message said:

to adjust the lever--I'm not in that much of a hurry.

It may bite you if you're standing and your chain skips.

maxo said:

Fx199 said:

I have bikes that have both.
Often an index shifter will be vauge or ratchet, whereas with my
friction shifter I can always get it just right. Might sound crazy but
does anyone PREFER friction??

I used to think that, before I got indexed shifters. Of course, some of
it depends on the kind of indexed shifter you get; downtube indexed
shifters would be less of an improvement than "brifters".

But since I got Ergo shifters, I would never consider going back.

Quoted message said:

My road bike is friction because I like the simplicity of it and the
virtually silent shifting.

Who? Silent? I used to ride in groups back when we all had friction.
Rattle-rattle, scrape, ping. Missed shifts were common, as were the
poorly adjusted derailleur that just made weird noises.

Quoted message said:

The reliability is a huge plus.

Something else contrary to my experience. My old Campy Record shifters
were constantly in need of adjustment. The resistance would never stay
where it should be, and usually would work loose, causing autoshifts.
I haven't even thought about adjusting my road bike shifters since I
serviced the bike last Winter.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | Arguing with an engineer is like mud wrestling with a pig... You
_`\(,_ | soon find out the pig likes it!
(_)/ (_) |

Peter Cole said:

Quoted message said:

fast, but if I miss one out of a hundred shifts, it's not going to kill

me

Quoted message said:

to adjust the lever--I'm not in that much of a hurry.

It may bite you if you're standing and your chain skips.

Fortunately, though, you can't shift friction shifters while standing.
Bad idea, anyway, but your hands are pulling on the bars, not giving you a
chance to reach down to the levers. Shifting while standing is something
no one considered until we got brifters. Most modern systems
tolerate such abuse fairly well, but it is abuse. Choose your gear before
you get out of the saddle.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | Enron's slogan: Respect, Communication, Integrity, and
_`\(,_ | Excellence.
(_)/ (_) |

David L. Johnson said:

Quoted message said:

My road bike is friction because I like the simplicity of it and the
virtually silent shifting.

Who? Silent? I used to ride in groups back when we all had friction.
Rattle-rattle, scrape, ping. Missed shifts were common, as were the
poorly adjusted derailleur that just made weird noises.

Yes, absolutely silent. Silent running, almost imperceptable shifts. I'm
using a Shimano Titlist derailleur from 1979 with new Sram cogs & chain,
and a pretty Suntour crankset. Derailleurs haven't got that much
better, but chains and rings have, the reason for poor shifting back in
the day can be blamed on this. 😉

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The reliability is a huge plus.

Quoted message said:

Something else contrary to my experience. My old Campy Record shifters
were constantly in need of adjustment. The resistance would never stay
where it should be, and usually would work loose, causing autoshifts. I
haven't even thought about adjusting my road bike shifters since I
serviced the bike last Winter.

I took up some stretched new cable slack in June, which would happen with
any drivetrain, but the shifting system has been adjustment free for about
5000 miles. ;P

Yes you do have to tighten the thumbscrews every now and then to avoid
autoshifting when applying torque, but you can avoid this buy getting a
nice set of ratcheting shifters from ebay, such as the Simplex/Modolo
"retrofriction" levers. The look super sexy to boot. :P

Doesn't anyone here ride off road? I can't imagine what it would be like to
try downshifting on a steep hill with technical terrain without indexing.
If you ride off road, and your indexing is not spot on, you work on the bike
before the next ride!

"David L. Johnson" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Peter Cole said:

Quoted message said:

fast, but if I miss one out of a hundred shifts, it's not going to

kill

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

me

Quoted message said:

to adjust the lever--I'm not in that much of a hurry.

It may bite you if you're standing and your chain skips.

Fortunately, though, you can't shift friction shifters while standing.
Bad idea, anyway, but your hands are pulling on the bars, not giving you

a

Quoted message said:

chance to reach down to the levers. Shifting while standing is something
no one considered until we got brifters. Most modern systems
tolerate such abuse fairly well, but it is abuse. Choose your gear

before

Quoted message said:

you get out of the saddle.

Sure, but was I was thinking of was the case where you shift (badly) then
stand & have the chain skip. This sort of thing always seemed to happen in
rolling hill climbs where you downshift seated, then soon after stand to
muscle over the top. In those cases autoshifts always seemed to happen at
the worst time -- when you were putting out maximum force on the pedals.

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

David L. Johnson said:

Quoted message said:

My road bike is friction because I like the simplicity of it and the
virtually silent shifting.

Who? Silent? I used to ride in groups back when we all had friction.
Rattle-rattle, scrape, ping. Missed shifts were common, as were the
poorly adjusted derailleur that just made weird noises.

Yes, absolutely silent. Silent running, almost imperceptable shifts.

The only way I could tell my friction shift was good was by ear -- trim it
until it quiets down. Index shifting just goes "click".

Peter Cole said:

"maxo" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

David L. Johnson said:

> My road bike is friction because I like the simplicity of it and the
> virtually silent shifting.

Who? Silent? I used to ride in groups back when we all had friction.
Rattle-rattle, scrape, ping. Missed shifts were common, as were the
poorly adjusted derailleur that just made weird noises.

Yes, absolutely silent. Silent running, almost imperceptable shifts.

The only way I could tell my friction shift was good was by ear -- trim
it
until it quiets down. Index shifting just goes "click".

Having had both, I'd never to back to friction shifting.

--
Bob in CT
Remove ".x" to reply

I have indexed shifting with (gasp) downtube shifters.
The best of both worlds.
The cable routing is the same as with friction shifters.
There are not a bunch of moving parts and monkey-motion as with the
'integrated' shifters.
As a result: it's precise, quick, and not prone to failure.
Also cheaper.
And for whatever it's worth (approximately nothing), it's lighter.

"Fx199" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

I have bikes that have both.
Often an index shifter will be vauge or ratchet, whereas with
my friction shifter I can always get it just right.
Might sound crazy but does anyone PREFER friction??