For The Love Of Bryan Ball and Larry Varney



Larry Varney wrote:

> I will admit to some ignorance about Monkey Island. It's
> a group of Chicago-area recumbent riders who are racers
> of a sort, right? Or is it a "movement in the Midwest",
> that Bryan can't stop - but if he ignores it, it will go
> away?...

Monkey Island has gone away "due to gross abuse by a vocal
minority."
[1] It was intended to be a "no holds barred" HPV racing
discussion forum, but apparently webmaster Warren
Beauchamp decided things were getting out of hand so the
forum was shut down.

I believe that the theoretically ideal discussion venue
would be one that is unmoderated so everyone can have their
say, but that required everyone to reveal their true
identity. Hiding behind a pseudonym removes the poster from
the consequences of his/her statements, which can lead to
discussion deteriorating into nothing more than insults.

[2] <http://www.wisil.recumbents.com/monkeyisland/>,
<http://www.wisil.recumbents.com/wisil/>.

--
Tom Sherman - Quad Cities (Illinois Side)
 
Tom Sherman wrote:
> Larry Varney wrote:
>
>> I will admit to some ignorance about Monkey Island.
>> It's a group of Chicago-area recumbent riders who are
>> racers of a sort, right? Or is it a "movement in the
>> Midwest", that Bryan can't stop - but if he ignores it,
>> it will go away?...
>
>
> Monkey Island has gone away "due to gross abuse by a vocal
> minority."
> [1] It was intended to be a "no holds barred" HPV racing
> discussion forum, but apparently webmaster Warren
> Beauchamp decided things were getting out of hand so
> the forum was shut down.
>
> I believe that the theoretically ideal discussion venue
> would be one that is unmoderated so everyone can have
> their say, but that required everyone to reveal their true
> identity. Hiding behind a pseudonym removes the poster
> from the consequences of his/her statements, which can
> lead to discussion deteriorating into nothing more than
> insults.
>
> [1] <http://www.wisil.recumbents.com/monkeyisland/>,
> <http://www.wisil.recumbents.com/wisil/>.
>

Actually, Monkey Island has not "gone away" (of course,
I haven't checked lately - maybe Bryan does have the
power, simply by ignoring it, as nogoslow says - but it
has moved to a different provider/server/whatever you
want to call it.

--
Larry Varney Cold Spring, KY
http://home.fuse.net/larryvarney
 
Kevin,

I applaud what Ed and his club have done. Looks like they
get some pretty regular turn-outs for their rides. I
consider the Monkey Island rides and the message board as
two completely different things. It's always been the
board I had issues with not the riders or the group as a
whole. I know Ed Gin and Alan and Warren and Sean pretty
well and have always had the utmost respect for them.
Right now I'm an ocean away so it's just not possible for
me to stop in and check out the scene anyway. Maybe I will
when I get back.

"nogoslow" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> [email protected] ('BentRider) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > I'm actually glad that this got posted here. Now you all
> > can see what I've been dealing with every day for the
> > last year and a few months. Aren't these lovely people?
> > This actually pretty tame compared to some of the things
> > they've called me.
> >
> > Bryan J. Ball www.bentrideronline.com
>
> Hi Brian,
>
> I am going to give you a little advice about Monkey
> Island. Just ignor it and it will go away! There is more
> going on here that you just don't understand and you can
> either go along with it or get run over by it. It is a
> freight train coming your way. This is a movement in the
> Midwest and you can't stop it. Just today there was a huge
> turn out to see team Bacchetta up close and personal. If
> it is so bad why would John Schlitter and Rich Pinto be
> associated with it who are the founders of Bacchetta? They
> were accepted here and fit in just fine. If you want to
> take your war over this issue to newsnet so be it Bryan
> but you will lose in the end IMHO. As a journalist at BROL
> you should lay aside your personal feelings and
> investigate this growing story. You will or someone else
> will. Your choice I guess! And you are welcome as my
> personal guest on the Island. I am one of the biggest
> gorilias on the Isile and will offer you protection but,
> you won't need it since you will be welcomed by the
> Monkey's. So, when you get back to the states you must
> make a point of coming to Chicago for a ride.
>
> Kevin Team Bacchetta

---
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> > Team Bacchetta
>
> I will admit to some ignorance about Monkey Island.
> It's a group of Chicago-area recumbent riders who are
> racers of a sort, right? Or is it a "movement in the
> Midwest", that Bryan can't stop - but if he ignores it,
> it will go away? And as for Schlitter and Pinto being
> "associated with it" - by that I'm assuming you mean
> they paid the Chicago-based group a visit - or is it
> more than that? I'm all for investigating almost any
> "growing story", so if I'm wrong about this - if Monkey
> Island is not a Chicago-area group of recumbent riders,
> if it won't disappear if Bryan ignores it, if perhaps
> Schlitter and Pinto's association with the group was
> something more than a visit, please let me know. I'd
> love to write a column about this freight train in the
> Midwest. Oh, and does the fact that I still have a
> coroplast fairing from one of Ed's seminars grant me
> safe passage when I ride GITAP in early June?

Larry,

It is just a club but it is getting a lot of people involved
in riding and racing recumbents. And yes that post about you
and Bryan was way way over the top and a lot of the stuff
posted lately was way over the line and hopefully this stuff
will come to an end by itself so I think ignoring a few
trolls is the best policy. But moderation still is not the
answer since people need a place to post things that are
under there skin. Your site is different and you have to do
what you have to do. But you have to admit some of the
satire is really funny at times? But, as the club grows I am
sure some of this juvinile stuff will fall by the way side?
It will be interesting to see what happens with MI as the
Chicago area rides get bigger as more people in the area
find out about the rides. Will it become an embarrasment for
the club at some point? Well, tune in and wait and see? It
will be interesting. Bacchetta was just visiting and don't
approve or dissaprove they came because it is where a lot of
riders gather in the Chicago area. I think there position is
to ignor most of it.

Kevin
 
Earlier Kevin wrote about Monkey Island:

“If it is so bad why would John Schlitter and Rich Pinto be
associated with it who are the founders of Bacchetta?”

But then he admitted that:

“Bacchetta was just visiting and don't approve or
dissaprove they came because it is where a lot of riders
gather in the Chicago area. I think there position is to
ignor most of it.”

Boy Kevin, that flip-flop is worthy of a politician. For
Bacchetta to be “associated with” Monkey Island would mean
(at least in English) that there was a relationship between
the two. And you tried to defend the honor of Monkey Island
by suggesting that Bacchetta would not be “associated” with
it if you monkeys were so bad. But then it turns out that
Bacchetta was just visiting, and didn’t approve or
disapprove of your antics, and tried to ignore most of it.
Were you stretching the truth about anything else?

Kevin also wrote:

“But moderation still is not the answer since people need a
place to post things that are under there skin.”

Since when do decent people really “need” a place to
anonymously post lies and insults?

Most of the Monkey Island gang are probably – in person at
least – great guys, who would be fun to ride with. I
certainly envy your $4000 titanium bikes, appreciate what
you are doing for recumbent visibility in the Chicago area,
and wish I were strong enough to keep up with your “28 mph”
rides. But please, quit trying to defend the childish,
boorish, insulting, and juvenile Internet behavior of some
of your members.

Steve Christensen
 
Steve Christensen wrote:

> ... Most of the Monkey Island gang are probably ?in person
> at least ?great guys, who would be fun to ride with....

This is generally correct in my opinion.

I believe a lot of the bad feelings come from people who do
not know (since they do not know the individuals involved)
what to take seriously and what is intended in jest.

--
Tom Sherman - Quad Cities (Illinois Side)
 
Tom Sherman <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

[...]

> I believe that the theoretically ideal discussion venue
> would be one that is unmoderated so everyone can have
> their say, but that required everyone to reveal their true
> identity. Hiding behind a pseudonym removes the poster
> from the consequences of his/her statements, which can
> lead to discussion deteriorating into nothing more than
> insults.

I agree with the above statement, but identifying ourselves
won't necessarily prevent the insults from flying fast and
furious. Sherman and I are a case in point. Of course, he
has his understated way of calling me names and I have my
more above board way of doing it. But I will admit, if you
are totally anonymous you will tend to be a pig about it.

That is also the reason why small towns are better places
for people to be living than large metros where no one knows
anyone else. In a small town, if you screw up too badly, you
will have to leave like an outcast because everyone knows
exactly who you are and what you did. And they may forgive,
but they will never forget.

--
Ed Dolan - Minnesota