I recently got a set of custom wheels built up with the new American Classic hubs. The rear hub is "high flange" which, I gather, is a bit of a throw-back to an older way of doing things. Seemed to make sense to me in that you shorten the spokes and maybe you can increase the tension or something.
So last night I was looking at an ad for the new Bontrager Race Lite wheels and they're promoting their new "flangeless" hubs. So what would be the benefit of that? IIRC, they just say something fluffy like "sleeker and more aerodynamic." OK, they look nice, but so what?
So can anyone give me a Readers Digest on the pros and cons of high flange vs. flangeless?
I recently got a set of custom wheels built up with the new American Classic hubs. The rear hub is "high flange" which, I gather, is a bit of a throw-back to an older way of doing things. Seemed to make sense to me in that you shorten the spokes and maybe you can increase the tension or something. So last night I was looking at an ad for the new Bontrager Race Lite wheels and they're promoting their new "flangeless" hubs. So what would be the benefit of that? IIRC, they just say something fluffy like "sleeker and more aerodynamic." OK, they look nice, but so what? So can anyone give me a Readers Digest on the pros and cons of high flange vs. flangeless? Bob C.
The larger the flange the more distance between spoke holes, if you keep the number of spoke holes constant. You need space between the holes to support the load. If you use aluminum alloy hubs the space between the spoke hoes should be at least half again as wide as the spoke hole diameter. The aluminum alloy is usually 1/4 the strength of quality stainless spokes. The thickness of the flange at the spoke holes is about twice the thickness of the spoke material. This covers the minimum safety margins of material strength. The larger the hub flange the more torsional stifness and lateral stiffness in the wheel (all other things held constant). The result of a larger hub flange diameter is less spoke stretch due to torsional loads. Most single riders don't need that additional features of torsional and lateral stiffness, but it can help in tandems and could extend fatigue life. The quality of the build makes a difference because there will be differences in spoke support angles and the spoke alignment at the nipple/rim interface is different from small to large hub flange configurations. I will let other posters handle the stories of flangeless hubs.
"psycholist" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>... <cut>
Quoted message said:
So can anyone give me a Readers Digest on the pros and cons of high flange vs. flangeless?
Bob C.
To summarise Jobst Brandt's section on High vs Low in the bicycle wheel, high flanges give additional stiffness, but low flange hubs give more than enough stiffness anyway.
High flange wheels are (a little bit) easier to lace (than low flange), as the spokes are further apart at the flange, this is particularly true for high spoke counts where the requisite number of holes would be difficult to fit round a low flange - looking at my 48 spoke wheels high flange wheels I don't think this would be possible with a low flange design.
Flangeless designs simply make it easier to replace spokes (particularly drive side spokes, without removing sprockets) as they can be fitted into place in the hub along their final alignment without bending.
I recently got a set of custom wheels built up with the new American Classic hubs. The rear hub is "high flange" which, I gather, is a bit of a throw-back to an older way of doing things. Seemed to make sense to me in that you shorten the spokes and maybe you can increase the tension or something.
Quoted message said:
held constant). The result of a larger hub flange diameter is less spoke stretch due to torsional loads. Most single riders don't need that additional features of torsional and lateral stiffness, but it can help in tandems and could extend fatigue life.
That's why you also still see them on track bikes, justifiably or not.
On Mon, 5 Apr 2004 08:56:50 -0400, "psycholist" <[email hidden]>
Quoted message said:
I recently got a set of custom wheels built up with the new American Classic hubs. The rear hub is "high flange" which, I gather, is a bit of a throw-back to an older way of doing things. Seemed to make sense to me in that you shorten the spokes and maybe you can increase the tension or something.
So last night I was looking at an ad for the new Bontrager Race Lite wheels and they're promoting their new "flangeless" hubs. So what would be the benefit of that? IIRC, they just say something fluffy like "sleeker and more aerodynamic." OK, they look nice, but so what?
So can anyone give me a Readers Digest on the pros and cons of high flange vs. flangeless?
Not necessarily. Indeed Shimano Deore flangeless (Shimano FH-M555-S/L) weighs in at 485g compared with the Deore flanged version (Shimano FH-M525-S/L) at 449g. Weights taken from www.shimano-europe.com.
(the really weight conscious must also allow for the longer spokes required to reach the spoke sockets of the flangeless hub).
I can't really see any compelling reason for going for a flangeless design - perhaps others could suggest one? The only advantage seems to be ease of spoke replacment.
I can't really see any compelling reason for going for a flangeless design - perhaps others could suggest one? The only advantage seems to be ease of spoke replacment.
You don't have to bend the spoke, and a bent section would be weaker than a straight section of the same size. I don't know how frequently spokes break at the bend, so this may or may not be an issue of consern.
You don't have to bend the spoke, and a bent section would be weaker than a straight section of the same size. I don't know how frequently spokes break at the bend, so this may or may not be an issue of consern.
I was offered a job to remove the spokes that were broken off inside of a flangless hub and decided I could only do it by destroying the threads inside the hub. I understand that I was the 4th person who turned down the project before the owner tossed the flangless hub in the recyling bin and went back to a standard small flanged hub. There are usually at least 2 sides to the story in a different approach. Unique approaches usually have their good ideas, but you should examine failure modes and how you would deal with them. Availability and prices of quality spokes of the desired length in the standard elbowed design can be an advantage. Flangless designs are set for one spoke pattern while flanged hubs can utilize more than one spoke crossing pattern.
