First bike for 20 years

On Thu, 08 Sep 2005 02:22:34 +0100 someone who may be Stuart
Millington <[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

I've just got my first bike, well for the last 20ish years, i.e. I've
not ridden since I was I kid, how easily do (other) people pick this
up again?

It depends on the person. It also depends on what one means by
picking it up again, riding well or not thinking one will fall off
any second. I suggest finding somewhere quiet to re-learn the
basics.

I also recommend getting hold of a copy of "Cyclecraft" and reading
it. It has chapters on bike handling as well as the more advanced
things.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E
I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government
prevents me by using the RIP Act 2000.

Stuart Millington said:

I'm would "like" to ride to work from Wordsley to Wolverhampton (in time -
probably along the cut from the Navigation pub to the back

Aha. You will do well on this group.

Quoted message said:

pedal-back brake) with 1 gear - now I've got 21 of the things to figure
out. Plus, all of the talk about broken chains here - which I never got on
that thing - is getting me a little worried about getting there and back!

Forget about it. Broken chains are not common.
You have a new bike, and it is unlikely to break a link on the chain.

And if it does happen, the scenario could be one of:

a) passing cyclist offers to help, and fixes it for you
b) you get a lift home from a friend/relative
c) you phone a taxi, and request an estate car
d) you lower the seat a little and scoot the thing home like a
hobby horse
e) you push/scoot the bike to the nearest bike shop, where chain is
replaced

If you are worried about mechanical problems, carry the following:
A decent pump
A spare inner tube to fit your wheels

That;s it - everythin else may be cadged from said passing cyclist.
You could add what is called a 'multitool' - just ask in your local bike
shop. Expect to pay 10-20 pounds.

Stuart Millington said:

I've just got my first bike, well for the last 20ish years, i.e. I've
not ridden since I was I kid, how easily do (other) people pick this
up again?

I'm would "like" to ride to work from Wordsley to Wolverhampton (in
time - probably along the cut from the Navigation pub to the back
(North, Pendeford) of Wolvo'😉, but I'm now at the point where I'm
convinced I'm going to fall off as soon as I get on the thing.

Is that through tentative attempts to ride again or the horror stories
that are sometimes recounted here? If the latter then take them with as
much or more salt than the Friend of a Friend stories down the pub.
If the former, then there is a bit of relearning to do. I presume
balance is fine, it is sorting out all the gears that is the problem?

With 21 gears you will have two gear controllers. One, for the left
hand has three settings. Think of these as gear ranges, high, medium,
and low. For starters, set it to medium. These are the three gears at
the front by the pedals.

The right hand has seven gears that are closer together than the other
set. These are the ones you will normally change (like in a car) when
riding to suit the conditions. Set these to about the middle. Gear 3, 4
or 5. These gears are the set of cogs at the back, by the wheel.

Part 1.
Find somewhere flat and traffic free to try this out. Get on the bike
and ride in these settings. If it feels that the pedals are to stiff,
use an easier (smaller number, larger cog) gear (ie if in 4, try 3). If
it feels like your feet are spinning too fast, just like a car, change
down to a harder gear.

Find what is comfortable for you at that speed. If you are pedalling
comfortably then the balance is much easier. You will need to select
gear, as in a car, depending on your speed, uphill/downhill, and the
wind etc. Pick the one that is most comfortable for you at that time.

It is a good idea to try to avoid big front to big rear and small
front to small rear cogs (ie low range to hard gear and hi range to
easy gear) as this puts more strain on the chain and wears it quicker,
as well as taking a bit more effort.

That brings on part 2.

Now you have mastered the gears and can set them appropriate to whether
you are going uphill, downhill, and so on, you will want to work on
position. Many people have their saddles set too low. This can be bad
for the knees and is less efficient than setting it correctly.

Step 1 is being able to start and stop off the saddle. Straddle the
bike (OK, there are other ways of doing this) and set the pedal to
about 2 o'clock. Press on the pedal, stand up and get onto the saddle,
finding the other pedal with your foot as you do so. Sounds complicated
but is actually quite easy after a couple of attempts.
Likewise stopping, as you come to a halt, put one pedal down at 6
O'clock and stand up on it, off the saddle. , step down with the other
foot as you brake the bike gently to a halt. When you are happy with
that, gradually move the saddle up till it feels most comfortable. (as
a rule of thumb, when it is at the right height, you should be able to
put your heel on the pedal at 6 o'clock and have your leg just about
straight. You will notice an increase in power, control, and ride
better for it.

The next step is practice as much as possible. As has been suggested,
get a copy of Cyclecraft. SOme of the advice may seem counter-intuitive
(ie wrong) but it does work and will keep you safer on the road. When
you are ready to head out on the road, it may well be worthwhile
investigating any local cycle training schemes where a qualified
instructor can get you on the right lines very quickly. It makes a huge
difference to pleasure and safety when you use correct roadcraft.

I hope this little bit of advice helps. Do feel free to let us know how
you get on.

...d

Quoted message said:

Aside from "fear", "cowardice", "old timer" and "what are gears" [1]
;-)

How long do people find it takes to get back into riding after 20
years? Or may be "old timer" is appropriate ;-)

[1] My last bike was one of the "old" BMX's (plastic'ish wheels with a
pedal-back brake) with 1 gear - now I've got 21 of the things to
figure out. Plus, all of the talk about broken chains here - which I
never got on that thing - is getting me a little worried about getting
there and back!
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Stuart Millington said:

[1] My last bike was one of the "old" BMX's (plastic'ish wheels with a
pedal-back brake) with 1 gear - now I've got 21 of the things to
figure out.

21 sounds like a lot, but in reality you'll have about half that in
effective ratios.

big ring at front, use with smallest 3 cogs at the back
wee ring at front, use with smallest 3 cogs at the back
middle ring at front, use with middle 3 cogs at the back.

So after a couple of changes at the back, change the front to keep in
sequence.

The idea is to keep a reasonable rev rate for the pedals (cadence) no
matter what the gradient/headwind, so lower gears for harder work, just
like a car. Try and keep your cadence high (80+ revs a minute is a good
target to aim for, but unlikely you'll be near that to start with, but
do remember that's your target), changing gears to keep it roughly the
same all the time.

So "am I in the right gear?" is simply a matter of are your legs turning
at about the rate you usually expect them to on a bit of flat road. If
they're going slower, you want a lower gear and if they're windmilling
then change up. Think of it like a car where you try and keep the rev
counter in the engine's happiest range, changing gear to optimise.

Quoted message said:

Plus, all of the talk about broken chains here

I've never broken one. Keep your chain well cleaned and oiled and don't
clunk over-high gears and it's likely to keep going for years.

I'll second the suggestion of Cyclecraft, and suggest you get a fair bit
of practice in on increasingly trafficsome roads before you try the
commute. And yes, it does get easier! :-)

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Stuart Millington said:

I've just got my first bike, well for the last 20ish years, i.e. I've
not ridden since I was I kid, how easily do (other) people pick this
up again?

I got my first bike in 15-ish years a couple of years back, tis easy
peasy lemon squeezy to get back into it.

Quoted message said:

[1] My last bike was one of the "old" BMX's (plastic'ish wheels with a
pedal-back brake) with 1 gear - now I've got 21 of the things to
figure out.

Remember you have to pedal while you're changing gear, and you may
find you have to slightly 'over shift' (ie turn the shifter a little
past the mark) to select the right gear. It soon becomes 2nd nature.

Quoted message said:

Plus, all of the talk about broken chains here - which I
never got on that thing - is getting me a little worried about getting
there and back!

Like others have said, that kind of thing is v. rare. If you're
worried or would just like to know how to fix stuff, look out for bike
maintenance classes locally. I did one last year and I'm really glad
I did.

Happy riding!

Peter Clinch said:

Quoted message said:

Plus, all of the talk about broken chains here

I've never broken one. Keep your chain well cleaned and oiled and don't
clunk over-high gears and it's likely to keep going for years.

It is very rare. In over 30,000 miles I have broken one, maybe 2 and
both would be down to my fault for not putting them back together
properly. I have seen one other break as well. That is very few. You
are most unlikely to have a chain break, about as likely as being
attacked by a buzzard, and only marginally more likely than being
struck by lightning.

Quoted message said:

I'll second the suggestion of Cyclecraft, and suggest you get a fair bit
of practice in on increasingly trafficsome roads before you try the
commute. And yes, it does get easier! :-)

...d

David Martin said:

It is very rare. In over 30,000 miles I have broken one, maybe 2 and
both would be down to my fault for not putting them back together
properly. I have seen one other break as well. That is very few. You
are most unlikely to have a chain break, about as likely as being
attacked by a buzzard, and only marginally more likely than being
struck by lightning.

On my recent cycle leader course the lead trainers said they actually
found it quite common on kids' bikes. But of course on many of these
bikes we have the caveat of zero maintenance and no qualms about riding
them through streams, and some seriously horrible mashing stood up on
the pedals in stupidly high gears.

It's certainly /very/ rare for a chain in a good state of repair to
break. Rarer than a flat in a car, for example, and most people don't
panic about that.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

in message <[email hidden]>, Peter Clinch

(') said:

Stuart Millington said:

[1] My last bike was one of the "old" BMX's (plastic'ish wheels with a
pedal-back brake) with 1 gear - now I've got 21 of the things to
figure out.

21 sounds like a lot, but in reality you'll have about half that in
effective ratios.

big ring at front, use with smallest 3 cogs at the back
wee ring at front, use with smallest 3 cogs at the back

s/smallest/largest/

Quoted message said:

middle ring at front, use with middle 3 cogs at the back.

So after a couple of changes at the back, change the front to keep in
sequence.

This is good advice, but isn't required. In practice you can use all the
sprockets at the back with the middle at the front, all but the smallest
at the back with the smallest at the front and all but the largest at
the back with the largest at the front without any problems at all;
running smallest to smallest or largest to largest will cause
accelerated chain wear. Also, if you are using a Shimano setup where you
can't trim the front derailleur, you'll get a lot of noise from the
chain rubbing against the sides of the front deraileur when using small
with small or big with big, and if you're getting that noise it's a way
of the system telling you you'd really be better on a different sprocket
at the front.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Plus, all of the talk about broken chains here

I've never broken one. Keep your chain well cleaned and oiled and
don't clunk over-high gears and it's likely to keep going for years.

I've never broken one either in several tens of thousands of miles of
cycling.

--
[email hidden] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

...but have you *seen* the size of the world wide spider?

Stuart Millington said:

I've just got my first bike, well for the last 20ish years, i.e. I've
not ridden since I was I kid, how easily do (other) people pick this
up again?
Aside from "fear", "cowardice", "old timer" and "what are gears" [1]
;-)

How long do people find it takes to get back into riding after 20
years? Or may be "old timer" is appropriate ;-)

Actually propeling and balancing on a bike is almost instantaneous
whilst riding efficiently/in traffic can take quite a while to master
Cyclecraft seems to be the preffered reading for this
Went from a 5 mile run was a complete day out to 20 miles in a couple
of hours (this on a "Y" frame full suss competition win, sure it would
be quicker on a "proper" bike) in six~seven months, remember of your 21
gears some will mean the chain is crosed so remove six for that
(assuming three front rings: smallest front ring and two smallest cogs,
middle ring smallest and largest cogs, largest ring and the two largest
cogs) and then some ratios will duplicate so a bike with what seems 21
gears may actually have 10. With a gap of twenty years only advice I
could give is not to run before you can walk push yourself but be
realistic in what you can achieve.
Have had a couple of p*ct*r*s but have never (/me touches wood) had
a chain break. You can't allow for every evenetuallity sometimes a taxi
home/long walk is the only option (if you haven't got a freind/partner
who can come get you in a car, always have a means of letting people
know you are ok/need help). All IMHO off course
--
This post contains no hidden meanings, no implications and certainly no
hidden agendas so it should be taken at face value. The wrong words
may be used this is due to my limitations with the English language .

yours S
Nihil curo de ista tua stulta superstitione

Thanks to all for all the replies, far more detailed than I
expected. Now all the bits are on the bike, I'll have a go at the
weekend and try not to give the neighbour's kids too much to laugh at
;-)
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soup said:

Stuart Millington wrote:

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I've just got my first bike, well for the last 20ish years, i.e. I've
not ridden since I was I kid, how easily do (other) people pick this
up again?
Aside from "fear", "cowardice", "old timer" and "what are gears" [1]
;-)

How long do people find it takes to get back into riding after 20
years? Or may be "old timer" is appropriate ;-)

Actually propeling and balancing on a bike is almost instantaneous

It took me about a week and a half to get the nerve up to do it (yes,
I'm a coward and I know it ;-), but after being unable to balance on a
stationary bike (which I could do a couple of decades ago) I went out
tonight... local roads - with ZERO traffic and the only pedestrians
were the locals from the pub...

Note: the zero traffic - I would not have done this in any area where
there was any traffic - whether pedestrian or vehicular.

Down the hill to the pub (got up to 15MPH with brakes on) and a
couple/few nice pints in the pub, talking to an ex-copper who still
rides. Back up the hill was a bit wobbly, but that was more that my
legs had given up after less than half a mile of uphill riding,
probably in the wrong gear :-(

Quoted message said:

whilst riding efficiently/in traffic can take quite a while to master
Cyclecraft seems to be the preffered reading for this

It'll be a while before I go back into traffic at this rate.

Quoted message said:

Went from a 5 mile run was a complete day out to 20 miles in a couple
of hours (this on a "Y" frame full suss competition win, sure it would
be quicker on a "proper" bike) in six~seven months, remember of your 21
gears some will mean the chain is crosed so remove six for that

The gear changes were "weird", to say the least! I tried to keep to
"1-1/2/3" / "2-3/4/5" / "3-5/6/7" and they are "indexed", but I seemed
to have gotten them "in between" gears at times, if that is possible?

Quoted message said:

Have had a couple of p*ct*r*s but have never (/me touches wood) had

I've got the "gel filled" tubes. Which, I'm told reduce "incidents" at
the expense of weight. Given my weight, I doubt a bit of gel in a
couple of tubes will make any difference ;-)
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On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 01:24:26 +0100 someone who may be Stuart
Millington <[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Note: the zero traffic - I would not have done this in any area where
there was any traffic - whether pedestrian or vehicular.

Zero traffic, other then yourself. It is worth remembering that you
are part of the traffic, with the rights and responsibilities this
involves.

--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E
I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government
prevents me by using the RIP Act 2000.

Stuart Millington said:

It took me about a week and a half to get the nerve up to do it (yes,
I'm a coward and I know it ;-), but after being unable to balance on a
stationary bike (which I could do a couple of decades ago) I went out
tonight... local roads - with ZERO traffic and the only pedestrians
were the locals from the pub...

Note: the zero traffic - I would not have done this in any area where
there was any traffic - whether pedestrian or vehicular.

Down the hill to the pub (got up to 15MPH with brakes on) and a
couple/few nice pints in the pub, talking to an ex-copper who still
rides. Back up the hill was a bit wobbly, but that was more that my
legs had given up after less than half a mile of uphill riding,
probably in the wrong gear :-(

You will find that the ability to ride back up the hill comes very
quickly as you ride more. And teh balance etc.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

whilst riding efficiently/in traffic can take quite a while to master
Cyclecraft seems to be the preffered reading for this

It'll be a while before I go back into traffic at this rate.

Probably not as long as you think. Improvement is generally very quick.
Next time you ride it will be a bit better, then a bit better still.
After a few weeks of regular riding you will be much better.

Great to hear you have got out on the bike. Keep it up and keep us
posted.

...d

Stuart Millington said:

Note: the zero traffic - I would not have done this in any area where
there was any traffic - whether pedestrian or vehicular.

Having just become a cycle trainer I had my first job on Wednesday
evening, which was some "cycle buddying" for a lady who's not really
used a bike for 20 years. She wants to get distance in to get back into
the hang of it, and is doing very well there, but even sticking to the
local off-road tracks there's some road sections to link up. She was
quite nervous at one point through Broughty Ferry, but she did just the
right thing in sticking to her line a bit out from the kerb and keeping
going in a predictable line with a few reassuring words from behind from
me. As long as you know the rules and are skilled enough to go in
straight lines, and are happy to stop by the side of the road if it gets
a bit hairy, it's not actually anything special sharing the road with
motor vehicles. The drivers don't want to hit you and they're operating
according to rules that you and they both know.

Quoted message said:

Down the hill to the pub (got up to 15MPH with brakes on) and a
couple/few nice pints in the pub, talking to an ex-copper who still
rides. Back up the hill was a bit wobbly, but that was more that my
legs had given up after less than half a mile of uphill riding,
probably in the wrong gear :-(

Wrong gear? I'm sure you looked very dashing in whatever you were
wearing... <b-booom-tssss!>

Your legs should be going around at about the same speed on any gradient
where you're trying to optimise progress. If things are getting too
slow for your pedal turning, change down.

Quoted message said:

The gear changes were "weird", to say the least! I tried to keep to
"1-1/2/3" / "2-3/4/5" / "3-5/6/7" and they are "indexed", but I seemed
to have gotten them "in between" gears at times, if that is possible?

Yes, they may need a little adjustment. It's quite common on a new bike
for the cable to stretch in a little as it starts to be used, and that
puts the indexing slightly off. The manual should have a note on how to
fix it, or have the place you bought it do it for you, but the nub of
the matter is down at the derailleur arm where the cable goes in there's
a wee screw adjuster to lengthen the cable, and you screw that out to
tighten and check by changing through and making sure the gears are
sitting right, not falling between and not rattling.

If the whole 2 different derailleurs thing is a bit of a faff for now,
pop it in the middle ring at the front and use 2-6 at the back, only
using the front changer for the hills (big ring for down, wee ring for up).

HTH, and keep at it!

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Peter Clinch said:

Having just become a cycle trainer I had my first job on Wednesday
evening, which was some "cycle buddying" for a lady who's not really
used a bike for 20 years.

Great. Its real fun and I hope you enjoyed it.
I'm taking a chap of 50 out this afternoon who also wants some
confidence training
(booked for him by his wife).

Quoted message said:

As long as you know the rules and are skilled enough to go in
straight lines, and are happy to stop by the side of the road if it gets
a bit hairy, it's not actually anything special sharing the road with
motor vehicles. The drivers don't want to hit you and they're operating
according to rules that you and they both know.

That is the most important thing to stress.
No other road user is out to cause harm [1] and it is important to
emphasise that a cyclist is just as much 'traffic' as everyone else.

[1} Cl*rks*n excepted

John B

Quoted message said:

nub of the matter is down at the derailleur arm where the cable goes
in there's a wee screw adjuster to lengthen the cable, and you screw
that out to tighten

Do a quarter turn each time then check.

This site <URL:http://www.parktool.com/repair/> will walk you through it.

David Hansen said:

On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 01:24:26 +0100 someone who may be Stuart
Millington <[email hidden]> wrote this:-

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Note: the zero traffic - I would not have done this in any area where
there was any traffic - whether pedestrian or vehicular.

Zero traffic, other then yourself. It is worth remembering that you
are part of the traffic, with the rights and responsibilities this
involves.

I know that. That's why, for first time out, I went out when there
would be no _other_ traffic and I had plenty of room to "wobble"
without hitting anything that was stationary ;-)
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Peter Clinch said:

Yes, they may need a little adjustment. It's quite common on a new bike
for the cable to stretch in a little as it starts to be used, and that
puts the indexing slightly off. The manual should have a note on how to
fix it, or have the place you bought it do it for you, but the nub of

A manual, from Dec***lon? ;-)

Quoted message said:

HTH, and keep at it!

Thanks.

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Stuart Millington said:

A manual, from Dec***lon? ;-)

Not familiar with the emporium in question, but I'm quite surprised that
any mass market bike comes without a basic user manual. If this seems
unlikely from Decathlon then probably best not ask them to adjust it for
you either... ;-/

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net [email hidden] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/