Fatso ain't looking that bad....

Tuschinski said:

The Tour de Suise isn't the TdF. But I think the people writing of JU should eat crow. Or should that be a laxative as they were full of it? 🙂

Looks like there was a massive split and the sprinters, McEwen notably,
were way behind. Jan effectively outsprinted the other sprint
non-specialists. At least he's showing good tactics by not starting the
race 18 minutes down.

Richard Adams said:

Jan effectively outsprinted the other sprint non-specialists.

Still, Camenzind is no sukkelaar.

Richard Adams said:

Tuschinski said:

The Tour de Suise isn't the TdF. But I think the people writing of JU should eat crow. Or should that be a laxative as they were full of it? 🙂

Looks like there was a massive split and the sprinters, McEwen notably,
were way behind. Jan effectively outsprinted the other sprint
non-specialists. At least he's showing good tactics by not starting the
race 18 minutes down.

There was a break of two riders with 35K to go. Ullrich
bridged up (with Camenzind on his wheel) at 25K and then did
a lot of work to keep the break away. Jeker made it up with
10K to go.

This was not a "sprint" win for Ullrich, but an impressive
win in a small break with some very good riders. Maybe he
has learned something from Zurich finally, where he often is
the main factor in the break but always looses the few-up
sprint.

I wonder what will be going on now in T-Mobile's camp
though, as they must have been supporting Vinokourov for the
TdS. Ullrich cannot afford to alienate Vino right now,
unless he feels like superman. I expect to see some serious
domestique action from Ulle until the final time trial.

steve

Richard Adams said:

Tuschinski said:

The Tour de Suise isn't the TdF. But I think the people writing of
JU should eat crow. Or should that be a laxative as they were full
of it? 🙂

Looks like there was a massive split and the sprinters, McEwen
notably, were way behind. Jan effectively outsprinted the other
sprint non-specialists. At least he's showing good tactics by not
starting the race 18 minutes down.

Jan was doing some big turns early on today too, while Vino enjoyed a bit
more protection. "Suffer you sow/pig/swine/farm animal".

Jeff

Jeff Jones said:

"Suffer you sow/pig/swine/farm animal".

I don't think Ullrich will be doing a CN interview real soon.

steve robertson said:

[...] Maybe he
has learned something from Zurich finally, where he often is
the main factor in the break but always looses the few-up
sprint.

Indeed, that happened few times in Zürich. Last year, it was a bit
different, and Nardello won in a solo break. Wasn't it similar 2 years ago?
Jan must hate Zürich, but for some reason, he still likes it. Perhaps
similar to TdF (he never won Zürich, but got almost the same number of
second places).

BTW. Zürich is a phantastic race to watch at the street. With a bike, you
can see the racers twice each round. Then you can watch the finish at some
TV close to the road.

Quoted message said:

I wonder what will be going on now in T-Mobile's camp
though, as they must have been supporting Vinokourov for the
TdS. Ullrich cannot afford to alienate Vino right now,
unless he feels like superman. I expect to see some serious
domestique action from Ulle until the final time trial.

I guess, we will exactly see this.

Regards,
Dieter

Dieter Buerssner schreibt:
[snip]

Quoted message said:

BTW. Zürich is a phantastic race to watch at the street.

[snup]

I think you mean pfannentastic.

"Tuschinski" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

The Tour de Suise isn't the TdF. But I think the people writing of JU

should eat crow. Or should that be a laxative as they were full of it? 🙂

Quoted message said:

Do some searches from years past and you will see that picking on Jan is a
well established part of the traditional rivalry between Jan and any other
Tour contender. The worst years for actual weight gain are long past, but
tradition must be upheld (I guess). Some people just can't manage to come up
with new material and Jan being "fat" is too tempting for envious wannabes
to pass up.

Chris said:

Do some searches from years past and you will see that picking on Jan is
a well established part of the traditional rivalry between Jan and any
other Tour contender. The worst years for actual weight gain are long
past, but tradition must be upheld (I guess). Some people just can't
manage to come up with new material and Jan being "fat" is too tempting
for envious wannabes to pass up.

I know... But as I actually have met JU a few years ago I am very
annoyed about the nonsense sprouted about him. Anyone calling a pro
cyclist "fat" (Dario Pieri is supposed to be the exception, LOL) needs
to get a grip on reality. When I met him (it was an April in wich he was
once again called "fat"😉 I was a little bit shocked. I am called thin by
most people. But I look like a body builder compared to JU.

Sure LA looked like a stickfigure (And Dekker is just plain scary!), but
somehow I can't shake the feeling 1-2 kilos more wouldn't hurt a TdF
racer. I saw quite a few tests wich pointed out bike weigth isn't an
important factor at all... so how come two extra kilos would make
winning the TdF improbable?

--

Tuschinski said:

I saw quite a few tests wich pointed out bike weigth isn't an
important factor at all...

What tests and where?

JT

Tuschinski said:

I saw quite a few tests wich pointed out bike weigth isn't an
important factor at all...

What tests and where?

JT

John Forrest To said:

Tuschinski usenet- said:

I saw quite a few tests wich pointed out bike weigth isn't an
important factor at all...

What tests and where?
JT

The Dutch magazine Fiets had quite a few articles a few years ago on
bike weigth. Adrie van Diemen did something similar on rider weigth (if
you wonder, he had among other Danny Nelissen under his wing when he
became Worldchampion).

I could try to reason to it (but I'm no expert in this area): if you
take of one Kilo of the bike of a 75 kg pro you would get *approx*

Bike+ gear(shoes, helmet, socks etc)= 8.5kgs->7.5 kgs Rider =75kgs

Percentage weigth lost- 1.2%

Now how much would this effectively count towards friction? Friction is
minor compared to air resistance (more when climbing for sure, but
would it be over 0.1%?). And would you ascend somewhat faster
(conservation of energy)?

I agree that every little thing counts, but we are entering the realm of
myth here.

To complicate it:*extra kg bodyweigth=could mean Extra KG fuel/muscle?*

--

Tuschinski <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

John Forrest To said:

Tuschinski usenet- said:

I saw quite a few tests wich pointed out bike weigth isn't an
important factor at all...

What tests and where?
JT

The Dutch magazine Fiets had quite a few articles a few years ago on
bike weigth. Adrie van Diemen did something similar on rider weigth (if
you wonder, he had among other Danny Nelissen under his wing when he
became Worldchampion).

I could try to reason to it (but I'm no expert in this area): if you
take of one Kilo of the bike of a 75 kg pro you would get *approx*

Bike+ gear(shoes, helmet, socks etc)= 8.5kgs->7.5 kgs Rider =75kgs

Percentage weigth lost- 1.2%

Now how much would this effectively count towards friction? Friction is
minor compared to air resistance (more when climbing for sure, but
would it be over 0.1%?). And would you ascend somewhat faster
(conservation of energy)?

I agree that every little thing counts, but we are entering the realm of
myth here.

To complicate it:*extra kg bodyweigth=could mean Extra KG fuel/muscle?*

--

Acording to www.analyticcyling.com the difference at 400 watts on a 6%
slope is 7 cm/sec a fairly substanial amount. I.E for a one hour
uphill TT, the difference is 252 meters; roughly 35 seconds.

The website also explains the calculations.