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FAQ on choosing a "clipless" pedal system

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Road Cycling
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17 May 2004
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Steve Freides
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  1. A friend is taking her bike in for an overhaul and, after
    seeing how much my wife and I like our Speedplay Frogs, is
    also interested in getting a "clipless" pedal system, which
    will be the first time for her.

    Is there an comparison of the various types of pedal systems
    out there suitable for the casual cyclotourist? My wife
    found SPD's hard to get in and out of but loves Frogs. The
    type of riding is nothing more than casual day trips, so
    being able to walk around is important. Money isn't
    particularly an issue except that she doesn't ride a lot
    and, while she owns a reasonably good enthusiast bike, it
    would be silly to spend several hundred dollars on shoes and
    pedals for her.

    Thanks in advance.

    -S- kbnj.comkbnj.com

  2. I'm a member of a touring group here in Cork, Ireland, for
    about 15 years. At that time when we started touring people
    used cleats or Look. Now all of us use SPDs. I've used them
    since the came in. The VP ones are fine, and cheaper.

  3. "Gearóid Ó Laoi/Garry Lee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    I'm a member of a touring group here in Cork, Ireland, for
    about 15


    years.

    Quoted message said:

    At that time when we started touring people used cleats or
    Look. Now


    all of

    Quoted message said:

    us use SPDs. I've used them since the came in. The VP ones
    are fine,


    and

    Quoted message said:

    cheaper.

    Thank you. Perhaps I need to clarify - my friend is going to
    get either SPD's, Frogs, or similar - I'm looking for
    something in writing that will explain the differences to
    her. She has definitely decided to go with a modern clipless
    pedal system, one that supports a recessed cleat. The
    question is only which one.

    -S- kbnj.comkbnj.com

  4. Steve Freides said:

    Thank you. Perhaps I need to clarify - my friend is going
    to get either SPD's, Frogs, or similar - I'm looking for
    something in writing that will explain the differences to
    her. She has definitely decided to go with a modern
    clipless pedal system, one that supports a recessed cleat.
    The question is only which one.

    For a casual cyclist: SPDs are the cheapest option, they
    work quite well, and you can get them with a variety of
    cycling shoes which _you can walk in_. The "I can walk in my
    shoes!" argument can trump everything else if you are just
    using the bike to get around...

    Chris
    --
    Chris Colohan Email: [email hidden] PGP: finger
    [email hidden] Web: www.colohan.com Phone: (412)268-4751

  5. I have Crank Brothers Eggbeaters and am happy with them. I
    don't see them on many bikes. Not sure why.

    Curt

    "Steve Freides" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    A friend is taking her bike in for an overhaul and, after
    seeing how much my wife and I like our Speedplay Frogs, is
    also interested in getting a "clipless" pedal system,
    which will be the first time for her.

    Is there an comparison of the various types of pedal
    systems out there suitable for the casual cyclotourist? My
    wife found SPD's hard to get in and out of but loves
    Frogs. The type of riding is nothing more than casual day
    trips, so being able to walk around is important. Money
    isn't particularly an issue except that she doesn't ride a
    lot and, while she owns a reasonably good enthusiast bike,
    it would be silly to spend several hundred dollars on
    shoes and pedals for her.

    Thanks in advance.

    -S- kbnj.comkbnj.com

  6. "Steve Freides" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    A friend is taking her bike in for an overhaul and, after
    seeing how much my wife and I like our Speedplay Frogs, is
    also interested in getting a "clipless" pedal system,
    which will be the first time for her.

    Is there an comparison of the various types of pedal
    systems out there suitable for the casual cyclotourist? My
    wife found SPD's hard to get in and out of but loves
    Frogs. The type of riding is nothing more than casual day
    trips, so being able to walk around is important. Money
    isn't particularly an issue except that she doesn't ride a
    lot and, while she owns a reasonably good enthusiast bike,
    it would be silly to spend several hundred dollars on
    shoes and pedals for her.

    If she likes Frogs, get Frogs. If the thing she likes about
    Frogs is that they are double-sided, she might try this
    Nashbar ATB pedal:

    tinyurl.com3dn7f

    It is SPD but I find them extremely easy to get in and out
    of because they are double sided. Then get some cheap ATB
    shoes and she's set for walking and riding for well under
    $100 total.

    There is an even cheaper Nashbar pedal. Don't get it, it's
    not SPD compatible.

    JP

  7. Christopher Brian Colohan <[email hidden]> wrote in
    :"]news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    For a casual cyclist: SPDs are the cheapest option, they
    work quite well, and you can get them with a variety of
    cycling shoes which _you can walk in_. The "I can walk in
    my shoes!" argument can trump everything else if you are
    just using the bike to get around...

    Any mountain bike clipless pedal system can be easily walked
    in. The biggest advantage of Shimano SPD is that you get
    pretty good quality for a low price. Some other systems
    offer better performance (especially in muddy conditions) or
    lower weight, but always at a higher price.

  8. "Steve Freides" <> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    My wife found SPD's hard to get
    in and out of but loves Frogs.

    You may want to look at the'multi-release' cleats that are
    available for SPD pedals: they're extremely easy to clip out
    of. Only thing to watch out for is wear - they get harder to
    clip out of when they're worn. OTOH, I just replced my
    cleats after 4 years and about 10,000 miles, so they don't
    wear fast.

    They don't come standard with SPD pedals, but have to be
    purchased separately, so your wife probably had standard
    SPD cleats.

    With these cleats, a feirly inexpensive set of pedals and
    shoes, and you're in business.

    --
    Richard Utt

  9. Steve Freides said:

    Is there an comparison of the various types of pedal
    systems out there suitable for the casual cyclotourist?

    I'm no expert, but a friend of mine asked me about clipless
    pedals about a year ago and I wrote him an email with my own
    personal analysis.

    It's probably neither complete nor fully accurate, but it's
    a comparison and it's for a casual rider.

    I'm sure folks all over are going to jump on me for things I
    wrote, but I'll post it anyway, just for fun.

    [By the way, I personally just switched from a pair of
    cheap SPD pedals (PD-M515) to a wonderful, amazing,
    beautiful, fantastic pair of pedals (PD-M959). The
    difference is night and day. I found my pair brand new at a
    local co-op for $100. If you are willing to spend the money
    (they retail for a fair bit more than that, but see what
    you can find), they are worth every penny. Not only do they
    clip in and out as smoothly as you could ever want, they
    turn like butter and are just a goddamn JOY to ride. I put
    them on my fixie and I swear it felt like I dropped my gear
    ratio. I'm just in love with them and won't hesitate to
    spend the bucks on great pedals.]

    Here goes (I'll attempt to read it and edit it right now,
    but remember I wrote it a year ago for somebody else whom I
    know well):

    Clipless systems consist of pedals and cleats that interlock
    and give you the ability to apply force to the cranks at
    every point in the stroke (even the back stroke at the
    bottom, which a clip will never give you). They're a little
    bit daunting because you actually have to consciously unclip
    your foot before taking it off the pedal and the truth is
    that you WILL fall down within the first few times you try
    to ride with these things. The cleats require special shoes,
    but mostly these days they've standardized enough that most
    cleats fit most shoes.

    There are many types of clipless pedal systems and they're
    all proprietary to some extent (though there is some
    licensing). They break down into walkable and unwalkable
    categories and have relative strengths.

    I just went online looking for a good comparison, but there
    wasn't anything apparent to me. Mostly, folks like what they
    have or what they used first and can only compare in one
    direction.

    Really, there are only four practical walkable types:
    Eggbeaters, Frogs, ATACs, and SPDs.

    Eggbeaters (from Crank Bros.) have a pedal that looks like
    an eggbeater with four blades. The cool thing about them is
    that they are mechanically super simple and essentially have
    four "sides" for connecting to the cleat, whereas most have
    two. The drawback is that they're a bit less common and
    expensive and I don't know anybody that actually uses them
    to attest to their walkability, though they have "road" and
    "MTB" (mountain bike) cleats which might say something about
    walkability. They do now have a platform petal which makes
    NOT clipping in sometimes workable. (Mike has these, but
    he's not really happy with them.) <URL:
    crankbros.comcrankbros.com >

    Frogs by Speedplay are an attempt to adapt a popular fancy
    road pedal to more practical wet/dry, walkable pedals.
    There's only two models from one manufacturer. The cleats
    are more expensive if you have more than one pair of shoes,
    but only one set of pedals. Some people really like them
    because they're light and they look cool. The other
    Speedplay pedals look better, to my eyes, but they're not
    really walkable. There's a new cleat for the Frog line
    that's supposedly totally compatible with standard (we'll
    see in a moment what that means) shoes. <URL:
    speedplay.comspeedplay.com >

    ATACs from Time are considered the sort of "high
    performance" multi-purpose system. They're a bit more
    expensive, but they're lighter and they don't come in a non-
    durable low-end. As with all the others, the cleats fit just
    fine in standard shoes. They're not as adjustable as some
    others, but they claim they don't have to be. My friend
    Michael Wolfe (who rode his recumbent from Portland to
    Boston, as I've said a billion times) swore by them, but now
    he rides eggbeaters. <URL: timesportusa.comtimesportusa.com >

    SPDs from Shimano are the most common type of pedal. Shimano
    is the leading maker of bicycle components and equipment, so
    this shouldn't be a surprise. As with everything is the
    industry, "standard" means the way Shimano does it (except
    in cases where Shimano stupidly patented something that
    could easily be done another way). So you'll find that shoes
    made for ANY walkable cleat will be called "SPD shoes",
    regardless of which system you use. There are two SPD
    systems. There's the regular SPD that's general use (like I
    use -- sometimes called MTB) and there's SPD-R for road
    racing and track and stuff. The second isn't really walkable
    and you'll see the difference immediately. Nothing confusing
    about it, really, except the name. SPDs are recessed enough
    in the shoe that you can actually make a shoe where the
    cleat never touches the ground... granted, such a shoe might
    not be compatible with some of the more hybrid-type pedals
    without a little cutting away of sole. There's a kind of
    staggering variety of pedals available for SPDs. I've heard
    bad things about the knock-offs and have always had good
    luck with the Shimano brand (three pair, so far... all
    different). Cleats are essentially the same way: stick with
    the brand name. They license somewhat promiscuously. Anyway,
    that's what most folks use and it's good enough... but it's
    a bit like buying into the monopoly... then again, it's also
    can be done cheap and works Just Fine. <URL:
    shimano.comshimano.com

  10. In rec.bicycles.misc Steve Freides said:

    Is there an comparison of the various types of pedal
    systems out there suitable for the casual cyclotourist? My
    wife found SPD's hard to get in and out of but loves
    Frogs. The type of riding is nothing more than casual day
    trips, so being able to walk around is important. Money
    isn't particularly an issue except that she doesn't ride a
    lot and, while she owns a reasonably good enthusiast bike,
    it would be silly to spend several hundred dollars on
    shoes and pedals for her.

    If she likes the frogs keep this in mind. Speedplay in the
    last year and a half changed the cleat design for the frogs
    in order for them to fit more shoes. Many people have found
    the new "Frog II" cleat to be much more difficult to clip
    into. I don't know if this is going to be an issue for you,
    but her old frog cleats will still work with the new frog
    pedals. Compared to the frogs not many other pedals on the
    market have nearly as much float. SPDs have just a few
    degrees of float and the spring tension tends to not allow
    the foot to rotate much.

    Any pedal system that requires a road shoe will not be
    suitable as non recessed cleats and hard plastic soles are
    horrible to walk on for all but the shortest distances. That
    includes speedplay X2's, Look, and Shimano SPD-R/SPD-SL.

    Budgetwise SPD and it's many clones are the cheapest, as are
    mountain bike shoes.

    --
    ---
    Eric Yagerlener remove "usenet" from email address to reply

  11. Why not just get Frogs? If the friend doesn't like them, you
    can buy them from him/her.

  12. Why not just get Frogs? If the friend doesn't like them, you
    can buy them from him/her.

  13. "Steve Freides" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    A friend is taking her bike in for an overhaul and, after
    seeing how much my wife and I like our Speedplay Frogs, is
    also interested in getting a "clipless" pedal system,
    which will be the first time for her.

    Is there an comparison of the various types of pedal
    systems out there suitable for the casual cyclotourist? My
    wife found SPD's hard to get in and out of but loves
    Frogs. The type of riding is nothing more than casual day
    trips, so being able to walk around is important. Money
    isn't particularly an issue except that she doesn't ride a
    lot and, while she owns a reasonably good enthusiast bike,
    it would be silly to spend several hundred dollars on
    shoes and pedals for her.

    Steve,

    My take is as follows:

    SPD is cheapest and ubiquitous. The competing systems
    have their virtues, but there's no point paying for what
    you don't need. You'll find SPD pedals for as low as $40-
    50 a pair; you'll pay at least $80 if not $120 for any of
    the others.

    Time ATAC is better for clearing mud and snow. If your
    friend is staying mostly onroad (true?), this probably
    doesn't matter. I have heard that they are both easier and
    harder to get into than SPD. Hmmm. Depending on model, Times
    may have more float, if float is an issue.

    Eggbeaters' 4-sided entry probably is easier to get into for
    an uphill start on tricky singletrack or with four full
    panniers. But, for your friend's purposes, double-sided stomp-
    on SPDs are likely easy enough to get into.

    Frogs have "unlimited" float. Great if you need it.
    Expensive if you don't.

    I have the single-sided A515 SPDs on two bikes and like them
    a lot. For me, kicking the pedal over is no big deal, but I
    grew up in the toeclip era. Most people prefer double-sided
    pedals for ease of entry, whether on MTBs or on road bikes.

    Best Regards,

    Peter Storey

  14. [email hidden] (R15757) wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

    Quoted message said:

    Steve Freides wrote:

    << Thank you. Perhaps I need to clarify - my friend is
    going to get either SPD's, Frogs, or similar - I'm looking
    for something in writing that will explain the differences
    to her. She has definitely decided to go with a modern
    clipless pedal system, one that supports a recessed cleat.
    The question is only which one. >>

    I recommend the Time mtb pedals. Get the cheapest model,
    it is just the same as the expensive model except the
    pedal body is made of different material. These pedals
    cost a little more, but they are the simplest, most
    rugged, longest lasting, easiest to use, require no
    adjustment, work flawlessly in mud and ice, generally trouble-
    free piece of equipment. Which can NOT be said of cheap
    SPD pedals.

    I'd never recommend cheap pedals! I agree with your comments
    on Time pedals. One further advantage of the Time ATAC
    system is that they, in common with their road pedals,
    provide lateral float.

    LGF

  15. (LGF) said:

    I'd never recommend cheap pedals! I agree with your
    comments on Time pedals. One further advantage of the Time
    ATAC system is that they, in common with their road pedals,
    provide lateral float.

    Cheap Time pedals may be sub-optimal, but cheap SPDs are
    great. The $20 Nashbar Special SPDs I have work and feel
    every bit as good as my Shimano SPDs and my Egg Beaters.

    For somebody new to clipless, hybrid-clipless pedals may be
    comforting, like these: amazon.comamazon.com
    /B0001X2DCO/002-0641744-8751208

    For some reason, they're not showing on nashbar.com, but
    they usually go for $29.
    --
    Rick Onanian

  16. Hello All, I bought Shimano 324 pedals for both my bikes and
    they came standard with multi release cleats (and I bought a
    pair of cleats because I didn't know, so now I have 3 sets
    of cleats).

    I like them a lot, they're definitely easier to get out of
    than the Wellgo pedals that came with my mountain bike, any
    you can use them with plain shoes if you want.

    Steve.

    Richard said:

    "Steve Freides" <> wrote in message news:2gquljF5oftrU1@uni-
    berlin.de...

    Quoted message said:

    My wife found SPD's hard to get
    in and out of but loves Frogs.

    You may want to look at the'multi-release' cleats that are
    available for SPD pedals: they're extremely easy to clip
    out of. Only thing to watch out for is wear - they get
    harder to clip out of when they're worn. OTOH, I just
    replced my cleats after 4 years and about 10,000 miles, so
    they don't wear fast.

    They don't come standard with SPD pedals, but have to be
    purchased separately, so your wife probably had standard
    SPD cleats.

    With these cleats, a feirly inexpensive set of pedals and
    shoes, and you're in business.

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