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Expert advice- touring

Started by Dave Barton · · Last activity · 109 posts · 4,105 views

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Recumbent bicycles
Published
12 August 2004
Last activity
30 August 2004
Original author
Dave Barton
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109
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  1. Hi, everybody. I'm a former Vision r-40 (older model) owner who sold it due
    to some tricky problems 1) very front heavy, and2) terrible on softer
    shoulders (probable due to problem #1)

    I switched to a wedgie touring bike, and surprise, the wrist problems
    returned after a week-long trip (I'm dumb sometimes)

    I need the sage advice of 'bent experts on the ultimate load-bearing tourer,
    with at least 50-50 back-front weight balance, and the ability to do gravel
    paths, any configuration considered.

    Thank you oh wise ones!!!

    Dave Barton
    Jazz guitarist and bike nut

  2. Dave Barton said:

    Hi, everybody. I'm a former Vision r-40 (older model) owner who sold it due
    to some tricky problems 1) very front heavy, and2) terrible on softer
    shoulders (probable due to problem #1)

    I switched to a wedgie touring bike, and surprise, the wrist problems
    returned after a week-long trip (I'm dumb sometimes)

    I need the sage advice of 'bent experts on the ultimate load-bearing tourer,
    with at least 50-50 back-front weight balance, and the ability to do gravel
    paths, any configuration considered.

    Thank you oh wise ones!!!

    The RANS Rocket will fit the bill quite nicely, IMO, and is probably the
    least expensive bike to do so (but is still one of the best on its own
    merits).

    Here is a webpage of someone who switched from a Vision R-40 to a RANS
    Rocket for his touring bicycle:
    <http://www.phred.org/~alex/bikes/rocket.html>.

    --
    Tom Sherman – Quad City Area

  3. Have you asked him what a Rans Rocket is yet? 🙂

    "Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Dave Barton said:

    Hi, everybody. I'm a former Vision r-40 (older model) owner who sold it


    due

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    to some tricky problems 1) very front heavy, and2) terrible on softer
    shoulders (probable due to problem #1)

    I switched to a wedgie touring bike, and surprise, the wrist problems
    returned after a week-long trip (I'm dumb sometimes)

    I need the sage advice of 'bent experts on the ultimate load-bearing


    tourer,

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    with at least 50-50 back-front weight balance, and the ability to do


    gravel

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    paths, any configuration considered.

    Thank you oh wise ones!!!

    The RANS Rocket will fit the bill quite nicely, IMO, and is probably the
    least expensive bike to do so (but is still one of the best on its own
    merits).

    Here is a webpage of someone who switched from a Vision R-40 to a RANS
    Rocket for his touring bicycle:
    <http://www.phred.org/~alex/bikes/rocket.html>.

    --
    Tom Sherman – Quad City Area

  4. "Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Dave Barton said:

    Hi, everybody. I'm a former Vision r-40 (older model) owner who sold it


    due

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    to some tricky problems 1) very front heavy, and2) terrible on softer
    shoulders (probable due to problem #1)

    I switched to a wedgie touring bike, and surprise, the wrist problems
    returned after a week-long trip (I'm dumb sometimes)

    I need the sage advice of 'bent experts on the ultimate load-bearing


    tourer,

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    with at least 50-50 back-front weight balance, and the ability to do


    gravel

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    paths, any configuration considered.

    Thank you oh wise ones!!!

    The RANS Rocket will fit the bill quite nicely, IMO, and is probably the
    least expensive bike to do so (but is still one of the best on its own
    merits).

    Here is a webpage of someone who switched from a Vision R-40 to a RANS
    Rocket for his touring bicycle:
    <http://www.phred.org/~alex/bikes/rocket.html>.

    Forget about SWB. Go to LWB and don't look back. Almost any LWB will be far
    superior to any SWB. SWB is for sport riding. LWB is for serious touring.
    Thus spake Zarathustra!

    You should have converted your Vision R-40 to LWB and you would have had a
    very fine touring bike.

    --
    Regards,

    Ed Dolan - Minnesota

  5. "I need the sage advice of 'bent experts on the ultimate load-bearing
    tourer,
    with at least 50-50 back-front weight balance, and the ability to do gravel
    paths, any configuration considered."

    I am not an expert,not being over fifty miles from home (although I do have
    a briefcase).

    But, when has that stopped anyone on this venue.

    The gold standard of long distance touring is the Easy Racers Tour Easy in
    one of it's versions.

    As support of this statement I cite the following tour report site.
    http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/

    There are many recumbents going on long trips. Trikes and Tour Easy's
    predominate the ranks.

    You seem to favor two wheels(I agree). That rules out trikes.

    Your gravel road would sway the choice toward the EX version, with larger
    tires.

    People have toured on all most every available platform. I don't mean to
    disparage other designs.

    Miles of Smiles,
    Tom

  6. In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden] says...

    Quoted message said:

    Hi, everybody. I'm a former Vision r-40 (older model) owner who sold it due
    to some tricky problems 1) very front heavy, and2) terrible on softer
    shoulders (probable due to problem #1)

    I switched to a wedgie touring bike, and surprise, the wrist problems
    returned after a week-long trip (I'm dumb sometimes)

    I need the sage advice of 'bent experts on the ultimate load-bearing tourer,
    with at least 50-50 back-front weight balance, and the ability to do gravel
    paths, any configuration considered.

    Thank you oh wise ones!!!

    Dave Barton
    Jazz guitarist and bike nut

    I tour mostly on a P-38 Lightning. The weight distribution unloaded is 45% front 55% rear. With
    33mm Vredestein S-Licks, I have toured in many places where I wished there was a road. In short,
    the P-38 can handle anything you can find on a tour.

    Another excellent touring machine is my Bacchetta Giro. The Giro has an advantage over the P-38 in
    that the Giro supports a Midship Underseat rack for better load distribution.

    --

    Cletus D. Lee
    Bacchetta Aero-Basso
    Bacchetta Giro
    Lightning Voyager
    http://www.clee.org
    - Bellaire, TX USA -

  7. "Cletus Lee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>, [email hidden]


    says...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Hi, everybody. I'm a former Vision r-40 (older model) owner who sold it


    due

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    to some tricky problems 1) very front heavy, and2) terrible on softer
    shoulders (probable due to problem #1)

    I switched to a wedgie touring bike, and surprise, the wrist problems
    returned after a week-long trip (I'm dumb sometimes)

    I need the sage advice of 'bent experts on the ultimate load-bearing


    tourer,

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    with at least 50-50 back-front weight balance, and the ability to do


    gravel

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    paths, any configuration considered.

    Thank you oh wise ones!!!

    Dave Barton
    Jazz guitarist and bike nut

    I tour mostly on a P-38 Lightning. The weight distribution unloaded is 45%


    front 55% rear. With

    Quoted message said:

    33mm Vredestein S-Licks, I have toured in many places where I wished there


    was a road. In short,

    Quoted message said:

    the P-38 can handle anything you can find on a tour.

    Another excellent touring machine is my Bacchetta Giro. The Giro has an


    advantage over the P-38 in

    Quoted message said:

    that the Giro supports a Midship Underseat rack for better load


    distribution.

    Good Grief! Why tour on a SWB when there are perfectly good LWB's available.
    The Giro has a very high BB which is a complication for touring. The Easy
    Racers Tour Easy is by no means a perfect touring recumbent, but it is far
    superior to any SWB, and that includes the fabled P-38 Lightning too. If you
    are carrying a load, then it is just fine to have it all on the rear rack
    with a LWB. If you want more "balance" then a front rack will work on a LWB.
    Length matters on a recumbent. The only thing against a LWB is the size,
    mainly for transportation issues.

    --
    Regards,

    Ed Dolan - Minnesota

  8. "Dave Barton" <[email hidden]> wrote in
    news:[email hidden]:

    Quoted message said:

    I need the sage advice of 'bent experts on the ultimate load-bearing
    tourer, with at least 50-50 back-front weight balance, and the ability
    to do gravel paths, any configuration considered.

    The short answer is "whatever bike you have from EZ 1 to Reynolds T-
    bone."

    Starting from a clean sheet of paper, one might consider:

    Obvious LWB candidates:
    Stratus, V2, Tour Easy/GRR, Longbikes Slipstream/Vanguard

    The apparent European standards:
    HPV Streetmachine, Grasshopper, similar bikes from Challenger, Optima
    et.al.

    If you are otherwise constrained to SWB, darned near anything ought to
    work. You might even find an '01 or later suspended Vision with OSS at
    an attractive price. Past that, I'd at least think about a RANs Vivo, a
    Burley Limbo, then the usual suspects (Canto, Django, Rocket, VRex,
    various Bachettae), but don't rule out the Longbikes Eliminator or
    Haluzak Horizon. I kind of think side-arm USS (as opposed to knuckle
    draggin'😉 would be a blast on a tour.

    I'm not sure how much fun a stiff SWB would be after a day on the chip-
    seal, but if I had a stiff SWB, I wouldn't let that stop me. Although I
    might run the tire pressure down to 85 psi or so.

    Under no circumstances would I consider a P-38 as this would only
    encourage Cletus! (it's a JOKE!).

    As far as baggage, people are evenly split WRT trailers vs panniers. I'm
    starting to lean toward trailers (e.g. Nomad with the alternative hitch),
    but diff'rent strokes.

  9. In article <[email hidden]>, Howard <bishop(1199bitshifleft1)
    @yazhooz.com> says...

    Quoted message said:

    Under no circumstances would I consider a P-38 as this would only
    encourage Cletus! (it's a JOKE!).

    I have a love/hate, hot/cold relationship with my P-38. It presents lots of negatives, but there
    probably is not a better suited all around recumbent made. It is fast. It out climbs most
    recumbents. It can be a little pack mule. And with the Voyager option, it is the only touring bike
    that can do long distance tours and still fly free on a US airline.

    --
    Cletus D. Lee
    Bacchetta Giro
    Lightning Voyager
    http://www.clee.org
    - Bellaire, TX USA -

  10. Cletus Lee said:

    I have a love/hate, hot/cold relationship with my P-38. It presents lots of negatives, but there
    probably is not a better suited all around recumbent made. It is fast. It out climbs most
    recumbents. It can be a little pack mule. And with the Voyager option, it is the only touring bike
    that can do long distance tours and still fly free on a US airline.

    The Boulder Galaxy [1] (and its near twin, the Angletech Altitude) are
    reportedly fine touring bike, and should fold down into airline size
    case. S&S couplers are also available from certain dealers on bikes such
    as the RANS Rocket that would allow then to be packed down to a
    sufficiently small size (if the Angletech hinge is added to the RANS seat).

    [1] <http://www.boulderbikes.com/galaxy.htm>.

    --
    Tom Sherman - Quad City Area

  11. Thanks. all. Keep the opinions coming! I have a line on a used Rocket, and
    am also considering the Maxarya Ray-1 ( maxarya.com) I did tour with the
    old r-40, but was always wiping out on gravel shoulders!!
    Thanks again!!

    "Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Cletus Lee said:

    I have a love/hate, hot/cold relationship with my P-38. It presents


    lots of negatives, but there

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    probably is not a better suited all around recumbent made. It is fast.


    It out climbs most

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    recumbents. It can be a little pack mule. And with the Voyager option,


    it is the only touring bike

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    that can do long distance tours and still fly free on a US airline.

    The Boulder Galaxy [1] (and its near twin, the Angletech Altitude) are
    reportedly fine touring bike, and should fold down into airline size
    case. S&S couplers are also available from certain dealers on bikes such
    as the RANS Rocket that would allow then to be packed down to a
    sufficiently small size (if the Angletech hinge is added to the RANS


    seat).

    Quoted message said:


    [1] <http://www.boulderbikes.com/galaxy.htm>.

    --
    Tom Sherman - Quad City Area

  12. "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Forget about SWB. Go to LWB and don't look back. Almost any LWB will be


    far

    Quoted message said:

    superior to any SWB. SWB is for sport riding. LWB is for serious touring.
    Thus spake Zarathustra!

    You should have converted your Vision R-40 to LWB and you would have had a
    very fine touring bike.

    That is garbage, I've toured with my SWB Vision R-50 with no problems at
    all, either SWB or LWB will work fine

  13. "Cletus Lee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>, Howard


    <bishop(1199bitshifleft1)

    Quoted message said:

    @yazhooz.com> says...

    Quoted message said:

    Under no circumstances would I consider a P-38 as this would only
    encourage Cletus! (it's a JOKE!).

    I have a love/hate, hot/cold relationship with my P-38. It presents lots


    of negatives, but there

    Quoted message said:

    probably is not a better suited all around recumbent made. It is fast. It


    out climbs most

    Quoted message said:

    recumbents. It can be a little pack mule. And with the Voyager option, it


    is the only touring bike

    Quoted message said:

    that can do long distance tours and still fly free on a US airline.

    What is the part about it you hate?

  14. Edward Dolan said:

    Good Grief! Why tour on a SWB when there are perfectly good LWB's available.
    The Giro has a very high BB which is a complication for touring. The Easy
    Racers Tour Easy is by no means a perfect touring recumbent, but it is far
    superior to any SWB, and that includes the fabled P-38 Lightning too. If you
    are carrying a load, then it is just fine to have it all on the rear rack
    with a LWB. If you want more "balance" then a front rack will work on a LWB.
    Length matters on a recumbent. The only thing against a LWB is the size,
    mainly for transportation issues.

    Some people prefer a greater seat recline to prevent recumbent butt.
    This requires a higher bottom bracket to prevent a too open hip angle
    that affects climbing negatively.

    Greater seat recline on a LWB will result in excessive tiller unless a
    remote steering linkage is used.

    --
    Tom Sherman – Quad City Area

  15. "Mark Leuck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:mDUSc.242773$a24.74939@attbi_s03...

    Quoted message said:


    "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Forget about SWB. Go to LWB and don't look back. Almost any LWB will be


    far

    Quoted message said:

    superior to any SWB. SWB is for sport riding. LWB is for serious


    touring.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Thus spake Zarathustra!

    You should have converted your Vision R-40 to LWB and you would have had


    a

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    very fine touring bike.

    That is garbage, I've toured with my SWB Vision R-50 with no problems at
    all, either SWB or LWB will work fine

    But LWB will work better! But hey, if you want to listen to a jerk who does
    not put periods at the end of his sentences, be my guest.

    --
    Regards,

    Ed Dolan - Minnesota

  16. "Tom Sherman" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Edward Dolan said:

    Good Grief! Why tour on a SWB when there are perfectly good LWB's


    available.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    The Giro has a very high BB which is a complication for touring. The


    Easy

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Racers Tour Easy is by no means a perfect touring recumbent, but it is


    far

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    superior to any SWB, and that includes the fabled P-38 Lightning too. If


    you

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    are carrying a load, then it is just fine to have it all on the rear


    rack

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    with a LWB. If you want more "balance" then a front rack will work on a


    LWB.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    Length matters on a recumbent. The only thing against a LWB is the size,
    mainly for transportation issues.

    Some people prefer a greater seat recline to prevent recumbent butt.
    This requires a higher bottom bracket to prevent a too open hip angle
    that affects climbing negatively.

    Greater seat recline on a LWB will result in excessive tiller unless a
    remote steering linkage is used.

    All of the above is only too true. The RANS V2 , a LWB, gives you the higher
    BB thereby increasing comfort, but with tiller - and a high BB can sometimes
    be a complication effecting control in tight situations.

    I do enjoy SWB, but only for a few hours at best, after which they become
    tedious and aggravating. For extended touring I prefer a LWB that does not
    require so much input.

    --
    Regards,

    Ed Dolan - Minnesota

  17. "Cletus Lee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>, Howard


    <bishop(1199bitshifleft1)

    Quoted message said:

    @yazhooz.com> says...

    Quoted message said:

    Under no circumstances would I consider a P-38 as this would only
    encourage Cletus! (it's a JOKE!).

    I have a love/hate, hot/cold relationship with my P-38. It presents lots


    of negatives, but there

    Quoted message said:

    probably is not a better suited all around recumbent made. It is fast. It


    out climbs most

    Quoted message said:

    recumbents. It can be a little pack mule. And with the Voyager option, it


    is the only touring bike

    Quoted message said:

    that can do long distance tours and still fly free on a US airline.

    Yeah, but if you are flying around the country and the world taking your
    bike with you, maybe it is time to rethink what it is that you are doing in
    the first place. I think if I were flying off to Europe for instance I would
    not want to be encumbered with a bike. I can tour with a bike here at home
    and I do not ever need to go near an airport either. I just hop on the bike
    and go. Simple!

    Is that really the best use of your time and energy to be riding a bike in
    Europe?

    --
    Regards,

    Ed Dolan - Minnesota

  18. "Mark Leuck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:%DUSc.249569$IQ4.212846@attbi_s02...

    Quoted message said:


    "Cletus Lee" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    In article <[email hidden]>, Howard


    <bishop(1199bitshifleft1)

    Quoted message said:

    @yazhooz.com> says...

    Quoted message said:

    Under no circumstances would I consider a P-38 as this would only
    encourage Cletus! (it's a JOKE!).

    I have a love/hate, hot/cold relationship with my P-38. It presents


    lots

    Quoted message said:

    of negatives, but there

    Quoted message said:

    probably is not a better suited all around recumbent made. It is fast.


    It

    Quoted message said:

    out climbs most

    Quoted message said:

    recumbents. It can be a little pack mule. And with the Voyager option,


    it

    Quoted message said:

    is the only touring bike

    Quoted message said:

    that can do long distance tours and still fly free on a US airline.

    What is the part about it you hate?

    Mark Leuck only eschews periods at the end of his sentences. Apparently,
    question marks are OK with him. I guess he figures that if there is not a
    question mark at the end of a question, that no one will not bother giving
    him an answer. And he is quite right about that - at least I would never
    bother answering a question if I did not see a question mark. But even
    though Mark likes that particular punctuation, he remains adamant in his
    refusal to use the lowly, but important, period.

    --
    Regards,

    Ed Dolan - Minnesota

  19. "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    Mark Leuck only eschews periods at the end of his sentences. Apparently,
    question marks are OK with him. I guess he figures that if there is not a
    question mark at the end of a question, that no one will not bother giving
    him an answer. And he is quite right about that - at least I would never
    bother answering a question if I did not see a question mark. But even
    though Mark likes that particular punctuation, he remains adamant in his
    refusal to use the lowly, but important, period.

    Seek help

  20. "Mark Leuck" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:AI2Tc.244522$a24.138583@attbi_s03...

    Quoted message said:


    "Edward Dolan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    Mark Leuck only eschews periods at the end of his sentences. Apparently,
    question marks are OK with him. I guess he figures that if there is not


    a

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    question mark at the end of a question, that no one will bother giving
    him an answer. And he is quite right about that - at least I would never
    bother answering a question if I did not see a question mark. But even
    though Mark likes that particular punctuation, he remains adamant in his
    refusal to use the lowly, but important, period.

    Seek help

    Why don't you get your head screwed on straight and use periods at the end
    of your sentences like everyone else in the world - you screwball!

    --
    Regards,

    Ed Dolan - Minnesota

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