Edward Coyle comments on Lance

[font=arial] According to him, the "extraordinary" are the riders who developed wattage
in excess of 450 watts, with attacks at the bottom of the mountain. That
would be the case with Marco Pantani, who realized a record time of 37
minutes 15 seconds after having toiled through an Alpine stage. Even
without a bold attack in its first switch backs, Alpe D'Huez requires, in a
climb of 41 minutes 20 seconds @ 20 km/hour, a development of 400 watts fpr
a rider of 70 kg. David Moncoutie on a good day could get there. The record
to beat is 36 minutes 50 seconds, established by Marco Pantani in 1995, at
an average of 22.48 km/hr, having developed an average of 461 watts after
having crossed the Madeleine and Croix de Fer passes. Lance Armstrong lays
claim to the fifth best time (the three best were achieved by Pantani, the
fourth by Ullrich) in 2001 in 38 minutes 5 seconds, at 21.74 kh/hr. for an
averagee of 442 watts, after having crossed the Madeleine and Glandon
passes."


this is a quote from antoine vayer, if he is correct as i feel his numbers are
The best rider in the peleton today and the most talented is .........................

David Moncoutie
[/font]

Paolo said:

[font=arial] According to him, the "extraordinary" are the riders who developed wattage
in excess of 450 watts, with attacks at the bottom of the mountain. That
would be the case with Marco Pantani, who realized a record time of 37
minutes 15 seconds after having toiled through an Alpine stage. Even
without a bold attack in its first switch backs, Alpe D'Huez requires, in a
climb of 41 minutes 20 seconds @ 20 km/hour, a development of 400 watts fpr
a rider of 70 kg. David Moncoutie on a good day could get there. The record
to beat is 36 minutes 50 seconds, established by Marco Pantani in 1995, at
an average of 22.48 km/hr, having developed an average of 461 watts after
having crossed the Madeleine and Croix de Fer passes. Lance Armstrong lays
claim to the fifth best time (the three best were achieved by Pantani, the
fourth by Ullrich) in 2001 in 38 minutes 5 seconds, at 21.74 kh/hr. for an
averagee of 442 watts, after having crossed the Madeleine and Glandon
passes."


this is a quote from antoine vayer, if he is correct as i feel his numbers are
The best rider in the peleton today and the most talented is .........................

David Moncoutie
[/font]

If Ullrich has the fourth fastest time - surely it's Ullrich ?

Moncoutie is widely perceived to be a "clean" rider.
The belief is that he doesn't use PED's.

A measure of just watts is not an overall indication of who is best. Watts measures only the power an athlete can produce. If a rider of the style of Roberta Heras and Maggie Backstedt were able to produce the same watts over a given period of time who would be more likely to win a mountain stage?

I think you got the times climbing L'Alpe d'huez not entirely correct, or at least they dont macht up with my information. Here it is:

[font=Arial]Times Climbing l'Alpe d'huez[/font]

[font=Arial]38:37 - Ullrich 2004 (ITT)[/font]
[font=Arial]37:36 - Armstrong 2004 (ITT)[/font]
[font=Arial]39:06 - Mayo 2003
38:01 - Armstrong 2001
39:02 - Virenque 1997
38:23 - Ullrich 1997
37:35 - Pantani 1997 (current record)
39:30 - Riis 1995
39:28 - Indurain/Zulle 1995
38:04 - Pantani 1995
38:00 - Pantani 1994
39:45 - Indurain, 1991
41:50 - Fignon 1989
48:00 - Hinault/Lemond 1986
45:22 - Coppi 1952[/font]

By the way you said that that [font=Arial]Alpe D'Huez requires, in a climb of 41 minutes 20 seconds @ 20 km/hour, a development of 400 watts for a rider of 70 kg. I wonder how many watts did Indurain develop to climb Alpe D'Huez in 39:28 with his weight of 80 kg??? 600 watts??? For me Indurain was the strongest of them all.[/font]

sopas said:

I think you got the times climbing L'Alpe d'huez not entirely correct, or at least they dont macht up with my information. Here it is:

[font=Arial]Times Climbing l'Alpe d'huez[/font]

[font=Arial]38:37 - Ullrich 2004 (ITT)[/font]
[font=Arial]37:36 - Armstrong 2004 (ITT)[/font]
[font=Arial]39:06 - Mayo 2003
38:01 - Armstrong 2001
39:02 - Virenque 1997
38:23 - Ullrich 1997
37:35 - Pantani 1997 (current record)
39:30 - Riis 1995
39:28 - Indurain/Zulle 1995
38:04 - Pantani 1995
38:00 - Pantani 1994
39:45 - Indurain, 1991
41:50 - Fignon 1989
48:00 - Hinault/Lemond 1986
45:22 - Coppi 1952[/font]

By the way you said that that [font=Arial]Alpe D'Huez requires, in a climb of 41 minutes 20 seconds @ 20 km/hour, a development of 400 watts for a rider of 70 kg. How many watts did Indurain develop to climb Alpe D'Huez in 39:28 with his weight of 80 kg??? 600 watts????????? For me Indurain was the strongest of them all.[/font]

Yeah Indurain was exceptional.

limerickman said:

If Ullrich has the fourth fastest time - surely it's Ullrich ?

Moncoutie is widely perceived to be a "clean" rider.
The belief is that he doesn't use PED's.

what i was trying to say is that monc is percieved as a clean rider
if this is true and say most of the other riders in the top 20 are doped,
how good is this guy?
He must be incredible!!!!!
he finished alongside ivan basso in the tt up to huez last year and i have my doubts about ivan basso

i read a while ago that moncutie produces nearly the same power as greg lemond according to cyrille guimard