Dyno with USB outlet?

In news:[email hidden],
Duncan Smith <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine to tell
us:

Quoted message said:

Just wondering if anyone has seen or used a bike dyno that would
trickle charge a smart-phone/pocket-pc via the standard mini USB
cable?

Elsewhere it has been suggested that the (ferrrrrrociously expensive) B&M 12
vole job would allow one to wire up a motorcar 12 vole socket, for which USB
cables are readily available.

--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
A complimentary biro(tm) is /not/ to be sniffed at.

On 21 Feb, 08:51, "Dave Larrington" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Innews:[email hidden],
Duncan Smith <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine to tell
us:

Quoted message said:

Just wondering if anyone has seen or used a bike dyno that would
trickle charge a smart-phone/pocket-pc via the standard mini USB
cable?

Elsewhere it has been suggested that the (ferrrrrrociously expensive) B&M 12
vole job would allow one to wire up a motorcar 12 vole socket, for which USB
cables are readily available.

--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
A complimentary biro(tm) is /not/ to be sniffed at.

Does this fit the bill?

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/03/pedal_power.php

GIYF

David Lloyd

Quoted message said:

Does this fit the bill?

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/03/pedal_power.php

GIYF

Most admirably. I did try the search engines first - honestly!

Many thanks,

Duncan

In news:[email hidden],
David Lloyd <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine to tell us:

Quoted message said:

On 21 Feb, 08:51, "Dave Larrington" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Innews:[email hidden],
Duncan Smith <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine
to tell us:

Quoted message said:

Just wondering if anyone has seen or used a bike dyno that would
trickle charge a smart-phone/pocket-pc via the standard mini USB
cable?

Elsewhere it has been suggested that the (ferrrrrrociously
expensive) B&M 12 vole job would allow one to wire up a motorcar 12
vole socket, for which USB cables are readily available.

--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
A complimentary biro(tm) is /not/ to be sniffed at.

Does this fit the bill?

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/03/pedal_power.php

And allegedly available from Bikefix.

--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
und keine Eie.

"Dave Larrington" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In news:[email hidden],
David Lloyd <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine to tell us:

Quoted message said:

On 21 Feb, 08:51, "Dave Larrington" <[email hidden]>

Quoted message said:

Innews:[email hidden],
Duncan Smith <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine
to tell us:

> Just wondering if anyone has seen or used a bike dyno that would
> trickle charge a smart-phone/pocket-pc via the standard mini USB
> cable?

Elsewhere it has been suggested that the (ferrrrrrociously
expensive) B&M 12 vole job would allow one to wire up a motorcar 12
vole socket, for which USB cables are readily available.

--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
A complimentary biro(tm) is /not/ to be sniffed at.

Does this fit the bill?

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/03/pedal_power.php

And allegedly available from Bikefix.

--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
und keine Eie.

Allegedly, although I couldn't find it on the site. You can get it at
EcoGadgets though. http://shop.ecogadgets.com/index.php?cat=Pedal_and_Power
I've not tried this shop so can't speak about its reliability and service.
Less than £25 seems pretty good for this, and I might give one a go myself.

Colin

In article said:

"Dave Larrington" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

Quoted message said:

David Lloyd <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine to tell us:

Quoted message said:

On 21 Feb, 08:51, "Dave Larrington" <[email hidden]>
wrote:
> Duncan Smith <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine
> to tell us:
>
>> Just wondering if anyone has seen or used a bike dyno that would
>> trickle charge a smart-phone/pocket-pc via the standard mini USB
>> cable?

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/03/pedal_power.php

And allegedly available from Bikefix.

Allegedly, although I couldn't find it on the site. You can get it at
EcoGadgets though. http://shop.ecogadgets.com/index.php?cat=Pedal_and_Power
I've not tried this shop so can't speak about its reliability and service.
Less than £25 seems pretty good for this, and I might give one a go myself.

Also available at the Centre for Alternative Technology
http://www2.cat.org.uk/shopping/product_info.php?cPath=21_26_125&products_id=873&osCsid=8695b98a0994a61b7a0c1783eb5c7baf

The hand-cranked http://www.freeplayenergy.com/product/freecharge12v
could probably be adapted to be driven by a bike wheel somehow, but that's
probably not such a good solution (but potentially more useful if you want
to recharge your gadget on walking trips as well as cycling).

Quoted message said:

The hand-crankedhttp://www.freeplayenergy.com/product/freecharge12v
could probably be adapted to be driven by a bike wheel somehow, but that's
probably not such a good solution (but potentially more useful if you want
to recharge your gadget on walking trips as well as cycling).

In addition to a long-range battery, I thought the Power-Chimp!
http://www.amazon.co.uk/PowerChimp-Emergency-Charger-Mobile-Electronics/dp/B000NVTSEK

and some AA cells packed away would make a good solution for when
walking in the hills.

Regards,

Duncan

"Colin Reed" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

"Dave Larrington" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In
news:[email hidden],
David Lloyd <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine to tell
us:

Quoted message said:

On 21 Feb, 08:51, "Dave Larrington" <[email hidden]>
wrote:
> Innews:[email hidden],
> Duncan Smith <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine
> to tell us:
>
>> Just wondering if anyone has seen or used a bike dyno that would
>> trickle charge a smart-phone/pocket-pc via the standard mini USB
>> cable?
>
> Elsewhere it has been suggested that the (ferrrrrrociously
> expensive) B&M 12 vole job would allow one to wire up a motorcar 12
> vole socket, for which USB cables are readily available.
>
> --
> Dave Larrington
> <http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
> A complimentary biro(tm) is /not/ to be sniffed at.

Does this fit the bill?

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/03/pedal_power.php

And allegedly available from Bikefix.

--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
und keine Eie.

Allegedly, although I couldn't find it on the site. You can get it at
EcoGadgets though.
http://shop.ecogadgets.com/index.php?cat=Pedal_and_Power I've not tried
this shop so can't speak about its reliability and service. Less than £25
seems pretty good for this, and I might give one a go myself.

Colin

It does make me wonder what regulation there is as I have discovered that a
bike dynamo produces AC current and are capable of upto 12v.

I know it uses a cig plug which generally will drop it to the required
voltage but surely a cig lighter socet in car is DC already.

But the idea does apeal for my gps

Dave

In article <a54c16d9-3872-44b0-962f-2ea5aa6c0cc2@
71g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, Duncan Smith
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Just wondering if anyone has seen or used a bike dyno that would
trickle charge a smart-phone/pocket-pc via the standard mini USB
cable?

USB is just 5 volts at up to 500mA. A basic dynamo (actually an
alternator) produces a nominal 6VRMS 500mA AC.
Stick together a bridge rectifier, a smoothing capacitor and a voltage
regulator and you've (theoretically) got something to convert 6V AC to
5V DC, total cost about £2.50.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270182289027
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270146227591
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270191144166

All you need on top of that is the leads to hook it up, and something to
put it in.

I'm not sure how the losses would work out, I think that would depend on
the load and the dynamo characteristics but it's a long time since I did
this stuff.

Quoting Dave <[email hidden]>:

Quoted message said:

It does make me wonder what regulation there is as I have discovered that a
bike dynamo produces AC current and are capable of upto 12v.

Considerably more if spun fast enough (and, if a bottle dynamo, doesn't
slip, so easier with a hub dynamo) with enough resistance across the
terminals.
--
David Damerell <[email hidden]> Kill the tomato!
Today is Gloucesterday, February.

Dave Larrington said:

In news:[email hidden],
Duncan Smith <[email hidden]> tweaked the Babbage-Engine to tell
us:

Quoted message said:

Just wondering if anyone has seen or used a bike dyno that would
trickle charge a smart-phone/pocket-pc via the standard mini USB
cable?

Elsewhere it has been suggested that the (ferrrrrrociously expensive) B&M 12
vole job would allow one to wire up a motorcar 12 vole socket, for which USB
cables are readily available.

[herewegoagain] most dynamo's*) are constant current devices, so if this
works it should work with any but maybe at a slightly higher
speed[/herewegoagain] 😉

*) yes, litespin is an exception
--
/Marten

info(apestaartje)m-gineering(punt)nl

David Lloyd said:

Does this fit the bill?

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/03/pedal_power.php

In days of yore I had a job that paid me to play with toys and write
about them: this was one I looked at in, ooh, about 2001. Produced
by some Scandewegian outfit IIRC.

The supplied dynamo is cheap and nasty, fit only for the bin unless
you really have no other power source. However, it's an easy matter
to clip the cable and attach the socket to a decent dynamo.

Attached to a SON it worked fine for charging purposes, even on a
commute - on tour or whatever, with a decent run behind it, it would
have been a very good thing.

I didn't even attempt to work out what trickery was built into the
socket (surprisingly bulky, as it happens) but it seemed to turn the
syno output into a fair enough approximation of 12V DC to keep
the phone charger happy - bear in mind that it'll run a car charger,
not anything smaller and handier.

I might see if I can work out which box I need to fish mine out of -
I can see it coming in handy if half-baked plans come to anything
this summer.

Regards

John

"Rob Morley" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...
In article <a54c16d9-3872-44b0-962f-2ea5aa6c0cc2@
71g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, Duncan Smith
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Just wondering if anyone has seen or used a bike dyno that would
trickle charge a smart-phone/pocket-pc via the standard mini USB
cable?

USB is just 5 volts at up to 500mA. A basic dynamo (actually an
alternator) produces a nominal 6VRMS 500mA AC.
Stick together a bridge rectifier, a smoothing capacitor and a voltage
regulator and you've (theoretically) got something to convert 6V AC to
5V DC, total cost about £2.50.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270182289027
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270146227591
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270191144166

All you need on top of that is the leads to hook it up, and something to
put it in.

I'm not sure how the losses would work out, I think that would depend on
the load and the dynamo characteristics but it's a long time since I did
this stuff.

I agree that USB is 5v but the contraption in question I beleive is set up
to work from upto 12v as it tells you to use your own phone lead which has
the necessary electronics to drop the voltage to that needed by your phone
from the cig lighter socket which is usually 13.8v.

I guess that the components listed above or at least suitable alternatives
would do the job though. It is a while since I wired a rectifying circuit
too.

Dave

Rob Morley said:

USB is just 5 volts at up to 500mA. A basic dynamo (actually an
alternator) produces a nominal 6VRMS 500mA AC.
Stick together a bridge rectifier, a smoothing capacitor and a voltage
regulator and you've (theoretically) got something to convert 6V AC to
5V DC, total cost about £2.50.

Unfortunately, only theoretically, and not practically.

A bridge rectifier typically drops the voltage by 1.2v (0.6v per diode),
unless you have one based on schottky diodes, which will have a somewhat
lesser voltage drop (perhaps as small as 0.5v).

The 7805 regulator needs around 7.2v to work and give 5 volts. You can
get low dropout regulators that work on around 6v, but you've already
lost 1.2v to your rectifier.

If your dynamo can give 8.5 volts or more under load, it'll work.
Otherwise, you're going to need a switch mode regulator which, while not
expensive to build, is a bit more complex (especially if you want it to
regulate as well as a 7805).

--
From the sunny Isle of Man.
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.

Dylan Smith said:

Rob Morley said:

USB is just 5 volts at up to 500mA. A basic dynamo (actually an
alternator) produces a nominal 6VRMS 500mA AC.
Stick together a bridge rectifier, a smoothing capacitor and a
voltage regulator and you've (theoretically) got something to
convert 6V AC to 5V DC, total cost about £2.50.

Unfortunately, only theoretically, and not practically.

A bridge rectifier typically drops the voltage by 1.2v (0.6v per
diode), unless you have one based on schottky diodes, which will have
a somewhat lesser voltage drop (perhaps as small as 0.5v).

The 7805 regulator needs around 7.2v to work and give 5 volts. You can
get low dropout regulators that work on around 6v, but you've already
lost 1.2v to your rectifier.

If your dynamo can give 8.5 volts or more under load, it'll work.

Fortunately, a half decent dynamo does give this sort of voltage under load,
at least at speeds above 12mph, hence the use of twin headlamps wired in
series (requiring 12v).

Unfortunately, the output does fluctuate up and down as the rider gets
faster or slower.

Quoted message said:

Otherwise, you're going to need a switch mode regulator which, while
not expensive to build, is a bit more complex (especially if you want
it to regulate as well as a 7805).

There are regulator chips around which give the 5.5v for USB from almost any
applied voltage. There are numerous internet pages describing how to power
an iPod / MP3 player from an AA cell or two.

- Nigel

--
Nigel Cliffe,
Webmaster at http://www.2mm.org.uk/

Nigel Cliffe said:

Quoted message said:

Otherwise, you're going to need a switch mode regulator which, while
not expensive to build, is a bit more complex (especially if you want
it to regulate as well as a 7805).

There are regulator chips around which give the 5.5v for USB from almost any
applied voltage. There are numerous internet pages describing how to power
an iPod / MP3 player from an AA cell or two.

Yes, these are switch mode. They'll need an inductor and reasonably good
PCB layout to work properly. Not expensive, but unlike the 7805 which
will work with the most rudimentary wiring, needs a little more skill to
assemble and work correctly.

Certainly not beyond an electronics hobbyist, but probably not a newbie
project, which a rectifier/7805 circuit would be.

--
From the sunny Isle of Man.
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.

"Dylan Smith" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Nigel Cliffe said:

Quoted message said:

Otherwise, you're going to need a switch mode regulator which, while
not expensive to build, is a bit more complex (especially if you want
it to regulate as well as a 7805).

There are regulator chips around which give the 5.5v for USB from almost
any
applied voltage. There are numerous internet pages describing how to
power
an iPod / MP3 player from an AA cell or two.

Yes, these are switch mode. They'll need an inductor and reasonably good
PCB layout to work properly. Not expensive, but unlike the 7805 which
will work with the most rudimentary wiring, needs a little more skill to
assemble and work correctly.

Certainly not beyond an electronics hobbyist, but probably not a newbie
project, which a rectifier/7805 circuit would be.

--

At the end of the day the company that sells the kit have got it working.
They will sell you it for 2quid.

Having seen a review of it the result is that it does work - but the bottle
dynamo is cheap and [censored].

Personally I would want to get my own decent one, I would also want to get
my own handlebar holder (already have a suitable one for my use). The only
thing I need or at least need to see a circuit of is the connector as that
(which the reviewer said was bulky) is where the electronics are held that
would rectify, smooth and regulate the voltage to 12v as you use your own
cig lighter lead that drops the voltage to that which your PDA or phone
needs.

I also understand that a dynamo has a nominal voltage of 6v ac but that is
at around 5mph and voltages of 12+ volts are generally achieved at "normal"
cycling speed of 12mph.

I have just read on an electronics website (I have an interest but am no
expert) that if you feed 6v RMS AC into a bridge rectifier you will loose
1.4v leaving 4.6v RMS DC and this is then increased by the smoothing
capacitor to 6.4v smooth DC.

That being the case if 12v AC is fed into rectifier you end up with 10.6v
RMS which when smoothed will increase to 14.84v DC.

So providing you cig lighter plug can handle from 6 to 15 v then you get
your power. I also understand from the info that if you add a regulator into
the circuit then you will get your constant voltage at the cig soctet before
it is fed to the cig plug.

I would really love to know as I would not really want to spend 20 + quid if
I can do it myself.

Dave

In article <[email hidden]>, Dylan Smith
[email hidden] says...

Quoted message said:

Rob Morley said:

USB is just 5 volts at up to 500mA. A basic dynamo (actually an
alternator) produces a nominal 6VRMS 500mA AC.
Stick together a bridge rectifier, a smoothing capacitor and a voltage
regulator and you've (theoretically) got something to convert 6V AC to
5V DC, total cost about £2.50.

Unfortunately, only theoretically, and not practically.

A bridge rectifier typically drops the voltage by 1.2v (0.6v per diode),
unless you have one based on schottky diodes, which will have a somewhat
lesser voltage drop (perhaps as small as 0.5v).

The 7805 regulator needs around 7.2v to work and give 5 volts. You can
get low dropout regulators that work on around 6v, but you've already
lost 1.2v to your rectifier.

I'm glad someone around here knows what they're talking about. My mate
used to design SMPSUs, I suppose I should have asked him. :-)

Quoted message said:

If your dynamo can give 8.5 volts or more under load, it'll work.

As we're being creative, why stick to a regular bike dynamo? A suitable
stepper motor from a scrap printer or similar could be used (maybe gear
driven from the hub or crank, because printers are full of nice nylon
gears and stuff). I'm sure a bit of trial and error could come up with
something that would produce 10V at a reasonable speed.

Quoted message said:

The supplied dynamo is cheap and nasty, fit only for the bin unless
you really have no other power source. However, it's an easy matter
to clip the cable and attach the socket to a decent dynamo.

Thanks John, that's good to know the basics are at least sound.
Perhaps I'll consider upgrading the dyno if it doesn't seem to work/
last too well. My primary requirement from a dyno would be to charge
the phone (and maybe a rear light).

Maybe the B&M Dymotec would be a good choice, I don't fancy forking
out >£100 for the top model with my modest requirements though...
Their Dymotec 6 seems more reasonable at below 40.

Regards,

Duncan