Dura Ace Upgrade

"ottodog" <c> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hello,

Looking for advice. I have a stock Cannondale R700 Road

bike, and I was

Quoted message said:

thinking of upgrading the components from 105 to Dura Ace.

I guess my

Quoted message said:

question is, for the price, will the DA be a big

improvement over the 105?,

Quoted message said:

performance, reliability, etc, or would my money be better

spent elsewhere?

Quoted message said:

I still use the factory wheels, would it be better to

spend the money there?

Quoted message said:

I would like to upgrade from aluminum, to cf or ti someday

in the future.

Quoted message said:

Should I just save my money for that?

BTW I'm a rec rider mostly, 200 mi weekly when the weather

here in Colorado

Quoted message said:

permits.

TIA,

Chris

Why bother? All you're going to do is spend a lot of money to save less than 350 grams - it won't
make any difference to your performance or anything else except your image

Chris said:

Looking for advice. I have a stock Cannondale R700 Road bike, and I was thinking of upgrading the
components from 105 to Dura Ace. I guess my question is, for the price, will the DA be a big
improvement over the

105?,

Quoted message said:

performance, reliability, etc, or would my money be better spent

elsewhere?

I doubt you will notice any difference after making this expensive "upgrade." If you must upgrade,
do so as parts wear out.

Quoted message said:

I still use the factory wheels, would it be better to spend the money

there?

Are you having problems with those wheels? If not, why change? I would not recommend fancy
boutique wheels.

Quoted message said:

I would like to upgrade from aluminum, to cf or ti someday in the future. Should I just save my
money for that?

Maybe. What do you believe a new bike will do for you that your current bike won't? Frame material
alone doesn't determine whether a bike is good or bad.

In all your questions, it's not clear what problem you're trying to correct. If your current bike is
reliable and comfortable, I wouldn't be so quick to change.

Quoted message said:

BTW I'm a rec rider mostly, 200 mi weekly when the weather here in

Colorado

Quoted message said:

permits.

Great! Keep it up. "Riding lots" will have more effect than spending money on new hardware.

Art Harris

IMHO put that money towards a better framed bike, and go with either Ultegra or Campy Centaur
components; I think these are the best buy for a "Rec" rider.

I've had 105, Ultegra, Dura Ace, Centaur, Chorus and Record. The best 'coasting' bike I ever owned
had all Dura Ace except for Ultegra hubs. Wish I had that wheel set on my present bike.

Tom

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DuraAce components are all better than the 105. However, except for the shifters you really wouldn't
notice any difference. The Shifters have a more solid feel to them than the 105's but some people
prefer the softer shifting of the lower grade Shimano stuff.

200 miles a week is high mileage and I would think that you would be wearing parts out often enough
to warrant changing over to DuraAce.

"ottodog" <c> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Hello,

Looking for advice. I have a stock Cannondale R700 Road bike, and I

was

Quoted message said:

thinking of upgrading the components from 105 to Dura Ace. I guess

my

Quoted message said:

question is, for the price, will the DA be a big improvement over

the 105?,

Quoted message said:

performance, reliability, etc, or would my money be better spent

elsewhere?

Quoted message said:

I still use the factory wheels, would it be better to spend the

money there?

Quoted message said:

I would like to upgrade from aluminum, to cf or ti someday in the

future.

Quoted message said:

Should I just save my money for that?

BTW I'm a rec rider mostly, 200 mi weekly when the weather here in

Colorado

Quoted message said:

permits.

TIA,

Chris

Good points. I guess I should elaborate a bit. I feel my current setup is fine for the daily
training ride. I would however like to do more climbing, and mountain riding. So I guess weight
would be the big reason for the upgrade. It seems the weight difference is not great between the DA,
and 105, so I was wondering if there would be other advantages to the upgrade. My wheel upgrade was
also for weight purposes.

The frame change would be more for ride quality, then weight. The CD seems a little harsh, and tends
to leave me with sore joint after a long day in the saddle. I thought CF might improve the ride. I
was leaning toward the Kestrel 300EMS (overkill for me I know), but I love that bike.

Thanks, Chris

"Harris" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Chris said:

Looking for advice. I have a stock Cannondale R700 Road bike, and I was thinking of upgrading
the components from 105 to Dura Ace. I guess my question is, for the price, will the DA be a big
improvement over the

105?,

Quoted message said:

performance, reliability, etc, or would my money be better spent

elsewhere?

I doubt you will notice any difference after making this expensive "upgrade." If you must upgrade,
do so as parts wear out.

Quoted message said:

I still use the factory wheels, would it be better to spend the money

there?

Are you having problems with those wheels? If not, why change? I would not recommend fancy
boutique wheels.

Quoted message said:

I would like to upgrade from aluminum, to cf or ti someday in the

future.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Should I just save my money for that?

Maybe. What do you believe a new bike will do for you that your current

bike

Quoted message said:

won't? Frame material alone doesn't determine whether a bike is good or

bad.

Quoted message said:

In all your questions, it's not clear what problem you're trying to

correct.

Quoted message said:

If your current bike is reliable and comfortable, I wouldn't be so quick

to

Quoted message said:

change.

Quoted message said:

BTW I'm a rec rider mostly, 200 mi weekly when the weather here in

Colorado

Quoted message said:

permits.

Great! Keep it up. "Riding lots" will have more effect than spending money on new hardware.

Art Harris

Chris said:

the weight difference is not great between the DA, and 105, so I was wondering if there would be
other advantages to the upgrade.

I have two bikes. One has DA STI shifters and hubs, and Ultegra elsewhere. My other bike has 105 STI
shifters and a mix of Ultegra and 105 elsewhere. I don't notice any performance or reliability
differences.

Quoted message said:

My wheel upgrade was also for weight purposes.

Weight makes a difference when climbing. But you have to look at the TOTAL weight of the bike plus
the rider. Reducing bike weight by about two pounds will make hill climbing about 1% easier.

Quoted message said:

The frame change would be more for ride quality, then weight. The CD seems

a

Quoted message said:

little harsh, and tends to leave me with sore joint after a long day in

the

Quoted message said:

saddle. I thought CF might improve the ride. I was leaning toward the Kestrel 300EMS (overkill for
me I know), but I love that bike.

The issue of what affects ride quality has been discussed at length here in rbt. The general
consensus is that tire width and pressure are the determining factors.

Art Harris

"Harris" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Chris said:

the weight difference is not great between the DA, and 105, so I was wondering if there would be
other advantages to the upgrade.

I have two bikes. One has DA STI shifters and hubs, and Ultegra elsewhere. My other bike has 105
STI shifters and a mix of Ultegra and 105 elsewhere.

I

Quoted message said:

don't notice any performance or reliability differences.

Agree. The only real reason to get DA STI shifters is for warranty -3 years
DA/2 years everything else shimano....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

My wheel upgrade was also for weight purposes.

Weight makes a difference when climbing. But you have to look at the TOTAL weight of the bike plus
the rider. Reducing bike weight by about two

pounds

Quoted message said:

will make hill climbing about 1% easier.

Yes, lose some weight off your body will get you up the hill "faster". As others have stated, ride
more hills....

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

The frame change would be more for ride quality, then weight. The CD

seems

Quoted message said:

a

Quoted message said:

little harsh, and tends to leave me with sore joint after a long day in

the

Quoted message said:

saddle. I thought CF might improve the ride. I was leaning toward the Kestrel 300EMS (overkill
for me I know), but I love that bike.

The issue of what affects ride quality has been discussed at length here

in

Quoted message said:

rbt. The general consensus is that tire width and pressure are the determining factors.

If you want *more* comfort, get wider tires like 700x25. With wider tires, you can run lower
psi (100-110psi) and get arguably LOWER rolling resistance. alot cheaper than buying a new
frame or bike....

ottodog said:

Hello,

Looking for advice. I have a stock Cannondale R700 Road bike, and I was thinking of upgrading the
components from 105 to Dura Ace. I guess my question is, for the price, will the DA be a big
improvement over the 105?, performance, reliability, etc, or would my money be better spent
elsewhere? I still use the factory wheels, would it be better to spend the money there?

I would like to upgrade from aluminum, to cf or ti someday in the future. Should I just save my
money for that?

BTW I'm a rec rider mostly, 200 mi weekly when the weather here in Colorado permits.

TIA,

Chris

I upgraded my shifters and rear derailleur from Ultegra to DA ( After a crash when I had to
exchange them anyway) and there certainly was a difference in the ease and speed of shifting when
riding in a fast paceline. My carbon frame makes riding very much smoother than any Alu fram I've
had. Mind you though that I still get clobbered on many of our sprints by dudes riding 105
components and Alu frames.

If I had to choose between 105 on a carbon frame or DA on an Alu frame. I'd choose the carbon
frame anyday.

Now that's just me and I'm sure others would do it the other way around. Evidently since both setups
are sold 😉

--
Perre

You have to be smarter than a robot to reply.

ottodog' c said:

I would like to upgrade from aluminum, to cf or ti someday in the future. Should I just save my
money for that?

BTW I'm a rec rider mostly, 200 mi weekly when the weather here in Colorado permits.

There's seems to be nothing wrong with what you have if you are logging 200 mi/wk.

What you have is very reasonable quality and money you spend on more costly components or even a
plastic frame will make little difference. Comfort counts.

If you need to spend money, with your kind of mileage, invest in the most comfortable shoes and
shorts. Go on some organized tours. Bicycling is really a low cost form of recreation.

I don't follow my own advice and now have a sign on the work tag of for the bikes that says this
bicycle is perfect, play with something else.

ottodog' c said:

I was leaning toward the Kestrel 300EMS (overkill for me I know), but I love that bike.

You answered your own question. If you love the Kestrel, you are going to get it, even if
the majority of people tell you that it will make no difference. You will hear only the
favorable comments.

Love is that way you know. It has nothing to do with rational behavior.

PS: I been riding about 12-15,000 mi/yr since '92. I ride in the mountains here in CA. I've owned
the CF, various steel and several Ti bicycles. I've ridden CAAD3,4 and 5 frames exclusively for
several years not. Just like the one you ride. I'm getting old enough to need new joints not
new bikes.

Yeah, your probably right. Guess I'm just trying to rationalize the irrational. I've only had the CD
for about a year, and I'm already itching to try something different. The problem with that is it
usually ends in disappointment, because the returns usually don't justify the expense.

Thanks, Chris

"Paul Kopit" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

ottodog' c said:

I was leaning toward the Kestrel 300EMS (overkill for me I know), but I love that bike.

You answered your own question. If you love the Kestrel, you are going to get it, even if the
majority of people tell you that it will make no difference. You will hear only the favorable
comments.

Love is that way you know. It has nothing to do with rational behavior.

PS: I been riding about 12-15,000 mi/yr since '92. I ride in the mountains here in CA. I've owned
the CF, various steel and several Ti bicycles. I've ridden CAAD3,4 and 5 frames exclusively
for several years not. Just like the one you ride. I'm getting old enough to need new joints
not new bikes.

"ottodog" <c> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Yeah, your probably right. Guess I'm just trying to rationalize the irrational. I've only had the
CD for about a year, and I'm already itching to try something different. The problem with that is
it usually ends in disappointment, because the returns usually don't justify the expense.

Thanks, Chris

That's why you haunt ebay, www.roadbikereview.com, rec.bicycles.marketplace, swap meets, etc. Get
the bike/frame/parts used (or last year's colors) and you let some other sucker take the
depreciation. That's how I have a new $400 2002 S-Works road frame and a $190 Dean 853 mtn frame, a
Bontrager Road Lite, and...

There are deals out there, you just can't be in a hurry to get them.

Mike

ottodog-<< Looking for advice. I have a stock Cannondale R700 Road bike, and I was thinking of
upgrading the components from 105 to Dura Ace. I guess my question is, for the price, will the DA be
a big improvement over the 105?, performance, reliability, etc, or would my money be better spent
elsewhere?

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

<BR><BR>

Campagnolo shifters and a rear der is where I would start. Or spend your money on a bike fit, some
training programs, a massage therapy program. Replace the bike stuff as it breaks.

<< I would like to upgrade from aluminum, to cf or ti someday in the future. Should I just save my
money for that? >><BR><BR>

Why? What problem are you trying to solve, what question are you trying to answer?

<< BTW I'm a rec rider mostly, 200 mi weekly when the weather here in Colorado permits. >><BR><BR>

See above...

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 vecchios.comvecchios.comOpen ↗ "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

In article <[email hidden]>, c says...

Quoted message said:

Hello, Looking for advice. I have a stock Cannondale R700 Road bike, and I was thinking of
upgrading the components from 105 to Dura Ace. I guess my question is, for the price, will the DA
be a big improvement over the 105?, performance, reliability, etc, or would my money be better
spent elsewhere?

Unless your 105 parts are worn out, you won't notice a huge difference. I would wait till parts
start to wear out and replace those with DA parts.

Quoted message said:

I still use the factory wheels, would it be better to spend the money there?

A good set of handbuilt wheels could be a good upgrade, if your current wheels are falling apart. .

Quoted message said:

I would like to upgrade from aluminum, to cf or ti someday in the future. Should I just save my
money for that?

Upgrade? Why do you think changing the material will be an upgrade? Good frames can be made from any
of the materials you suggest, just as easily as bad frames can be made from the same materials. The
material is not as important as how it is used.
-----------------
Alex __O _-\<,_ (_)/ (_)

"Alex Rodriguez" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
"]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, c says...

Quoted message said:

Hello, Looking for advice. I have a stock Cannondale R700 Road bike, and I was thinking of
upgrading the components from 105 to Dura Ace. I guess my question is, for the price, will the DA
be a big improvement over the

105?,

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

performance, reliability, etc, or would my money be better spent

elsewhere?

Quoted message said:

Unless your 105 parts are worn out, you won't notice a huge difference. I would wait till parts
start to wear out and replace those with DA parts.

Good plan. I was unsure of compatibility between the to, but a little research here has answered my
questions. I figured I would have to replace the whole group. Only problem I might have is that I
have a triple now, and would like to go to a double.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I still use the factory wheels, would it be better to spend the money

there?

Quoted message said:

A good set of handbuilt wheels could be a good upgrade, if your current

wheels

Quoted message said:

are falling apart. .

Any recomendations??

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

I would like to upgrade from aluminum, to cf or ti someday in the future. Should I just save my
money for that?

Upgrade? Why do you think changing the material will be an upgrade? Good frames can be made from
any of the materials you suggest, just as easily as bad frames can be made from the same
materials. The material is not as important as how it is used.

Good point, I guess I read alot about the ride qualities of certain materials. Although this seems
to be a very controversial topic.

Quoted message said:

-----------------
Alex __O _-\<,_ (_)/ (_)

Gee Peter, You couldn't recomend anyone in the north Denver metro area, could you.. ; )

Actually a bike fit is probably a good idea. I was less than impressed by the LBS where I
purchased the bike.

Chris

Quoted message said:

----- Original Message ----- From: "Qui si parla Campagnolo" <[email hidden]> Newsgroups:
rec.bicycles.tech Sent: Monday, August 18, 2003 7:00 AM Subject: Re: Dura Ace Upgrade

Quoted message said:

otto-<< I feel my current setup is fine for the daily training ride. I would however like to do
more climbing, and

mountain

Quoted message said:

riding. So I guess weight would be the big reason for the upgrade. It

seems

Quoted message said:

the weight difference is not great between the DA, and 105, so I was wondering if there would be
other advantages to the upgrade. My wheel upgrade was also for weight purposes. >><BR><BR>

Don't expect the weight savings to be huge and don't expect the

performance

Quoted message said:

difference to be either.

<< The frame change would be more for ride quality, then weight. The CD

seems a

Quoted message said:

little harsh, and tends to leave me with sore joint after a long day in

the

Quoted message said:

saddle >><BR><BR>

Get a bike fit, fatter tires.

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 vecchios.comvecchios.comOpen ↗ "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Quoted message said:

Good point, I guess I read alot about the ride qualities of certain materials. Although this seems
to be a very controversial topic.

Quoted message said:

-----------------
Alex __O _-\<,_ (_)/ (_)

This is an understatement! There are guys out there that try to say that frame material has no
bearing on how a bike rides, and there are guys out there that believe it does matter, but that
essentially you can make the materials do the same things with enough engineering.

The same argument goes on (and on, and on...) over aero wheels, rotating weight, Campy v. Shimano,
and a myriad of other things.

If it makes you (and I stress YOU) feel like riding, then go for it. Just don't expect everyone to
agree with your choices... and if you're posting here, better make sure that you know what you're
talking about unless you really want to get hammered for repeating some of the more prosaic sayings
in our great sport.

Mike

ottodog c said:

the whole group. Only problem I might have is that I have a triple now, and would like to go to
a double.

You would? Do you currently have a lot of miles on your 105 stuff?

Why would you want to eliminate the extra gear? I'm not looking to argue it, just wondering what
would cause that desire.

I have all 105 double on my bike...sometimes think I'd like a triple. Heh.

Quoted message said:

Good point, I guess I read alot about the ride qualities of certain materials. Although this seems
to be a very controversial topic.

The material is not as important as how it is used: true.

That doesn't mean you shouldn't enjoy getting a new CF frame to replace your existing, satisfactory
frame. There is always room for improvement, just don't be blind or narrow-minded.

If you _really_ need to get rid of money on bicycling stuff, buy something for me. I could make a
list...<G>

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

----------------- Alex __O _-\<,_ (_)/ (_)

--
Rick Onanian

Mike S. mikeshaw2@coxDOTnet said:

If it makes you (and I stress YOU) feel like riding, then go for it.

That ought to be the standard answer for everything. It's certainly accurate.

Quoted message said:

Mike

--
Rick Onanian